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TomB	Posted - 2003.07.29 14:34:00 - [1] These blueprints were missing on the market and will be available on the live server on next patch update: (chaos should get updated with this soon) Microwarpdrive I EMP L EMP S Fusion M Phased Plasma L Phased Plasma M Phased Plasma S Acolyte I Heavy Beam Laser I Medium Beam Laser I Tachyon Beam Laser I Multifrequency L Multifrequency M Multifrequency S Antimatter L Antimatter M Antimatter S Plutonium L Plutonium M Plutonium S 150mm Railgun I 425mm Railgun I Heavy Neutron Blaster I 1400mm Howitzer Artillery I 280mm Howitzer Artillery I 780mm Howitzer Artillery I Large Shield Extender I Photon Scattering Field I "Where is my hat?"
Hippey	Posted - 2003.07.29 14:45:00 - [2] Welcome back, TomB ------------------------------------------- If you kill them, they will die! Sport the war, war support The sport is war, total war When victory's really a massacre. The final swing is not a drill It's how many people I can kill!
drunkenmaster	Posted - 2003.07.29 14:49:00 - [3] superb, thanks for the heads up. except you forgot the BP for 'Drunktech super 5800mm heavy gauss hybrid projectile laser mk III (with shield boost)' I'll note this as an oversight, and be expecting it in the next update. .
Johnson McCrae	Posted - 2003.07.29 15:03:00 - [4] Edited by: Johnson McCrae on 29/07/2003 15:03:07 Thank you TomB. Was wondering why AM bp's were harder to find than chicken teeth. It ain't over till the fat lady falls on ya! [ 2004.10.09 02:50:23 ] (combat) Your 425mm Compressed Coil Gun I perfectly strikes Guardian Sentry, wrecking for 747.3 damage.
Blood Hawk	Posted - 2003.07.29 15:12:00 - [5] I can supply with AM S and M bp's Show them no mercy ... for you shall receive none!
zincol	Posted - 2003.07.29 16:03:00 - [6] Edited by: zincol on 29/07/2003 16:04:03 cool,and when will this be taking places....
Grymwulf	Posted - 2003.07.29 16:36:00 - [7] Quote: These blueprints were missing on the market and will be available on the live server on next patch update: (chaos should get updated with this soon) Note the statement: next patch update ___________________________________________ General Protection Fault
zincol	Posted - 2003.07.29 16:39:00 - [8] Quote: Quote: These blueprints were missing on the market and will be available on the live server on next patch update: (chaos should get updated with this soon) Note the statement: next patch update yesssss but when is da next patch lol!!!
Virulence	Posted - 2003.07.29 17:00:00 - [9] what about the missing skills? shadows and dust
Hottie	Posted - 2003.07.29 22:50:00 - [10] And there was much rejoicing!
Thano	Posted - 2003.07.29 23:02:00 - [11] oooohhh looks like im going to have to start saveing even more money
ga'ia	Posted - 2003.07.30 00:07:00 - [12] wb TomB, glad to have u back __________________________________________________________
Jarjar	Posted - 2003.07.30 01:46:00 - [13] Edited by: Jarjar on 30/07/2003 01:48:30 Mmmmm tachyons. drool Edit: I believe Astrogeology, Metallurgy and Research will make it to the market, too.
Falzone	Posted - 2003.07.30 08:32:00 - [14] is tomb the head dev the guy that was on vacation if so i'd just like to thank you for going on vacation, keeping our money and doing very little to improve the game.
ga'ia	Posted - 2003.07.30 11:31:00 - [15] Falzone, you should apologize to TomB! The devs have worked on EVE without any vacation for atleast two, do u think you could work for two years without a break!? baka __________________________________________________________
Balack	Posted - 2003.07.30 11:32:00 - [16] I realise I'm gonna get royally flamed here but... This is a joke, what do you mean "missing"? they weren't missing, just nobody except a few bought them before you magically removed all the copies from the market last time. Talk about ** the market up even more, you should've done it properly in the first place and only released a certian number of BP's that way you'd know that 20,000 original plutinium (or whatever) existed. As it stands the economy is boosted by demand for these rare BP's, not for long though soon everyone will be making ammo, and thats another market ed. Playing Eve isnt about planning a mega corp its about seconded guessing how CCP will ** you in the a55 next. And what about the missing drone BP's like berserker!!!!! PS, get your edit pen out, or just simply remove my post, I couldn't care less I'm so mad right now
Robomonkey	Posted - 2003.07.30 13:25:00 - [17] I must say I'm very disapointed (borderline disgusted) with this update. My corp is currently mainly based around selling researched BP copies, in fact we recently purchased an original medium Phased Plamsa for many millions of isk, and when the market presented itself (before highways and shuttles) we spent days if not weeks visiting all the other regions to get a copy of each BP, both of these endouvers are now wasted time and money. I apperciate that 90% of people will welcome this change, this is because 90% of people don't have the BP's. Even though copies are all still available you just have to watch the trade channel. I think this is also very badly implemented, why are you telling people of this change TomB????, I'd really like to know, all it does is kill the current market and lets scammers sell any originals they currently have for large sums of cash to the unaware. These extra copies should also be introduced gradually, so as to slowly decline the demand, not just wipe it out in one go. Good story line!!!!!, what happened, every station in the galaxy suddenly found a long lost supply???? This sort of change should just be implemented without any advance notice, as now people who have the time to read the boards are at an advantage to those that don't, same as the lab slots, why tell people what you're going to do, just do it and then tell people, that way everyone is on an even playing field. These changes keep being made, but no allowance is ever made for the effects they have, just like the corps that were mining Arka from day one, they still have 100's millions of isk in bank, after the change other players cannot even hope to come close to this. This is the third time my corp has been screwed now, we seem to keep putting a lot of effort and thought into things that just get thrown away with a patch. A very unhappy and disapointed Robo.
