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give caladari a new battle ship or rebuilt raven option.

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Hawk Firestorm	Posted - 2005.07.28 01:59:00 - [61] Edited by: Hawk Firestorm on 28/07/2005 01:59:49 Ya know once upon a time when the game was far more balanced than it is now... I remember when missiles where a secondary weapon and ya actually fitted guns on a raven, and well they actually could hit something too. heh (the guns that is)
Sun Ra	Posted - 2005.07.28 12:12:00 - [62] If u want an npc ship buy a bloody apoc We're coming for you
Seth Killbain	Posted - 2005.07.28 12:16:00 - [63] Originally by: j0sephine Edited by: j0sephine on 27/07/2005 06:32:39 "Are you sure about that? It's already hard to fit 6 siege and 2 NOS, not sure 2 extra missile slots would yield so much power since you'd have to fill your lows with PDS/RCUs." Well, with the Advanced Weapon Upgrades fully trained it seems like you should be able to fit 7 Siege Launchers II and would be left with ~360 mw spare and all low slots. With one RCU II the free grid would grow to ~2150 mw... that's enough to fit 8 siege II's with nearly 500 grid spare... and still the room for 4 damage mods? that'd be roughly 5 k damage per salvo every 7-8 sec against regular resistances, on average... would hurt -.x (siege launchers are much lighter on the grid than heavy nosferatu) Not trying to be picky, but its not grid which caps a Raven, its the cpu. It would be hard to fit 7 siege with any kind of other defence.
j0sephine	Posted - 2005.07.28 12:51:00 - [64] "Not trying to be picky, but its not grid which caps a Raven, its the cpu. It would be hard to fit 7 siege with any kind of other defence." Mhmm even with 8 siege II's it looks like there's 347 cpu left or so... nearly 200 after you put in the low slot modules. True, you won't build much of tank out of that, but you don't seriously expect to be able to put full tank on the all-out-damage gankageddon type of ship, do you..? o.O;
Seth Killbain	Posted - 2005.07.28 13:19:00 - [65] thats exactly my point :) it wont be able to do jack all else :), so why not ? I can fit six (named for cpu) and fit a tank with close restraints, i would like to be able to fit 8 and fly a tin bucket.
j0sephine	Posted - 2005.07.28 13:36:00 - [66] Edited by: j0sephine on 28/07/2005 13:41:20 "thats exactly my point :) it wont be able to do jack all else :), so why not ?" Do you see this slight disadvantage preventing people from crying about the gankageddon? ^^ (because after all it's not like you need much of tank when your offense is your best defense) Add the fact you'd be able to deal this sort of damage from way farther than mega pulses can reach (we'll conveniently ignore the flight time issue, just like typical whine would) ... can't help but think yes, it would cause lot of forum noise, potential balancing drawbacks nonwithstanding. ^^;; edit: and finally, 'not much of tank' isn't equal to complete lack of one. 200 cpu is enough to fit large shield booster II, couple hardeners and cap rechargers in remaining slots... that's not exactly no defense whatsoever, there -.o
Seth Killbain	Posted - 2005.07.28 13:51:00 - [67] Fair enough point that, it would have to be rebalanced to actually work, and the one thing i learn to fear is the balancing or should i say ability to balance in this game. Still nice thought
John Blackthorn	Posted - 2005.07.28 14:27:00 - [68] It's utter bull crap that the missle changes afer patch are better. They ARE NOT! However, since there not ever going to be changed back you gota live with what is in game. I have all but one of the new missle skills to level 4. The other one is level 3. Torps are utterly fubared except if you are firing against another b.s.. And then they still suck becuase none of the new skills effect torps, and you gota be almost point blank range for them to hit otheriwse the person you are shoting at just warps off. Some of us trained torp 5.. for what? damn 35 days wasted. Though I fly the scorp, which is why i trained level 5 so i could do some decent damage. I would have never trained level 5 torps if i knew this was goign to happen. I'm flying with cruise missles now.. so i can hit frigates for 30 damage, cruisers for about 100. and b.s. for about 180. every other b.s. in the game can tank a scorps damage output. -BT
DrunkenOne	Posted - 2005.07.28 14:33:00 - [69] Originally by: Nikolai Nuvolari Edited by: Nikolai Nuvolari on 26/07/2005 22:28:54 We've already had this discussion a few weeks ago, and we very thoroughly worked out the solution. It is called the Panther, and it is death and beauty in the perfect form. And I love it. It's got: 8 high slots, 6 med slots, 4 low slots 7 turret hardpoints, 1 missile hardpoint Bonuses are +5% large hybrid turret damage and +5% large hybrid turret rate of fire Dronebay would either be very small, or nonexistant. We never really resolved that. Now if only we could convince the Devs to code it in... And every person with any sense shot down that idea because that would be the most overpowered ship of any class in the game. Originally by: Sochin CCP has provided you with the tools you need to avoid crime. You're just too lazy/stupid to use them.
