| Pages: [1] 2 3 :: one page |
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Layrex
   |
Posted - 2005.08.14 21:26:00 -
[1]
nerf missles, the raven, the scorp (hey let's just make it's bonuses even worse while we're at it, or remove them rofl!!).
Let's also make shield tanking even more ineffective compared to armour tanking! Rather than just having shield extenders vastly underpowered, and boosters use too much cap for too little gain compared to reps. Let's make it so one boost turns your ship, OFF!!!
Make sure you get the cruisers and HACS too, we all know how overpowered THEY are!! What do you mean BOTH our hacs are sniper platforms??? That's not fair I want another! We all know how hacs like the zealot and Deimos are rubbish.
No Caldari missle AF?? THAT'S OK!! Why don't we remove the turret points too, and make them little itty-bitty EW platforms!!
Thankyou ccp! All the constant nerfing of everything here and there hasn't left this game in a mess it'll likely never recover from, let's just make sure we give Caldari one last kick in the face incase Caldari players feel one tiny sense of worth for playing this race.
------------------------------
|
Blind Fear
|
Posted - 2005.08.14 21:30:00 -
[2]
I <3 the fact missiles arent an idiot-proof weapons system anymore.
Its really adorable watching all the people who were so heavily reliant on that particular quality.
------------------------------------------------
Derailing threads with logic since 1992 |
Dimitri Forgroth
|
Posted - 2005.08.14 21:31:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Dimitri Forgroth on 14/08/2005 21:32:09
XLarge Booster II: 400 cap for 600: 1.5 eff
with amp: 400 cap for 780: 1.95 eff
with compensation: 360 for 780: 2.167 eff (More than armour tanking).
I know it's a urine heist etc, but you usually steal the urine by asking for the bad things to be nerfed into worse things, not the good things. 
Don't be a bad loser | DPS Spreadsheet |
HippoKing
|
Posted - 2005.08.14 23:21:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: Elektra Storm
Originally by: HippoKing
i am hereby starting a petition for a forum feature that autolocks any thread on which the title starts with the words "nerf the" or has exclaimation marks in the thread title.
add to that any thread with "devs look here" in the title 
and this has TWO exclaimation marks 
|
Saladin
|
Posted - 2005.08.14 23:28:00 -
[5]
There is some merit to this argument. All turrets have fall off, but missles do the same damage right up to the end of their flight time. Missles that travel further to their target should do less damage on impact
----
|
HippoKing
|
Posted - 2005.08.14 23:30:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Saladin
There is some merit to this argument. All turrets have fall off, but missles do the same damage right up to the end of their flight time. Missles that travel further to their target should do less damage on impact
and missiles do ****all damage to anything smaller than their specific target at ANY range
do u know what happens to an inty that is shot by a gank ship at 100km?
|
Saladin
|
Posted - 2005.08.14 23:36:00 -
[7]
Originally by: HippoKing
Originally by: Saladin
There is some merit to this argument. All turrets have fall off, but missles do the same damage right up to the end of their flight time. Missles that travel further to their target should do less damage on impact
and missiles do ****all damage to anything smaller than their specific target at ANY range
do u know what happens to an inty that is shot by a gank ship at 100km?
I did try this. I was in a shuttle at about 100km moving in a transverse direction to the gank ship, and all shots missed or hit for zero damage, when the cruise missles caught up, the shuttle blew up
----
|
Blind Fear
|
Posted - 2005.08.14 23:40:00 -
[8]
Originally by: HippoKing
Originally by: Saladin
There is some merit to this argument. All turrets have fall off, but missles do the same damage right up to the end of their flight time. Missles that travel further to their target should do less damage on impact
and missiles do ****all damage to anything smaller than their specific target at ANY range
do u know what happens to an inty that is shot by a gank ship at 100km?
Well, if I'm flying (since the target painter bug was fixed), I'm smart enough to keep my transverse up... so every shot misses every time.
If you're flying, you'll do something retarded and die.
Any questions?
