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fukier
RISE of LEGION
792
|
Posted - 2013.02.10 00:22:00 -
[91] - Quote
Mallak Azaria wrote:fukier wrote:Sal Landry wrote:fukier wrote:1. isk sink as the insurance runs out after 90 days I don't think you understsand how insurance works wrt isk sinks and faucets. Enlighten me then... Its a sink because you dont get isk back if you are not podded after the 90 days. Insurance is for the most part, an isk faucet. It injects more isk in to the economy than it ever takes away.
Thank you. At the end of the game both the pawn and the Queen go in the same box. |
CausticS0da
Viziam Amarr Empire
169
|
Posted - 2013.02.10 08:43:00 -
[92] - Quote
Tear Miner wrote:Leave it to an RoL member to come up with half baked ideas. This thread is going places.
Anyway, my advice is: Leave the hard thinking to CCP, it's their job.
Don't quit your dayjob, kid. ;)
This post is priceless. 1. Suggesting that there is a core personality trait shared only by a particular alliance in a computer game.... Check 2. Suggesting that players should not be able to contribute to the development of the game in the forums by offering new ideas... check 3. Calling someone they don't know 'kid'... Check
Thanks for that contribution, come back soon we can't wait to hear from you! |
Ris Dnalor
L'Avant Garde Happy Endings
445
|
Posted - 2013.02.10 08:48:00 -
[93] - Quote
fukier wrote:CCP Fozzie wrote: Clone costs in their current form are not something we as a design department are happy with. Beyond that we can't make commitments on the issue at this time.
Ok Forum peeps CCP is not happy [edit] with the current mechanics with clone prices [edit]... So what say you how would you fix the clone shenanigans? My 0.02 isk on the subject: 1. Keep clone prices the same in all medical bays. 2. Give us the abilily to manufacture clones using PI products 3. Let us as a player transport clones in our ships 4. Let us as players buy and sell clones on the market 5. revamp the clone bay mod for ships. (perhaps make a sub cap clone bay ship or a mod for pos that can produce/hold clones) 6. allow multiple clones to be in a medical bay (that way i can stockpile clones so i dont have to buy new ones each time i die)
this would be great for a player like me who has over 120 mill SP as my clones are getting rather expensive this would also open up areas of NPC 0.0 that are currently vacant due to distance to medical bay stations. this would also take away the punishment for older players who just happened to play the game longer then others. remember older char does not mean a rich char. plus i would not mind taking out cheep ships and pvp in them as the clone cost would not be 500 times the cost of loosing the ship. this would also take something that is currently out of players hands and make it a market dynamic variable. which in my eyes is always a good thing to give power to the players.
personally I think GoonSwarm should be given the only clone BPOs as a reward for all the content they've generated for eve over the years. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=118961
EvE = Everybody Vs. Everybody
- Qolde |
Jace Errata
Ghosts That Linger
374
|
Posted - 2013.02.10 13:15:00 -
[94] - Quote
DeMichael Crimson wrote: Anyway, maybe just have 3 different types of Medical Clones available? Such as:
'Basic' Medical Clone = no Implant slots 'Standard' Medical Clone = Attribute implant slots 1-5 'Upgraded' Medical Clone = Attribute implant slots 1-5 and Hardwiring slots 6-10
I like this idea - however I think it would be good to have a second type of Standard clone, with just the Hardwiring slots. The system you've got there rather discourages fitting your clone for combat. Stealth OST puns and blatant lies since 2009 Jace Errata on Twitter
One day they woke me up so I could live forever It's such a shame the same will never happen to you |
fukier
RISE of LEGION
796
|
Posted - 2013.02.10 17:16:00 -
[95] - Quote
Ris Dnalor wrote:fukier wrote:CCP Fozzie wrote: Clone costs in their current form are not something we as a design department are happy with. Beyond that we can't make commitments on the issue at this time.
