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Frake Lomes Century Citadel 1	Posted - 2013.05.13 23:59:00 - [1] - Quote After a few years + few more years of EVE, the most almost best sandbox spaceship game ever (10% truth rule), are there any plans to fix the Drone UI? If only there was a team dedicated to making the games UI better, a team which could be called: Team SuperAwesomeBestFriendsForeverPinkZombieKitten or maybe it was simply Team Best Friends or somesuch. Anyhows, I thought Drone UI fixes were in the CCPwerks at some point and we could have expected at least something to make drones a little more bearable for a few years now. Can someone at least give me a slight glimmer of hope, just a tiny beacon of light....even if it is an inbound torpedo about make my day a little more interesting?
Ckra Trald Stellar Essence STELLAR CONSTELLATION 167	Posted - 2013.05.14 00:04:00 - [2] - Quote Drones is general are messed up. UI is clunky, they lack hotkeys, most of the EW drones are not very good, and they tend to get blown up too fast. ^^ poorly made blunt forum post above ^^
Frake Lomes Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic 6	Posted - 2013.05.29 01:17:00 - [3] - Quote Shameless bump. With the addition of probe love, stargate love, tiericide love, and other lubbins on EVE, might I humbly suggest to CCPwerks (aka all those lovable minions working hard on making EVE better) to start putting Drone UI fix post-it notes on the top of the "Big pile of to-do" post-it notes. Would be much appreciated for some Drone UI lovin.
Sergeant Acht Scultz School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 759	Posted - 2013.05.29 01:20:00 - [4] - Quote If drones AI is still in need of a lot of work, most of drones issues got forgotten for some time with the introduction of drone modules and ships bonus changes making those work a bit better but no solve the core problems of those. UI is secondary but still something in need of work too. removed inappropriate ASCII art signature - CCP Eterne
Doc Fury Furious Enterprises 1986	Posted - 2013.05.29 01:21:00 - [5] - Quote --> Features & Ideas Discussion The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the ho's and politicians will look up and shout 'Save us!' and I'll look down, and whisper 'Hodor'.
Frake Lomes Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic 6	Posted - 2013.05.29 01:25:00 - [6] - Quote Doc Fury wrote: --> Features & Ideas Discussion right, right, this is the wrong place for it, but it's not so much an idea for features and stuff as a cry for help for something terribly neglected. Kind of like Alma crying for her kids she never got to raise (+10 points for all of you out there getting this reference).
Winterblink Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion 70	Posted - 2013.05.29 03:07:00 - [7] - Quote Ckra Trald wrote: Drones is general are messed up. UI is clunky, they lack hotkeys, most of the EW drones are not very good, and they tend to get blown up too fast. Since when do they lack hotkeys? http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Keyboard_Controls#Drones warp drive active
Jake Warbird Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 2661	Posted - 2013.05.29 03:11:00 - [8] - Quote Still don't see hotkeys to launch pre-defined groups of drones in that link.
Winterblink Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion 70	Posted - 2013.05.29 03:17:00 - [9] - Quote Jake Warbird wrote: Still don't see hotkeys to launch pre-defined groups of drones in that link. The post I was replying to implied there were NONE, not specific ones for scenarios that you describe. That being said, what you suggest is something I'd totally love to have. warp drive active
War Kitten Panda McLegion 2047	Posted - 2013.05.29 11:31:00 - [10] - Quote Winterblink wrote: Jake Warbird wrote: Still don't see hotkeys to launch pre-defined groups of drones in that link. The post I was replying to implied there were NONE, not specific ones for scenarios that you describe. That being said, what you suggest is something I'd totally love to have. No, you just read it that way. They do indeed lack hotkeys for an essential function - deployment. It's a pretty universal "specific scenario" I find that without a good mob to provide one for them, most people would have no mentality at all.
Abrazzar Vardaugas Family 1889	Posted - 2013.05.29 11:36:00 - [11] - Quote Maybe, for a baby step, they could add a hotkey to press and hold so you can click single drones to dock and undock, depending on where they are. Sovereignty and Population New Mining Mechanics

CCP Arrow C C P C C P Alliance 394	Posted - 2013.05.29 11:48:00 - [12] - Quote I can't make any promises, but I've worked on many mockups and ideas for a brand new Drone UI and I would love to work on it's implementation with my team Game of Drones in the near future. All I can say is keep up the good work of giving us ideas for it and know that the right people are listening CCP Arrow-á-á\|-á Senior Game Designer-á\|-á @CCP_Arrow

Ruskarn Andedare Lion Investments 187	Posted - 2013.05.29 11:59:00 - [13] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: I can't make any promises, but I've worked on many mockups and ideas for a brand new Drone UI and I would love to work on it's implementation with my team Game of Drones in the near future. All I can say is keep up the good work of giving us ideas for it and know that the right people are listening It's true! The great ones do exist and they still believe in the true path of drones!
War Kitten Panda McLegion 2047	Posted - 2013.05.29 12:15:00 - [14] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: I can't make any promises, but I've worked on many mockups and ideas for a brand new Drone UI and I would love to work on it's implementation with my team Game of Drones in the near future. All I can say is keep up the good work of giving us ideas for it and know that the right people are listening What are the chances of letting us see the mockups and giving feedback on the "right" direction? Do we need to support a Pro-Drone CSM candidate for this to happen, or can you share with the whole class please? :) I find that without a good mob to provide one for them, most people would have no mentality at all.
Debora Tsung The Investment Bankers Guild 139	Posted - 2013.05.29 12:50:00 - [15] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: I can't make any promises, but I've worked on many mockups Pictures or it didn't happen! There's nothing a million chinese guys can't do cheaper.
Lors Dornick Kallisti Industries Solar Assault Fleet 534	Posted - 2013.05.29 13:37:00 - [16] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: I can't make any promises, but I've worked on many mockups and ideas for a brand new Drone UI and I would love to work on it's implementation with my team Game of Drones in the near future. All I can say is keep up the good work of giving us ideas for it and know that the right people are listening My deeply cynic soul can't decide if this is a blatant attempt to divert attention from launcher complains and/or generic whines over some change in Odyssey. Or if it's an equally blatant but more personal attempt from Arrow to harvest forum likes ;) Either way, it was the best post I've read in weeks. CCP Eterne: Silly player, ALL devs are evil. CCP Fozzie: When Veritas describes a programming challenge as "very hard" I tend to believe him.
iskflakes 481	Posted - 2013.05.29 14:47:00 - [17] - Quote EVE needs this more than it needs exploration. -
Arkenai Wyrnspire Turalyon Plus 1664	Posted - 2013.05.29 14:50:00 - [18] - Quote iskflakes wrote: EVE needs this more than it needs exploration. I think I agree, actually. Sig'd.-áGallente FW best FW.
Ruskarn Andedare Lion Investments 188	Posted - 2013.05.29 14:56:00 - [19] - Quote Arkenai Wyrnspire wrote: iskflakes wrote: EVE needs this more than it needs exploration. I think I agree, actually. Sadly, so do I, but the way exploration has gone has me a little worried about 'improvements' atm (BTW does anyone here remember Dark Star - now think of that bomb as an Ogre in your drone bay )
Jarod Garamonde Action Bastards 258	Posted - 2013.05.29 15:54:00 - [20] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: I can't make any promises, but I've worked on many mockups and ideas for a brand new Drone UI and I would love to work on it's implementation with my team Game of Drones in the near future. All I can say is keep up the good work of giving us ideas for it and know that the right people are listening And there was much rejoicing (amongst droners, anyway) "you can identify eve players by looking at their cars. Since they don't drive what they can't afford to lose."-á --áBienator II
ElQuirko Jester Syndicate S0UTHERN C0MF0RT 1369	Posted - 2013.05.29 17:01:00 - [21] - Quote I really don't understand why drones weren't given as much priority as ship/weapon rebalancing. Drones span every race and near every ship class - fixing the usability of drones shoulda been way more important than, say, giving the tristan two extra powergrid or completely revamping what the cyclone does. Save the Domi model! Spacewhales should be preserved.
Arkenai Wyrnspire Turalyon Plus 1665	Posted - 2013.05.29 17:25:00 - [22] - Quote ElQuirko wrote: I really don't understand why drones weren't given as much priority as ship/weapon rebalancing. Drones span every race and near every ship class - fixing the usability of drones shoulda been way more important than, say, giving the tristan two extra powergrid or completely revamping what the cyclone does. Definitely. There have been rebalancing things for practically every weapon system - except drones. Whilst the problem isn't as simple as just a rebalance, there are loads of drones which are subpar and could do with a buff, for example, the Acolyte drones (Nearly any Caldari/Amarr drone, actually). Drones have also become increasingly common in ships - every race's cruisers have them now, and it only gets worse as sizes increase. I feel it would be better to give less drones to ships that aren't Gallente (or Amarr). Sig'd.-áGallente FW best FW.