annoing	Posted - 2003.07.30 13:39:00 - [18] Hey Robomonkey -- The reason being is that have to take care of the carebears and their mega corp friends who missed out when they were first released. That is CCP and the EVE dev team for you >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The Inquisition Long live the Inquisition Long live the Emperor Long live Amarr! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
annoing	Posted - 2003.07.30 13:39:00 - [19] Hey Robomonkey -- The reason being is that have to take care of the carebears and their mega corp friends who missed out when they were first released. That is CCP and the EVE dev team for you >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The Inquisition Long live the Inquisition Long live the Emperor Long live Amarr! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
j0sephine	Posted - 2003.07.30 13:51:00 - [20] "we spent days if not weeks visiting all the other regions to get a copy of each BP, both of these endouvers are now wasted time and money." Thanks to your endeavours you had quite a few weeks of headstart to research your BPs and cash on being practically exclusive supplier. How's that 'wasted time and money'?..
Varsuuk	Posted - 2003.07.30 14:12:00 - [21] It really has to do with reducing the extremely negative affects of the bp change (for the better as long as it is not impossible to buy originals) coming. Some bps disappeared because they went from huge (too many) to tiny amounts on market FROM a DEV CHANGE... not being bought - then they were bought out. For some reason EMP M was reintroduced and I had hoped for others, but never came. As for ammo suppliers... I am one. I'd love to know what regions you are supplying, I am sure you DO sell ammo - but do you cover all the emp regions? cos boy do we need more ammo vendors (well, I am happy we dont have that many ;P) I am not too worried about ammo as long as it isn't overdone. There is not much profit and alot of maintenance in selling AMMO, vs the BP (likely what is bothering some most) This can easily be determined by seeing just how LITTLE of the rare bp ammo is SOLD ;)
Robomonkey	Posted - 2003.07.30 14:13:00 - [22] How is it wasted time and money??? We spent a large proportion of out profits on a phased plasma BP, about 4-5 days ago, that money is wasted. And its wasted time because we now have a set of original researched BP's that are all worthless.
kewl007	Posted - 2003.07.30 14:14:00 - [23] Edited by: kewl007 on 30/07/2003 14:16:59 i would just like to say that Falzone is a moron and that he should be banned for insulting a DEV like that... i mean c'mon you never take vacation maybe ? Falzone=foo Having that said i would like to thank TomB for adding those BPs... 425mm railgun was just inexistant and the rarity of those BP only contributed to make a monopoly situation... now you guys have to explain me why in a capitalist economy a market in monopoly is a good situation... IT IS NOT. Players should be able to compete with each other regarding the price of those items not one player selling Tachyons for 5M a piece.. and Robomoney.. that's the price to pay to see the game improves... last time they added production efficiency a couple of ppl were ****ed coz they had bought the skill 3 days before patch for 25M.... coz it used to be rare and loot only. sry to say but that's a small and needed price to pay to see this game improves..
JaminBen	Posted - 2003.07.30 14:24:00 - [24] So whats the point in introducing another load of bp originals,are u gonna do the same again in two months time when they are all sold out again and totally screw the bp copy market. Also why are u posting this here its a damn outrage cos u have just created a temporay exploit for those ppl that havent read this tiny little post.I have seen ppl getting royaly screwed last night paying 25 mill for large anti matter original think they where getting a good deal only to find they can buy one on the market next patch day. If you are gonna change the game peramiters then u have to let all the ppl know not just a select few who have the time to read this hidden post.Next time make a message appear on screen when u log into the game warning ppl this is happening. One more thing TomB why dont u sod off back on holiday or where ever u where and leave us in peace cos yes i was one of those that wasted millions of isk last night GGRRRRRRR
Robomonkey	Posted - 2003.07.30 14:24:00 - [25] Varsuuk...thats exactly the problem to start with there was like 50,000 copies of every BP in virtually every station, then the next day there was 10, hence they all became rare and valuable. What should've happened is the Devs should've run queries to see how many copies of each BP had been sold and then made up the numbers to say 2000 each in the market. But thats not what happened. And I agree that this is a change to make the limited production run change seem better. Robo PS I think I've seen you touting your wares on the trade channel
JaminBen	Posted - 2003.07.30 14:26:00 - [26] So whats the point in introducing another load of bp originals,are u gonna do the same again in two months time when they are all sold out again and totally screw the bp copy market. Also why are u posting this here its a damn outrage cos u have just created a temporay exploit for those ppl that havent read this tiny little post.I have seen ppl getting royaly screwed last night paying 25 mill for large anti matter original think they where getting a good deal only to find they can buy one on the market next patch day. If you are gonna change the game peramiters then u have to let all the ppl know not just a select few who have the time to read this hidden post.Next time make a message appear on screen when u log into the game warning ppl this is happening. One more thing TomB why dont u sod off back on holiday or where ever u where and leave us in peace cos yes i was one of those that wasted millions of isk last night GGRRRRRRR
BSOD	Posted - 2003.07.30 14:29:00 - [27] Quote: So whats the point in introducing another load of bp originals,are u gonna do the same again in two months time when they are all sold out again and totally screw the bp copy market. Also why are u posting this here its a damn outrage cos u have just created a temporay exploit for those ppl that havent read this tiny little post.I have seen ppl getting royaly screwed last night paying 25 mill for large anti matter original think they where getting a good deal only to find they can buy one on the market next patch day. If you are gonna change the game peramiters then u have to let all the ppl know not just a select few who have the time to read this hidden post.Next time make a message appear on screen when u log into the game warning ppl this is happening. One more thing TomB why dont u sod off back on holiday or where ever u where and leave us in peace cos yes i was one of those that wasted millions of isk last night GGRRRRRRR "BP copy market" I think it should be obvious that the devs frown upon the "BP copy market". If you had ANY clue whatsoever, you wouldn't have been betting on the copy market in the past few weeks, as it was announced long ago that copies were going to be nerfed. Essentially, as of next patch, copies are going to become nearly worthless due to their usage limit. If you had a business set up around selling BP copies, then too bad. The writing has been on the wall for weeks. TomB: What about the following BPs: Basic Coprocessor - I've been unable to find a BP for this for months. Basic Magnetic Field Stabilizer - I don't think a BP was ever available for this, only pirate drops given the quantities available for sale. Why do projectile users get a damage mod with a BP available but hybrid users don't? ---------------- Blue Screen of Death CEO Exodus Enterprises
Fallen Angel	Posted - 2003.07.30 14:34:00 - [28] limited... usage... next... patch? wha? Fallen Angel doesn't like those words because the only way his corp would have EVER afforded a battleship blueprint would be a copy.
