Agreed. My point was CCP originally expressed that the BC changes would take effect in January thereby causing people to use December, all of December, to train up BCV.

The announcement for the Orcas happened late imo. I didn't hear about the change until very recently and it looks like it will take effect on the 19th.

Therefore comments 1 & 2.

'straight out of the blue'. All depends on how much notice you think is reasonable. 4 months seem ok? 'Out of the blue' would have been a change on the 19th. And only someone that pays no attention to the dev blogs would think it was happening on the 19th.

Thinking about people in less advantageous positions.

Would you agree that my corp is in a less advantageous position as yours? Clearly my corp is paying attention. If you're not paying attention after the ship balancing and recent changes, you're likely not going to pay attention to begin with; no amount of flashing text and bright colors are going to get the message across.

Read my post before this one. No legitimate way that you can say those aren't possibilities.

So when you come back to an MMO that has regular expansions and patches, you don't bother figuring out what changed?

The patch notes are obvious and easy the check. These changes are not so easy. Really, there is no reason to fight against making them more visible. Zero, zilch, nadda.

Hey look. You still don't understand the concept of Sunk cost, and when it became clear that nobody supported you in your campaign (in the other thread) to untrain skills you intentionally trained, you decided to make a new thread.

So surprising.


You trained the pre-requisite skills for the Orca. You can fly the Orca. Any changes to the pre-requisite skills for the orca are irrelevant, as you already have the benefit (flying an orca) at the cost you agreed to (the skills you trained).

And how is worthless?

They got to fly the Orca before the change.
They get to fly it afterwards.

From their perspective, /nothing/ has changed.

What this really boils down to is:
'Waah! they get to do something more easily than I got to.'

That's all.

Do you complain when you go to MacDonalds, and find out they cut the price the day before? When you had a burger the week before and had to pay the higher price?

No, it's not a legitimate complaint.

The dev blogs are accessible in the exact same place as the patch notes.
If anyone chooses not to read either that's their problem.

Actually check back before you complain that I made a new thread. I didn't create the previous thread, and the other the other thread was regarding the Iteron and was not anything to do with reimbursing SP for the Orca.

And now you've added your 2 cents worth into the sea of opposing opinions on this issue. And after reading through this new thread hopefully you are now big enough to realise that this is a legitimate complaint despite the fact you may not agree with it.

Except dev blogs aren't clearly laid out to be "upcoming changes to the game" or anything like that.

Again, no reason not to adjust this. Providing good customer support is not the customers problem. Ever. Its the customer's responsibility to use it once its provided

but right now, the visibility of these things are low, even on the forums. Even on the dev blogs. You really have to search to find this stuff, and in fact you have to know what you're looking for in the first place. That isn't a good thing. Give me one good reason you're against this sort of thing rather than "oh, its their fault, lol"

That is your opinion, although I don't think your complaint of my complaint is legitimate either. hehe

I didn't say you created the other thread, you were making the exact same complaints about the Orca in the other thread, and you still don't understand the concept of sunk cost.

It is not a legitimate complaint, because you got exactly what you paid for (the ability to fly an orca), at the time you paid for it (when you finished training for it), at a price you were willing to pay for it (the time you spent training for it). All of those things are still true, and (assuming that there aren't any time machines), nothing will change those things. That's how Sunk costs work.

No, you don't. The dev blogs are ******* easy to find. Stop being ridiculous.

The Orca is a pretty straight forward situation.

But what really bakes my noodle is trying to figure out the Rorqual. It's a completely new set of prerequisites with a lot of questions as to what skills CCP will be adding or refunding, as the case may be.

Mr Epeen

By that logic, they shouldn't refund for removed skills either. Those were the costs at the time and they aren't stopping you from doing something after their removal. Gotta have more reason than that unless you're against those sort of reimbursements too.

By that logic, they shouldn't refund for removed skills either. Those were the costs at the time and they aren't stopping you from doing something after their removal. Gotta have more reason than that unless you're against those sort of reimbursements too.

Uh no, because removed skills are taking something away from the player that the player spent time developing.
Nothing is being taken away from you here.

Except not really if they can do everything they could do before. All they lost is time, and some SP which is actually a favor since it reduces their clone cost.

How does a removed skill equate to doing everything you could do before?

Because the benefit of the skill never went away. You just don't need the skill for it anymore.

And everybody else gets the same exact benefit as you do without having to skill anything at all.
Do you see the difference?

Pretty clear to me.

If you have 0 SP and want to fly a Rorq post patch, you will have to train all of those new pre-reqs.
If you can fly a Rorq now, you will not need to train anything new.
If you have the Capital Industrial Ship skill installed, you will be able to train it at will, regardless of what new pre-requisites you might posses (or not).

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