Ok Forum peeps CCP is not happy [edit] with the current mechanics with clone prices [edit]... So what say you how would you fix the clone shenanigans? My 0.02 isk on the subject: 1. Keep clone prices the same in all medical bays. 2. Give us the abilily to manufacture clones using PI products 3. Let us as a player transport clones in our ships 4. Let us as players buy and sell clones on the market 5. revamp the clone bay mod for ships. (perhaps make a sub cap clone bay ship or a mod for pos that can produce/hold clones) 6. allow multiple clones to be in a medical bay (that way i can stockpile clones so i dont have to buy new ones each time i die)
this would be great for a player like me who has over 120 mill SP as my clones are getting rather expensive this would also open up areas of NPC 0.0 that are currently vacant due to distance to medical bay stations. this would also take away the punishment for older players who just happened to play the game longer then others. remember older char does not mean a rich char. plus i would not mind taking out cheep ships and pvp in them as the clone cost would not be 500 times the cost of loosing the ship. this would also take something that is currently out of players hands and make it a market dynamic variable. which in my eyes is always a good thing to give power to the players. personally I think GoonSwarm should be given the only clone BPOs as a reward for all the content they've generated for eve over the years.
what to replace tech when ccp move to ring mining?
At the end of the game both the pawn and the Queen go in the same box. |
Galphii
Clandestine Vector THE SPACE P0LICE
113
|
Posted - 2013.02.11 01:08:00 -
[96] - Quote
The cost of upgrading and repurchasing a close is a penalty for losing in pvp, as if losing implants, ship and mods wasn't enough. We want to be encouraging people to pvp more, not less. Remove the cost of clones entirely, as well as their limits to saved SP. You get a new one automatically after you die, in the place you designate and go on your way. X |
NEONOVUS
Saablast Followers
324
|
Posted - 2013.02.11 01:16:00 -
[97] - Quote
What if CCP got rid of learning implants and clone grades by swapping clones for manufactured ones that had higher base stats? This way you could pvp in a clone with no expensive learners and let players set the price completely. |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
3830
|
Posted - 2013.02.11 01:32:00 -
[98] - Quote
Mallak Azaria wrote:fukier wrote:Sal Landry wrote:fukier wrote:1. isk sink as the insurance runs out after 90 days I don't think you understsand how insurance works wrt isk sinks and faucets. Enlighten me then... Its a sink because you dont get isk back if you are not podded after the 90 days. Insurance is for the most part, an isk faucet. It injects more isk in to the economy than it ever takes away. Yeah, because that's definitely the same insurance he was talking about.
The insurance he was referring to, the clone insurance that has been proposed several times (I'm merely repeating those proposals in this thread, very little of that if any can be attributed to me), would not add any isk to the economy whatsoever. It would be a pure isk sink, same as clone upgrades are now, however it removes the PVP penalty aspect for high SP players.
There would be no payout on losing a pod, the insurance would simply mean that over the coverage period you wouldn't have to upgrade your clone every time you get podded - it's done automatically for the entire insurance period for an infinite number of clones. Malcanis for CSM 8 Phrases like "you can't nerf / buff X EVE is a Sandbox" have the same amount of meaning as "If this is a sack of potatoes then you can not carrot." - Alara IonStorm |
Jada Maroo
Southern Cross Empire Flying Dangerous
1005
|
Posted - 2013.02.11 01:39:00 -
[99] - Quote
Lower clone prices, cut the delay in jump cloning, get rid of leaning implants, speed up training to compensate.
You shouldn't have to train more slowly because you PVP. For as much as CCP claims to want to encourage PVP, the loss of SP gain speed (or the loss of a very expensive pod) is one of the biggest barriers to jumping into the null sec pool. |
Corey Fumimasa
Royal Caldari Imperial Guard Imperium Directive
98
|
Posted - 2013.02.11 04:51:00 -
[100] - Quote
I love the idea of transporting clones in ships! Especially if the guy that loots it can melt it down and get some of your skill points!!! Man to hell with PLEX and ISK and MODS lets make SP's lootable, and make organ jacking a profession.
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
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Corey Fumimasa
Royal Caldari Imperial Guard Imperium Directive
100
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Posted - 2013.02.11 11:33:00 -
[101] - Quote
Jada Maroo wrote:Lower clone prices, cut the delay in jump cloning, get rid of leaning implants, speed up training to compensate.
