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Don't make the CE purchasable by PLEX.

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Ottersmacker Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED 365	Posted - 2013.04.28 19:38:00 - [31] - Quote Kamorain Dinard wrote: If you do decide to sell things like this for PLEX in the future, announce that that will happen well in advance. It's not like it would be shipped before October anyway, if they came out with a 'statement of Yes it will be available for PLEX', people have like half a year to purchase it via PLEX as a pre-order, and all the time in the world after that without the pre-order swag. It's not as if it was a 5 minute window that would cause every PLEX ever to be bought up. The RMT worries are by far less significant than with something like a GFX card. Hundreds of millions of consumers are potentially interested in purchasing graphics cards. How many do you think would like a 150 Gé¼ collectors edition of an Internet spaceship game? Probably more than 0, but worrying about 'CCP being undercut' makes no sense, because they've been already paid for the PLEX. i just locked an open door.. strange, yet symbolically compelling.
James Amril-Kesh 4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance 4775	Posted - 2013.04.28 19:40:00 - [32] - Quote Brooks Puuntai wrote: Ottersmacker wrote: + CCP gets their money, because all PLEX in existence (unless it's been simply spawned by CCP - something they claim not to do) has already been paid for anyway. + CCP potentially gets to sell more copies. With an actual physical item, I doubt the process is that simple. Of course it is. Why wouldn't it be? The exchange of money is exactly the same, so why does the product or service make a difference? I was talking about this a while back with someone regarding Fanfest. You could buy Fanfest tickets with PLEX but you couldn't buy, say, airline tickets. It's perfectly doable and CCP might even turn a profit from doing so. PLEX cost is maybe $18 or $19 on average depending on the packages that people buy, so CCP would ask for the amount of PLEX that covers the cost of the ticket, rounded up one. If say ticket cost modulo* plex cost is $5 on average and 1000 people buy tickets with PLEX, then CCP turns a profit of $5000 for nothing other than being an intermediary in the transaction. (Modulo is essentially an operation that gives you the remainder of an integer division. 10 / 3 = 3 with remainder 1, so 10 modulo 3 is 1)
Michael Stabb School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 13	Posted - 2013.04.28 20:25:00 - [33] - Quote Hessian Arcturus wrote: . I am aware that as of yet, there is no limit on how many can be bought. But if everyone bought the collectors edition, it stops being a collectable... Pokemon cards, sports cards, Pogz., stamps, those cards you used to get in cigarette packets.. even money! All mass produced but all collectable. Sure, some are crap (depending on who you're talking to) but much of it is worth a lot of money. If this is about wanting something unique that lets you say "Look at this, I have this but many people don't", you're missing the point of having an item to celebrate ten years of EVE. Don't be fooled by "Collectors Edition", everything becomes "valuable" in time.. except maybe Madonna.
Nathalie LaPorte Republic University Minmatar Republic 135	Posted - 2013.04.28 20:28:00 - [34] - Quote Michael Stabb wrote: Hessian Arcturus wrote: . I am aware that as of yet, there is no limit on how many can be bought. But if everyone bought the collectors edition, it stops being a collectable... Pokemon cards, sports cards, Pogz., stamps, those cards you used to get in cigarette packets.. even money! All mass produced but all collectable. Sure, some are crap (depending on who you're talking to) but much of it is worth a lot of money. If this is about wanting something unique that lets you say "Look at this, I have this but many people don't", you're missing the point of having an item to celebrate ten years of EVE. Don't be fooled by "Collectors Edition", everything becomes "valuable" in time.. except maybe Madonna. Someone isn't current on the Forbes 'richest musicians' list.
Michael Stabb School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 13	Posted - 2013.04.28 20:35:00 - [35] - Quote Nathalie LaPorte wrote: Someone isn't current on the Forbes 'richest musicians' list. She may have money but that doesn't make her valued
Alaekessa Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. 89	Posted - 2013.04.28 20:38:00 - [36] - Quote Dave Stark wrote: plex is the only way i'd buy one. but that's mainly because i couldn't stomach a -ú126 outgoing on my bank statement for an item where over 50% of it is things i don't want. Go check the Dust GD, you might like what you find. C'mon CCP, let us suicide gank the high-sec pub matches in Dust.....