Lister Vindaloo Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 1	Posted - 2013.05.29 20:40:00 - [23] - Quote All the other rebalancing gives me hope that a drone fix is on the way, and lets face it they don't need a rebalance they need a total rebuild. But I now have hope, with any luck winter will bring droneageddon.
PinkKnife Future Corps Sleeper Social Club 342	Posted - 2013.05.29 21:28:00 - [24] - Quote I love how CCP has gone around fixing things that effect maybe 1/2 the population of EVE, POS'es, sure they were bad, but the drone UI is way worse and effects way more people. Christ a whole race is dedicated to them, yet still, over a year after the first UI mockups were shown at fanfest IX we still are stuck with the same UI that was awful and ****** in 2004, and continues to bring down the game as it is. At this point, ANYTHING is better than what we have now.
Roime Ten Thousand Years Shinjiketo 3021	Posted - 2013.05.29 21:42:00 - [25] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: I can't make any promises, but I've worked on many mockups and ideas for a brand new Drone UI and I would love to work on it's implementation with my team Game of Drones in the near future. All I can say is keep up the good work of giving us ideas for it and know that the right people are listening Awesome! I hope you get you get allocated the project! My wishlist for the UI is simple... simplish at least: - ability to set Primary and Secondary group, and to bind shortcuts to launch these groups - each drone gets assigned a number from 1-5, and you can select one or several of these by user-defined shortcuts - when drone(s) are selected, the normal commands apply only to selected drone(s) - launched groups needs to expand, and the returned group collapsed in the window, opposite behaviour to current! - ability to see damage on drones in bay - indicator when drones are targeted These would relieve drone pilots from the dropdown menu ballet, and provide the necessary information required to control drones successfully. A lesser wish is to be able to create mixed drone groups of combat and other drones. Keeping the window size slim is important. Drones in general need quite a bit more than a usable UI, but I guess rebalancing and game mechanics would be handles by other teams. Thumbs up! -á- All I really wanted was to build a castle among the stars -
Garviel Tarrant Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel 948	Posted - 2013.05.29 22:00:00 - [26] - Quote Personally i think this is MUCH more important than jump effects and moving the undock button just to move it. Fix the systems that are TERRIBLE first.. Then the ones that ruin immersion... Gameplay before fluff please. BYDI (Shadow cartel) Recruitment open!
Herzog Wolfhammer Sigma Special Tactics Group 2816	Posted - 2013.05.29 22:48:00 - [27] - Quote Please let us script drone responses in the client. While some settings on their behavior would be good, like "passive", "attack if attacked" or "attack nearest hostile", etc, being able to go beyond into certain conditions would be a great help and I don't imagine that this could not be server level so much that the "Oh noez the server will have to work harder and I might have a .00001 percent increased chance of not getting a KM" crowd loses the right to forum rage. Simple drone scripting instruction on the client side like: Engage enemies in tactical order by size/threat level(Extreme/Danger/Risky) OR Distance Engage enemies in order of attack form: Warp scrambling me/webbing me/energy draining me/target painting me/damping me/ ... etc Engage by ship type order frigates/battle cruisers/assault frigates/destroyers/etc Return when: sheilds are at 20 percent (THIS would be excellent for keeping drones alive) or Return when: Armor reaches 10 percent ..........etc.............. We already have drones returning to the bay automatically when the ship starts initiating warp. Yeah I know. I can hear them now: "But.... but... .this will further dumb down the game!" No, it will reduce drone tedium and if someone's killmails depend on someone else's bad UI tedium they are lame. I would bet those who would fear such measures have a lot of rookie ships and pods on their boards. Fact is that drone scripting is still up to the player so nothing is being done for anybody to give anybody an advantage over anybody. It would also be great to be able to export drone action/response configurations or scripts and import them to that they can be shared for cases where a fleet doctrine requires drones to behave in a certain way. We could even fancy perhaps some of the drone behavior customization to have specific fleet directives like "protect logistics ship" or even other directives for logistical drones. Having collections of these scripts would also be handy for various situations. We could see a whole new world break out for drones and make using drones more unique and interesting.
Frake Lomes Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic 13	Posted - 2013.05.29 23:36:00 - [28] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: I can't make any promises, but I've worked on many mockups and ideas for a brand new Drone UI and I would love to work on it's implementation with my team Game of Drones in the near future. All I can say is keep up the good work of giving us ideas for it and know that the right people are listening So the great ones in CCPwerks do exist, thank the supremely-intelligent-omnipotent-patron(ess) or whichever being that you believe or don't believe exists (try that diversity crowd!). Anyhows, thnx for the reply. Really look forward to future drone stuff. +1 for Team Game of Drones
Jake Warbird Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 2664	Posted - 2013.05.31 06:53:00 - [29] - Quote There is hope!
Lister Vindaloo Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 1	Posted - 2013.05.31 14:25:00 - [30] - Quote I kinda like the more complex behavior idea but I'd like to be able to set it for each group I have made, not just for the entire bay.

CCP Arrow C C P C C P Alliance 447	Posted - 2013.05.31 19:15:00 - [31] - Quote Ok, I usually don't go into design methodologies on the forums but I'm in a Friday kind of mood so let's just try this together for fun. Imagine just for a second that there are no Drones in EVE and there never was a Drone Management System. Now imagine you are coming up with ideas for such a system.. User Needs - What is the single most important need this feature should fulfill? Usefullness - Name one important thing you want this feature to do for your current game experience. Functionality - How do you want to control this feature? Inspiration - Give one example of something from a Sci-fi movie you think should be used as a reference Potential - Name one good game mechanic currently existing in EVE which this feature could benefit from using Have fun! o7 CCP Arrow-á-á\|-á Senior Game Designer-á\|-á @CCP_Arrow

Amuneti Jones Shockwave Innovations Surely You're Joking 3	Posted - 2013.05.31 19:59:00 - [32] - Quote User Needs - What is the single most important need this feature should fulfill? Alternate combat method. A weapon's substitute that permits alternative gameplay. Drones permits a person who does not understand optimum range, falloff, the hundreds of different ammo types, to be competitive, apply damage, or use utility while not being the perfect pilot. There are "MANY" people who use just drones, be it by lazyness or preference. They don't understand guns, sniper fits, brawling fits, etc. They wan to launch and let the drones control their own optimal damage while the person controls their ship. This allows for a macro approach, they worry less about ranges, and more about applying utility to their droneforce. This also allows a micro-approach by swapping in and out certain utility based drones (less viable now as we are reduced to just 5 drones). Usefullness - Name one important thing you want this feature to do for your current game experience. Substitute as my secondary defense system (a working e-war platform, ECM drones work to a degree. Webber drones, sensor damp drones, neut drones, and to a degree target painting drones, do little to nothing). Functionality - How do you want to control this feature? F1, F2, F3. Allow us to set a drone group as a click button just like a gun. (heck make a micro 4th role for drones). 1 click, attack, 2nd click, return. Inspiration - Give one example of something from a Sci-fi movie you think should be used as a reference Someone mocked it up for you already http://freebooted.blogspot.com/2012/12/no-retribution-for-drones.html http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-0L9EipkVbUA/UMHeRAN587I/AAAAAAAAC1M/hWVTulUiIkY/s1600/EVE_Drone_UI.png Potential - Name one good game mechanic currently existing in EVE which this feature could benefit from using I can't name one that would not.. wait.. refining.
MeBiatch Republic University Minmatar Republic 1053	Posted - 2013.05.31 20:03:00 - [33] - Quote ElQuirko wrote: I really don't understand why drones weren't given as much priority as ship/weapon rebalancing. Drones span every race and near every ship class - fixing the usability of drones shoulda been way more important than, say, giving the tristan two extra powergrid or completely revamping what the cyclone does. from what i understand drone ui is legacy code and being rewritten from scratch much like crimewatch was just not as complicated. more then likely the code is being first updated now and only after that can we expect improvements to 1. drone UI 2. drone usability. Ok, so you've corrected my spelling,do you care to make a valid point? -áThere are no stupid Questions... just stupid people...
Freighdee Katt Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 162	Posted - 2013.05.31 20:23:00 - [34] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: I can't make any promises, but I've worked on many mockups and ideas for a brand new Drone UI and I would love to work on it's implementation with my team Game of Drones in the near future. All I can say is keep up the good work of giving us ideas for it and know that the right people are listening Alright then, tell us how many likes you need on this post to convince your superiors to green light it. I feel confident we can deliver double whatever number you need.