You shouldn't have to train more slowly because you PVP. For as much as CCP claims to want to encourage PVP, the loss of SP gain speed (or the loss of a very expensive pod) is one of the biggest barriers to jumping into the null sec pool.
I just noticed this. Making Eve easier and less risky will make it boring. Jumping into null and PvPing everyday is exciting because it is scary and risky. Your implants are part of that risk, if you want lower risk then wear cheaper implants. The player who wears expensive implants has an advantage and pays for that advantage in greater risk.
I hate the jumpclone timer myself, but it is one of the limitations that we need to plan for, without those limitations there is no planning required, and that is a big part of Eve. He who plans better has an advantage. Also the jumpclone timer is one of the things that keeps NewEden a big place, the shorter that timer is the smaller New Eden is.
As for clone prices; if someone doesn't want to put their clone at such risk then they can go to Empire space to PvP. Risking your pod is one of the things that separates Null sec from Empire space.
Doing away with these risks and limitations would make NewEden a smaller less exciting place.
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
3515
|
Posted - 2013.02.11 15:01:00 -
[102] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote:Jada Maroo wrote:Lower clone prices, cut the delay in jump cloning, get rid of leaning implants, speed up training to compensate.
You shouldn't have to train more slowly because you PVP. For as much as CCP claims to want to encourage PVP, the loss of SP gain speed (or the loss of a very expensive pod) is one of the biggest barriers to jumping into the null sec pool. I just noticed this. Making Eve easier and less risky will make it boring. Jumping into null and PvPing everyday is exciting because it is scary and risky. Your implants are part of that risk, if you want lower risk then wear cheaper implants. The player who wears expensive implants has an advantage and pays for that advantage in greater risk. I hate the jumpclone timer myself, but it is one of the limitations that we need to plan for, without those limitations there is no planning required, and that is a big part of Eve. He who plans better has an advantage. Also the jumpclone timer is one of the things that keeps NewEden a big place, the shorter that timer is the smaller New Eden is. As for clone prices; if someone doesn't want to put their clone at such risk then they can go to Empire space to PvP. Risking your pod is one of the things that separates Null sec from Empire space. Doing away with these risks and limitations would make NewEden a smaller less exciting place. I agree on jump clone delay staying, as well as learning implants staying.
However as you get older you should not be penalized simply because you've been around for awhile. Your options should never become more limited as you get older, which is currently the case. And frankly, it's a fairly silly justification to say that the more you know the more expensive your clone should become. Paying more for a clone that is modified, or has more capabilities, makes far more sense.
An experienced player should never have to feel adverse to flying a T1 ship simply because your base (even implantless) clone cost dwarfs the cost of the ship you are in.
You SHOULD have more at risk if you've chosed to invest a lot in your clone, both in implant cost and the cost of the clone itself. But that should be part of a choice, not a penalty for loyalty. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Sergeant Acht Scultz
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
547
|
Posted - 2013.02.11 15:15:00 -
[103] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Lower the cost so my clone is not more expensive than my ship would be nice.
I don't know about you but my clone cost after 1.2 hits is going to skyrocket. Flying something under BC size will not be an option, even BC size ships my clone will cost almost as much (if not the same), if I want somehow to have fun flying smaller stuff or just because I have to and loose pod without implants it's a couple hours ratting like a window licker just to pay for the pod. (already reduced login time because unlike many against this change having a family and a job it's my main concern)
This is completely unfun and only prevents me from login said character if there's no BS fleet going on, the second one being capital/JF pilots guess what...hello high sec.
Gò¡Gê¬Gò«n+ên+¦n++n+¦n+ëGò¡Gê¬Gò«-á don't haten++ |
Corey Fumimasa
Royal Caldari Imperial Guard Imperium Directive
101
|
Posted - 2013.02.11 18:42:00 -
[104] - Quote
Why didn't you guys stop training if clone costs were becoming prohibitive? Train an alt designed to fly frigs if that's what you want to do. I don't know what is more disheartening; the fact that you guys are asking for Eve to make up for your fail character build or the possibility that they will concede to your demands.
