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Malena
   |
Posted - 2005.07.27 01:17:00 -
[1]
additional leadership skill requests/petition/idea, whatever you want to call it. (of course, only the highest level counts)
Skill name: Ice Miner Synergy
Description: when in a gang, the harmonics of the gang's lasers are forced into balance, thereby reducing the cycle time.
Effect: 2% reduction in cycle time per level.
Skill name: Ore miner synergy
Description: when in a gang, the natural tendency to try and outdo the person next to you results in a higher production all around.
Effect: 1.5% increase in mining laser efficiency per level.
Thoughts? Signatures?
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Zeetre
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Posted - 2005.07.27 01:25:00 -
[2]
 good idea! anything to improve ice mining production.. let's face it.. it's work.. and that detracts from the game.. be nice to see such skills become available
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Zenst
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Posted - 2005.07.27 01:59:00 -
[3]
Dont see any harm in it and given the ever increaseing mineral demands why not drop em into the game.
Must admit when i first read your post I read "additional leadership skill requests/petition/idea, whatever you want to call it. (of course, only the highest level counts)" - and was laughing at the idea of leadership skills to request petitions :o).
SO yeah signed, even though I doubt I will directly take advantage of it myself, stilldont see any harm and offers some people a chance to be more welcome on minning ops instead of just bringing a poc wand 5/5 mining :).
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Omber Zombie
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Posted - 2005.07.27 10:44:00 -
[4]
would be a helpful addition for mining based corps. I may have suggested something similar a while back (in ideas forum) but as a corp management skill for ceo's to help create niche roles for corps.
-----------
I have a blog
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Syrec
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Posted - 2005.07.27 14:16:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Syrec on 27/07/2005 14:16:48
I think it should be more than that. You were too modest with the bonus'. I think gangs of miners should get +25% yield at skill level 5/5, if one of them has it. It will give more insentive for group mining. I'd make it a rank 2, with only mining IV as a prerequ, so that newer players don't have to wait a year to train it.
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Ricdic
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Posted - 2005.07.27 19:07:00 -
[6]
As CEO of a mass mining corp, we would kill for these skills. Or any sort of love from CCP would be nice. The last real increase we got was what 6 months ago, when osprey's and minmatr cruiser (forget name) got the mining bonus.
Barges dont count, because weighing a large with an apoc is way too close for a highly SPECIALISED mining ship. Sorry, just a drop of whine in a great idea.
------------------------------------------
Dreadnought Production INC is recruiting
Join DPI Channel Or Visit (IGB)
http://www.mmorpg-online.net/intro.html |
GrendelPrime
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Posted - 2005.07.28 02:19:00 -
[7]
This sounds like a cool idea, can't remember the last time I turned on a mining laser though.
But as someone who has provided cover/security for many a corp Ice mine... anything that lets my corp m8's mine faster so we can get it down quicker gets two big thumbs up from me.
"Though you may die, do not give up your honor"
-- Miyamoto Musashi
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Degs
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Posted - 2005.07.28 17:18:00 -
[8]
COOL,
Anything that will help the smaller corps compete sonds good to me! Its always the larger corps that seem to get all the advantages-give the little guy a chance CCP!
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hectiQ
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Posted - 2005.08.01 00:47:00 -
[9]
This would really be a great skill :)
I hope CCP reads this 
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Delacho
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Posted - 2005.08.01 11:16:00 -
[10]
signed
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Morydor
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Posted - 2005.08.01 21:27:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Morydor on 01/08/2005 21:27:08
Signed |
seanb29
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Posted - 2005.08.01 22:10:00 -
[12]
Signed
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Gutsani
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Posted - 2005.08.02 19:13:00 -
[13]
wont harm the game, signed
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TuRtLe HeAd
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Posted - 2005.08.04 07:10:00 -
[14]
/signed
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Chaotic Mind
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Posted - 2005.08.04 08:15:00 -
[15]
signed with every hand I got,
we got so many gang skills for combat, why don't we have some for miners.
GO OVEUR GO
*whip* 
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Amiga A4000
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Posted - 2005.08.04 09:45:00 -
[16]
More mine synergy skills needed, lets have 'em for all mineing tasks.
Don't try to be a great man,
just be a man and let history
make it's own judgements.
 |
Jarelle
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Posted - 2005.08.04 19:16:00 -
[17]
Signed!
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Bedrock
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Posted - 2005.08.04 19:34:00 -
[18]
great idea! Mining in gangs should always been encouraged, it reduces those afk-miners/macro-miners (although they will always still exist) but this gives others a more incentive for mining ops.