Freighdee Katt Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 162	Posted - 2013.05.31 20:30:00 - [35] - Quote As far as "how it should work," I'd only ask for two things: (1) Remove "aggressive" mode and drone auto-attack. Drones shoot at nothing until I tell them to. When I tell them to shoot something, they shoot at it until it's dead, and they do not stop shooting it unless I tell them to shoot something else. When the thing dies, they go back to idle or orbit. (2) NPCs do not shoot drones. Full stop. Players can still shoot them of course, but NPCs do not. Those two changes would solve every problem you thought you were trying to solve by making NPCs shoot at drones, and they would do a better job of solving those problems than the "new AI" ever will. No auto-attack = no afk, it's as simple as that. This would put drone users on the same footing as users of all the other primary weapon systems, and it would have the side effect of allowing you to remove a whole lot of wonky and probably hard to maintain "drone AI" code.
J3ssica Alba Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 786	Posted - 2013.05.31 20:37:00 - [36] - Quote http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-0L9EipkVbUA/UMHeRAN587I/AAAAAAAAC1M/hWVTulUiIkY/s1600/EVE_Drone_UI.png This^ Can't emphasize how much better this would be than having to click in that tiny menu during combat This is my signature. There are many others like it, but this one is mine.-á Without me, my signature is useless. Without my signature, I am useless
Jonas Sukarala Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State 211	Posted - 2013.05.31 20:53:00 - [37] - Quote J3ssica Alba wrote: http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-0L9EipkVbUA/UMHeRAN587I/AAAAAAAAC1M/hWVTulUiIkY/s1600/EVE_Drone_UI.png This^ Can't emphasize how much better this would be than having to click in that tiny menu during combat i like it but i prefer the bars if you need to rep a drone with armour repper for instance you need to know its armour amount etc. Although drones need to have more distinct tanking styles more like ships which would help if T2 drones had T2 resists too match. Along with much lower sig radius so they survive long enough to be worth having bars. 'Tech3 ships need to be put down, like a rabid dog drooling everywhere in the house, they are out of line' CCP Ytterbium Nerf missile range into place where is the TD missile change?-á ..projectiles should use capacitor. ABC's should be T2 HABC and nerf web strength its still too high
Garviel Tarrant Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel 957	Posted - 2013.05.31 21:03:00 - [38] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: Ok, I usually don't go into design methodologies on the forums but I'm in a Friday kind of mood so let's just try this together for fun. Imagine just for a second that there are no Drones in EVE and there never was a Drone Management System. Now imagine you are coming up with ideas for such a system.. User Needs - What is the single most important need this feature should fulfill? Usefullness - Name one important thing you want this feature to do for your current game experience. Functionality - How do you want to control this feature? Inspiration - Give one example of something from a Sci-fi movie you think should be used as a reference Potential - Name one good game mechanic currently existing in EVE which this feature could benefit from using Have fun! o7 1. Make using drones fun. 2. Make me capable of properly managing drones without using a list (A list that doesn't even tell me what drones are damaged if i recall them making it very hard to cycle drones) 3. Mouse and keyboard? same way as everything else 5. Modules (although it would be nice if unlike guns you could cancel a recall.. Its really annoying when you accidentially turn of your gun, and you actually have to wait for it to finish cycling and turn of before turning it on again, losing precious seconds.. that would be amplified if you had to wait for drones to recall to put them out again :P I skipped 4 because i don't get it :P BYDI (Shadow cartel) Recruitment open!
Lunaleil Fournier StarFleet Enterprises Red Alliance 24	Posted - 2013.05.31 21:35:00 - [39] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: User Needs - What is the single most important need this feature should fulfill? Usefullness - Name one important thing you want this feature to do for your current game experience. Functionality - How do you want to control this feature? Inspiration - Give one example of something from a Sci-fi movie you think should be used as a reference Potential - Name one good game mechanic currently existing in EVE which this feature could benefit from using Single most need: less clicks during combat. How to control: Activate module button to attack current target, deactivate to make drones return and orbit. While a full UI redo would be appreciated, simply adding drones as a module asap (on top of current UI) would make things 10,000% better.
Kadl Imperial Academy Amarr Empire 45	Posted - 2013.05.31 21:37:00 - [40] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: Ok, I usually don't go into design methodologies on the forums but I'm in a Friday kind of mood so let's just try this together for fun. Imagine just for a second that there are no Drones in EVE and there never was a Drone Management System. Now imagine you are coming up with ideas for such a system.. User Needs - What is the single most important need this feature should fulfill? Usefullness - Name one important thing you want this feature to do for your current game experience. Functionality - How do you want to control this feature? Inspiration - Give one example of something from a Sci-fi movie you think should be used as a reference Potential - Name one good game mechanic currently existing in EVE which this feature could benefit from using Have fun! o7 I am going to take a different approach to your questions. Question 4 intrigued me first and I tried to think of SciFi where I have read or seen drones. Star Trek uses drones like probes. In Battlestar Galactica and Star Wars they use fighters instead of drones (in space). Babylon 5 has one drone which asks questions and tries to blow up the station. It seems like written fiction might have more, but they are still rare. The problem is that drones don't put characters in danger. It is much more exciting to have a fighter pilot, which can put the pilot in real danger. So drones have a lack of characterization and therefore suffer in stories. There are sources for inspiration in UAVs, combat robots (which oppose heroes), and pets in other MMOs. The Star Cruiser board game for 2300 AD had missiles which acted like drones. Homeworld had some drones. Star Fleet battles had "drones", but they were more like missiles in EVE. Note how the war games have more inspiration because they don't need characterization. Before considering the other questions it might make sense to clarify the basic starting point. "Imagine .. no Drones" leaves things quite open. Are you asking for a complete re-imagining of drones, or just the Drone Management System? It seems that those are two very different questions. Both of them are interesting. I think you have a number of re-imagined Drone Management Systems already here. Still, your question was based on a complete re-imagining.
Ali Aras Valkyries of Night Of Sound Mind 296	Posted - 2013.05.31 21:38:00 - [41] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: Ok, I usually don't go into design methodologies on the forums but I'm in a Friday kind of mood so let's just try this together for fun. Imagine just for a second that there are no Drones in EVE and there never was a Drone Management System. Now imagine you are coming up with ideas for such a system.. User Needs - What is the single most important need this feature should fulfill? Usefullness - Name one important thing you want this feature to do for your current game experience. Functionality - How do you want to control this feature? Inspiration - Give one example of something from a Sci-fi movie you think should be used as a reference Potential - Name one good game mechanic currently existing in EVE which this feature could benefit from using Have fun! o7 As a gallente, I find imagining an EVE without drones a challenging exercise. But okay, I'll do this slightly backwards. Inspiration: The Robot novels by Isaac Asimov, especially the Lije Baley and later Foundation ones. Drones are robots-- good for manual labor and tasks that are considered beneath the capsuleer. They're not even as good as non-capsuleer pilots given their low initiative and reaction speed, but they get the job done. User needs: A way to do things automatically that the user does not actually want to do. Reduce grinding. Usefulness: my god I really want drones to haul my crap between two systems. Especially when said crap is a lot of minerals from refine <> build. I might ever use a build pos. Functionality: I'd like an RTS interface. EVE is sometimes an RTS, I want to be able to take logistics drones and load them up and then route them through systems/poses/stations, salvage and mining drones and give them a path to do their thing, and combat drones which I give orders to like a squad. For the last one, hotkeys would be essential. Potential: Crimewatch. As drones are not considered particularly important and contain no sentient beings, CONCORD doesn't care that strongly if you shoot 'em, although you will incur a suspect timer for shooting at all. If you wanted to do whatever it is you were doing with that drone, you should have asked a capsuleer. If you want to gank dudes on gates, just send some drones through and see what happens. Content creation opportunities! http://warp-to-sun.tumblr.com -- my blog
Infinity Ziona Cloakers 39	Posted - 2013.05.31 21:44:00 - [42] - Quote It would be an improvement just to have a separate box of the current drone buttons without having to highlight your drones and lose focus on your target. Just stick them about the drones box.
Nam Dnilb Universal Frog 21	Posted - 2013.05.31 21:53:00 - [43] - Quote Little things can go a long way. Put one recall button on every drone in local space. "Itchy, you are hurt, come back to drone bay and get some rest!"
