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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
SengH
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Posted - 2006.02.13 23:53:00 -
[211]
fit sensor boosters then test the first module again. It seems they dropped that part out of the description. Its extending the sensor res bonus of sensor boosters.
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Komarkh
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Posted - 2006.02.14 00:01:00 -
[212]
Edited by: Komarkh on 14/02/2006 00:02:01
 Originally by: SengH
fit sensor boosters then test the first module again. It seems they dropped that part out of the description. Its extending the sensor res bonus of sensor boosters.
I tested this on sensor boosters ... no effect on them
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SengH
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Posted - 2006.02.14 02:03:00 -
[213]
Originally by: Komarkh
Edited by: Komarkh on 14/02/2006 00:02:01
Originally by: SengH
fit sensor boosters then test the first module again. It seems they dropped that part out of the description. Its extending the sensor res bonus of sensor boosters.
I tested this on sensor boosters ... no effect on them
they worked 2 weeks ago when I last checked. Unless they broke something in the meantime.
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Aleis
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Posted - 2006.02.14 23:29:00 -
[214]
Edited by: Aleis on 14/02/2006 23:30:01
Howdy all,
I've been lagging a bit on updating this thread but first info page has been updated to include Command ships and Mindlink (Although the mind link bonus is speculative since i don't have one)
I have a Claymore now and currently at lvl 3 so i have tested the formula directly against the numbers i've been getting.
Oh and Santiac your max bonuses are wrong you multiplied by 6 for teh Spec lvl instead of 5.
Correct Max Bonus
2% Base = 25.875%
3% Base = 38.8125%
Still for Gang wide that nothing to scoff at.
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Sarmaul
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Posted - 2006.02.14 23:43:00 -
[215]
ok, my brain hurts. can you give me the boosts for the 2% and 3% modules with:
Command Ships 4
xxx Specialization 4
both on a Fleet Command and a Field Command (should be the same as a regular bc right?) and no fancy implants fitted please?
thanks
Originally by: Jenny Spitfire
Sarmaul 4tw.  
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Tiuwaz
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Posted - 2006.02.15 00:39:00 -
[216]
Originally by: Sarmaul
ok, my brain hurts. can you give me the boosts for the 2% and 3% modules with:
Command Ships 4
xxx Specialization 4
both on a Fleet Command and a Field Command (should be the same as a regular bc right?) and no fancy implants fitted please?
thanks
Command Ships 4
xxx Specialization 4
Squadron Command 4
no implants
Fleet Command
2% base: 12,544
3% base: 18,816
Field Command (or normal BC)
2% base: 11,2
3% base: 16,8
Originally by: Oveur
****! Lets nerf it!
To the nerfmobile!
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Sarmaul
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Posted - 2006.02.15 00:44:00 -
[217]
Edited by: Sarmaul on 15/02/2006 00:45:46
Originally by: Tiuwaz
Originally by: Sarmaul
ok, my brain hurts. can you give me the boosts for the 2% and 3% modules with:
Command Ships 4
xxx Specialization 4
both on a Fleet Command and a Field Command (should be the same as a regular bc right?) and no fancy implants fitted please?
thanks
Command Ships 4
xxx Specialization 4
Squadron Command 4
no implants
Fleet Command
2% base: 12,544
3% base: 18,816
Field Command (or normal BC)
2% base: 11,2
3% base: 16,8
exactly what I wanted to know. thanks!
edit: omg at the web range on a Huginn/Rapier the propulsion jamming gang module active - 71.2896km with a domi web, and that's not even with maxed gang skills!!!!
Originally by: Jenny Spitfire
Sarmaul 4tw.
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Sarmaul
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Posted - 2006.02.15 00:52:00 -
[218]
don't suppose you've got the Command 5, Spec 5 and Squad 5 values for 2% and 3% handy? 
Originally by: Jenny Spitfire
Sarmaul 4tw.
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Tiuwaz
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Posted - 2006.02.15 01:00:00 -
[219]
Edited by: Tiuwaz on 15/02/2006 01:06:33
Originally by: Sarmaul
don't suppose you've got the Command 5, Spec 5 and Squad 5 values for 2% and 3% handy?