Woohoo lets all go ride the rides in Eve land!
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
Sergeant Acht Scultz
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
549
|
Posted - 2013.02.11 19:22:00 -
[105] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote:Why didn't you guys stop training if clone costs were becoming prohibitive?
Train an alt designed to fly frigs if that's what you want to do. I don't know what is more disheartening; the fact that you guys are asking for Eve to make up for your fail character build or the possibility that they will concede to your demands.
Woohoo lets all go ride the rides in Eve land!
You have a very short vision of what gaming and fun is and would like Eve to be what it was back in your stone age 2003.
Flash news: it's not and you'll have to get over it sooner than later.
Penalizing players for progression is bad, brings nothing fun or smart decisions, it's poor gaming design and completely opposed to what fun is meant to be when you dare to log in to Eve online servers and dedicate time/money to it.
It's rather with guys like me capable to see this is wrong and tell it out loud with no complex to simple minded players that this game evolves, simple minded sheep product buyers are always happy with whatever amount of crap they get thrown at their face and still have the boldness to say "thank you good sir", they should ask a private server beta version of Eve.
This clone cost stupid thing has to go away for the overall good of this game, by adjusting market/trading fees it would get more isk out of the game than any amount of high SP characters that don't play or avoid taking all risk. You might and will not like my opinion, it's your right, but seems there are more players not liking the current status than the other way around, will you get over it ?
Gò¡Gê¬Gò«n+ên+¦n++n+¦n+ëGò¡Gê¬Gò«-á don't haten++ |
Jenn aSide
Smokin Aces.
1332
|
Posted - 2013.02.11 19:38:00 -
[106] - Quote
All of you guys are wrong.
EVE should handle clones like Battlestar Galactica did: you have a clone ship flying around in space, if you get podded, you wake up there.
If someone blows up your clone ship and you get podded, you die, and are completely out of the game, but CCP will contract you a free 30 day trial of World of Darkness...because that's what you deserve for dying, nub. |
Corey Fumimasa
Royal Caldari Imperial Guard Imperium Directive
101
|
Posted - 2013.02.11 19:45:00 -
[107] - Quote
Sergeant Acht Scultz wrote:Corey Fumimasa wrote:Why didn't you guys stop training if clone costs were becoming prohibitive?
Train an alt designed to fly frigs if that's what you want to do. I don't know what is more disheartening; the fact that you guys are asking for Eve to make up for your fail character build or the possibility that they will concede to your demands.
Woohoo lets all go ride the rides in Eve land! You have a very short vision of what gaming and fun is and would like Eve to be what it was back in your stone age 2003. Flash news: it's not and you'll have to get over it sooner than later. ..... are more players not liking the current status than the other way around, will you get over it ?
If its a closed issue why the discussion? Take your winnings and move on.
I play Eve because it is a challenge, every move is a puzzle, and there is a cost for mistakes. That is what keeps it interesting and exciting for me.
Many people have been coming back to Eve after long breaks, players who remember what Eve was like in 04 and 05. They are not coming back because they remember the easy old days when loosing ships and clones was a joke, or because they heard that Eve finally caved in to the "themepark" players. They are coming back because they remember Eve as being a challenge.
I wouldn't bet on CCP going one way or the other with this.
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
Vincent Athena
V.I.C.E.
1592
|
Posted - 2013.02.11 23:19:00 -
[108] - Quote
Irya Boone wrote:I think clones Should be cheaper or free Only the implants should cost more than Now.
And Allow Jump clone in the same [Region or System] under 24H timers.
And of course allow people To build/ sell / buy clones But Not WIth PI but With CORPSES and other things maybe Clone = corpse+ PI T4 + Salvaged items .
giving corpse a new life ^^ and create a new career Corpse collector :) You mean alt corpse provider. http://vincentoneve.wordpress.com/ |
Ankles McGlashan
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.11 23:47:00 -
[109] - Quote
I'm definitely a fan of getting rid of clone upgrades completely. Just an annoying and pointless ritual to go through which punishes me for being absentminded and forgetful and rewards me for having a smartphone and Aura.