Szczutek Bermuda Syndrome 1	Posted - 2013.05.31 21:59:00 - [44] - Quote maybe some kind of "drone launchers" insteed of drone bays... You putting drones to launcher like ammo before undock, program them (simple steps how they should move) and just f1-fx (on/off - go/back) them later ;)
Mike Azariah Gallente Benevolence Association 366	Posted - 2013.05.31 22:06:00 - [45] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: Ok, I usually don't go into design methodologies on the forums but I'm in a Friday kind of mood so let's just try this together for fun. Imagine just for a second that there are no Drones in EVE and there never was a Drone Management System. Now imagine you are coming up with ideas for such a system.. User Needs - What is the single most important need this feature should fulfill? Usefullness - Name one important thing you want this feature to do for your current game experience. Functionality - How do you want to control this feature? Inspiration - Give one example of something from a Sci-fi movie you think should be used as a reference Potential - Name one good game mechanic currently existing in EVE which this feature could benefit from using Have fun! o7 My turn Needs: Robotics serve to replace humans in jobs that are too repetitive or too dangerous. Gallente use them for the latter, I would assume Caldari to be the former. So combat drones would be Gallente, task oriented ones etc. each race specializing. Usefullness: Pet class (to use fantasy terms) so combat drones would still be the first to be instituted but scavenger ones that tow and or loot on command would be right behind. Drones would also be the only thing that would make sense for HULL repair. Functionality: A more comprehensive set of programmable hotkeys. Subgroups of drones cna be set as flights. Launch flight 1, recall flight 1 launch flight 2. Inspiration: Hull repair R2D2, dangerous tasks . . . bomb squad remotes Potential. Scavenging. Bots to tractor items as mini tugs. Making looting more broad as a noctis prime drops its spawn and sweeps the field my 2 cents m Inspiration Mike Azariah-á CSM8
Lors Dornick Kallisti Industries Solar Assault Fleet 544	Posted - 2013.05.31 22:37:00 - [46] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: Ok, I usually don't go into design methodologies on the forums but I'm in a Friday kind of mood so let's just try this together for fun. You're drunk. Post when you are sober and we might believe that there are people employed by CCP that remembers that there's drones ;) CCP Eterne: Silly player, ALL devs are evil. CCP Fozzie: When Veritas describes a programming challenge as "very hard" I tend to believe him.
Frake Lomes Talon Strike Force LTD Orion Empire 15	Posted - 2013.05.31 23:32:00 - [47] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: Ok, I usually don't go into design methodologies on the forums but I'm in a Friday kind of mood so let's just try this together for fun. Imagine just for a second that there are no Drones in EVE and there never was a Drone Management System. Now imagine you are coming up with ideas for such a system.. User Needs - What is the single most important need this feature should fulfill? Usefullness - Name one important thing you want this feature to do for your current game experience. Functionality - How do you want to control this feature? Inspiration - Give one example of something from a Sci-fi movie you think should be used as a reference Potential - Name one good game mechanic currently existing in EVE which this feature could benefit from using Have fun! o7 Ok, My thoughts (for what they count anyhows) When developing Software (or coding, etc, etc) the idea is to keep the system as simple as possible yet functional for both the end user and developer; this helps bug report/shooting, implementation, and so forth. Taking CCP Arrows scenario here of no drones existing in mind: USER NEEDS: A set of assets that could be remotely directed to engage in utilitarian, combat, or logistical activities to augment current pilot capabilities and to interact with their environment. USEFULLNESS: Running with CCP Arrows aforementioned scenario: CCP Arrow wrote: Imagine just for a second that there are no Drones in EVE and there never was a Drone Management System. Now imagine you are coming up with ideas for such a system.. Drones could be used to augment on-ship weapon systems (kinda like, target painting), jam adversarial targets, repair friendlies, shoot adversaries, mine virtual rocks, assist with codebreaking derelicts in a minigame that has yet to be launched , could be some of the more localized uses of drones. Leaving drones behind could help with remote monitoring of gates, POS defense drones, planetary bombardment drones (love you Dusties! ). With all these potential functions: Drone Management and Information would be extremely important. Information on drones being targeted by hostile entities may help enhance situational awareness. Damaged drones could also display their health status when stored, if they are damaged. Repairing drones (Nanite Paste + Module as example) when stored in drone bay would be helpful. Knowing which stored drones are damaged would be convenient so the player does not inadvertently launch a severely damaged drone. A simple Red, Yellow, Green stoplight indicator should be sufficient. Grouping drones or controlling them via standard RTS style (Ctrl+1 selects Drone 001, Ctrl+2 selects Drone 002, and so forth). An even BETTER feature would be the ability to mix drones (EWAR grouped with Combat). There are plenty of RTS type games out there (not advocating ripping them off of course ) that can set some simple pre-conditions for when drones to return to ship or target new hostiles. With enough time (the eternal enemy), you could make drones more like mini-ships with the player able to throw on a rig/module/script on an unpackaged drone to modify it for more firepower, speed, or other criteria. FUNCTIONALITY: Including a menu involving drones with the additional situational information. With screen real-estate as an issue, a sizable/movable menu with launched drones and stored drones (drone bay) with status indicators and drone controlling (single and/or grouped). INSPIRATION: Well, virtually any movie with launchables. Or game for that matter. Real-world: status of remotely controlled assets are already utilized. Dark Reign (old RTS) for the concept of pre-set behavioral (return after 50% damage, aggressive stance, etc.) POTENTIAL: Fighters, Fighter Bombers, Drones to top it off. Done right it could also set the proof of concept and platform for future squad/wing/fleet monitoring menus or status indicators. This potentially could provide a useful platform in the future for POS or planetary asset monitoring.
Roime Ten Thousand Years Shinjiketo 3058	Posted - 2013.06.01 00:14:00 - [48] - Quote User needs - UI must provide full and reliable control of both drone groups and individual drones in PVP combat. Usefullness - UI allows me to focus on piloting my ship and use drones to their full potential without losing them due to lack of feedback. Functionality - I want both keyboard and mouse control for launching and controlling groups and single drones. Inspiration - UI makes drones smart like R2D2, and talk like C-3PO. Potential - PI processor icons relay information via simple and clear visual and audio clues. Drones are not lazy-mode automatons for me, they are the other weapon of my ships. Not secondary or primary, just the other depending on the ship. I want to be able to command them while retaining equal focus to all the other combat events, modules and manual piloting as other weapon systems allow, and even more so as I still need to consider range and transversal of my turrets. -á- All I really wanted was to build a castle among the stars -
Lyza Kimbo Cat Scratch Fever 13	Posted - 2013.06.01 00:29:00 - [49] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: Ok, I usually don't go into design methodologies on the forums but I'm in a Friday kind of mood so let's just try this together for fun. Imagine just for a second that there are no Drones in EVE and there never was a Drone Management System. Now imagine you are coming up with ideas for such a system.. User Needs - What is the single most important need this feature should fulfill? Usefullness - Name one important thing you want this feature to do for your current game experience. Functionality - How do you want to control this feature? Inspiration - Give one example of something from a Sci-fi movie you think should be used as a reference Potential - Name one good game mechanic currently existing in EVE which this feature could benefit from using Have fun! o7 1) bring me beer 2) bring me beer! 3) I click the button marked "beer" or press the hotkey , and it brings me beer 4) Silent Running, with Bruce Dern, he has Hughie, Dewey, and Louie bring him stuff 5) Pizza! beer and pizza are awesome together
Herzog Wolfhammer Sigma Special Tactics Group 2821	Posted - 2013.06.01 00:40:00 - [50] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: Ok, I usually don't go into design methodologies on the forums but I'm in a Friday kind of mood so let's just try this together for fun. Imagine just for a second that there are no Drones in EVE and there never was a Drone Management System. Now imagine you are coming up with ideas for such a system.. User Needs - What is the single most important need this feature should fulfill? Usefullness - Name one important thing you want this feature to do for your current game experience. Functionality - How do you want to control this feature? Inspiration - Give one example of something from a Sci-fi movie you think should be used as a reference Potential - Name one good game mechanic currently existing in EVE which this feature could benefit from using Have fun! o7 For a drone management system.... 1. Single most important need would be to be configurable by the user as the very use of drones suggests some automation objective to begin with. Users of drones should be able to configure how their drones respond to the environment and various conditions in that environment. 2. The one important thing would be to have the ability to program drones or issue standing orders to them to meet certain conditions based on status. For example, when the drone is down to armor or a part of it, that it could return to the mothership for repair or dock. 3. My best preference for controlling this feature would be, through some means, to PRE-program these directives perhaps through a scripting box or maybe a graphical flowchart structure to dictate drone behavior. These are not things that should be happening during combat. 4. I would say that the Terminator, though more a cyborg than a drone, is a good example. Since we use drones to terminate our enemies, it's not that much of a stretch after all. The Terminator had directives or a list of targets and priorities that were programmed in and adhered to for as long as possible. 5. An existing mechanic that would benefit is that of drones being used to assist other players, or there is the case of logistical drones and ECM/EWAR drones too, which would have different needs and priorities. That there is a variety of drones rounding out a ships arsenal is great and being able to preconfigure directives would enhance the enjoyment and involvement of ship fitting and strategy. I would predict that battles could be decided on drone programming alone, opening up an entirely new "career field" and lending further importance to drone ships in the Gallente line and flexibilty to the drone-using ships of the other races. To further build on existing features in that mindset, drone programs or configurations should be as transferable as ship fittings. Continuing on the note of an introduction of drones to the game as if they have not been here before, we should also consider the ability to control how far away from the mothership a drone will go.