Command Ships 5
Squadron Command 5
xxx Specialization 5
no implant
Fleet Command
2% base: 17,25%
3% base: 25,875%
Field Command (or normal BC)
2% base: 15%
3% base: 22,5%
with implants
Fleet Command
2% base: 25,875%
3% base: 38,8125%
Field Command (or normal BC)
2% base: 22,5%
3% base: 33,5%
been doing the maths for myself today by coincidence 
edited: corrected a small brainfart
Originally by: Oveur
****! Lets nerf it!
To the nerfmobile!
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Aleis
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Posted - 2006.02.19 05:49:00 -
[220]
Edited by: Aleis on 19/02/2006 05:55:35
Might want to check your edited Barin fart Tuwaz,
cause your numbers on the max bonus, with the T1 ship and no implant, are off. i just jumped over to my regualr cyclone to double check and am getting a even 15% on Evasive Manuvers gang mod, **(Skirmish war spec lvl5 + Squad command lvl 5)**
for ease of compairsen for people that might not be planning on going all the way spec wise, I added to the first post two sets of max bonuses, one for maxed skills, fleet command bc and mindlink implant.
And another block for more economic training scheme, simple max skill in warfar spec, and squad command, as if you were flying a T1 BC or the Feild command with no implant.
Max Bonus (T1, or Feild Command BC, Without Mindlink)
2% Base = 15%
3% Base = 22.5%
Max Bonus (Fleet Command BC, With Mindlink)
2% Base = 25.875%
3% Base = 38.8125%
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SengH
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Posted - 2006.03.01 03:00:00 -
[221]
Ok guys... it seems our beloved gang mods got hit by bugs again.... time to sort out again whether their working everyone who can test please retest the mods with and without the fleet command BC to see if their working for you.
Information warfare - recon operation
Current Status: Bugged gives ~ 1.8% bonus when mod should be 18%. (Bugreported)
All Skirmish warfare mods
Confirmed to be working with both T1 BC and Claymore. Bonuses applying correctly.
I hope you guys could help out with this. Weve worked a long time to get them fixed and it seems like the bugs have crept back in.
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Monkar
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Posted - 2006.03.01 08:16:00 -
[222]
Edited by: Monkar on 01/03/2006 08:17:20
Quote:
Command Ships 5
Squadron Command 5
xxx Specialization 5
no implant
Fleet Command
2% base: 17,25%
3% base: 25,875%
Yes this is correct practise verifies as well, however i always wondered why the Specialization Multiplier isn't x 6.
Description states 100% Bonus to effectiveness per level.
So for a 2% link:
Level 1 boost from the link should be 4%. Level 2 boost 6%. Level 3 Boost 8%. Level 4 boost 10%. Level 5 boost 12%.
However the boost at level 5 is only 10%.
I never noticed if you actually get a bonus at level 1, but from what the desc of the skills states... the multiplier should start from x 2 (100%) and work it's way to x 6 (500%).
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TomB
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Posted - 2006.03.01 10:26:00 -
[223]
Originally by: SengH
Ok guys... it seems our beloved gang mods got hit by bugs again.... time to sort out again whether their working everyone who can test please retest the mods with and without the fleet command BC to see if their working for you.
Information warfare - recon operation
Current Status: Bugged gives ~ 1.8% bonus when mod should be 18%. (Bugreported)
All Skirmish warfare mods
Confirmed to be working with both T1 BC and Claymore. Bonuses applying correctly.
I hope you guys could help out with this. Weve worked a long time to get them fixed and it seems like the bugs have crept back in.
recon operation getting fixed for patch after the blood
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SengH
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Posted - 2006.03.01 10:49:00 -
[224]
Edited by: SengH on 01/03/2006 10:50:42
thanks for that TomB.. from what I've heard the other info warfare mods seem to be bugged too. I dont have them anywhere near my char though atm to test.
Could you clarify whether capital class shield boosters/armor reps not being affected by the armored/siege gang mods is a design decision or if it is a bug (its been around for an awfully long time)?