I like it.
/signed
----------------------------------------------
[apparent-dreams.com] |
Sandivar
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Posted - 2005.08.05 13:03:00 -
[19]
Absolutely signed!
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Henri Trader
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Posted - 2005.08.06 08:28:00 -
[20]
Signed!!!
That would be a great incentive for group mining ops!
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Cobra64
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Posted - 2005.08.06 10:37:00 -
[21]
Signed, encourages teamplay
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Tar Ecthelion
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Posted - 2005.08.06 21:27:00 -
[22]
Signed
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zoturi
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Posted - 2005.08.06 21:31:00 -
[23]
Edited by: zoturi on 06/08/2005 21:31:25
double post..
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zoturi
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Posted - 2005.08.06 21:31:00 -
[24]
Signed
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Malena
|
Posted - 2005.08.09 19:38:00 -
[25]
The response I have gotten in game is that some folks think the bonus to the ice mining synergy should be higher...I would love to see it at 5%, but I just don't see CCP making it that high...they seem to love making things difficult on the POS owning players...I.E. the problem with projectile guns in engaging targets, the issue where the POS is using more fuel than it is supposed to, the sheer pain-in-the-assness of ice mining...
So, at least some bonus is better than none....
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mamolian
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Posted - 2005.08.09 21:13:00 -
[26]
I think this is a great idea.. Leadership has already gotten some boosts in the last patch, with leadership modules etc.. Adding one for mining would be nice, and definitly somthing id max on the way to pimping meh covetor.
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Uisige Beatha
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Posted - 2005.08.10 12:59:00 -
[27]
signed, group mining will cheer up the miners no end
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Pecksi
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Posted - 2005.08.11 05:17:00 -
[28]
Absolutely signed! Rank II skill with 2% increase in efficiency /lvl would be ok, even.
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Linia
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Posted - 2005.08.11 05:41:00 -
[29]
signed!
This would be a MUST to all miners!
Currently Training: Heavy Drone Operation V  /Rank5/ |
Malena
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Posted - 2005.08.16 16:24:00 -
[30]
kicked up because we need more response if there is ever going to be a change...
on a slightly different subject, anyone know why you can sort the roid scanner by type and by amount remaining, but not distance?
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Valynn Fylahd
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Posted - 2005.08.16 18:40:00 -
[31]
signed
_____________________
It pays being a *****! |
Red lensman
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Posted - 2005.08.16 18:42:00 -
[32]
sign
Great idea to encourge mining ops
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Harry MacDougal
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Posted - 2005.08.16 19:00:00 -
[33]
Great idea. It would miners tons while not detracting much from anywhere else. It might even drop prices a little, with more minerals coming in.
--------------
Its just a matter of semantics. You call it a drinking problem, and I call it a reality exit strategy... |
ilandri
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Posted - 2005.08.16 19:44:00 -
[34]
weve been talking about somthing like this to help miners and get people minning togerther again like back in the day. i hope ccp decides to notice and implemant somthign like this.
signed
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Santiac
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Posted - 2005.08.16 19:52:00 -
[35]
from the "In Development":
Needful Things for Mining
We should add some simple improvements for Mining which are already available for various combat situations. Things like Implants, Leadership Skills/Modules, Tech 2 barges, new skills and perhaps even new modules!
:)
________________________________________
<insert clever/witty comment here>
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Troezar
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Posted - 2005.08.16 20:22:00 -
[36]
My new campaign is more mining yield = cheaper ships = more pvp = more fun
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Agent F
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Posted - 2005.08.17 01:02:00 -
[37]
/.signed
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Rafein
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Posted - 2005.08.17 09:49:00 -
[38]
Personally, I don;t see leadership really affecting mining yields. Unless a leader can convince a laser to pull more ore in.
What I would like to se is more mining turrets, maybe a few skills. I would like to see a new line mining turrets that require a lot more cap, but in return give more minerals per cycle. Kinda like how large lasers do more damage, buy drain more cap than
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Malena
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Posted - 2005.08.19 20:30:00 -
[39]
Edited by: Malena on 19/08/2005 20:30:34
 Originally by: Rafein
Personally, I don;t see leadership really affecting mining yields. Unless a leader can convince a laser to pull more ore in.
So tell me then, how do you see leadership affecting the armor total? Somehow leaders are capable of making a ship put out more armor, shields, speed and targetting speed, yet you don't think they should be able to convince more from a mining laser? Weak argument, IMO.