Robomonkey	Posted - 2003.07.30 14:36:00 - [29] Kewl007...How can this be an improvement?? all it means is another once valuable item is now common, thus reducing demand once again. And how is it fair to people who paid 25m for PE 2-3 days before they were released on the market, these sort of changes should be made on a schedule, so if you know when they're gonna release new things or change the mechanics of the game and economy. They should announce it a month earlier, now what wrong with that??? a serious question, whats wrong with having a schedule??? If this was an improvement they would be released gradually and in different regions, but I bet on patch day every region will have as many copies as they want. Also what about the Berserker BP??? Robo
JaminBen	Posted - 2003.07.30 14:39:00 - [30] Hmmm no i dont think they wanna get rid of the copy market or they wouldnt have spent time on coding making the copies last a limited amount of time and what else are u gonna need the labs for maybe reverse engineering dont make me laugh we'll never see that in our life times the rate ccp are going.
Robomonkey	Posted - 2003.07.30 14:47:00 - [31] Quote: I think it should be obvious that the devs frown upon the "BP copy market". Well thats a stupid statement, if they frown upon it why introduce the bloody thing, they after all control the friggin game, as is quite clear. The copy market will always be around, as somebody mentioned (sorry forgot your name) how are most people gonna be able to afford a BS BP, unless its a copy!!! and don't say not everyone should have one, because thats just a lame argument!!!
Xeserox	Posted - 2003.07.30 15:00:00 - [32] HOnestly, i don't see what the big fuss is about here. "wan i wasted time on gettign these BPs and things." I think that you are honestly upset that now you don't have a monopoly on the market of being the only ammo supplier carrying phased plasma or EMP M. My corp has an original of Antimatter M. Reasearched and all that. And we are Embracing this patch. why? because its all part of the game. From Beta till now this is how its been. They release something, and let everyone get producing it.. so it builds the market, and then the cut it back. They are "layering" things in eve so that Everything for everyone is even. So no, you corp isn't gettign screwed... you just have a bad attitude about other people getting these BPs. You are scared that your competition is going to seel more ammo than you now, and be able to produce it at a much better price and make more money on it. Honestly, The universe of EVE is huge. If you are in your very own corner with your very own market... then stop worrying about it. If not, well its time for your copr to do some market research, and maybe build more than just ammo. Xeserox -Free Lance Frigate Pilot
JaminBen	Posted - 2003.07.30 15:07:00 - [33] er yes thats the object of the game .To find a market and make your way in eve but how can u do that if they keep changing the rules.Yes i'am upset at this and yes we did have a monopoly on the market but IMHO thats the whole point of the game.Some ppl will be bounty hunters some miners other traders in rare loot drops and of course some in bp copies.How would all the miners feel if ccp halfed the value of ore cos they mine too quickly. Thats my feelings now to find another way to make isk :((
Muacha	Posted - 2003.07.30 15:13:00 - [34] Edited by: Muacha on 30/07/2003 15:29:10 Edited by: Muacha on 30/07/2003 15:26:03 Edited by: Muacha on 30/07/2003 15:24:03 *edited upon reread...I hate when that happens. Robo I can certainly relate to your frustration. In the 2nd week of the retail launch, I set out to find the 280mm Howitzer BP. I vistited about 15 different regions and there were ZERO BP for sale on the market. I think these were actually dropped from pirates or there were only about 10 when the game was launched. 2 weeks ago, I set out to find the Med Phased Plasma BP...again visiting over 15 regions and I could not find it anywhere on the open market. However, some lucky sod had picked one up and was selling the ammo for 60 isks per unit!!! That's outrageous. I would also be upset if I spent millions on the BP because I almost did. Yeah, it sucks but that's the way it goes. None of us know where CCP will take the game, nor what BPs will become rare. IMHO, this gave an unfair advantage to some of the players who happen to be lucky enough to pick the right BP to buy. And BTW, your not totally screwed yet, the BP Copy nerf has not yet been implemented so maybe you can recoup your costs by selling copies of your "improved" BP. I'm glad to see that CCP is adding all these BPs. I think it will be better for the majority of the players and the economy as a whole. Hey, JaminBen....That is EXACTLY what happened to us miners a while back. CCP moved all of the asteroids that yeild Zydrine and Megacyte to non-empire space! Then they moved Omber to .8 space....so yeah....we miners got hit VERY hard by this change. Was it better for the game/economy....time will tell.