Edit: while your at it.. considering how long it took for remote armor repairers/shield transfers to get included with the bonus could you check capital remote armor reps/shield transfers to see if they are affected by the bonus.
Thanks for the prompt response.
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Santiac
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Posted - 2006.03.01 12:36:00 -
[225]
Originally by: Aleis
Oh and Santiac your max bonuses are wrong you multiplied by 6 for teh Spec lvl instead of 5.
This was because i somehow misread the mindlinks bonii, thinking they would add +50% effectiveness to Spec skill bonus (effectively making it a 150% increase per skill level) then a spec skill at IV with a mindlink would give 600% :)
But either i was deranged at the time, or the stats have been altered back to now simply granting another flat +50% increase on top of whatever the command bonus is. And instead they now grant a +50% per level to base warfare skills, if my memory serves me, making the total bonus from any of the base warfare skills 15%.
So, my bad either way :)
________________________________________
<insert clever/witty comment here>
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Monkar
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Posted - 2006.03.01 13:40:00 -
[226]
Originally by: Santiac
Originally by: Aleis
Oh and Santiac your max bonuses are wrong you multiplied by 6 for teh Spec lvl instead of 5.
This was because i somehow misread the mindlinks bonii, thinking they would add +50% effectiveness to Spec skill bonus (effectively making it a 150% increase per skill level) then a spec skill at IV with a mindlink would give 600% :)
But either i was deranged at the time, or the stats have been altered back to now simply granting another flat +50% increase on top of whatever the command bonus is. And instead they now grant a +50% per level to base warfare skills, if my memory serves me, making the total bonus from any of the base warfare skills 15%.
So, my bad either way :)
The problem is that at level 5 spec skill i still only get a x 5 multiplier.
For instance: Damnation flown with level 4 skill level 5 spec skill and level 5 squadron command.
Armored Warfare link bonus = 16.8%
Which is the number one should be getting with spec skill level 4.
2(link value) x 5 (spec multiplier) = 10 x 1.5 (squadron command multiplier) = 15 x 1.12 (command ship multiplier) = 16.8%
When it should be 20.16%.
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Cain Calzon
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Posted - 2006.03.01 13:46:00 -
[227]
ooh i wish they would fix the gang modules so they would affect Capital Armor Repairer/Capital Shield Booster
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Berasus
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Posted - 2006.03.01 15:31:00 -
[228]
I don't suppose anyone can say if the armour warfare mod for increased repair speed effects the armour repair drones?
Same question for the shield ones too i guess.
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Santiac
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Posted - 2006.03.01 17:01:00 -
[229]
Originally by: Monkar
....
The problem is that at level 5 spec skill i still only get a x 5 multiplier.
For instance: Damnation flown with level 4 skill level 5 spec skill and level 5 squadron command.
Armored Warfare link bonus = 16.8%
Which is the number one should be getting with spec skill level 4.
2(link value) x 5 (spec multiplier) = 10 x 1.5 (squadron command multiplier) = 15 x 1.12 (command ship multiplier) = 16.8%
When it should be 20.16%.
________________________________________
<insert clever/witty comment here>
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Aleis
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Posted - 2006.03.02 03:51:00 -
[230]
The problem is that at level 5 spec skill i still only get a x 5 multiplier.
the x5 multiplier is correct.
Basicly you can think of the lvl 1 as simply just alowing you to use the modules, there for 2% base at 100% for lvl 1 is a 2% bonus to whatever.
Kind of a round about way of doing it but it's that way because the skill that alows you to equip the module is the one that gives the bonus.
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Monkar
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Posted - 2006.03.02 08:22:00 -
[231]
Originally by: Aleis
The problem is that at level 5 spec skill i still only get a x 5 multiplier.
the x5 multiplier is correct.
Basicly you can think of the lvl 1 as simply just alowing you to use the modules, there for 2% base at 100% for lvl 1 is a 2% bonus to whatever.
Kind of a round about way of doing it but it's that way because the skill that alows you to equip the module is the one that gives the bonus.