------------------------------------------------
Derailing threads with logic since 1992 |
Dimitri Forgroth
|
Posted - 2005.08.14 23:42:00 -
[9]
It's really rather easy to go from 100km -> 5km without getting hit once.
Don't be a bad loser | DPS Spreadsheet |
Tenashi
|
Posted - 2005.08.14 23:54:00 -
[10]
why not change the bonuses to 5% to mining and 5% to cargo capacity just for u 
|
Sgt Spiff
|
Posted - 2005.08.15 00:35:00 -
[11]
I laughed so hard after reading your post i almost cried
|
Deja Thoris
|
Posted - 2005.08.15 01:32:00 -
[12]
Can you nerf their portraits too.
I'm so tired of all the "square jawed yokel" look.
|
ELECTR0FREAK
|
Posted - 2005.08.15 01:42:00 -
[13]
Edited by: ELECTR0FREAK on 15/08/2005 01:46:51
Originally by: Saladin
Originally by: HippoKing
Originally by: Saladin
There is some merit to this argument. All turrets have fall off, but missles do the same damage right up to the end of their flight time. Missles that travel further to their target should do less damage on impact
and missiles do ****all damage to anything smaller than their specific target at ANY range
do u know what happens to an inty that is shot by a gank ship at 100km?
I did try this. I was in a shuttle at about 100km moving in a transverse direction to the gank ship, and all shots missed or hit for zero damage, when the cruise missles caught up, the shuttle blew up
Sorry, thats bull. A shuttle has 25 signature radius, and cannot MWD. With maxed Guided Missile Precision, the explosion radius of a Cruise is 225m. 25/225 = .11 damage modifier. Even a full gank Raven doing 500 damage per Cruise will do 55.5 damage per missile before resists. 6 missile launchers, thats 333 damage before resists. A shuttle has 350 HP. 1 salvo of Cruise will never blow a shuttle up.
Please come back when you're not making things up.
Edit- typo during calculation
-Electrofreak
Discoverer of the Missile Damage Formula |
Saladin
|
Posted - 2005.08.15 01:45:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Saladin on 15/08/2005 01:46:51
Edited by: Saladin on 15/08/2005 01:46:10
Originally by: ELECTR0FREAK
Originally by: Saladin
Originally by: HippoKing
Originally by: Saladin
There is some merit to this argument. All turrets have fall off, but missles do the same damage right up to the end of their flight time. Missles that travel further to their target should do less damage on impact
and missiles do ****all damage to anything smaller than their specific target at ANY range
do u know what happens to an inty that is shot by a gank ship at 100km?
I did try this. I was in a shuttle at about 100km moving in a transverse direction to the gank ship, and all shots missed or hit for zero damage, when the cruise missles caught up, the shuttle blew up
Sorry, thats bull. A shuttle has 7 signature radius, and cannot MWD. With maxed Guided Missile Precision, the explosion radius of a Cruise is 225m. 7/225 = .031 damage modifier. Even a full gank Raven doing 500 damage per Cruise will do 15.5 damage per missile before resists. 6 missile launchers, thats 93 damage before resists. Sorry, the shuttle doesn't blow up.
Please come back when you're not making things up.
Sorry this is no joke, I did do it and I did lose the shuttle. As soon as they started hitting I tried to warp out but couldnt in time. I'd post a kill mail but you'd just accuse me of fabricating it.
----
|
ELECTR0FREAK
|
Posted - 2005.08.15 01:46:00 -
[15]
Please meet me on SiSi then, I'll be happy to prove it to you.
-Electrofreak
Discoverer of the Missile Damage Formula |
Saladin
|
Posted - 2005.08.15 01:49:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Saladin on 15/08/2005 01:49:55
Ok I came up with an RP reason that CCP can use for this additional nerf:
Longer flight times mean that less fuel is left on board the missle to add to the strength of its detonation.
And yes I did remove that comment about the 0.11 after re-reading your post.
----
|
ELECTR0FREAK
|
Posted - 2005.08.15 01:52:00 -
[17]
Edited by: ELECTR0FREAK on 15/08/2005 01:53:26
Fuel onboard a missile is not used for detonation. Thats the warhead.