Or at least have some sort of undock warning dialogue. That's not exactly babying us any more than jumping into low-sec is it? |
Corey Fumimasa
Royal Caldari Imperial Guard Imperium Directive
101
|
Posted - 2013.02.11 23:52:00 -
[110] - Quote
Ankles McGlashan wrote:I'm definitely a fan of getting rid of clone upgrades completely. Just an annoying and pointless ritual to go through which punishes me for being absentminded and forgetful and rewards me for having a smartphone and Aura.
Or at least have some sort of undock warning dialogue. That's not exactly babying us any more than jumping into low-sec is it? No, its not hand holding any more than the lowsec warning, they are both horrible ideas that make Eve kinder and gentler.
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
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Wacktopia
Noir. Black Legion.
455
|
Posted - 2013.02.11 23:53:00 -
[111] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Lower the cost so my clone is not more expensive than my ship would be nice.
This.
Clone costs are a bit pointless to be honest. What does the clone cost actually achieve other than an ISK sink? The bottom line is that now I have one of those annoying signatures. |
Ankles McGlashan
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
1
|
Posted - 2013.02.12 00:04:00 -
[112] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote:No, its not hand holding any more than the lowsec warning, they are both horrible ideas that make Eve kinder and gentler.
Or less tedious. And by golly eve needs to do itself every favour it can on that front. |
Corey Fumimasa
Royal Caldari Imperial Guard Imperium Directive
101
|
Posted - 2013.02.12 00:04:00 -
[113] - Quote
Wacktopia wrote:baltec1 wrote:Lower the cost so my clone is not more expensive than my ship would be nice. This. Clone costs are a bit pointless to be honest. What does the clone cost actually achieve other than an ISK sink?
By that argument ships, mods and implants should also be free. Miners and industrialist could be compensated by NPC purchasing agents and then everyone would be happy.
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
Corey Fumimasa
Royal Caldari Imperial Guard Imperium Directive
101
|
Posted - 2013.02.12 00:09:00 -
[114] - Quote
Ankles McGlashan wrote:Corey Fumimasa wrote:No, its not hand holding any more than the lowsec warning, they are both horrible ideas that make Eve kinder and gentler. Or less tedious. And by golly eve needs to do it self every favour it can on that front. tedious = attention to detail; Eve has always rewarded that sort of play, it is similar to chess and poker and Bridge that way. Eve will make a terrible FPS. I can't for the life of me understand why so many people are trying to push it that way.
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
MadMuppet
Three Fish In A Box
814
|
Posted - 2013.02.12 00:20:00 -
[115] - Quote
My opinion on clone costs:
If you are podding in low-sec, null, or WH space, half the cost of the first clone (and start a 23hr hour cooldown).
If you are podded in high-sec, full price and the 23 hour cooldown starts.
If you get podded again during the cooldown, the clone cost is 50% of the price above and the cooldown timer restarts. (ie the lowest price would be 25% of base ever)
Getting podded while a member of FW is the same as getting podded in low-sec (even if you die in high-sec). People at war do not get the protection unless they are also in FW (to avoid exploitation)
Reasoning: CONCORD protection tax for high-sec pods. 23 hour cooldown to avoid the 'fencepost' problem. Reducing the cost might encourage more 'risky' behavior. Capping the reduction to 25% to avoid people from running a 'suicide night'. People at war do not get the same protection as people in FW unless they are also in FW (to avoid exploitation for cheaper clones)
I would also change the cooldown on the jump clone to 23 hours for the 'fencepost' issue. I mine in EVE because I'm too drunk to fish in WoW.-á |
Ankles McGlashan
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
1
|
Posted - 2013.02.12 00:21:00 -
[116] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote:tedious = attention to detail; Eve has always rewarded that sort of play, it is similar to chess and poker and Bridge that way. Eve will make a terrible FPS. I can't for the life of me understand why so many people are trying to push it that way.