Originally by: Rafein
What I would like to se is more mining turrets, maybe a few skills. I would like to see a new line mining turrets that require a lot more cap, but in return give more minerals per cycle. Kinda like how large lasers do more damage, buy drain more cap than
How much more new line do you want? We have miner 2s, they have been in the game for a long time, as have ice miners. Granted, Ice miner 2s are something we need, I admit that, but that is a matter of time, not design. I am not saying they woulnd't be nice, or that I wouldn't use them, what I am saying is, the likelihood of getting them is virtually none... The likelihood of the gang skills being implemented is actually pretty high if we can get enough people to speak loudly enough about wanting it.
As another additional idea, perhaps a bit of coding where the more people you have in the gang, and within say, 100km of each other, the bigger the bonus to mining yield.
Malena
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Dr Grimm
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Posted - 2005.08.20 15:53:00 -
[40]
Some fantastic ideas! Group mining bonuses are most definately needed in the game to balance the ones available for combat.
Signed.
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franny
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Posted - 2005.08.20 22:06:00 -
[41]
signed
please for the sake of what little sanity I have left, make mining faster so I have to spend less time staring at the rocks |
m4d cows
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Posted - 2005.08.21 02:12:00 -
[42]
Gank miner skills 300% more dmg to barges thats an good idea 
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Dale Omen
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Posted - 2005.08.21 02:21:00 -
[43]
More work for the haulers,lol.
Signed
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jazmu
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Posted - 2005.08.21 05:20:00 -
[44]
Signed, definetely.
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Caldess
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Posted - 2005.08.21 22:22:00 -
[45]
*gasp* Someone has good ideas to reduce the length of time someone has to spend doing what is easily the most boring thing in any MMORPG ever?
Signed.
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Gunther Dwendel
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Posted - 2005.08.22 03:25:00 -
[46]
Do it, great idea.
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00'00
|
Posted - 2005.08.22 04:23:00 -
[47]
Signed
No guarantee of sanity under this line:
---------------------------------------
Dance Dance Mammoth - Revolution |
LittleHorror
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Posted - 2005.08.22 07:49:00 -
[48]
Signed
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Kadarin
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Posted - 2005.08.22 08:32:00 -
[49]
Nice ideas. I like it..
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Cassandra Nova
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Posted - 2005.08.22 13:24:00 -
[50]
Signed 
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Rendill
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Posted - 2005.08.23 00:08:00 -
[51]
I like it. Could even have a gang assist module or two to go with it.
/signed
CEO |
Emeline Cabernet
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Posted - 2005.08.23 06:13:00 -
[52]
/Signed
This is a good idea.
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VodkaMan
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Posted - 2005.08.23 06:59:00 -
[53]
Signed
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Carragan
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Posted - 2005.08.23 14:00:00 -
[54]
/Signed |
Kayne Darklight
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Posted - 2005.08.23 22:09:00 -
[55]
Edited by: Kayne Darklight on 23/08/2005 22:16:22
/signed
"The universe consists of little people, and players. The little people obey the rules, the players make them. Which would you rather be?"
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Arleonenis
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Posted - 2005.08.24 11:16:00 -
[56]
signed
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Everlyn
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Posted - 2005.08.24 14:22:00 -
[57]
i don't mine a lot, but it's nice ;)
* signed
Everlyn
Brave New World - CEO
OPUS Alliance
German Gaming Community |
valhalla MCMLXXIV
|
Posted - 2005.08.24 15:01:00 -
[58]
signed....
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Aldelphius
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Posted - 2005.08.24 18:20:00 -
[59]
signed. We need to encourage group actvity, not discourage it.
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Piter
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Posted - 2005.08.25 20:33:00 -
[60]
YES !!!!!! more skills for mining or mod"s needed it gets way to boring to just sit and stare at the roid or scan for rats more group activity promoted great idea
been a miner for 2 yrs now would be nice to have a brake |
Fingalickin
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Posted - 2005.08.26 07:19:00 -
[61]
Edited by: Fingalickin on 26/08/2005 07:20:39
Signed
Definately would help, my corp does lots of group mining, for individual profit and corp stocks (As i'm sure lots of others do!) skills like these would be fantastic.
"Don't mess with the Chicken! It tastes soooooo Goooood!" |
numember1
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Posted - 2005.08.26 10:12:00 -
[62]
wonderful, i will have a try
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Henri Trader
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Posted - 2005.08.28 11:10:00 -
[63]
signed,why not give us miners some love after all the love that has been given to pvp
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CelticKnight
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Posted - 2005.08.29 08:23:00 -
[64]
/signed!