Wacktopia Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group 520	Posted - 2013.06.01 00:52:00 - [51] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: Friday kind of mood.... Have fun! o7 Ok, here goes; I am going to pretend completely that drones do not exist now. User Needs- What is the single most important need this feature should fulfill? To perform a job that my ship cannot do itself. Either because the ship is too slow, not agile enough, doesn't have the weapon systems, or whatever. These new 'drone' things need to do something I cannot do in my ship. Perhaps the drones can repair my ship? Usefullness - Name one important thing you want this feature to do for your current game experience. I would want it to give me more options in my chosen career path. More flexibility. Functionality - How do you want to control this feature? Using the F-keys and/or clicking icons around the existing modules general area. Inspiration - Give one example of something from a Sci-fi movie you think should be used as a reference Not a movie but I like the idea of the Combat Wasps from the Peter F Hamilton confederation universe. Basically the ships launched swarms of different wasps to do the fighting in space. Potential - Name one good game mechanic currently existing in EVE which this feature could benefit from using Certainly the module control either by the icons or F-keys. Also the damage arcs for my ship. My drones should have similar displays but perhaps smaller and positioned or shaped in a way that fitted the screen well. Weapon grouping controls are also nice and would be a good inspiration. Looks like the yellow quafe shirt is more popular than I thought ;)
Karsa Egivand Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic 201	Posted - 2013.06.01 01:14:00 - [52] - Quote Freighdee Katt wrote: (1) Remove "aggressive" mode and drone auto-attack. Drones shoot at nothing until I tell them to. When I tell them to shoot something, they shoot at it until it's dead, and they do not stop shooting it unless I tell them to shoot something else. When the thing dies, they go back to idle or orbit. Yes. Freighdee Katt wrote: (2) NPCs do not shoot drones. Full stop. No.
mkint 1041	Posted - 2013.06.01 01:18:00 - [53] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: Ok, I usually don't go into design methodologies on the forums but I'm in a Friday kind of mood so let's just try this together for fun. Imagine just for a second that there are no Drones in EVE and there never was a Drone Management System. Now imagine you are coming up with ideas for such a system.. User Needs - What is the single most important need this feature should fulfill? Usefullness - Name one important thing you want this feature to do for your current game experience. Functionality - How do you want to control this feature? Inspiration - Give one example of something from a Sci-fi movie you think should be used as a reference Potential - Name one good game mechanic currently existing in EVE which this feature could benefit from using Have fun! o7 1) user needs - drones need to do what their launching ship can't. I think the concept of drones in EVE is more or less in a good place. Small ships use drones to supplement their main damage, big ships use them to either supplement main damage (sentries) or more commonly for close support. 2) usefulness - for my current game experience? I think as far as basic mechanics go, only the sentries need a serious look. The drawback of their stationary nature make it impractical to use them in quite a few situations. For sentries to be what they should, they need to be able to move with the ship that launched them. That would still let them behave like railguns, except more so. A module to enable that functionality (perhaps one that uses a turret slot?) would serve to help balance it. A sentry drone that works like that, with attributes more like blasters would also be welcome, as well as sentries/blaster-sentries of all sizes. 3) functionality - this is where we've currently got problems. Drones are meant to be a weapon system, we should be able to control them like a weapon system, with the f-keys. Right now, the drone AI is flat out stupid. When the drone AI is used at all, it pretty much never makes the right decision. Some mechanic that allows the drone AI itself to incorporate player feedback would be much more interesting. Perhaps drones should grant 2 additional targeting slots that can only be used for drone commands, that have built in auto-targeters (so drones lock, but do not automatically engage the targets the AI would currently just attack.) To jam those 2 targeting slots, the drones themselves should have to be jammed. The functionality of the drone window listing groups isn't bad. It would be nice if the groups were automatically collapsed/expanded. Buttons on the drone control window wouldn't be a bad idea. Some simple drone macro's would be nice as well... allow us to 1-button launch->attack->recall, or any other combination the users can think of. 4) inspiration - I don't think I can cite any specific cases, but it seems most sci fi with launchables tend to use them as close support. I'm not sure any example I can think of would have any common ground to compare to EVE. 5) potential - we'll throw this into a random thoughts categories, but it seems a lot of sci fi uses launchables as scouts, for intel gathering. Right now, any player who actually cares about EVE uses an alt to scout. Shifting that functionality to a drone seems like a pretty awesome idea. I'm not talking probes, but maybe a drone that will go through a gate and relay the overview back to the launching ship. I think it would still be balanced if the drone couldn't actually warp (just go through the gate) and if it was a 1-way trip (meaning if you don't go through the gate, the drone is lost), and if it didn't give you a list of local. It wouldn't provide all the advantages of having a dedicated scout, but it would still flesh out a game mechanic that is really kinda stupid as it is. And one more, I think I've also heard of plenty of sci fi using drones as decoys... if it played out as having a duplicate on the overview, or just in d-scan/probing, I think that'd be a pretty cool usage. Maxim 34: If you're leaving scorch-marks, you need a bigger gun.
James Amril-Kesh 4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance 5303	Posted - 2013.06.01 01:28:00 - [54] - Quote Freighdee Katt wrote: (1) Remove "aggressive" mode and drone auto-attack. Drones shoot at nothing until I tell them to. When I tell them to shoot something, they shoot at it until it's dead, and they do not stop shooting it unless I tell them to shoot something else. When the thing dies, they go back to idle or orbit. Why would you ask to have the option removed? Just don't use it. Don't ask to have an optional feature removed. -áMy (mostly boring) Youtube channel.
Mara Rinn Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium 3560	Posted - 2013.06.01 02:09:00 - [55] - Quote User Needs Drones provide a granular means of adding offensive, defensive and utility functions to a ship, in a manner complementary to existing module and rig systems. As such, the Drone Management System must allow the user to: Select drones to interact with by group, based on the user's own criteria. For example one group of drones might contain a mixture of drone types such as a sentry drone, webifier drone and target painter drone Assign control of drones to a fleet mate Deploy drones to a specific location to perform their task from that location Assign a primary task for a particular group of drones, e.g.: "Attack", "Assist", "Guard" and allow this task to be identified with a hot key on the ship UI (i.e.: act like a module that can be dragged to the F1-F8 slots) Allow keyboard shortcuts for assigning commands to drone groups, such as deploy and recall Allow drones to be automatically recalled when the pilot initiates a warp sequence Usefullness Drones should be as easy to use as any module. Functionality Based on drones in my drone bay, I want to be able to: Select drones to form a drone group Assign a primary function for that drone group Assign that primary function to a HUD button Upon activating the HUD button (e.g.: press "F1"), have the drones deploy if necessary, then proceed to perform their primary function (on the specified target if a target is required) Select drone actions on targets in space by interacting with that target in some way. For example this could be accomplished using extensions to the radial menu: bring up radial menu on untargeted rock asteroid -> extra actions -> drones -> mine repeatedly => action is to target asteroid then assign drones to mine that rock Inspiration Any RTS UI: group units and assign action such as "move while attacking". Potential Radial Menu. Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players
Jack Tronic borkedLabs 74	Posted - 2013.06.01 02:11:00 - [56] - Quote I boarded a carrier on my alt. I wanted to self destruct as all 960 drones in the bay were unstacked and showing as separate entries in the drone window. That just sums up everything wrong with it.
Utremi Fasolasi The Jagged Edge Rebel Alliance of New Eden 248	Posted - 2013.06.01 03:19:00 - [57] - Quote Some considerations that come to mind: 1. Being able to organize drones into flights or wings when docked beyond just dumping them in the drone bay is important. Some kind of mini palette like the ship fitting service. Organizing them should be separate from deployment to keep things simple and clean. 2. We know each flight or wing of deployed drones is going to be a max of 5 drones. (except for Carriers and we can't forget those) 3. We know bandwidth is a thing. A flight in the drone bay organizer should have a bar showing the bandwidth used, to make this visible and mean something like PG and CPU do for ship fitting and PI command centers and POS's. 4. Another indicator for # of drones possible per flight based on Drones skill. Max Drones and BW are the PG and CPU of drones in effect. 5. Radial menus for acting on an individual deployed drone or flight. Down with nested right click menus. And down with the separate Selected item windowette. 6. Having each preset drone group as a UI button near the module racks would be good. Click a button for deployment that pops the deployed drones onto the HUD with the info you need to command them. Click that button again to withdraw them. Or click another button for another preset to automatically recall the last set and then deploy the next one. 7. Since a ship will always have a limited number of drones in the bay, pre-organized into preset flights, the number of deploy/recall buttons will be restrained naturally. 8. Likewise you can only have 1-5 drones in space at a time for a flight, so you need an area that can display the info graphically for these 1-5 and act on them. A circle an outer ring divided into 5 for the max of 5 drones, with a circle in the center where the "attack" and "return" commands can be buttons. 9. On this ring or polygonal shape, a border of a drone element would flash yellow if targeted, red if red boxed/shot. 10. Each drone element would have your three health bars. Each one can be left clicked for radial menu love. To recap: 1. A drone organizer palette similar to ship, POS or dropsuit fitting to pre-organize drones into flights, with each flight naturally constrained by Drones skill and ship bandwidth. 2. On the space HUD, one button to deploy/recall each group near your module buttons/central ship wheelie thing. 3. On space HUD when drones deployed, an array of the 1-5 deployed drones, allowing you to see their status easily and command them with radial clicks.