X'Alor	Posted - 2005.07.28 14:35:00 - [70] And if you guys keep this up and making a new thread with a new title with the same old whine about caldari turret based BS. Well hate to say it but CCP and their ebil ways just might give you what you want. Except those of us would rather see the T2 version raven be a T2 version missle boat. keep whining we need a turret BS and they just make the T2 versions some crappy railgun boat. You wanna fly a kick arse hybrid turret based BS. just train the damn mega T and sheild tank it, it'd be just like a caldari hybrid based BS but much cooler looking.

OffBeaT	Posted - 2005.07.29 00:31:00 - [71] Edited by: OffBeaT on 29/07/2005 00:31:26 what **es me off is that large smart bombs use too much cap and are no good aginst frigs/interseptors in a real way & the same with medium one's. torps have no spread like the old days so i cant lanuch a can shot it with a torp and sprad damage the frigs like the old days. i cant hit frigs/interseptors well with cruise missiles & fast enough too beat out there worp jamming me befor the BS shot in on me. i am a real sitting duck solo out here npcing. drones arnt gona get thre job done. they arent strong enough at lvl4. so eather make the drones what they where in the past usful or give the raven the ability too mount 8 lanchers so i can fit 2 small or assult lanchers in too back up my drons. i can't replace drones from a can when the npc's shoot them so ** the drone defance idea out here solo. i dont train gunnry past 4 so puting lite turrets on will not do for me what my missiles can, pluss i am caldrai and dont like too see turrets on my ships.
Nikolai Nuvolari	Posted - 2005.07.31 22:36:00 - [72] Originally by: DrunkenOne Originally by: Nikolai Nuvolari Edited by: Nikolai Nuvolari on 26/07/2005 22:28:54 We've already had this discussion a few weeks ago, and we very thoroughly worked out the solution. It is called the Panther, and it is death and beauty in the perfect form. And I love it. It's got: 8 high slots, 6 med slots, 4 low slots 7 turret hardpoints, 1 missile hardpoint Bonuses are +5% large hybrid turret damage and +5% large hybrid turret rate of fire Dronebay would either be very small, or nonexistant. We never really resolved that. Now if only we could convince the Devs to code it in... And every person with any sense shot down that idea because that would be the most overpowered ship of any class in the game. I don't know how you got the impression that "every person with any sense shot down that idea" unless you've stopped reading and started projecting your opinions onto everyone else. And no, it would not be the most overpowered ship of any class in the game. Even among battleships it wouldn't be the most powerful...it's really a very specialized sniper. It has almost no short range defence because 425mm railguns can't hit at close range, it has only one missile launcher, and it doesn't have drones. As far as ALL ship classes go, it's still vulnerable to the things that all other battleships are vulnerable to, probably more so... ___________________________________________ ^^^*---All things serve the Beam---*^^^ GDBT is recruiting!
Carth Jared	Posted - 2005.07.31 23:04:00 - [73] Originally by: Nikolai Nuvolari Originally by: DrunkenOne Originally by: Nikolai Nuvolari Edited by: Nikolai Nuvolari on 26/07/2005 22:28:54 We've already had this discussion a few weeks ago, and we very thoroughly worked out the solution. It is called the Panther, and it is death and beauty in the perfect form. And I love it. It's got: 8 high slots, 6 med slots, 4 low slots 7 turret hardpoints, 1 missile hardpoint Bonuses are +5% large hybrid turret damage and +5% large hybrid turret rate of fire Dronebay would either be very small, or nonexistant. We never really resolved that. Now if only we could convince the Devs to code it in... And every person with any sense shot down that idea because that would be the most overpowered ship of any class in the game. I don't know how you got the impression that "every person with any sense shot down that idea" unless you've stopped reading and started projecting your opinions onto everyone else. And no, it would not be the most overpowered ship of any class in the game. Even among battleships it wouldn't be the most powerful...it's really a very specialized sniper. It has almost no short range defence because 425mm railguns can't hit at close range, it has only one missile launcher, and it doesn't have drones. As far as ALL ship classes go, it's still vulnerable to the things that all other battleships are vulnerable to, probably more so... And if you decide to fit blasters? the hybrid bonus' dont just affect 425s u know... I would hardly call it a very specialized sniper.. ATUK Killboard \| 5 Killboard
DrunkenOne	Posted - 2005.08.01 04:52:00 - [74] Edited by: DrunkenOne on 01/08/2005 04:55:00 Originally by: Carth Jared Originally by: Nikolai Nuvolari Originally by: DrunkenOne Originally by: Nikolai Nuvolari Edited by: Nikolai Nuvolari on 26/07/2005 22:28:54 We've already had this discussion a few weeks ago, and we very thoroughly worked out the solution. It is called the Panther, and it is death and beauty in the perfect form. And I love it. It's got: 8 high slots, 6 med slots, 4 low slots 7 turret hardpoints, 1 missile hardpoint Bonuses are +5% large hybrid turret damage and +5% large hybrid turret rate of fire Dronebay would either be very small, or nonexistant. We never really resolved that. Now if only we could convince the Devs to code it in... And every person with any sense shot down that idea because that would be the most overpowered ship of any class in the game. I don't know how you got the impression that "every person with any sense shot down that idea" unless you've stopped reading and started projecting your opinions onto everyone else. And no, it would not be the most overpowered ship of any class in the game. Even among battleships it wouldn't be the most powerful...it's really a very specialized sniper. It has almost no short range defence because 425mm railguns can't hit at close range, it has only one missile launcher, and it doesn't have drones. As far as ALL ship classes go, it's still vulnerable to the things that all other battleships are vulnerable to, probably more so... And if you decide to fit blasters? the hybrid bonus' dont just affect 425s u know... I would hardly call it a very specialized sniper.. onos a person with sense . It would heavily outdamage a blasterthron (2 damage bonuses), while having 6 mids to shield tank on leaving all the lows for mag stabs. Meaning that basically, instead of having to choose "should i fit for gank and kill him fast before he kills me, or should i fit a tank and outlast him," your dreamship could do both. Hell you could even fit a 6 slot ew setup while still outdamaging a gankageddon or blasterthron. Originally by: Sochin CCP has provided you with the tools you need to avoid crime. You're just too lazy/stupid to use them.