Dave Stark 2961	Posted - 2013.04.28 20:40:00 - [37] - Quote Alaekessa wrote: Dave Stark wrote: plex is the only way i'd buy one. but that's mainly because i couldn't stomach a -ú126 outgoing on my bank statement for an item where over 50% of it is things i don't want. Go check the Dust GD, you might like what you find. interesting.
Hessian Arcturus S.W.O.R.D. Navy 48	Posted - 2013.04.28 21:32:00 - [38] - Quote Michael Stabb wrote: Nathalie LaPorte wrote: Someone isn't current on the Forbes 'richest musicians' list. She may have money but that doesn't make her valued Definitely would if you know what I mean hahahaha No no I dont want the CE to say "look at this I have it and not many others do"... I might not even be able to get it if I cant save up enough and they decide to make it "x amount"... I know CCP get money from PLEX that people buy, but someone who just buys PLEX from the market in game, with in game ISK that they've amased from years (I know it doesnt take years to make ISK) and then gets a CE... They have just got the CE for free... Some one else baught the PLEX with RL money, theyve baught it with money that doesnt exist.. I dont know if ive put across very well what im trying to say there...its good in my head, but I dont know if you understand what I mean in that last paragraph? Lol If not, sorry... It's human nature to want to explore. To find your line and go beyond it. The only limit, is the one you set yourself.
Dub Step Death To Everyone But Us 32	Posted - 2013.04.28 22:27:00 - [39] - Quote Waah, somebody aquired some box of needless stuff via a different monetary method than me and I cant TAKE IT!!!111. Your Mum might care but no-one else does. Please shut up.
Gogela Freeport Exploration Loosely Affiliated Pirates Alliance 2410	Posted - 2013.04.28 22:36:00 - [40] - Quote PLEX is real money just as dollars are. PLEX represents real money. I don't see what the problem is. 6 PLEX for digital edition seems more than reasonable, especially if you don't get the physical goods. +PGêç+P \|-áGèò \| -ë-û-ë

Mr Epeen It's All About Me 2410	Posted - 2013.04.28 22:38:00 - [41] - Quote CCP would actually make more by selling the CE for PLEX. For me that's neither here nor there, though. What I want is to be able to cover the insane shipping cost with PLEX. Mr Epeen There are 86,400 seconds in a day. You just saved one of them by typing 'u' instead of 'you'.-á Congratulations, dumbass!
Robus Muvila GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 256	Posted - 2013.04.29 00:26:00 - [42] - Quote Alaekessa wrote: Dave Stark wrote: plex is the only way i'd buy one. but that's mainly because i couldn't stomach a -ú126 outgoing on my bank statement for an item where over 50% of it is things i don't want. Go check the Dust GD, you might like what you find. If I could offset the cost of the Collectors edition by unloading the Dust514 content on someone else I would buy the collecters edition in a heartbeat, but what is CCP's stance on this? Seeing as this is an unredeemed coupon does this fall outside of RMT clauses of trading game assets for real money seeing as the game assets haven't been redeemed yet? Seems like a bit of a grey area, but one that holds pretty heavy sway on whether I would shell out for the collectors edition or not. TMC Senior Developer http://themittani.com - Because EvE has needed a proper news site for ages
Owena Owoked Apocalypse Reign 21	Posted - 2013.04.29 01:45:00 - [43] - Quote Robus Muvila wrote: Alaekessa wrote: Dave Stark wrote: plex is the only way i'd buy one. but that's mainly because i couldn't stomach a -ú126 outgoing on my bank statement for an item where over 50% of it is things i don't want. Go check the Dust GD, you might like what you find. If I could offset the cost of the Collectors edition by unloading the Dust514 content on someone else I would buy the collecters edition in a heartbeat, but what is CCP's stance on this? Seeing as this is an unredeemed coupon does this fall outside of RMT clauses of trading game assets for real money seeing as the game assets haven't been redeemed yet? Seems like a bit of a grey area, but one that holds pretty heavy sway on whether I would shell out for the collectors edition or not. Considering that it is a physical good I would say that once you have it there should be no problem putting it up on ebay or craig's list. So a private sale should fall under that as well.