Jack Tronic borkedLabs 74	Posted - 2013.06.01 05:36:00 - [58] - Quote Lets not forget, store drone folders on the server! Its super important for carriers.
Mara Rinn Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium 3560	Posted - 2013.06.01 05:57:00 - [59] - Quote Ali Aras wrote: my god I really want drones to haul my crap between two systems. Especially when said crap is a lot of minerals from refine <> build. I might ever use a build pos. You can use courier contracts to do this today. Put up a courier contract, perhaps even advertise in local. Just like magic, your stuff has been moved! Of course it would be nice if I could create contracts for people to deliver stuff to or pick stuff up from my POS or POCO. Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players
DSpite Culhach Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic 109	Posted - 2013.06.01 06:46:00 - [60] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: Ok, I usually don't go into design methodologies on the forums but I'm in a Friday kind of mood so let's just try this together for fun. Imagine just for a second that there are no Drones in EVE and there never was a Drone Management System. Now imagine you are coming up with ideas for such a system.. User Needs - What is the single most important need this feature should fulfill? Usefullness - Name one important thing you want this feature to do for your current game experience. Functionality - How do you want to control this feature? Inspiration - Give one example of something from a Sci-fi movie you think should be used as a reference Potential - Name one good game mechanic currently existing in EVE which this feature could benefit from using Have fun! o7 The problem is always making something balanced. I have no idea on that here, I can only give opinions on what the system currently feels like. * User Needs: Players have to invest quite a bit of SP into Drones skills, and at the same time, have a weapon system that be shot and disabled. Ability to launch, recall and even place drones on "evade" quickly, seems rather important. Right now, the whole system being a "pull down menu" wastes critical time. Usefullness: Make Drones work just like another weapon system, rather then me feeling like an airport traffic controller hotkeys would be much faster then a pull down manu, especially when we have a bunch to one side with G15 keyboards. Functionality: One hotkey for each function. I can only give an example from personal experience, so here goes. - Drones assigned to a flight number, so [keys]-F1 to F5 might launch Sets 1-5 - Since we have a direct ship link to drones ALL the time, they should always have their own "targeted" window. This would simplify clicking on one, then running a remote repair module on one. I can see people shooting their drones by accident ... - Radial menu on each drone would allow finer control. * Inspiration: The Sentinel drones from the Matrix? I'd like them to feel like a primary weapon system on drone boats. We are putting a gun system out to be shot at, we should not have to recall it almost instantly at the first sign of damage, because we know that otherwise they will die on the flight back to us. Ability to quickly apply logi support to them would help greatly. * Potential Radial menus? I suddenly woke up thinking I had a nightmare, then remembered I can't even fly Amarr Battleships. I add bits to this when I'm bored https://www.dropbox.com/s/foijsawsqolarom/EVE_Online.html
AbhChallenger Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 7	Posted - 2013.06.01 07:59:00 - [61] - Quote I don't want to try to pass off other people's ideas as my own so I will not use the format . I will just say my thoughts on the matter. There are many people who do not like drones. I can understand as in the past they were being used as AFK isk printing machines. However, The change to aggro mechanics has badly punished those who were legitimately using drones for PVE content. Many argue that it is a fair price to pay for not having to rely on lock times like other weapon types. I disagree but I agree that we can't return to the days of AFK isk printing. So I propose a deal. Lets agree to change drone mechanics so that PVP and PVE are separate behaviors for the sake of fairness. In short I agree with those above who have said NPCs do not attack drones. In exchange I agree with others above that. A) Drones will no longer automatically attack NPCs even defensively. Only player ships. B) Drones will only attack an assigned NPC target that remains locked. Yes that means drone PVE boats will have to start thinking about the time it takes to lock up smaller targets. Yet everyone else already has to do this and I think that being able to use medium and heavy drones without fear of them being WTF alphaed by unfair NPC aggression mechanics. And those who worry about drone abuse will know that drone users can't AFK mission or rat anymore.
Donedy Snuff Box Urine Alliance 150	Posted - 2013.06.01 10:00:00 - [62] - Quote Frake Lomes wrote: After a few years + few more years of EVE, the most almost best sandbox spaceship game ever (10% truth rule), are there any plans to fix the Drone UI? If only there was a team dedicated to making the games UI better, a team which could be called: Team SuperAwesomeBestFriendsForeverPinkZombieKitten or maybe it was simply Team Best Friends or somesuch. Anyhows, I thought Drone UI fixes were in the CCPwerks at some point and we could have expected at least something to make drones a little more bearable for a few years now. Can someone at least give me a slight glimmer of hope, just a tiny beacon of light....even if it is an inbound torpedo about make my day a little more interesting? This^9000
Chi'Nane T'Kal Interminatus Aeterna Anima 86	Posted - 2013.06.01 10:32:00 - [63] - Quote Freighdee Katt wrote: This would put drone users on the same footing as users of all the other primary weapon systems, and it would have the side effect of allowing you to remove a whole lot of wonky and probably hard to maintain "drone AI" code. It would also make drones obsolete as a weapons system. If there is no difference, what's the point?
Chi'Nane T'Kal Interminatus Aeterna Anima 86	Posted - 2013.06.01 10:54:00 - [64] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: Ok, I usually don't go into design methodologies on the forums but I'm in a Friday kind of mood so let's just try this together for fun. Imagine just for a second that there are no Drones in EVE and there never was a Drone Management System. Now imagine you are coming up with ideas for such a system.. User Needs - What is the single most important need this feature should fulfill? Usefullness - Name one important thing you want this feature to do for your current game experience. Functionality - How do you want to control this feature? Inspiration - Give one example of something from a Sci-fi movie you think should be used as a reference Potential - Name one good game mechanic currently existing in EVE which this feature could benefit from using Have fun! o7 Or how about we don't imagine there were no drones and fix the existing system instead? Because for the most part it's not as bad as some people make it. Simple tweaks: - Make it possible to pull drones into the F1-Fx slots just like an active module. Hitting the corresponding key will then activate the drone's basic function (attack/mine/repair). Right clicking the button will allow drone commands like return etc. - if the UI doesn't support the above, simply create an invisible temporary control module for every launched drone on launch and destroy on control loss (warp/recall to bay) - give us a way to assign an attack profile (priority order for frigs/cruisers/BS) to a drone group or launched drone - give us a way to set a threshold on shields/armor to activate auto return If the rest stays as it is, that would already cover 95% of my headaches with drones.
Agaetis Byrjun Endalaust Mercurialis Inc. RAZOR Alliance 52	Posted - 2013.06.01 10:57:00 - [65] - Quote lil story: I remember when I was a complete newbie in EVE (no worries, I'm still a semi-complete noob), like 2-3 months old and with no clue of what a carrier was or about which was the mistery lying behind words like sensor strenght, firewall bs and such...... it happened that CCP dared to send out one of those polls and it asked about suggests for a better EVE. Now, with nothing much to say I just wrote: Drone UI :D 2 years later, a dev is at least confirming he wrote something to for testing purposes \o/ ______________________________ just because you're paranoid it doesn't mean they're not after you
poppeteer Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic 12	Posted - 2013.06.01 11:13:00 - [66] - Quote Gotta think hard before giving you what you ask, CCP Arrow, however having seen it not answered, and this particular example not referenced, I must say re Question 4; Inspiration Andromeda (tv sci-fi); sensor drones, offensive/defensive ECM, attack, repair, guard, etc
Major 'Revolver' Ocelot GRU Special Forces 97	Posted - 2013.06.01 11:18:00 - [67] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: I can't make any promises, but I've worked on many mockups and ideas for a brand new Drone UI and I would love to work on it's implementation with my team Game of Drones in the near future. All I can say is keep up the good work of giving us ideas for it and know that the right people are listening Fix it! I love to reload during a battle!-áThere's nothing like the feeling of slamming a long silver missile into a well greased chamber...
Jake Tzestu Imperial Academy Amarr Empire 4	Posted - 2013.06.01 11:25:00 - [68] - Quote just a thought....i always assumed that scanning probes were drones that scanned so why can we not have a combined UI that covers both probes and drones. Now that we have preset probe settings it shouldnt be that hard to make the same work for launching combat drones. Just thinking out loud.
Infinity Ziona Cloakers 40	Posted - 2013.06.01 12:37:00 - [69] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: Ok, I usually don't go into design methodologies on the forums but I'm in a Friday kind of mood so let's just try this together for fun. Imagine just for a second that there are no Drones in EVE and there never was a Drone Management System. Now imagine you are coming up with ideas for such a system.. User Needs - What is the single most important need this feature should fulfill? Usefullness - Name one important thing you want this feature to do for your current game experience. Functionality - How do you want to control this feature? Inspiration - Give one example of something from a Sci-fi movie you think should be used as a reference Potential - Name one good game mechanic currently existing in EVE which this feature could benefit from using Have fun! o7 Single most important need - To perform the intended function of the drone type selected. Usefulness - the usefulness would be having that function carried out. How do you want to control it - minimal supervision. It should be on par with the requirement to reduce traversal, reload, manage cap when using guns. Sci-fi Movie - drones in stargate universe. Good existing system - fighters, fighters warp, drones would benefit from this system too and functionally its not really an OP thing or in anyway game changing. Its simply convenient and inline with all other weapons systems in EvE.
Nicen Jehr Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective 197	Posted - 2013.06.01 16:25:00 - [70] - Quote Imagine you are coming up with ideas for a Drone Management System. User Needs - What is the single most important need this feature should fulfill? Easily and quickly order your little drone minions to do tasks, either individually or by group: Launch, Attack, Salvage, Return and Orbit, Return to Bay Usefullness - Name one important thing you want this feature to do for your current game experience. I want you to give drones some limited AI. I want them to have a more realistic degree of autonomy, which you could accomplish with more detailed orders. Set an order on your primary drone group, "Aggressively pick targets as soon as you launch, unless I give you a specific target." And set a different one on your sentries, "Recall myself to drone bay if the ship starts moving faster than 30km/s." Or, "Return to drone bay once my shields hit 50%." Functionality - How do you want to control this feature? I want a hotkey to 'Launch Selected Drone Group'. I want hotkeys for 'Select Next/Prev Drone Group.' I want to put different types of drones in one group. And it should be easy to edit groups - perhaps ungrouped drones can automatically join a group to replace a drone of the same type, when that grouped drone dies. For those who don't like hotkeys, create pseudo-module buttons to can put in their HUD buttons Inspiration - Give one example of something from a Sci-fi movie you think should be used as a reference In Star Wars Episode I (at 51:50, 54:50, ) Darth Maul lands on Tatooine and sends off some autonomous probe droids. They scout various locations then return to his ship with intel. Potential - Name one good game mechanic currently existing in EVE which this feature could benefit from using You might be able to give FC's the same tools as players. The FC could define a set of orders, and choose what orders to actually issue to their fleet. Those might be "Undock and align to outgate" or "Set range at 1000m from your fleet superior"; the FC would issue these orders in combat, and players would receive an orders interface (like an upgrade of the Broadcasts window) showing current orders (and maybe also past or future orders.) Further suggestions: I'd like to see my drone hp bars when they're in my drone bay. For that matter, shouldn't drone ships be able to slap some nanite paste on damaged drones to repair them in bay? Perhaps if you have backup drones, you could order damaged drones them to stay onboard when their group launches (maybe your ship intelligently swaps grouped, damaged drones out for ungrouped, undamaged drones when a group docks.) Little Things to improve GëíGïüGëí-á\| My Little Things posts
Dax Buchanan Straya. Scrapyard. 4	Posted - 2013.06.01 16:39:00 - [71] - Quote Herzog Wolfhammer wrote: 1. Single most important need would be to be configurable by the user as the very use of drones suggests some automation objective to begin with. Users of drones should be able to configure how their drones respond to the environment and various conditions in that environment. I really like the idea of them being programable.
Praxis Ginimic 322	Posted - 2013.06.01 22:38:00 - [72] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: Ok, I usually don't go into design methodologies on the forums but I'm in a Friday kind of mood so let's just try this together for fun. Imagine just for a second that there are no Drones in EVE and there never was a Drone Management System. Now imagine you are coming up with ideas for such a system.. Have fun! o7 User Needs - What is the single most important need this feature should fulfill? Drones would be a weapon system. For many ships it would be a supplemental such as a split weapons platform but the very nature of drones would provide more utility, spreading the concept of split weapons into the other modules. Eg. TD, web, ECM, shield transfer. As such the feature needs to be as effective as any other module. Players make a trade off for this utility in the launch/flight time of drones. With that said, there is no reason that drones can't be used as a primary weapon. Missiles, for example have a delayed reaction due to flight time but make up for this with a selectable damage type and the lack of need to consider tracking. hint: missiles are integrated with the current module UI. Usefullness* - Name one important thing you want this feature to do for your current game experience. A feature such as this has the singular ability to augment fitting. I can widen my engagement envelope by using medium guns and a flight of light drones or fit a cap injector in my mids in lieu of a web because I have a flight of drones that can cover the effectiveness of that module. Scaling this idea up for use as a main weapon system is of particular importance to certain professions such as explorers, cloaky/probing scouts, dedicated neut ships & logi boats. Functionality - How do you want to control this feature? This is the big question and weighs heavily on the answers to the other questions. We all want a seamless integration to the UI of drones both in flight and fitting. Granted the very nature of the beast requires a bit more usability than click on/off & OH but a properly executed integration shouldn't need its own window. If we are to use drones as a supplemental module then we should be able to control them like we do any other mod. I would put a launch/recall button on the HUD just like the other mods get, with the same key-binding ability as the others. You could have one for each group or a single button that you must load groups into like ammo. The recent reintegration of radial menus should easily cover the other orders that need to be given to drones. I second the idea floated earlier about a 5-sided wheel with HP bars & activity indicators for flights of drones. An extra drone "central HUD" such as the one that we use to monitor our HP/cap would allow us to do the same for a flight of drones. In fact, a scalable/anchorable "drone HUD" with key-bind' drone group buttons could replace the current iteration of the drone window beautifully. Inspiration - Give one example of something from a Sci-fi movie you think should be used as a reference I don't really get this. Why look to sci-fi for inspiration when there are already so many real world applications of the tech. I would implore CCP to look at the drones currently in use for military and civil application for inspiration of both utility and form. Potential - Name one good game mechanic currently existing in EVE which this feature could benefit from using Fitting edited to add more awesome sauce
Gilbaron Free-Space-Ranger Nulli Secunda 888	Posted - 2013.06.02 01:02:00 - [73] - Quote User Needs - What is the single most important need this feature should fulfill? my ship can do some stuff, it can't do other stuff. drones should be there to fill that gap there should be a wide variety of stuff that drones can do, not limited to shooting stuff, direct support for myself and others and non-combat roles should also be viable options drones in non-drone ships should not be very strong, drones in drone-ships should be serious business Usefullness - Name one important thing you want this feature to do for your current game experience. more versatility in a whole lot of situations Functionality - How do you want to control this feature? I would rather be limited by the amount of drones i can use at once than by the absolute number of drones i can carry. there should be a difference between combat and non-combat drones in this context (non-combat dronescan launch from the cargohold but can't return ?) launching drones: a radial menu (its ***** AWESOME !) attacking/recalling: keybinds to rule them all Inspiration - Give one example of something from a Sci-fi movie you think should be used as a reference I like R2D2 i like the versatility the WOW shaman has with his totems Potential - Name one good game mechanic currently existing in EVE which this feature could benefit from the usability of the radial menu We are recruiting german-speaking PVP players, contact me :) Banner was used for this Post**
Utremi Fasolasi The Jagged Edge Rebel Alliance of New Eden 249	Posted - 2013.06.02 01:07:00 - [74] - Quote AbhChallenger wrote: A) Drones will no longer automatically attack NPCs even defensively. Only player ships. B) Drones will only attack an assigned NPC target that remains locked. Absolutely not. Drones are a counter to ECM. This would make Caldari ewar and Guristas rats OP.
AbhChallenger Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 7	Posted - 2013.06.02 01:57:00 - [75] - Quote That would be bit of a nerf for those who do those missions or rat in those regions. However, Nothing compared to the nerf to drone users after the new AI. The reason I say no more auto attack in exchange for no more NPC targeting of drones is because just getting flat out no more NPC targeting would cause controversy on the forum and people going back to AFK mission isk printing. However as it stands now using medium and heavy drones is virtually worthless unless the NPC target is right in front of your nose and you know how to predict when to spam shift-R. Also drones as a counter to ECM is a bit silly with the current system in my opinion. You cant order them to attack an unlocked target so they go off and do their own thing. If they get shot at and you have to bring it back it will just orbit until something else decides to shoot at you. Then you just have the advanced ones that just love to target your drones regardless. Right now the situation is utterly unbalanced against primary drone users.
Rytell Tybat Kallocain Pharmaceuticals 45	Posted - 2013.06.18 16:39:00 - [76] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: Ok, I usually don't go into design methodologies on the forums but I'm in a Friday kind of mood so let's just try this together for fun. Imagine just for a second that there are no Drones in EVE and there never was a Drone Management System. Now imagine you are coming up with ideas for such a system.. User Needs - What is the single most important need this feature should fulfill? Usefullness - Name one important thing you want this feature to do for your current game experience. Functionality - How do you want to control this feature? Inspiration - Give one example of something from a Sci-fi movie you think should be used as a reference Potential - Name one good game mechanic currently existing in EVE which this feature could benefit from using Have fun! o7 1. Add a new tactical element to combat (emphasis should be on fun Sci Fi gameplay). 2. Deploying different combinations of drones should offer specialised benefits. Making good choices of which drones to deploy and what combinations work should be the essence of drone combat (your opponent also has choose which drones to attack first). Right now, your decisions are mostly made in the station hangar, when you fill your drone bay. 3. Drones should be easily controllable on 3 levels. Individually, grouped and all deployed. If possible a single click to issue a command on any of the 3 levels. Dragging and dropping from/into groups is also a big requirement. 4. Only thing I can think of offhand are the sentry guns in Aliens. Translating to EVE: small, cheap, deployable stationary automatic guns that don't need for you to lock, but attack all aggressors (easily disabled). 5. Something along the lines of a leadership drone that offers bonuses to either other ships, or even other drones (operating range?). Potentially frees up extra slot on your ship. Oh wait you said one "good" game mechanic. Really only a possibility if leadership bonuses are changed to be on grid only. There are so many possibilities and improvements that could be made for drones. Every facet of them really needs to be looked at. This method of re-imagining them from scratch seems like a great approach.
Evei Shard 186	Posted - 2013.06.18 18:28:00 - [77] - Quote CCP Arrow wrote: Ok, I usually don't go into design methodologies on the forums but I'm in a Friday kind of mood so let's just try this together for fun. Imagine just for a second that there are no Drones in EVE and there never was a Drone Management System. Now imagine you are coming up with ideas for such a system.. User Needs - What is the single most important need this feature should fulfill? Usefullness - Name one important thing you want this feature to do for your current game experience. Functionality - How do you want to control this feature? Inspiration - Give one example of something from a Sci-fi movie you think should be used as a reference Potential - Name one good game mechanic currently existing in EVE which this feature could benefit from using Have fun! o7 1. Combat. Reps and salvaging are nice, but .. see Inspiration 2. Add more strategy by allowing different drone-fleet composition and bring a whole new set of "rules" to ranged (100km or so) battles. 3. Icons with hot-keys 4. The volatile battles between ships using versatile high power expandable drones in the Reality Dysfunction series by Peter F. Hamilton. 5. Warping to a pre-set distance other than 0m. Let pilots focus on navigation, MWDs, ABs, etc. while the drones do the dps, ecm, eccm, etc. When I started Eve, my original character was Gallente because, as I was somewhat misinformed, the Gallente were the ones who used drones the most. The PvP battles, and much of PvE where you have to be scraping hulls in order to be in range are fine, but in my experience so far, that's all there is. Kiting happens, and sniping does on occasion, but the majority of PvP is about who can reach out and key the other guys hull first. I'd like to see battles won/lost based purely on drone activity. One guy loads 80 full dps drones, while the other loads 40dps and 40ECM, then as they pop one by one, and replacements start to deplete, the guy with the ECM drones starts to come out on top because he chose a drone augmentation module while the other guy opted for armor plates on his own hull. Meanwhile, while the drones are battling, the two primary ships approach and it then comes down to the in-your-face battle with the drones flying around like a mad nest of hornets. I'd like to see the total number of controlled drones increased to 10, drone bays increased in size while drone size is decreased. Make them harder hitting, more vulnerable, and dirt cheap expendable. Turn drones into something more like AI driven purpose-configurable ammo. Profit favors the prepared
Domanique Altares Rifterlings Point Blank Alliance 417	Posted - 2013.06.18 18:29:00 - [78] - Quote I'm too stupid to interpret and respond appropriately to the five questions asked by our benevolent dev, so I will respond as briefly as I can with the features I would embrace: A. Do not remove aggressive mode, as has been suggested. If you don't know why this is a good thing, then you've never successfully used it to run off an ECM ship while jammed. Keep it optional. Make the option actually work when it is supposed to. Aggressive drones should be aggressive. Passive drones should be passive. And they should know in rudimentary fashion what thing to attack in lieu of having a locked target. ECM > Highest incoming DPS > Etc. My drones are not rogue drones. They should do what they are told. B. From a UI standpoint, I would love for grouped drones to be slottable like grouped weapons. They should become a clickable icon that can be assigned to a hotkey. On/Launch Off/Recall. A radial menu with common drone functions for each of these 'buttons' would be fantastic. Single function hot-swapping should be enabled. If I have my 'F1' group in space, and then activate my 'F2' group, the first group should return to bay and the second launch (and possibly engage) automatically. C. Default state for non-engaged drones. Give them a short timer between engagements; if it runs out, then do what is set default. Loiter in space, or return and orbit as is your preference. D. The drone interface window should provide watchlist stats on every drone in the bay, just as it does the ones in space. Each drone/group of drones should have a launch icon in the management window similar to the warp icon in the new scanning interface. No right click dropdown needed to launch things not already on your hotbar. The drone management window should be 'lockable,' and subsequently have drag-and-drop for grouping drones. No more right clicking to assign drones to groups. Stacked drones should not behave like a single unit for this functionality. (Or alternatively, should unstack/unpackage when place in a drone bay.) I shouldn't have to launch them to separate them for grouping. E. The ability to move drones into/out of your drone bay from cargo. Unavailable when under aggression, should take a good amount of time, cap, or likely both to accomplish. Would make it nice in null/FW systems where you don't have the option of docking up, or access to POS/Orca/Etc. Rifterlings Corporation is now recruiting pilots for faction warfare solo & small gang frigate PvP. Visit our website at www.rifterlings.com or join our in game channel weflyrifters to speak to a recruiter.
Debora Tsung The Investment Bankers Guild 156	Posted - 2013.06.19 09:59:00 - [79] - Quote I know it's actually just about the Drone UI, but I hope You can forgive me for posting other stuff I wanted for my drones for a long time, too. I want an active module that repairs my drones while they're in my drone bay. I want an easy way to see which drones in my drone bay are damaged. That way I could actually begin to cycle my drones. Drone groups with mixed drones and assignable hot keys to launch the drone groups would be nice. A drone launch module that would allow me to launch drones at a target over a large distance... like a micro jump drive, just for drones. Things like that would be cool... Also a Drone that delivers chicks and booze. There's nothing a million chinese guys can't do cheaper.
Ruskarn Andedare Lion Investments 202	Posted - 2013.06.19 15:24:00 - [80] - Quote Drone Bay 'Module' Could we have a Drone Bay 'Module' that acts a bit like the probe launcher on the UI. You can either drag drones onto it from the Drone Hangar to load it or use the rt-click menu similar to loading probes or weapon ammo. When activated - whether by hotkey or lt-click: Launches the drones that are loaded. When re-activated recalls the active drones: 1. If the Drone Bay is empty they return to it 2. If the Drone Bay is occupied they return to the Drone Hangar, pilot can then launch the fresh drones from the Drone Bay. Drones in the Drone Hangar can be repaired, but not those in the Drone Bay.
Masuka Taredi Imperial Academy Amarr Empire 61	Posted - 2013.06.19 15:27:00 - [81] - Quote Ckra Trald wrote: Drones is general are messed up. UI is clunky, they lack hotkeys, most of the EW drones are not very good, and they tend to get blown up too fast. Yup. The thing hobbling drones is 10 year legacy code that hard limits what they devs can change before rewriting the base code. Which would mean addressing all of the legacy code. Like rate of fire. To be honest. The drone UI needs completely redone from the ground up. What we have is lacking at best.
Marrnius DeLeon Deep Void Merc Syndicate Villore Accords 5	Posted - 2013.06.19 15:47:00 - [82] - Quote I think the new radial menu is the perfect place to start for the drone UI. It could be utilized with the current menu they have and make it quicker or add it as an option when selecting yourself.
Spurty 898	Posted - 2013.06.19 16:26:00 - [83] - Quote i demand drone killmails --- GÇ£If you think this Universe is bad, you should see some of the others.GÇ¥ GÇò Philip K. ****
Rake Mizar Caucasian Culture Club Transmission Lost 1	Posted - 2013.06.19 16:43:00 - [84] - Quote Drone UI thread requires a reminder of how long this kind of thing has been going on.... KAPLAAAH!

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