Is that an official dev responce?
Cause i can give you a mile long list of skills that are required to use modules.
Skills that also give a bonus to the module which is calculated normally even from level 1.
Repair systems, Remote Repair Systems, Starship Command skills, Gunnery skills, etc etc etc.
So your reasoning isn't supported at all by how skills that are required to use modules and also give bonuses to said modules have worked so far.
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SengH
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Posted - 2006.03.02 08:42:00 -
[232]
Edited by: SengH on 02/03/2006 08:42:37
Originally by: Monkar
Originally by: Aleis
The problem is that at level 5 spec skill i still only get a x 5 multiplier.
the x5 multiplier is correct.
Basicly you can think of the lvl 1 as simply just alowing you to use the modules, there for 2% base at 100% for lvl 1 is a 2% bonus to whatever.
Kind of a round about way of doing it but it's that way because the skill that alows you to equip the module is the one that gives the bonus.
Is that an official dev responce?
Cause i can give you a mile long list of skills that are required to use modules.
Skills that also give a bonus to the module which is calculated normally even from level 1.
Repair systems, Remote Repair Systems, Starship Command skills, Gunnery skills, etc etc etc.
So your reasoning isn't supported at all by how skills that are required to use modules and also give bonuses to said modules have worked so far.
Thats how the've worked since their inception a year ago during the cold war patch. So I dont see it changing anytime soon.
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Juan Andalusian
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Posted - 2006.03.02 09:07:00 -
[233]
Originally by: SengH
Thats how the've worked since their inception a year ago during the cold war patch. So I dont see it changing anytime soon.
There have been bugs that lasted way longer and were still dealt with.
Just because something is wrong for an x ammount of time doesn't make it right, nor does it make it acceptable.
**Pain is meant to be felt** |
SengH
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Posted - 2006.03.02 09:15:00 -
[234]
Originally by: Juan Andalusian
Originally by: SengH
Thats how the've worked since their inception a year ago during the cold war patch. So I dont see it changing anytime soon.
There have been bugs that lasted way longer and were still dealt with.
Just because something is wrong for an x ammount of time doesn't make it right, nor does it make it acceptable.
Its not wrong thats just how it works. You cannot fit the module without the spec so its already factored in to save server side calculations. Rather than doing a base 0%+2%*spec level, they just drop the 0 out. It saves an extra calculation each time the mod is fitted.
There certain ships ie. the sacrildge I think that already have their bonuses factored into the base desc save server side calculations.
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Juan Andalusian
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Posted - 2006.03.02 09:36:00 -
[235]
Originally by: SengH
Its not wrong thats just how it works. You cannot fit the module without the spec so its already factored in to save server side calculations. Rather than doing a base 0%+2%*spec level, they just drop the 0 out. It saves an extra calculation each time the mod is fitted.
There certain ships ie. the sacrildge I think that already have their bonuses factored into the base desc save server side calculations.
So if they are doing this on purpose to save poor us of the horrendous load of such a calculation, why on earth do 90% of the other skills in this game work the other way?
Do your repairer cycles get reduced by 0.2 at level 5 skill? Does your inty sig radius get reduced by 0.2 at level 5? Does your medium energy turret do 1.2 more damage at level 5? Does your remote repairer consume 0.2 less cap at level 5? Does your thorax get 1.2 bonus to damage at level 5?
As for your sacrilege, the bonuses are factored in because the skill responsible for said bonus is required at 5 to even get in the ship. Of course the bonus is also multiplied by 1.25 and not 1.2 just because the ship needs the skill.
**Pain is meant to be felt** |
SengH
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Posted - 2006.03.02 10:00:00 -
[236]
Originally by: Juan Andalusian
As for your sacrilege, the bonuses are factored in because the skill responsible for said bonus is required at 5 to even get in the ship. Of course the bonus is also multiplied by 1.25 and not 1.2 just because the ship needs the skill.
Why are you arguing with me that falls exactly in line with what I am saying. You require lvl 1 spec to even fit the module. The bonus is multiplied by 5 when you have it maxxed. (1+0.02%*5) 1.10% bonus with max skills.