Anything to reduce SM cycle times..
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000Hunter000
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Posted - 2005.08.29 12:49:00 -
[65]
Oh yes, SIGNED!!!
I mean ccp wants us to start on 'professions' right? Well one of my professions is mining, so a few more advanced miningskills would be nice.
Esp something that gives an added benefit to barges and T2 stripminers, i mean were allready getting a bit 'nerfed' there anyways, now the miningcrystals will deteriorate after the next patch :(
signature? What signature? ;) |
roBurky
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Posted - 2005.08.30 09:22:00 -
[66]
I think mining leadership stuff is a great idea. But to fit in with the new style leadership skills, there would have to be a normal leadership skill, a specialist leadership skill, and leadership modules to fit to a battlecruiser.
Industrial Warfare
- 2% bonus to mining yield.
Industrial Warfare Specialist
- 100% bonus to Industrial Warfare modules
Industrial Warfare Link - Collective Harvesting
- 2% reduction in ice harvester cycle time
Industrial Warfare Link - Centralised Mining
- 2% bonus to mining laser range
Industrial Warfare Link - Strip Mining
- 2% bonus to strip miner mining yield.
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Mc Bane
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Posted - 2005.08.31 06:16:00 -
[67]
signed
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Verrul
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Posted - 2005.08.31 13:32:00 -
[68]
signed as a mfl
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Sunflare
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Posted - 2005.09.01 10:36:00 -
[69]
Signed would love this
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Aliksr
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Posted - 2005.09.02 00:07:00 -
[70]
heh you guys got it
New Mining Gang Modules
T2 Mining Barges
Mining Implants, Mindlink
so there you go, they're sneaking this into the patch for T2 BS. expect it to be delayed several times and eat into the kali release date :)
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Trell Asaker
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Posted - 2005.09.03 22:22:00 -
[71]
Signed
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Oreah
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Posted - 2005.09.04 10:11:00 -
[72]
ooh Maa gawd
Signed !
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Fellater
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Posted - 2005.09.05 12:26:00 -
[73]
I very much appreciate the goal, something / anything needs to be done to make mining more rewarding.
In addition to this idea I'd like to see changes that promote the use of specialised mining vessels; barges, scythe, osprey etc over others. One way would be to introduce lasers / modules that can only be fitted, or only give a bonus, when mounted on these ships. Another would be to create slot 1 / 2 modules that can only be fitted to ships with a mining bonus. These modules would boost mining output per turret.
At the risk or upsetting the Apoc mining community I don't see why a Battleship should be able to outmine all other ships but the largest barge.
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Alvara
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Posted - 2005.09.05 15:19:00 -
[74]
Love the idea.
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Phoenixhawk
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Posted - 2005.09.07 06:08:00 -
[75]
*Signed*
Stay Chilly & Watch Your Six! |
Kamigaze
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Posted - 2005.09.07 06:48:00 -
[76]
Signed!!!
|
Messerschmitt facility
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Posted - 2005.09.07 07:03:00 -
[77]
Sure, I will buy my ice cheaper
_________________________________
A conclusion is the place where you got tired of thinking...
|
Ciana
|
Posted - 2005.09.07 08:55:00 -
[78]
Signed! 
|
s4mp3r0r
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Posted - 2005.09.07 12:09:00 -
[79]
signed, with 3 mains and 6 alts.
Proud ex-CEO of the official Verone Fanclub.
Convo Mirel yirrin ingame for details on how to join, and a free " I ♥ Verone Ö" Bumpersticker!! |
Samuel G
|
Posted - 2005.09.08 05:40:00 -
[80]
Signed :)
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Doktor Soet
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Posted - 2005.09.08 09:28:00 -
[81]
signed!
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jaynee
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Posted - 2005.09.13 12:51:00 -
[82]
Edited by: jaynee on 13/09/2005 12:52:58
signed
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scotayne hawkins
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Posted - 2005.09.13 12:52:00 -
[83]
very good idea hope they bring it in soon small corps like mine really struggle to get going due to small numbers of miners in corp so any bonus's are highly welcome.
Signed
CEO of strike combat supplies
|
Ishahn
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Posted - 2005.09.15 07:26:00 -
[84]
signed
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De Tol
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Posted - 2005.09.15 15:13:00 -
[85]
Originally by: Bedrock
great idea! Mining in gangs should always been encouraged, it reduces those afk-miners/macro-miners (although they will always still exist) but this gives others a more incentive for mining ops.
I like it.
/signed
and i hoped i got away form the macro AFk guys when i starte eve last week no you tell me they do it here  well i like the sound of it and as a new be i thin it would be fun
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Mystrin
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Posted - 2005.09.16 02:47:00 -
[86]
Signed, this would be great to have !!
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VodkaMan
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Posted - 2005.09.16 07:57:00 -
[87]
Mining implant already in game - it gives +5% mining yield
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Hasan Rachid
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Posted - 2005.09.16 11:24:00 -
[88]
/signed
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Carden
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Posted - 2005.09.19 11:25:00 -
[89]
Signed |
Karmic
|
Posted - 2005.09.19 14:01:00 -
[90]
Edited by: Karmic on 19/09/2005 14:07:14
Edited by: Karmic on 19/09/2005 14:04:01
Edited by: Karmic on 19/09/2005 14:01:54
Seleene posted this link somewhere a while ago and said it was a skill that they were going to get. 
(the link being http://evegames.hostingbig.com/eve/sissi/Skills@~32;@~38;@~32;Accessories/Skills/Leadership/Mining@~32;Foreman.xml )
- - - - - - - - -
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Retrax
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Posted - 2005.09.19 16:09:00 -
[91]
Originally by: Malena
Skill name: Ore miner synergy
Description: when in a gang, the natural tendency to try and outdo the person next to you results in a higher production all around.
Effect: 1.5% increase in mining laser efficiency per level.
LOL I like it.
+5% to Industrials' speed and maneuverability? :D
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000Hunter000
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Posted - 2005.09.19 22:05:00 -
[92]
Well sofar no real opposition!
I do hope CCP is listening THIS time.
signature? What signature? ;) |
Draka
|
Posted - 2005.09.20 04:32:00 -
[93]
/signed
|
zacuis
|
Posted - 2005.09.20 11:52:00 -
[94]
this is a fantastic idea i love it. i totally agree that miners should get leadership bonus`s. why do combatants seem to get all the good stuff. also how about a bonus to hauler size or speed when in a mining group perhaps a mining drone bonus too.
totally signed
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Damar Stiehl
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Posted - 2005.09.21 07:31:00 -
[95]
signed
|
Sequince
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Posted - 2005.09.22 07:01:00 -
[96]
Mining Based leadership skill set 4TW. Great idea. SIGNED
FEER THE EEK!
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Malkaar
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Posted - 2005.09.22 11:27:00 -
[97]
signed!
|
Drakolus
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Posted - 2005.09.22 14:59:00 -
[98]
Definately Signed...A HUGE bonus for small corp's mining ops.
Molden Heath Local #473 |
Aion Amarra
|
Posted - 2005.09.23 17:33:00 -
[99]
Hum. I just took a look at this database here.
If you browse the Leadership category, you will notice two skills. Mining Foreman and Mining Foreman Specialist.
What struck me as interesting is that 'Mining Foreman' according to the stats in the database provides a 5%(!) bonus to mining yield per level.
Also, under ship equipment -> Gang Coorinators, you will find the three according modules.
Mining Foreman - Crystal Optimization
Mining Foreman - Drone Gathering
Mining Foreman - Ice Harvesting
Sounds interesting. But the stats don't tell what those mods do exactly.
Anyways. It looks like the devs are looking into it. ^_^
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Malena
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Posted - 2005.09.27 13:47:00 -
[100]
Sweeeeet. Thanks for that update. Nice to see...and the link actually worked for me, not like the earlier ones which gave me a 404.
I can only hope that the skills and modules make their debut soon... And that the dedicated command ships make their appearance as well.
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Malena
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Posted - 2005.11.02 22:47:00 -
[101]
I know that the @#$* drone changes and the even more #@$)(* mark 2 modifications are at the forefront of everyone's testing desires, but has anyone seen anything about this recently? Any test server lurkers out there?
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Josclyn Verreuil
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Posted - 2005.11.04 21:38:00 -
[102]
Additional mining mods and abilities (leadership was mentioned i believe) are mentioned from the fanfest blog if I'm not mistaken, slated for RMR.
~Verreuil Inc. |
Tricore
|
Posted - 2005.11.05 12:42:00 -
[103]
I hate mining, but it wont hurt the game so... Signed.