Kamorain Dinard Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2013.04.29 02:05:00 - [44] - Quote Michael Stabb wrote: Kamorain Dinard wrote: Sounds sensible. If you allow it to be purchased via PLEX, people with billions of ISK will buy lots of PLEX with ISK and use it to buy the collector's editions. This will distort the PLEX market and push up PLEX prices. Higher PLEX prices mean that people buying them with ISK to sub their accounts will be unable to do so and may stop playing, harming the game in the long run. And then the people who sell PLEX will come in, buy more ETC's and start selling more PLEX until supply/demand evens out again. HOORAY FOR THE ECONOMY! \o/ Why do you say that people would buy more PLEX and enter more into the economy if the ISK price of them rises? PLEX don't work like normal goods because, they aren't really just goods in the EVE economy at all, they are a means to exchange $ for ISK or, ISK for game time (which, since it otherwise costs $s is basically just a proxy for $s). PLEX enter the EVE economy by people buying them from CCP for $ and selling them for ISK in EVE to get an ISK boost. If the ISK price of them rises, people get more ISK per PLEX they buy or, equivalently, more ISK per $. People most likely want some amount of ISK in game (that isn't dependant on price of PLEX) so, they spend some amount of $ on PLEX. If the ISK price of PLEX rises, they get more ISK per PLEX (or per $ spent on PLEX) so, they don't need to buy as many as before to get the same amount of ISK. This means that, counterintuitively, the more expensive PLEX are in terms of ISK, the less of them get bought. PLEX work the opposite way round to most items because, their price in ISK is actually their value to the people buying them from CCP (which is what creates them) and, their $ price is the price that the consumer sees when buying them from CCP so, if their ISK price rises, there will actually be less of them, not more as with most goods in EVE. It is the $ price of PLEX that has to fall to make people buy more of them (i.e. more of them enter the EVE economy). If CCP make a new use for lots of PLEX (like making people able to buy the collector's edition with them), they need to also make them cheaper in real money to keep the PLEX market stable (which they aren't likely to want to do).
Fredfredbug4 Eve Defence Force Tribal Band 777	Posted - 2013.04.29 02:13:00 - [45] - Quote Because of PLEX being purchasable with "real money" that makes ISK and subsequently PLEX "real money" as well. 33,333,333.33 ISK is roughly equivalent to 1 USD, give or take. Therefore, purchasing the collectors edition for PLEX is perfectly reasonable and should be allowed. Watch Fred Fred Frederation and stop cryptozoologist! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it!
Rachel Starchaser Perkone Caldari State 1	Posted - 2013.04.29 02:54:00 - [46] - Quote What is a collectors edition?
Ember Saint Time-Lost Proto-Drake 8	Posted - 2013.04.29 07:44:00 - [47] - Quote Hessian Arcturus wrote: someone who just buys PLEX from the market in game and then gets a CE... They have just got the CE for free... Would you give away, say to me, all of your ISK - after all 'it's free'? : ) I doubt it, because obtaining the ISK also took some effort. There's also alternative cost - I bought 10 PLEX in anticipation for a potential CE offer, if I used them for such a purpose, I'd miss out on 10 months of game time. It's not 'free' : ) Kamorain Dinard wrote: This means that, counterintuitively, the more expensive PLEX are in terms of ISK, the less of them get bought. "How much ISK am I getting for this?" is what a person considering sale of PLEX asks themselves. Do you think the amount of people willing to take the opportunity is constant regardless of the conversion rate, say both for 15$->300M ISK and 15$->500M ISK?