Besides, when it takes a Cruise missile, with maxed velocity skills, fired from a Raven, over 12 seconds to fly 100km, and STILL hit a small, fast moving target for GREATLY reduced damage (about 1.1 damage if you're firing Cruise from a gank Raven at an Interceptor going 4km/sec), you really have no grounds for arguement.
And if you really want to test how well turrets work at range, fine, please log onto Sisi, I'll throw some 425mm rails onto my Scorpion, and shoot you from 100km, we'll see how long you last.
-Electrofreak
Discoverer of the Missile Damage Formula |
Saladin
|
Posted - 2005.08.15 01:54:00 -
[18]
Originally by: ELECTR0FREAK
Edited by: ELECTR0FREAK on 15/08/2005 01:53:26
Fuel onboard a missile is not used for detonation. Thats the warhead.
Besides, when it takes a Cruise missile, with maxed velocity skills, fired from a Raven, over 12 seconds to fly 100km, and STILL hit a small, fast moving target for GREATLY reduced damage (about 1.1 damage if you're firing Cruise from a gank Raven at an Interceptor going 4km/sec), you really have no grounds for arguement.
And if you really want to test how well turrets work at range, fine, please log onto Sisi, I'll throw some 425mm rails onto my Scorpion, and shoot you from 100km, we'll see how long you last.
I have every confidence that a scorpion with 8 tracking computer IIs will achieve the goal of skewing the results
----
|
ELECTR0FREAK
|
Posted - 2005.08.15 01:56:00 -
[19]
I'll even show you my setup. Or are you afraid to be proven wrong?
-Electrofreak
Discoverer of the Missile Damage Formula |
j0sephine
|
Posted - 2005.08.15 02:00:00 -
[20]
Edited by: j0sephine on 15/08/2005 02:02:25
"Sorry, thats bull. A shuttle has 25 signature radius, and cannot MWD. With maxed Guided Missile Precision, the explosion radius of a Cruise is 225m. 25/225 = .11 damage modifier. Even a full gank Raven doing 500 damage per Cruise will do 55.5 damage per missile before resists. 6 missile launchers, thats 333 damage before resists. A shuttle has 350 HP. 1 salvo of Cruise will never blow a shuttle up."
A few ballistics in the lows will both sufficiently up the damage and speed up the RoF, to the point where you'll have a constant string of missiles rather than separate salvos -.o
(note he didn't actually say it was single salvo that killed him... just a series of missiles)
|
Saladin
|
Posted - 2005.08.15 02:03:00 -
[21]
Originally by: ELECTR0FREAK
Edited by: ELECTR0FREAK on 15/08/2005 01:59:28
I'll even show you my setup. Or are you afraid to be proven wrong?
Edit- I'm even giving you the benefit of the doubt. I could even just fit 325mms, saying that they're comperable to Cruise. Unless, of course, you want to compare how well turrets compare versus Torpedos against small fast ships at range.
I'm not out to prove anything. It happened to me, and thats enough for me to talk about it. Try it out with your friends and report back sport.
----
|
ELECTR0FREAK
|
Posted - 2005.08.15 02:05:00 -
[22]
Edited by: ELECTR0FREAK on 15/08/2005 02:07:34
Face it bud. I know what I'm talking about. I've spent long days testing missiles when I was working on uncovering the damage formula, and I'm definately no stranger to turrets. Heck, I fly an Eagle with Tech 2 Medium Rails... I know a thing or two about using turrets at range. Should I bother to mention that on another account, I've got an Armageddon, Apoc, Zealot, and Retribution? You're out of your league 
But I cordially invite you onto the test server with me. I'm logging in over there right now, send me a Convo. I'd really like to help you figure this out.
Edit- doh, have to patch Singularity... but I'll be waiting 
-Electrofreak
Discoverer of the Missile Damage Formula |
Mortuus
|
Posted - 2005.08.15 02:07:00 -
[23]
Who cares that missles do small amounts of damage than normal. At 100km a good frigate pilot won't get hit by any guns anyway, well, maybe a slow moving AF, but certainly nothing that will close that distance in a reasonable time anyway.