Juju Mojo	Posted - 2003.07.30 16:07:00 - [35] This is a dynamic game. It is SUPPOSED to change over time. If the thought of things changing really really bothers you, you shouldn't be playing this game.
Robomonkey	Posted - 2003.07.30 16:12:00 - [36] Edited by: Robomonkey on 30/07/2003 16:13:44 This is also suppoed to be a realistic game!!!!, things like this don't happen. Also like you said "Over time", yeah introduce them over time, not all in one go. Also I'm not fussed about change, just about the way it happens. Still nobody has answered my question, "Whats wrong with having a schedule for changes like this, and informing people 1 month in advance?"
j0sephine	Posted - 2003.07.30 16:20:00 - [37] "This is also suppoed to be a realistic game!!!!, things like this don't happen." If things like this don't happen in real life, why do you think the information like stock market 'hints' is one of the most valuable and sought after commodities?.. At least with this game all you need to get such info is a bit of your time necessary to browse this forum section; something which can be easily done during mining session etc.
Robomonkey	Posted - 2003.07.30 17:05:00 - [38] Edited by: Robomonkey on 30/07/2003 17:06:36 Ah sorry I forgot, when we establish that there's there's a shortage of something in the world, the next day there's an over supply. Silly me, the supply doesn't gradually build up or anything, its just there!!!! And thats called 'insider trading', and is illegal. Besides there was no real need to post this information at all, none whatsoever. I personally bought this game to play it and spend time in the Eve universe, not read dev forums to ensure I don't get screwed or am at a disadvantage!!!
j0sephine	Posted - 2003.07.30 17:46:00 - [39] "Ah sorry I forgot, when we establish that there's there's a shortage of something in the world, the next day there's an over supply. Silly me, the supply doesn't gradually build up or anything, its just there!!!!" Note we are talking about blueprints; technological breakthroughs are called that for a reason -- they can happen quickly, forcing those who enjoyed the monopoly to adapt to the new rules. You're now subjected to a variant of this personally; try and see how you can overcome it, silly as it sounds you never know how valuable experience like this can be in real life... "And thats called 'insider trading', and is illegal." Indeed; EVE allows you to participate in a range of illegal activities if you so please. If i may remind you, your point was 'things like this don't really happen', not that they are illegal... "Besides there was no real need to post this information at all, none whatsoever." But there's no real need not to post it, either; this little information might come useful for those active enough to bother to find it. In your case, it just made you aware your investment wasn't as good as you thought it was... is it really a reason to complain?
Robomonkey	Posted - 2003.07.30 18:09:00 - [40] oh right, so I could copy 50,000 BP's for every station in a day, yeah??? My point was that things like having a massive number of items arriving in one day everywhere in world doesn't happen, not that illegal activities don't happen. And...you shouldn't have to rely on outside interation (these boards) to stay competitive in the game. The reason this info shouldn't have been posted is because it has now killed the market for copys of these BP's early, before it actually happens in the game.
j0sephine	Posted - 2003.07.30 18:29:00 - [41] Edited by: j0sephine on 30/07/2003 18:30:10 "And...you shouldn't have to rely on outside interation (these boards) to stay competitive in the game." Ohh come on now; surely you don't need to rely on the monopoly to remain competitive, and the info posted here is just one of the factors which can help you? Especially when you consider you can research your blueprints before anyone else, having early access to them; get some long-term contracts for the delivery before anyone else can offer them etc... "The reason this info shouldn't have been posted is because it has now killed the market for copys of these BP's early, before it actually happens in the game." Uhmm ok, but just a while ago you were asking, "Whats wrong with having a schedule for changes like this, and informing people 1 month in advance?" Wouldn't this kill the market for much longer?..
Jojin	Posted - 2003.07.30 18:30:00 - [42] You can be upset you just made a costly mistake prior to a change in the market structure of EVE, but please keep your frustration in game. To demand more notification or want some sort of compensation because you didnÆt know or were not informed is just a method to displace a poor decision. No matter how much lead time prior to notification is given, there would always be someone who just made a decision prior to an announcement which, after learning of the new information, turned out to be a poor business decision. Because of this, there will always be some casualties of the market. The best you can hope for is the decisions you make are good and well timed.
Robomonkey	Posted - 2003.07.30 18:46:00 - [43] I'm not asking for compenstation, and "keep my frustration in game", how exactly??, this information is posted outside of the game. Just a point of note, we DIDN'T make a bad descision, at the time taking everything into account we made a good investment and over time would've turned a profit, what we didn't count on was CCP. However what should've happened is they should've tied this into the story, with a news post as a result of the joint research pact with Gallentine\Calderi, stating that a shortage is going to be rectified with research into how making more originals. Now this information is public our corp is prolly worth less than 15% of what it was, I'm angry because this isn't something you can plan for. I'm giving up now,like I said earlier, 90% of people will like this change, and so 90% of people are going to post saying i'm wrong....fine
Rathas	Posted - 2003.07.30 18:52:00 - [44] This is pretty much a good move anyway to go in tandem with the "number of use" copied BP's Most of the module bp's on that list (with the exception of the Micro warp drive) havent been on the market appart from one day when a dev seemed to acidentaly put them on the market then removed them all the next appart from this the ammo bp's and the Micro warp drive were brought up by a small number of organisations who wished to profit by taking all the bp's off the market then sell them again later at a higher price (although they ended up selling copies as those cant be copied and thus compete with them) (in fact I brought my corps copies of the the antimatter blueprints at the same time as someone was stealing the supply (on that day remote buy wasnt working and we were racing each other to grab bp's (although I only wanted one of each size) :) Once the max use copy bp's are in then originals are finally going to become more useful and people can finally save up for them. The rest of the modules I know have not been existing in the game so far (appart from one day) and needed to be put in anyway as they were a "missing" part of the content (I commpiled a list of where to get all the blueprints at one point for my guild in order to get hold of them when we had the money using "show all" on the market and then going to all the regions and those were the ones not being sold) In my opinion selling copies of blueprint after the patch will still be a viable option however the amount you will be able to charge will be dramatically reduced - however you WILL have repeat business for your blueprints as they will run out however you are still making an HUGE profit on selling them as they cost nothing appart from the lab costs to produce (and most of the new BP's on the market will give you even more scope as most of the weapons being put on are the best for their size!!! BSC, Chief Tactical Officer "All right, they're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time" - Lt Gen Lewis B. Puller
BSOD	Posted - 2003.07.30 19:26:00 - [45] Quote: Quote: I think it should be obvious that the devs frown upon the "BP copy market". Well thats a stupid statement, if they frown upon it why introduce the bloody thing, they after all control the friggin game, as is quite clear. The copy market will always be around, as somebody mentioned (sorry forgot your name) how are most people gonna be able to afford a BS BP, unless its a copy!!! and don't say not everyone should have one, because thats just a lame argument!!! Because they never introduced a BP copy market? Remember, you can't sell them on the market. And their other actions (usage limits) make it pretty obvious that they do not see rampant copying as a good thing for this game. ---------------- Blue Screen of Death CEO Exodus Enterprises
Muacha	Posted - 2003.07.30 19:33:00 - [46] Robo, it's obvious that your frustrated but ya know what...your not the only one. In the first week of retail I bought all the Small Proj. Gun and Ammo BP (except the 280mm Howitzer) because I wanted to start an arms MFG business. Imagine my frustration, after having spent all that time and money buying BP, to discover that NPC pirates were droping these guns like crazy....they are common drops by the NPC pirates....and these are low level pirates .8 and .7 space pirates!!! Well, my investment was blown but I had to adapt and overcome. I'm now in my 3rd month of playing and I've found many more ways to make money in the game. If the markets are right, I can make a mill in 1 hour easily, with very little risk. However, this doesn't happen all that often so I have to watch for it. One could also make the argument that the developers are in fact giving you advanced notice of the change. It was posted yesterday and prolly wont be implemented until next week at the earliest. So your arguments about no notice are not correct. Yeah, you would rather have a schedule, so would everyone...but I would rather see fast corrections, for errors, than schedules. Regarding your idea that these things don't just hit the market all at once is simply wrong. Companies store up items then place them all on the market at one time. That's why they have "release" dates. Ever notice that there are multiple copies of a game on the shelves when the game is released??? That's exactly what they are doing. CCP has put everyone on notice that these BP, which should have been there all along, will be released with the next patch. And they don't really need to roleplay the release of items that should have been there all along. Really, it just sounds like you want to hold onto your monopoly and you will make any argument to do just that. Well, I'm very glad to see these BP being released, instead of schedules for release. Looks like you better start copying.
Silver Striker	Posted - 2003.07.30 19:40:00 - [47] Quote: except you forgot the BP for 'Drunktech super 5800mm heavy gauss hybrid projectile laser mk III (with shield boost)' Yeah and don't forget the Frequency Antimatter Fusion L rounds too. What good is that gun without ammo eh? *That's fantastic, really, but we need more COW BELL!!!!*
Mjr Tom	Posted - 2003.08.03 01:46:00 - [48] Can't wait to get my grubby hands on a pair of 1400mm Howitzers.
Marcus Grisbius	Posted - 2003.08.03 06:25:00 - [49] I am glad for this change. Our corp has been in the ammo business for some time now. But for the life of me and anyone else who has tried to find EMP L, Phased Plasma L and Plutonium L BP's, whether original or copies, our efforts have been unsuccessful. In fact, I had almost come to the conclusion that those did not exist. That shouldn't be the case. There wasn't a copy market for any of those. No one was selling them. Also, there were not many people who were actually making the products with the blueprints. I'm glad that I won't have to turn away customers who are asking for certain ammo types because for all practical counts the ammo doesn't even exist. The true value of a blueprint should be the product it produces, not the overvalued demand for a copy of the blueprint. The demand for these rare ammos and such were not nearly as high as the demand for the bp copies which doesn't make sense. Addressing the idea of all these changes not happening in one day in the real market. Russia has control over enough diamonds that it could swamp the market and make them worthless overnight. They don't because it's not in their best interest at the moment. But all rarity does change your perception of the value of an item, not the intrinsic value or usefulness of it. I'm sorry you were valuing something that did not meet the usefulness that you speculated you could sell it for. If you need to buy some ammo, GOD Inc. has what you need at good prices and large quantities. Contact me ingame if you are interested. Certainty of death... little chance of success... what are we waiting for? - Gimli, son of Gloinn
kingsize	Posted - 2003.08.12 11:10:00 - [50] The BP copy "market" stinks because, unlike the rest of the game which is balanced between risk and reward, this market is not. CCP have done a fine job in re-balancing the game.