Eugene Kerner TunDraGon Drunk 'n' Disorderly 670	Posted - 2013.04.29 08:00:00 - [48] - Quote Op....you know that it is only called a collectors edition that you can feel like a special snowflake, do you? "Also, your boobs " -á CCP Eterne, 2012
Elizabeth S 6	Posted - 2013.04.29 08:01:00 - [49] - Quote Here is a quote from CCP Spitfire from another thread https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=229742&p=2 Quote: This collectors edition will be limited in terms of copies produced; i.e. once they're gone, they're gone. =)
Cesar Caltrans Caltrans 13	Posted - 2013.04.29 08:09:00 - [50] - Quote I haven't seen the CE yet but I would rather buy it with cash. it would keep it rare in the long run I Really Love LIKES.. -á PLEASE Sir / Miss Can I get a Like :)-á Thank you

Ember Saint Time-Lost Proto-Drake 8	Posted - 2013.04.29 08:14:00 - [51] - Quote It wouldn't make sense to produce less than they can potentially sell if they have any business sense at all. They will add up all pre-orders, come up with a number of potential neo-neckbeard purchasers over the span of a few years and add those as well + include a nice stash for random future purposes .. that will be the number of copies produced.
Colonel Xaven Decadence. RAZOR Alliance 268	Posted - 2013.04.29 08:19:00 - [52] - Quote Hessian Arcturus wrote: In my opinion, this would be a bad idea on CCPs part. There are hundreds, probably thousands of players in the game with billions and billions of ISK. If they all decided to purchase a Collectors Edition via in game methods, then it will take away the aspect of it being a Collectors Edition due to the fact everyone will have one. In my opinion all Limited Editions or Collectors Editions should only ever be purchasable by real money. If you cant afford it, well save for it. You wouldnt go into a store and buy the N7 Edition of Mass Effect 3 (for example) if you didn't have the monies to do so... Leaving it as a real money purchase, also stops people that would buy it for PLEX and then sell it for a hundred quid, undercutting CCP. I'm not having a go at the people who are asking this, I'm simply stating that I think its a bad idea, and giving you a reason why I think this. Discuss...(please lets keep it civil). EDIT: Just in case anyone does think about saying, oh its someone with a lot of real life money ready to splash it around, this isnt the case. I will be saving money each month so I may purchase a copy... You are aware that every PLEX is backed up by real money? So either buying for 150 $ / EUR or the adequate PLEX amount doesn't matter for CCP. What ever non-economic issue you might have with that, I don't understand it. www.facebook.com/RazorAlliance
Sentient Blade Walk It Off 908	Posted - 2013.04.29 08:35:00 - [53] - Quote I reallllly wanted the collectors edition too. But I'm in agreement with Stark here, I have no interest in either the board game or the DUST stuff (mainly because it's not available on PC). Everything in it to do with EVE i'd gladly purchase for -ú99 but it looks like a lot of the packaging and such has been made towards fitting an almost completely unrelated board game >.> whoops. It's made it a bit tougher decision for me.
Tiberius StarGazer StarGazer Heavy Industries And Exploration 365	Posted - 2013.04.29 08:38:00 - [54] - Quote I don't see what the issue is, someone somewhere paid for a plex and had it put into the game. Just because someone without the cash uses the PLEX doesn't mean that it hasn't been paid for.
Kousaka Otsu Shigure Telluria Mechanics 0	Posted - 2013.04.29 10:11:00 - [55] - Quote Well, I must HAVE that Golden Pod.. it would be against my Amarrian heritage not to pre-order it! Truly, "Collectors Item" has been misused quite often as to cheapen the term. A true collector wouldn't hesitate to sell off some of her finest slaves (not the flogged ones I say) for the privilege of a Golden Pod.