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Tregaa Viskne
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Posted - 2005.11.05 13:14:00 -
[104]
/ Signed, definitely definitel signed.
and those skills on the database explorer look good :)
Except, the secondary for Mining Foreman Specialist is showing up as Siege Warfare at V... presumably that's meant to be Mining Foreman at V?
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Elrianmk2
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Posted - 2005.11.05 19:10:00 -
[105]
/signed
|
eicon
|
Posted - 2005.11.07 04:32:00 -
[106]
signed |
Lord Timelord
|
Posted - 2005.11.07 05:54:00 -
[107]
/signed.
This is needed with all the new items like Freighters, Dreadnoughts, and Outposts to name a few. Will make mining all the minerals to build them a little more managable.
__________
Visit GETCo's website at http://getco.guildportal.com/ |
Ralitge boyter
|
Posted - 2005.11.07 08:26:00 -
[108]
Just an idea,
CCP is putting in the mining stuff lots of new skills to learn for you mininers out there and lots and lots of new goodies.
Why not work on the rocks next?
What do I mean? Well its simple the way roks are currently spread out all over the universe all in a default size is well wrong.
How come that there is not a freak occurance out there where a omber rock is huge compaird to its normal standarized size. Why not have a veldspar rock which after scaning proves to also have traces of a more valubale mineral in it. With the right skills one could refine this special rock and get the more valuable stuff out.
Make mining more of an exciting thing where one could go exploring and find belts that contain better rocks than what one could see on the service. Right now CCP has just not put it on the map but one could very simply make a map of a region with exactly what belts contain which rocks in what quantities which rats are most likely to spawn and thus what would be the most profitable place to mine without having to even bother to look around ever again after making such a map once.
Please, CCP the mining gadgets are great but please make a more substancial change to the way the rocks are spawned, stop the downtime regrowth and make it redistribute. Setup a single server to do the recalculation and have it do the recalculation of a single region per down time. Makes for a several day loop in the way roids are distributed and will make miners have to re-think the usefullnes of their bookmarks.
I think CCP should put the excitment in mining instead of supporting the fat bloke in his underware browsing a **** site while sucking in the rocks without even looking at the screen.
-------------------------------------------
Should you disagree with me, well I guess that is because I disagree with you. If you have a problem with that please feel free not to tell me. |
Kazhoth
|
Posted - 2005.11.07 16:39:00 -
[109]
It would support more teamwork.. great idea.
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Khajit Smitty
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Posted - 2005.11.08 20:24:00 -
[110]
I really like the mining leadership bonus idea, brilliant however the only problem i can foresee with it is massive NPC corp gangs ganking the roids, but i suppose that this will be balanced out as the common ore types prices will crash due to increased supply and these players will move to low sec ultimately making CCP happier with more of us in low sec.
Good idea overall. !!
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Azaeren
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Posted - 2005.11.08 21:01:00 -
[111]
i just want better ore in lowsec systems, so miners will come there..and i can gank them.
the 'skill' should have a low increase though, 2-3% per level. requiring mining 5, science 5, and be a level 4 skill. |
MirvZero
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Posted - 2005.11.16 20:16:00 -
[112]
SIGNED, stamped, and approved =)
especially for ice mining
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KANE47
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Posted - 2005.11.17 00:51:00 -
[113]
/SIGNED. anything that could possibly make ice mining faster is a good thing in my book.
Make Ice Mining Faster. |
Malena
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Posted - 2005.11.29 23:34:00 -
[114]
anyone on SISI able to see if this is in with the current patch?
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Brannigan McCormick
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Posted - 2005.11.30 22:45:00 -
[115]
I'm checking SiSi almost daily for signs of mining improvement (pretty sure I read in a blog that 4 skills, and new modules would be available in RmR)
As of just now, nothing to that effect, at all (well, except for Elite Mining Barge skill, that is, but that skill is not finalized yet, i'm sure, as Mining Barge isn't a prereq yet)
T2 barges are in, although I SERIOUSLY hope they aren't final yet, only differences are med-slots, and at little boost in shield/armor/resistances. 
/Bran - Its good for you |
Ricardo Pt
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Posted - 2005.12.02 05:03:00 -
[116]
Signed
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teemu 2004
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Posted - 2005.12.03 18:20:00 -
[117]
i like this one. as said this would encourage group mining and make mining ice atleast a bit easier
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Cyclops43
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Posted - 2005.12.03 23:18:00 -
[118]
My vote would be against something like this. Not because I'm against miners (I'm not), but because it'll not have any effect at all.
Now, you'll probably all disagree, but there are a number of reasons why this is a fact.