ToKE	Posted - 2003.08.12 11:20:00 - [51] I have mixed feelings here, yes it's about time some of that stuff was available on the market, but if they make masses of them available theres no point setting up a buisiness with them cause everyone else will buy them too. CCP have long said they want the player trade market to be a focal point, but theres no money to be made from market blueprints- everyone who has a demand for them can go out and buy the blueprints themselves. Manufacturing is to easy, you struggle to sell most pirate loot because you're not allowed to put it on the market and tech lvl 2 stuff still seams to be a mirage on the horizon. IMO CCP should sort the market out by making it so you can sell EVERY SINGLE ITEM in the game on the market. Most people dont like the trade channel because it's either spammed or causes alot of lag because of the shear ammount of people on it. plus if you stick something ont he market you can forget about it. CCP should also make certain items only available in certain regions to bump up demand, and to encourage exploration. CROWD CONTROL PRODUCTIONS, HURRY UP AND GET IT RIGHT BEFORE YOU HAVE NO ONE LEFT TO CARE _______________________________________________ Ahaahhhh you didn't count on my loyal army of Prostitutes did you?
Trimax	Posted - 2003.08.12 13:06:00 - [52] Quote: CCP have long said they want the player trade market to be a focal point, ... IMO CCP should sort the market out by making it so you can sell EVERY SINGLE ITEM in the game on the market. Most people dont like the trade channel because it's either spammed or causes alot of lag because of the shear ammount of people on it. plus if you stick something ont he market you can forget about it. CCP should also make certain items only available in certain regions to bump up demand, and to encourage exploration. I agree, I joined this game to be a trader and to run a trading Corp. Currently trading is not is not a practical way to make a living. At one-point products were only found in different regions, this included BPs, race specific skills & equipment, and some trade goods. Before the creation of the 'Super-highway' it required 30-40 gate jumps across low sector systems to move from Minmater to Gallente space. I was able to make good money moving Hybrid skills, BPs, weapons & ammo into Minmater markets. These trade routes also provided escort responsiblites for my corp members that wanted to fight. The loss of diversity in the market makes trading a lost art. My other problem with being a trading corp, is that corporations do not trade or place market orders, individuals do. This means that if you place a market order for your corp. you must service it, and move the realized sales into the corp wallet. This negates the RL corp model and does not provide for specialized corp members responsible for trading or refining.
Aegis Osiris	Posted - 2003.08.12 15:51:00 - [53] Don't know if anyone has said this yet, wasn't able to read through the 4 pages of invective ;) This 'nerfing' of the copy market is a GOOD thing, for both buyer and seller. Previously, you bought a BP copy and could produce as many units as you liked. Due to this, copies were expensive, but you really only needed 1. Only research was left to the originals. Now, with the copies having a set limit, the price will drop. If the corp doing the copying can set the limit, then the price is scalable. Want taht ship BP, but only want to make a couple?? Copy will be cheap. Want to make a bunch to put on the market? BP will cost more. This increases the flexibility of the market. For the sellers, this also means that, while you may have to charge less per BP copy, there is more demand to research it, AND the BP copies will be a REPEAT BUSINESS. People will use theirs up and come for another, so it has the potential for constant income, as opposed to a one shot deal. Just my 2 cents.
csebal	Posted - 2003.08.12 18:06:00 - [54] Edited by: csebal on 12/08/2003 18:06:55 Robomonkey wrote: Quote: I'm not asking for compenstation, and "keep my frustration in game", how exactly??, this information is posted outside of the game. Just a point of note, we DIDN'T make a bad descision, at the time taking everything into account we made a good investment and over time would've turned a profit, what we didn't count on was CCP. However what should've happened is they should've tied this into the story, with a news post as a result of the joint research pact with Gallentine\Calderi, stating that a shortage is going to be rectified with research into how making more originals. Now this information is public our corp is prolly worth less than 15% of what it was, I'm angry because this isn't something you can plan for. I'm giving up now,like I said earlier, 90% of people will like this change, and so 90% of people are going to post saying i'm wrong....fine Well, next time you'll think twice about the possible outcomes of your investment, and consider the risks involved properly. Everyone with just a lil bit of common sense would have known, that investing into rare BP originals or blueprint copies of those is risky, as they'll eventually get fixed, and you'll be able to get them for a lot cheaper then. In addition, having a business based around selling copies, and even whining about it ruined is only good to **** people off. Have you an idea, how many manufacturers had to look after another job, after buying their precious originals, just because the price wars with those who bought well researched copies were too expensive? Those selling copies en masse ruin the production economy, and they do it because of another crucial design mistake: allowing infinite copying of blueprint originals. If i were you, i would happily sit on the millions i made with no work, selling 300k copies of the original i bought for 30k, and keep my mounth shut, trying to get as little attention as possible. Oh, and thank nicely TomB for posting this info, as it is posted to help those who care to read it (if they lack the IQ to find it out themselves). ------------- This post is nothing more than my personal opinion. It does not represent the official standpoint of Fountain Alliance, or the HUN Corporation in any way. -------------
Naht	Posted - 2003.08.13 06:11:00 - [55] Not sure how this is really going to turn out but the Devs have stated on numerous occasions that BP copies will quickly become obsolete as BP research continues. Assuming that the Devs weren't speaking about the significantly diminishing returns on mineral and production time research, I can only guess that we haven't seen "the meat" of BP research. With that said I have no idea what "the meat" will be, but if the research prophecy comes true some day, I hope weÆll all be laughing about that time we were worried about the BP copies of a bunch of tech level 1 junk.