I'm not quite sure how 'can we get rid of this pointless death and distraction tax?' really equates to 'give me a flight stick please'
each to their own and their ADHD meds though. |
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
2436
|
Posted - 2013.02.12 00:39:00 -
[117] - Quote
Another way to mix things up would be to make pods indestructible and strategically useless like a crew escape pod. A capsule that cannot see local nor be seen, does not show up on overviews, and can only see "gates and stations".
This might seem carebearistic, but the leverage here is that on destruction of any ship that any pod is in results in the damage or loss of implants to the pilot, possibly random, and such implants appearing on the KM.
Trouble is, per the PVP notion about balance and the general gripe about so-called carebears, is the Joe Highsec blitzing incursions with a complete 1BIL implant set does not risk it like Joe Lowsec, who, knowing that podding is inevitable, may forgo implants entirely or stay with cheaper ones.
It's also notable that people with extremely deep pockets can lose clones all day because it's "cheaper" time wise to get podded back to the hangar.
Thus random damage and loss of implants for the entire player spectrum and the lost intel tool of capsules and having to make the "time is money" choice of a capsule SD would certainly stir things up, as well as put PVe players on their toes regarding ship loss (encouraging smarter ship fitting) . I think it would also increase lowsec PVP, since the "inevitable total loss" scenario creates a mental wall unlike what a "probable partial loss" does.
These are of course my .2ISK and those with deep pockets or who have gone without implants all these years, egotistically attached to their decisions, are likely to rage about it. |
Corey Fumimasa
Royal Caldari Imperial Guard Imperium Directive
101
|
Posted - 2013.02.12 01:07:00 -
[118] - Quote
Ankles McGlashan wrote:Corey Fumimasa wrote:tedious = attention to detail; Eve has always rewarded that sort of play, it is similar to chess and poker and Bridge that way. Eve will make a terrible FPS. I can't for the life of me understand why so many people are trying to push it that way. I'm not quite sure how 'can we get rid of this pointless death and distraction tax?' really equates to 'give me a flight stick please' each to their own and their ADHD meds though. I'm sorry to have pushed you to vague metaphors and thinly veiled insults, it was not my intention.
It's just that the Eve players I remember looked at every setback and defeat as a lesson learned and a good tactic for future use. Now it seems that setbacks are an obstacle to gameplay. And so they are done away with and mitigated to the point that only one type of gameplay will exist in Eve.
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium
3078
|
Posted - 2013.02.12 03:11:00 -
[119] - Quote
Corbin Blair wrote:They said they were looking at clone costs. They didn't say they were going to remake the whole clone system from scratch.
EVE is a game fundamentally based on PvP and a player driven economy. I think it should be up to the market to decide how much a clone is worth.
We produce biomass through PI, we collect corpses through space combat. Why not add in the ability to produce multitudinous clones through PI or space manufacturing, with the ability to determine a "clone level" (i.e.: longer baking time for better quality brains), and leave it up to the players to decide how much the resource is worth?
So turn clone maintenance over to the players, introduce a new line of industry (suitable for a sovereignty themed expansion, for example) allowing us to build alpha through omega grade clones. Then we, the players, determine the value of that product by selling it on the market and leaving it up to players to stock their clone reserves.
The same market could serve Dust Bunnies and Capsuleers although Dust Bunnies don't currently pay for clones, they just have these reserves magically appearing.
The ISK sinks are still there: PI export costs, some kind of NPC-sourced reactant, sales taxes, clone activation costs, etc.
Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players |
Sergeant Acht Scultz
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
554
|
Posted - 2013.02.12 11:26:00 -
[120] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote:Ankles McGlashan wrote:Corey Fumimasa wrote:No, its not hand holding any more than the lowsec warning, they are both horrible ideas that make Eve kinder and gentler. Or less tedious. And by golly eve needs to do it self every favour it can on that front. tedious = attention to detail; Eve has always rewarded that sort of play, it is similar to chess and poker and Bridge that way. Eve will make a terrible FPS. I can't for the life of me understand why so many people are trying to push it that way.
Jesus Christ, I'm not sure you're human or that you really exist...
Gò¡Gê¬Gò«n+ên+¦n++n+¦n+ëGò¡Gê¬Gò«-á don't haten++ |
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