1. First and foremost, the big problem miners today face is not that you can mine too little ore. The BIG problem is macro-miners (not trying to or wanting to hi-jack the thread, but it has to be mentioned). Macro-miners are the main reason ore prices are low, and a skills like this will ALSO be exploited my MM's. If CCP can remove the MM's, then your profession will become much more profitable.
2. Second reason has something to do with game-design. Generally when running a multi-player game, the worst threat against the game itself is inflation. A very fine balance has to be achieved where money leave the game as fast at they are put into the game. This'll not help that.
3. The third reason is pure economics. For the ore you mine to have value, there has to be someone who build something from it, and whatever is built has to be used and USED UP! This means that for you to earn more from producing more ore, each player in EVE on average has to use more resources, i.e. has to fire more ammo, loose more ships/equip etc. The current use of resources has determined that ore has the price it has today, and there is no reason to believe that because ore is more plentiful people will use more of it. If you suddenly start to produce more ore, then what will happen is not that ore will keep its pricetag and miners will earn more money. No, ore prices will drop, and miners will probably end up earning the same or slightly less than now on average.
4. I'm guessing on this one, but my guess it that behind the scenes of CCP, there is a set of very complicated functions/algorithms that determine how this games economics is running. These algorithms decide whether miners will be allowed to earn more, not the wishes of miners or game designers.
5. At the moment, when I mine (using a Retriever), I'm making just about the same money as I do when running level 3 combat missions in a Ferox. If exceptional LP offers are taken into account, the missions earn a small amount more. Both of these activities take place in high-sec. I thus see no justification in making it easier for miners to earn money (even if my assumptions about economics above are wrong). After all, mining in high-sec does not entail any risk, while mission running has risk (maybe small, but it's there).
Just my 0.02 ISK
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Malena
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Posted - 2005.12.04 04:08:00 -
[119]
Edited by: Malena on 04/12/2005 04:14:10
Edited by: Malena on 04/12/2005 04:11:02
Just out of curiosity, what do you think is going to happen to ore prices and availability when titans enter the game, or as more people are able to afford the skills and train them for freighters and dreadnaughts?
No one is saying this should be easy, no one said "give it to us and make it a rank 1 skill" I personally think it should be at least a rank 6. And yes, it likely would be exploited by macro-miners. But there isn't anything that can't be exploited if you are creative enough.
From the sound of it, you use your retriever for ore mining... have you ever used it for ice mining, seen how incredibly tedious ice-mining can be. And there are only two skills that are directly related to ice mining...the barge skill itself so you can use more of them, and the ice-harvesting skill, which reduces the cycle time from "I want to stick my eye in front of this laser as it goes off because I am so bored" to "well, at least now I can go to the bathroom and maybe I will have finished the cycle by then" With the synergy skill, at least you could put even more...impetus on your corp mates to come help you keep the POS alive because with more of them, you would actually be increasing your production.
I agree with you on at least one thing directly though: inflation is a major problem in any MMO. However, it isn't mining, or even macro mining that caused the most major inflation issues recently...it is the insane amount of cash that was obtained by people for MISSIONS...but that is another subject entirely.
True, high sec mining entails little risk...I honestly hadn't considered that angle. Perhaps it should be something only allowed to work in .5 or below. It shouldn't be all that difficult to code, given that there are checks against the security rating of a system when someone deploys a tower, or when someone jumps into a CONCORD controlled area.
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Cyclops43
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Posted - 2005.12.04 11:32:00 -
[120]
Malena, I assume your questions were for me :-)
Hopefully ore prices will go up when new RMR stuff comes in. It is likely since a lot of people will want new gear, and the same has happened before with other expansions. After a while though, prices will start dropping again.
Unfortunately though, I think that RMR will also attract new macro miners. Why? Simply because everyone will want the new gear, and since a lot of it (at least in the start) will be very expensive, even more people will buy ISK online to get it first. More ISK customers = more macro miners or sweatshop miners.
I have tried ice mining. Exactly 2 ice cubes (a retrievers worth). It is boring, yes, but the main reason I didn't do more is that the ice market has been completely and utterly obliterated by macro miners. You earn more mining high-sec scordite than ice.
Inflation. You are incorrect in only using ISK as a measure for value in MMO's. To measure value creation in an MMO you have to look at everything players can create from nothing. In EVE's case, this is ISK, Ore and Loot. All of them are interchangable (at a certain exchange rate), so creating one is equivalent to creating another as they all add to the combined wealth pool. I know this keenly as I way back was one of the admins of a major MUD, and resource inflation was THE biggest problem.