Hessian Arcturus S.W.O.R.D. Navy 51	Posted - 2013.04.29 13:19:00 - [56] - Quote Elizabeth S wrote: Here is a quote from CCP Spitfire from another thread https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=229742&p=2 Quote: This collectors edition will be limited in terms of copies produced; i.e. once they're gone, they're gone. =) Well there we have it... It is a Limited Edition Collectors Edition... In my opinion, that should be real money only... But like I say, thats my opinion It's human nature to want to explore. To find your line and go beyond it. The only limit, is the one you set yourself.
Luke Diligovictus Repercussus RAZOR Alliance 9	Posted - 2013.04.29 15:09:00 - [57] - Quote I'm for making it available for plex, and here's my points on that; 1) Eve is a game that already allows financially challenged people to play with the same rights/priviledges as 'paid' subscribers, and they do this via a form of in-game RMT-ing via PLEX. To have a collectors edition that caters to only the PLEX-Sellers and not the PLEX-Consumers is, in my opinion, unfair to the large part of the community that is used to having the same access to the game as PLEX-Sellers. 2) A lot of people seem to think that having an increased demand for plex will drive prices up too high for the plex-consumers to continue using them - this is totally unfounded, in my opinion. I know alot of people who use plex for their accounts (and i'm talking highsec, not nullsec here) and i'm pretty sure they would still play if it took 2-3 days of isk farming to afford a plex instead of 1-2 days. Eve currency is already worth alot in real life money compared to other games, in relation to how easy it is to get. (e.g. it would take alot longer to get the equivalent of $20 worth of currency in another game than it would take to get $20 worth in eve). 3) Alot of the Plex-Sellers i know DO actually buy more plex when the price spikes, so they get the most out of their money. This happened with the New Eden Open tournament (plexes were above 650m for a while), then CCP put a little notice on the launcher essentially saying "oh my, the plex prices are spiking due to this entry fee". Lo and behold, the day that was put up, plex prices plummeted as the market was flooded with people trying to get the most out of their plexes. TLDR: Plex supply DOES increase when the price is up ASSUMING PEOPLE UNDERSTAND IT'S A TEMPORARY SPIKE. 4) Some of us REALLY can't afford the collectors edition anytime soon, and as it has been announced that it will be of finite supply, how can we get the CE in time? I personally have only $60 a month in spending money TOTAL, so not only would i have to save for more than 3 months, but i'd also have to nix all other expenses as well. e.g. no grabbing a quick slice of pizza when in a rush, no monthly lunch out with the family... Should i have not spend a dime for 4 months just to get a collectors edition for a game I love? Also, for those that look at me and go "bah, he lives in nullsec, he probably has tons of plexes and doesnt know how much people work in highsec to get their plexes", rest assured that's not the case. Highsec (and lowsec) now offer so many ways to get isk... I myself tried industry (was very profitable), scanning (some items you can loot in highsec are almost worth a plex BY ITSELF), wormhole daytripping (fairly steady) and missions (booooring, but the isk is there). I was able to fund 2 accounts long before i moved to nullsec, and was still able to save over a billion a month. I propose this idea forward: Instead of making a collectors edition available for plex, limited to 1 per account (which is a silly limit, most people with lots of isk run multiple accounts, i myself have a bunch of accounts running at the moment), How about CCP puts a 'Collectors Edition Application' up; you basically write a short blurb on why you want the CE via plex, then CCP does a quick background check (e.g. checks that you havent already asked for one with a different account, that you've been paying for your account with plexes already and therefore are serious, etc) and then decides whether or not to allow you to buy it with plex. This route would make it hard for people who just want to find a way to get cash value for their plexes, and CCP would be able to track them easily. I would happily pay 20 plex for one CE - having a golden pod on my main, having the dust gear for my 1 dust account... Thats all most of us plex-to-play-ers are asking. And before anyone bashes my points, understand that this is not me guessing, or making assumptions - this is based on my observations over almost 2 years of playing this delicious game. =)


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