Severus Trajan	Posted - 2003.08.13 07:04:00 - [56] Funny, IRL the exact same thing happened to me when I purchased some shares from an unnamed telecom/IT company. Apparently someone introduced a patch to the stockmarket soon afterwards, because all my shares immidiately became rather worthless. Very unrealistic! Things don't happen overnight, they should be introduced gradually! Please roll back the patch from Nasdaq!
Bald Hamster	Posted - 2003.08.13 11:06:00 - [57] Thanks for the update and all. Hope u had a good relaxing vacation TomB. I like this but everyone who is complainging is not worth the bytes its saved under. EVE Made the game and Is The Controller. Why ***** about it. I would honestly want to see more corp features like corp sells. Running the Wheel cuz there isn't anything better to do
Digital Sin	Posted - 2003.08.13 16:30:00 - [58] cheers for tomB no more "me too!" mini-battleship producing corps. bout damn time. you want an item from an expensive blueprint? GO BUY IT. "To be content,to be comfortable, is to be complacent. No one learns anything from pleasure..pain on the other hand is a most efficient instructor"
Cao Cao	Posted - 2003.08.13 16:49:00 - [59] Robomonkey: Too bad. Not everyone should have a battleship blueprint. It's not a lame argument it is the damn truth, blueprints are supposed to be 999999x more expensive than the ship itself and when there is no cost to speak of in order to copy one, that is somewhat lame now isn't it? Now get over yourself before you get yourself a hernia. Cao Cao - You are not your ship -
Rich Ryobi	Posted - 2003.08.13 17:42:00 - [60] Edited by: Rich Ryobi on 14/08/2003 12:40:15 Thanks for the update Tomb I'll be out selling the New prints by Thursday afternoon. By the way...Robomonkey, You, and Your Corp took a chance too make some good money, Unfortunetly You didn't take the time to think about what would Happen if "things changed" Life is what happens when You make plans, get used to it, Whining will not help. Thanks for the story of how not to deversify, I'll try not to make the same mistake.
ToKE	Posted - 2003.08.13 22:04:00 - [61] we still need to be able to sell stuff on the market, why do we have to wait so long for this to be fixed??? _______________________________________________ Ahaahhhh you didn't count on my loyal army of Prostitutes did you?
Fat Baastard	Posted - 2003.08.14 01:38:00 - [62] Now, I've read most of this forum and i've come to the conclusion that robomumkey is an a$$hole and if I need ammo... it won't be coming from his corp
Sphinxx	Posted - 2003.08.14 02:06:00 - [63] I agree with... well I don't remember his name...Munkeys just mad that he won't corner the market peddeling his ammo now, but Munkey, your gonna have to roll with the punches bro and THE GAME IS NOT FU@KING REAL!! Hello?!? there is no real money here to deal with just spent time having fun playing the game. Putting these bps on the market will help the market in ways, especially since theres a licence limitation on the copys...sigh... I have my own opinions about that... good and bad... but at least the copys that we have now won't change... You will have to keep in mind that the game is still young and there are a LOT of people that are not in corps and a LOT of newbs that are still out there waiting to purchase goods and mining there a$$'s off in there little ibis's and velators in hopes of having there own shiney battleship one day. Theres only 5k people playin anyway. More will come and the market will flux again... and you'll probably have more to ***** about then too... correct me if i'm wrong... but I don't think I am though. Munkey==> .... lmao Lookin for a deal on Caldari ships and other goods??? Please visit our site and make an inquiry as to what it is that you need and when we can provide you with it! What can we do to earn your business today? Offer you the best service and prices around on anything we offer! www.ebfrontieralliance.com
The Beast	Posted - 2003.08.14 09:37:00 - [64] ok now i may be sounding a little "obvious" here.. if i am (or stupid for that matter ) just say... ok example: You have 1 AM M BPC.. it can make 1000 rounds.. so thats 10 batches right? research lvl 5 or something.. instead of selling the AMMO why not sell a BP to make the ammo.. ppl an make there own ammo from your BP.. sell the BP for like 3500isk (or whatever it basicly cost you jack to amke anyway so thats 100% profit) then someone makes there own ammo.. it would be ever so slighty cheaper (like 10% or something) so it would make doing this worth while for people that need/want alot of ammo.. i mean i would do this.. (i already have some nice AM BP's and do make my own ammo) this way you can make it anywhere anytime.. especially if you are out in 0.0 with no AM ammo available it would be VERY handy indeed.. as far as monopoly stuff goes it think it is just plain unfair.. there is not enough stuff do make money from.. the only real way is to get a BP for something rare or mine.. trade routes are screwed my mega corps and there infinite wallets and buy/sell orders at downtime that small ppl just simply cant compete with.. i am a member of a small corp but there is a small group of us (4) that play all sorts of games together including this... we have tried everything to make reasonable money.. 0.0's are too dangerous for us at the moment... our skils are low/medium we all have our best cruisers for our race but we dont have the money for insurance (2.4mill on my MOA) to insure it and we sure dont have the 1.5 mill to fit the thing out again with guns if one of us gets wasted.. if we club our money together we can do some stuff but we make VERY small returns.. so we basicly get lucky with some rare loot in a 0.2 or something every now and again but thats about it.. and most of the time we keep it for our ships (things like Alpha/Beta hull mods.. ecm bursts etc) which just leaves mining... this is purley because mega corps kil both the trade markets and the BP markets due to the size or there wallets.. maybe sometimes size DOES matter. "If God Posted His Second Coming Here I Would Ban His Ass For Being Off Topic ! :)"
Damaclease	Posted - 2003.08.14 09:51:00 - [65] First up TomB good work on the game and you guys do deserve a holiday no matter what some prople think, Second good to see some more BPs on the market if ppl player thier cards right the new BP copy rules will make both the copying and manufacture business very profitible again, 3rd to people like Robo if you really don't like this image what you would be like with tech2 BP on the market as a few people have pointed out you just need to think ahead to do well and to DIVERSIFY thats my piece said good bye :)
TOKER	Posted - 2003.08.14 10:18:00 - [66] Bring on the bp's, its about time!!!!..
javer	Posted - 2003.08.14 12:22:00 - [67] so happy that i made my buy orders on all the listed new bp's that i lacked :-).... -------------------------------------------- Never argue with an idiot, they will drag you down to their Level and beat you with experience.