The distribution between these 3 are determined by simple economics, with people accumulating the one that is worth most because it flow SLOWEST into the system, in our case ISK. Since in our case ISK is also the official trading medium, that also contributes to the desire to collect them.
However, from my outside view (I haven't got access to CCP's algorithms and logs, though I would dearly like to  ), it seems to me like resources of all 3 kinds are not leaving the game fast enough, or that resources are coming in too fast. I would actually venture the suggestion that mining output should be REDUCED across the board, loot should be REDUCED accross the board, and mission money should be REDUCED accross the board. Either that, or danger levels should be increased so people loose more stuff. At the moment, if you stay in high-sec and have a minimum of intelligence, you do not loose resources except for ammo. This, I think, should change.
On your last point with limiting new skills to low-sec, I think it would probably work, but I don't like limiting things that way as it ruins part of the consistency of the storyline. Why would these skills only work in low-sec? What is the explanation for this? The aim of EVE's storyline creators would probably be to create a consistent, natural seeming, universe, with rules that make sense. They can't always do that (spaceship movement...) for gameplay reasons, but I think their aim is to limit the number of 'unnatural' things to an absolute minimum.
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Amarria Lightwielder
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Posted - 2005.12.05 18:12:00 -
[121]
/signed, would make mining in a gang more profitable, and mining in a gang is always more fun, cuddly :)
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Maco Dragoon
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Posted - 2005.12.06 21:28:00 -
[122]
/sign
but here's how you keep this from negatively affecting the economy (keeping it out of the hands of solo Macro Miners)....... members of your gange must be mining the same rock for the effect to take place...... more miners per rock, the better the bonus.
or..... a minimum of players mining a single rock for the mod to kick in.
===========================
I am just another SOE SWG NGE Refugee.
===========================
Is there a Lightsaber trade in Program?
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Defiant99
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Posted - 2005.12.08 19:03:00 -
[123]
/sign
Any boost to mining would, as everyone says, be greatly appreciated. I know it's supposed to be time-consuming, but it'd be good to encourage group mining operations.
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Malena
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Posted - 2005.12.08 20:33:00 -
[124]
Edited by: Malena on 08/12/2005 20:34:05
oh that really sucks when you type in a long thought out response and it doesn't post for some reason. Oh well. Not that important.
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Tregaa Viskne
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Posted - 2005.12.08 23:24:00 -
[125]
Originally by: Maco Dragoon
but here's how you keep this from negatively affecting the economy (keeping it out of the hands of solo Macro Miners)....... members of your gange must be mining the same rock for the effect to take place...... more miners per rock, the better the bonus.
This would probably also have the bonus effect of moving all barge miners to low sec, where the rocks are bigger - I know I only get about 2 or 3 cycles on any decent kind of ore in a fairly quiet 0.6 system in my covetor. Not sure about ice though, I've never tried it.
On the points made about a bigger supply of ore causing inflation, I disagree - unless I'm missing something obvious. I shall explain....
The ore we mine is only bought by other players. Mining ore only equals more wealth if there is somebody willing to buy it, and somebody will only be willing to buy it if they want to build something with it. More mins being mined creates a larger supply for the builder, and so assuming the same demand as before, should mean cheaper build prices as miners cut sell prices to compete. In any environment where demand for the ships and mods being built is reasonably high, this should mean cheaper prices for people buying ships and modules, as the builders will then compete and cut margins back to approximately where they were before.
This should even itself out for miners and builders - they get their goods cheaper, but their income is cut too. For mission runners and npc goods traders, however, this should surely be good news; their income wont change, but ships, mods, ammo etc should be cheaper.
Of course, all of this doesn't take into account the incoming demand for huge amounts of low end minerals to build the new breeds of capital ships, but most of that will probably be done in low sec due to the jump drive sec. restrictions, so I'd guess wont really hit the core system prices in any major way.
This is the way I see it working out, but I've never done an economics 101 class or anything, so feel free to point out any painfully obvious flaws in my long drawn out theory 
Originally by: CCP Hammer
Boobies?
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Malena
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Posted - 2005.12.26 17:45:00 -
[126]
So if anyone has actually seen the skills (besides mining upgrades) or the bpos/modules for any of the new mining items, a bit of news about where and how much would be most appreciated!
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Mudkest
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Posted - 2005.12.26 19:56:00 -
[127]
signed(to bring the skills/mods that were promised in game :p)
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