There is nothing wrong! Also gang mods are unique from all other mods as they affect everyone in the gang. If you have learn coding and complexity of functions, a small additional calculation can easily cause a ton of extra load as you scale upwards.
Tbh increasing the modifier to *6 as you want it would throw certain gang mods out of whack. Two of the combos that I use would give a 72.79% and a 79.65% bonus to the gang respectively. The difference is so large it would be screaming for the nerfbat.
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Juan Andalusian
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Posted - 2006.03.02 10:16:00 -
[237]
Edited by: Juan Andalusian on 02/03/2006 10:21:39
Quote:
Also gang mods are unique from all other mods as they affect everyone in the gang. If you have learn coding and complexity of functions, a small additional calculation can easily cause a ton of extra load as you scale upwards.
The code doesn't run the formula for every gang member. Not even the most retarded coder would do it like this.
It runs the formula to calculate the bonus set as a variable and applies the variable to all members. It's fairly simple.
Quote:
The bonus is multiplied by 5 when you have it maxxed. (1+0.02%*5) 1.10% bonus with max skills.
The description states, 100% bonus to effectiveness per level. That translates to 500% of 2% at level 5. 500% in every known corner of this planet translates into a 6x multiplier.
**Pain is meant to be felt** |
SengH
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Posted - 2006.03.02 10:21:00 -
[238]
Originally by: Juan Andalusian
Quote:
Also gang mods are unique from all other mods as they affect everyone in the gang. If you have learn coding and complexity of functions, a small additional calculation can easily cause a ton of extra load as you scale upwards.
The code doesn't run the formula for every gang member. Not even the most retarded coder would do it like this.
It runs the formula to calculate the bonus set as a variable and applies the variable to all members. It's fairly simple.
Quote:
The bonus is multiplied by 5 when you have it maxxed. (1+0.02%*5) 1.10% bonus with max skills.
The description states, 100% effectiveness per level. That translates to 500% of 2% at level 5. 500% in every known corner of this planet translates into a 6x multiplier.
Uhh a 500% increase means 6x multiplier.However 500 % by itself literally means out of 100 therefore 500/100 = 5.
If you need some brushing up on your math heres a wikipedia link for you.
Heres the important part.
A percentage may be a number larger than 100; for example, 200% of a number refers to twice the number. In fact, this would be a 100% increase, while a 200% increase would give a number three times the original value. Thus one can see the relationship between percent increase and times increase.
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Juan Andalusian
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Posted - 2006.03.02 10:33:00 -
[239]
I edited my previous post to correctly quote the skill desc.
100% bonus to effectiveness.
Originally by: SengH
Uhh a 500% increase means 6x multiplier,
Good.
Quote:
However 500 % by itself literally means out of 100 therefore 500/100 = 5.
Where do you come up with this "by itself" and "out of 100". The description is clear 100% bonus to effectiveness.
There is no by itself or 100 involved anywhere, the base effectiveness is set and known... 2 or 3, depending on the link.
100% bonus to 2 is 4, and 100% bonus to 3 is 6.
**Pain is meant to be felt** |
SengH
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Posted - 2006.03.02 18:34:00 -
[240]
Originally by: Juan Andalusian
I edited my previous post to correctly quote the skill desc.
100% bonus to effectiveness.
Originally by: SengH
Uhh a 500% increase means 6x multiplier,
Good.
Quote:
However 500 % by itself literally means out of 100 therefore 500/100 = 5.
Where do you come up with this "by itself" and "out of 100". The description is clear 100% bonus to effectiveness.
There is no by itself or 100 involved anywhere, the base effectiveness is set and known... 2 or 3, depending on the link.
100% bonus to 2 is 4, and 100% bonus to 3 is 6.
What I'm saying is that without the skill your bonus would be 0% you would not be able to fit the module at all thats why its already factored in. Thats probably the reasoning going on here, theres no point arguing with me. Its not like I'm CCP and can change the mods. If you feel that its a bug, bugreport it or hop on sisi and ask a BH.
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