Robomonkey	Posted - 2003.08.14 12:58:00 - [68] The copies in game now are going to change, they will be recalled after a certian amout of time!!! I never 'whinned' just voiced my feelings about something I didn't agree with. And...it can be real money, if you check ebay you can get approx ú5 per million right now, it was ú10 a little while ago. I was mad on the day, but hey, like you say roll with the punches, we are, and we're getting back on our feet
Nightreign	Posted - 2003.08.14 13:46:00 - [69] If CCP wanted to help us little corps they would bring back the spod and put it in low sectors like .3 or .2. My major problem is getting ganked 19+ jumps running bist to a station. Bring back the Spodium please
Zulu Alpha	Posted - 2003.08.14 14:39:00 - [70] This reminds me of when they first invented the telephone. Someone said 'Imagine, there might be one in every city'. Then look what happened. History is littered with RL examples of technologies or introductions that have either enhanced or ruined a market for people. Those who make out of it will rejoice. Those who lose will cry foul. Zulu Zulu Alpha Vortex Inc
UnrealFighter	Posted - 2003.08.14 14:59:00 - [71] At the end of the day .. we new the patch was coming so stop the whineing... .. take abit of time to look at the boards abit more... ( Huff.. Some people )
Adam Sudbury	Posted - 2003.08.14 15:02:00 - [72] The Beast: Don't be mistaken: size matters. always. My girlfriend tells me every night Cao Cao - You are not your ship -
Borothis Quishir	Posted - 2003.08.14 17:22:00 - [73] Nice to see those bps around now. Although some are still missing(or I am blind) The hull repairer BPS
Solas	Posted - 2003.08.27 22:19:00 - [74] You are also missing blueprints for: 30.0% Kinetic \| 35tf \| 3MW \| BASIC \| Energized Basic Magnetic Plating 32.5% Kinetic \| 40tf \| 4MW \| TECH1 \| Energized Magnetic Membrane I 30.0% Explosive \| 35tf \| 3MW \| BASIC \| Energized Basic Reactive Plating 32.5% Explosive \| 40tf \| 4MW \| TECH1 \| Energized Reactive Membrane I 30.0% EM \| 35tf \| 3MW \| BASIC \| Energized Basic Reflective Plating 32.5% EM \| 40tf \| 4MW \| TECH1 \| Energized Reflective Membrane I 30.0% Thermal \| 35tf \| 3MW \| BASIC \| Energized Basic Thermic Plating 32.5% Thermal \| 40tf \| 4MW \| TECH1 \| Energized Thermic Membrane I 15% EM \| 15% Explosive \| 15% Thermal \| 15% Kinetic \| 40tf \| 4MW \| BASIC \| Energized Adaptive Nano Mambrane I 14% EM \| 14% Explosive \| 14% Thermal \| 14% Kinetic \| 35tf \| 3MW \| TECH1 \| Energized Basic Adaptive Nano Plating I have literaly looked everywhere
BSOD	Posted - 2003.08.28 13:26:00 - [75] Quote: Nice to see those bps around now. Although some are still missing(or I am blind) The hull repairer BPS Could be intentional, since hull repairers are a powerful item. What is definately missing: Basic Magnetic Field Stabilizer and Basic Heatsink (Proj users get a basic gyro BP, why don't laser/hybrid users get a BP for their damage mods?) Basic Co-Processor. Anything "basic" should have a BP available. Also, smartbomb blueprints are still not visible on the market It appears to be the same bug as Miner IIs. ---------------- Blue Screen of Death CEO Exodus Enterprises
Janos	Posted - 2003.08.28 15:29:00 - [76] ok is there a such thing as the large secure container blue print?
Athule Snanm	Posted - 2003.08.28 15:37:00 - [77] What about various drone BPs such as the Praetor, Ogre, etc? Someone was selling originals of these from 150M to 375M (copies sell for a tiny fraction of this), which implies they did get out of the bag at some point. Someone I know got an ogre copy as an agent mission reward, are originals for these distributed in the same way or were they leaked like the weapon and ammo BPs? _______________________________ Doomheim - EVE's only hygiene!
edudtset	Posted - 2003.08.28 15:44:00 - [78] i dont think there is a secure can BP but if they do put one out im sure the joves will give tti the first one, and call it content ================================================ I just find laughable that, despite all the big talk, they end their "careers" in such a way. oO
BSOD	Posted - 2003.08.28 18:48:00 - [79] Quote: What about various drone BPs such as the Praetor, Ogre, etc? Someone was selling originals of these from 150M to 375M (copies sell for a tiny fraction of this), which implies they did get out of the bag at some point. Someone I know got an ogre copy as an agent mission reward, are originals for these distributed in the same way or were they leaked like the weapon and ammo BPs? I believe originals might have been drops for a while. ---------------- Blue Screen of Death CEO Exodus Enterprises

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