Sometimes you need to not use a direct approach...
|
ELECTR0FREAK
|
Posted - 2005.08.15 02:11:00 -
[24]
The main issue at hand is that missiles use ship velocity while turrets use transversal velocity. A frigate can fly straight at a missile ship, take damage at a vastly reduced level, close the distance, and tackle it, while the same frigate cannot do this with a turret ship without getting easily hit and ripped apart.
-Electrofreak
Discoverer of the Missile Damage Formula |
Saladin
|
Posted - 2005.08.15 02:14:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Saladin on 15/08/2005 02:17:20
Edited by: Saladin on 15/08/2005 02:14:38
Originally by: ELECTR0FREAK
Edited by: ELECTR0FREAK on 15/08/2005 02:07:34
Face it bud. I know what I'm talking about. I've spent long days testing missiles when I was working on uncovering the damage formula, and I'm definately no stranger to turrets. Heck, I fly an Eagle with Tech 2 Medium Rails... I know a thing or two about using turrets at range. Should I bother to mention that on another account, I've got an Armageddon, Apoc, Zealot, and Retribution? You're out of your league
But I cordially invite you onto the test server with me. I'm logging in over there right now, send me a Convo. I'd really like to help you figure this out.
Edit- doh, have to patch Singularity... but I'll be waiting
Yes when it comes to spending endless hours on the test server, I am out of my league. When it does come to in game play, I comment on things that happened in game as opposed to burying my head in excel spreadsheets and mathematical equations. I am not testing something on the test server I already experienced in game. Like I said try it yourself and let us know what your controlled expirement found. While I don't boast the ship collection you do, I have flown almost every kind of ship in EvE for over 2 years so I am not talking out of my ass
----
|
j0sephine
|
Posted - 2005.08.15 02:16:00 -
[26]
"the same frigate cannot do this with a turret ship without getting easily hit and ripped apart."
Please give me a call when you finish patching and get on test server, i wouldn't mind actually verifying that... ^^
|
ELECTR0FREAK
|
Posted - 2005.08.15 02:17:00 -
[27]
The difference is, I test these things ingame as well, not just on SiSi, but on Tranq too... thats why I'm totally confident in my stance here. Don't think I'm some nublet math nerd, I'll be more than happy to tear you apart if you come down to Impass. 
-Electrofreak
Discoverer of the Missile Damage Formula |
ELECTR0FREAK
|
Posted - 2005.08.15 02:23:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Aegis Osiris
Electro, quick question. In your argument above, you mention the sig radius of the shuttle, but you don't mention the speed. My understanding was the speed of the target plays are role in damage taken. The base explosion speed of a cruise missle, sans skills, is 500m/s, same base speed as a shuttle. Couldn't that have played a role in the instance Saladin mentioned?
Actually what it means is, that, if someone doesn't have Target Navigation Prediction trained up even one level, a Shuttle can potentially reduce that 55.5 damage even more by going over 500m/s. The example I cited was an unmoving shuttle. Personally, I have TNP 4, with an explosion velocity of 700 m/s on my cruise, which is why I left all this out, because for me, I hit an unmoving shuttle or a moving shuttle for the same amount. Someone with less skills though will potentially hit for even LESS.
-Electrofreak
Discoverer of the Missile Damage Formula |
Saladin
|
Posted - 2005.08.15 02:25:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Caldess
Wait, so how were you not able to warp away in time in a shuttle? Even in my science alt who has no navigation skills, the warps happen insanely fast. Just a random question as that caught my attention.
I was focused on maintaining my transverse motion and paid attention to the ship shooting me with turrets, I never saw the cruise missles until they were right behind me.
----
|
ELECTR0FREAK
|
Posted - 2005.08.15 02:27:00 -
[30]
So you had 2 ships shooting at you.
... 
-Electrofreak
Discoverer of the Missile Damage Formula |
| |
|
| Pages: [1] 2 3 :: one page |
| First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |