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Shederov Blood
Wrecketeers
513
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Posted - 2013.10.10 05:15:00 -
[91] - Quote
Combat Jacque wrote:Maybe you should find a game you like. I thought thread looked old. Where'd you find it, page 64? |
Erotica 1
Krypteia Operations Self Sabatoge
1371
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Posted - 2013.10.10 06:59:00 -
[92] - Quote
Shederov Blood wrote:Combat Jacque wrote:Maybe you should find a game you like. I thought thread looked old. Where'd you find it, page 64?
Necroposting protip: Start at the very oldest threads. Keep moving foward until you find one that is not locked. See Bio for isk doubling rules. -áIf you didn't read bio, chances are you helped fund those who did. |
Tuggboat
Oneida Inc.
32
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Posted - 2013.10.10 07:10:00 -
[93] - Quote
I hope to say something intelligent here and hereby close this thread.
Seven Koskanaiken wrote:CCP are brahma, the creator. Carebears are narayan, the preserver. PVPers are shiva, the destroyer. All exist as one in the cause and foundation of the universe. Transcend the paradigm to achieve enlightenment.
Everyone must fulfill their karma.
Ommmmmmmmmm.
Here is a nugget but only a nugget. There are in fact many paradigms on which emergent gameplay could be developed. Since our own creativity is limited to at best the combination of two known disciplines into a new third, to create requires mastery of at least two of the many disciplines available in Eve.
In this example the discipline of preserving is given a name and then combined with a second name destroyer as a cause to create a foundation. That's a valid religious combinatorial paradigm.
Our more familiar risk versus reward theory is very similar to Clausewitz's Rationale Calculus of War. In this paradigm the destroyers are given the term military and the preservers would be called citizens. The destructive PVPers are insurgents trying to occupy preserving citizens. The hope of maintaining any new creation is the creation of terms both can live with. Anything less results in an unstable created foundation.
But to only consider the two disciplines of destruction and preservation is to sell eve very short. I can think of at LEAST to other paradigms each with many disciplines that can be combined into an emergent creation, stable or unstable.
The two paradigms I would consider are the business model and the storyline. There business model idea can be as varied as many novel income streams and complex models of idealistic and mathematics can be shaped within the confines of the game tools and 3rd party tools external to the game.
The storyline we are of course familiar with. We have backstory for structure. Some of it was created by CCP even more has emerged in game. Conflicts between characters, factions and stakeholders can combine with a steady stream of game updates to create new stories and powers. In game tools for this are very limited but people familiar with creative writing or screenplay production can sketch these rather quickly into new channels for others efforts.
I'd love to here of more paradigms like this or even detailed listings of disciplines. Mastery of a discipline are often undervalued resources we often possess. Other disciplines often provide motives to act. Combinations of these two can create a new game of our own making.
Before I close, capital and social circles are always present if creation is to bare real fruit. We need a lot of money and more than a few friends. |
Susurrus Synaesthesia
Empyrean Guard Tactical Narcotics Team
1
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Posted - 2013.10.10 07:49:00 -
[94] - Quote
Jeez, who regenerated this mess.
I regretted making this thread the second I posted it.
Let's let this return to the grave where it belongs. |
Decian Cor
The Tall Order Angeli Mortis
1
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Posted - 2013.10.10 08:40:00 -
[95] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:
Fun fact.
You are also more likely to be involved in a road accident than ganked unless you do something stupid.
You are also much less likely to be involved in a road accident than getting ganked if you're busy playing EvE.
Doh. "There is no good and evil. There is only power, and those too weak to seek it." |
Trii Seo
Sabotage Incorporated Executive Outcomes
187
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Posted - 2013.10.10 09:23:00 -
[96] - Quote
Each time I hear the "Ganking unarmed ship unfair bawww" thing I laugh.
Many players risk their ships for income. The rat in null security space. They explore into hostile lands. They provide content to those who hunt them and many times die doing so.
Hisec carebears sit in riskless environment and either operate the ISK faucet valves (L4/Incursions) or gouge us on ship/fuel prices (Mining).
It is only, only valid we stick it to the man sometimes. Remind him Somalia is a place and evil people in boats with Kalashnikovs and Stingers will come for you if you've got too much cash or look too gankable to resist. Is it Hotdrop O'Clock yet?
Covert pilots unite! Safer working conditions, less accidental limb loss due to unfortunate Cyno accidents! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=258986 |
March rabbit
epTa Team Inc.
794
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Posted - 2013.10.10 09:53:00 -
[97] - Quote
Susurrus Synaesthesia wrote:So here is my challenge to the EVE community: How could carebears fight the PvPers in a way that did not involve actually blowing them up? - gathering more ISK thus making inflation and making PvP more expensive and less affordable? - docking and playing other games thus making CCP think what to do?
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March rabbit
epTa Team Inc.
794
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Posted - 2013.10.10 10:07:00 -
[98] - Quote
Andski wrote:Mara Rinn wrote:The only risk in suicide ganking the 30B ISK officer-fit marauder in a hisec mission hub is that the loot fairy will look upon you unkindly.
So you mean that it's just like market trading where you risk losing your investment and not getting any return? There are so many holes in the "suicide ganking is risk-free" whine. I thought you'd be smarter than that. 1) you ALWAYS get something at the end. be it killmail, hatemail, loot or tears 2) your logic can lead to "shooting monument at Jita is risky: each shot your gun produces makes damage which depends of RNG".
Yes, "so many holes".... |
Mra Rednu
Black Watch Guard
386
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Posted - 2013.10.10 10:18:00 -
[99] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Anomaly One wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Quote:There are also likely carebears who play the game in their limited free time, enjoy some of its less adrenaline motivated aspects and who truly like playing a game without any risks. Those people are wrong. They should in fact, quit this game and go crowdfund Star Citizen or X Rebirth or some other single player game. The rest of us can continue to play our MMO where we aren't allowed to bury our heads in the sand and pretend other people don't exist. other people don't exist, they are just cannon fodder npc who generate tears occasionally. A bot with tear generation implemented one might say Given how I have found that carebear insults tend to repeat themselves after enough time, this idea might have merit. Charles Panzram wrote:Lol thats like saying punching a toddler is as real and valid a fist fight as fighting someone of your own weight class.
How old are you? 12? A gank is a gank don-¦t call it PvP just to find some self-justification to feel better about it.
Well, I very much doubt that many toddlers play EVE, for starters. Second, by definition it is PvP. It is action that a player took against (versus, if you will) another player. The only way it's not PvP is if they admit that they were botting (and thus, the controller of the ship destroyed was not actually a player). In which case, the New Order guys are completely right about everything.
Actually by the definition you provide it is PaP ( player against player ) PvP would require both players to fight each other.
So ganking is PaP unless the gankee fired back at which point it is PvP even if the gankee was doing PvE at the time. |
Velicitia
Emergent Avionics
1666
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Posted - 2013.10.10 10:55:00 -
[100] - Quote
Mra Rednu wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:(lots of quoting). Actually by the definition you provide it is PaP ( player against player ) PvP would require both players to fight each other. So ganking is PaP unless the gankee fired back at which point it is PvP even if the gankee was doing PvE at the time.
Really, it's more a question of "the right word" to be used, since "versus" and "against" are synonymous.
Furthermore, "versus" directly references "against" as its main definition -- that is, "versus" is a specific usage of the word "against" to denote some form of a contest/struggle where one party in the action is considered "human" (e.g. "United States vs. Some Bad Guy" or "Army vs. Navy" or "Chilean Miner vs. Collapsed Mine Shaft*" or "Player vs. Player"). "Against" is generally used in situations where the thing being modified is a general noun or verb ("Rain beating against a window", "Surviving against all odds", "Leaning against a wall", "10 votes against 5", "Protection against gankers")
*OK, maaaaybe not this one ... it's early still.
And here I am using 7th grade English. Maybe it wasn't as much a waste as I thought ... One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia |
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embrel
BamBam Inc.
65
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Posted - 2013.10.10 11:27:00 -
[101] - Quote
TheGunslinger42 wrote:It's very dishonest to claim PVP you don't like isn't "real".
it's virtual in most cases. |
Erotica 1
Krypteia Operations Self Sabatoge
1378
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Posted - 2013.10.10 13:47:00 -
[102] - Quote
Decian Cor wrote:baltec1 wrote:
Fun fact.
You are also more likely to be involved in a road accident than ganked unless you do something stupid.
You are also much less likely to be involved in a road accident than getting ganked if you're busy playing EvE. Doh.
Unless you are driving down the road while playing Eve on your laptop. I know a guy that did that. See Bio for isk doubling rules. -áIf you didn't read bio, chances are you helped fund those who did. |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4802
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Posted - 2013.10.10 15:10:00 -
[103] - Quote
Erotica 1 wrote:Decian Cor wrote:baltec1 wrote:
Fun fact.
You are also more likely to be involved in a road accident than ganked unless you do something stupid.
You are also much less likely to be involved in a road accident than getting ganked if you're busy playing EvE. Doh. Unless you are driving down the road while playing Eve on your laptop. I know a guy that did that. What if you're afk cloaking. There are no goons. The goons' 0.0 dream is over.
"Progodlegend said the goal of N3 is to destroy Goonswarm Federation, but in reality NCdot is in Fountain due to the fact it is virtually the last place there is action." ~NC., Fountain 2013 |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4802
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Posted - 2013.10.10 15:13:00 -
[104] - Quote
March rabbit wrote:Andski wrote:Mara Rinn wrote:The only risk in suicide ganking the 30B ISK officer-fit marauder in a hisec mission hub is that the loot fairy will look upon you unkindly.
So you mean that it's just like market trading where you risk losing your investment and not getting any return? There are so many holes in the "suicide ganking is risk-free" whine. I thought you'd be smarter than that. 1) you ALWAYS get something at the end. be it killmail, hatemail, loot or tears 2) your logic can lead to "shooting monument at Jita is risky: each shot your gun produces makes damage which depends of RNG". Yes, "so many holes".... I guess you can loot our own wreck if you're enough of a bad ganker to not kill the target There are no goons. The goons' 0.0 dream is over.
"Progodlegend said the goal of N3 is to destroy Goonswarm Federation, but in reality NCdot is in Fountain due to the fact it is virtually the last place there is action." ~NC., Fountain 2013 |
Malcolm Shinhwa
Bad Touches
407
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Posted - 2013.10.10 16:17:00 -
[105] - Quote
Without the possibility of some bad guy performing random violence on your ship, you're left with only PvE in an MMO with absolutely the worst PvE of any MMO. Pirates need targets. Industrialists need a challenge. Its a symbiotic relationship. Hey CCP, please slush my fund like you did for SOMER Blink. |
Erotica 1
Krypteia Operations Self Sabatoge
1381
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Posted - 2013.10.10 16:24:00 -
[106] - Quote
No, Alavaria, this guy was most assuredly not afk cloaking. He is a famous bot aspirant miner who has over 100 accounts. Thankfully he did not get into an accident because then people would say something like "grrr goons" See Bio for isk doubling rules. -áIf you didn't read bio, chances are you helped fund those who did. |
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