Skyraker7	Posted - 2005.08.01 05:25:00 - [75] I never thought I would say this... but I like the changes. Average your skills out to 3-4 and then go fit 6 cruise and 4 BCU, it's awesome to watch. Whoever mentioned that Caldari has been outside PVP now for a year is exactly right, it was frustrating to have someone taking shots at you from 50km away while your torps s l o w l y made their way to the target. Now it's great! Sure frigates are a bit of a bugger but use drones. Now I was unhappy when I heard the changes but after a bit of training and experimentation it works just fine. Besides if it was over nerfed CCP will rebalance in the future. Cheers sKy
Karneh Vorous	Posted - 2005.08.01 06:30:00 - [76] I flew the Raven before the patch, I'm still flying the Raven now. Yeah, the day after the patch came out I thought the ship was garbage but, now that I've trained the skills and got 2 up to 5 and the rest to 4.... I couldn't be happier. I actually killed a frig doing 3000m/s this week without using a Nos. I certainly couldn't have done that before the patch. Invest some tme and the Raven is just as deadly as it was before. Otherwise, fly another ship or (laughs) put some guns on the Raven.
Vice Cicero	Posted - 2005.08.01 06:39:00 - [77] I like just as it is right now. Agree torps give less damage but the cruise is perfect!
Joshua Calvert	Posted - 2005.08.01 08:27:00 - [78] I think people should start listing their setups/appropriate skills if they start requesting changes to a ship. LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!
Nikolai Nuvolari	Posted - 2005.08.01 23:03:00 - [79] Edited by: Nikolai Nuvolari on 01/08/2005 23:03:30 Originally by: Carth Jared And if you decide to fit blasters? the hybrid bonus' dont just affect 425s u know... I would hardly call it a very specialized sniper.. Originally by: DrunkenOne It would heavily outdamage a blasterthron (2 damage bonuses) Alright. I didn't come up with the bonuses, but I'll propose a change to them. The bonuses will be +5% optimal range and +5% falloff range. Okay? Happy? That's about the most specialized sniper you're going to get. This would also keep it from outdamaging a Megathron with blasters. Originally by: DrunkenOne while having 6 mids to shield tank on leaving all the lows for mag stabs. Meaning that basically, instead of having to choose "should i fit for gank and kill him fast before he kills me, or should i fit a tank and outlast him," your dreamship could do both. All Caldari ships have a lot of medslots. So all Caldari ships can fit a shield tank and fill their few lowslots with magnetic field stabilizers or ballistic controls, but you're not complaining about those ships. Originally by: DrunkenOne Hell you could even fit a 6 slot ew setup while still outdamaging a blasterthron. Originally by: DrunkenOne it could be used as a great EW platform as well because even though it doesnt get the bonuses like a scorp, its still able to deal out ridiculous damage so the EW is just a bonus. And then, like you said, it can't tank. And even with the twin damage bonuses, I don't think its 4 lowslots would have allowed it to outdamage a Megathron with 7 lowslots, but it certainly can't with optimal and falloff bonuses. ___________________________________________ ^^^*---All things serve the Beam---*^^^ GDBT is recruiting!
Theron Gyrow	Posted - 2005.08.02 12:50:00 - [80] Originally by: Sorja Even Minmatar have full turret options for every class (is this correct?), I think Caldari should have the same option as others. No worry, that is not correct. All Minmatar cruisers need to have two high slots something else than turrets, Cyclone is split 5/3 (8 high slots), Typhoon is 4/4 (8 high slots) and even Tempest is 6/4 (again 8 high slots).

Zandramus	Posted - 2005.08.02 13:36:00 - [81] Edited by: Zandramus on 02/08/2005 13:37:57 I found a good use for my Raven last night... Insurance Fraud.... 108m for a useless pile of crap works for me 13d till I can use tech 2 large lasers woot... Zandramus S.A.S


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