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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Paul Uter
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2013.06.08 08:37:00 -
[1] - Quote
Now with almighty logic of CCP by making exploration in your face super easy and super abundant how far do you think prices will crash ??
How will that influence success of an expansion. |
Arkenai Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
1674
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 08:44:00 -
[2] - Quote
If lots of people are doing it, that's a successful expansion.
Of course, there's always going to be someone like you who cries about everything.
Sig'd.-áGallente FW best FW. |
Tyco Iinuit
Grey Dawn Initiative
1
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Posted - 2013.06.08 08:45:00 -
[3] - Quote
If prices crash as you predict, then people will search alternative ways to make isk, rather than exploring. Then , the decrease of explorers will make prices rise, reaching an equilibrium state, where true explorers will succeed and make profit and ocasional hype exporers will return to mining or pve.
The REAL problem is not where you point IMHO, the problem is at the ridiculous short loot tables, I ran around 20 sites, and got lots of the same blueprints (even the faction ones that I got) and decryptors, expect those to be cheaper every day. If the loot tables are expanded, then prices wouldn-¦t crash , due to high diversity of goods being retrieved by exploration. The problem is really there. Every data site and relic you get the same 60-80 items. |
Rhyonda Mcklenn
Caldari Deep Space Academy
6
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Posted - 2013.06.10 17:25:00 -
[4] - Quote
Loot prices are already down near worthless. None of the decryptors over a million anymore. Many far lower. There is also alot of noise in the pricing (it is all over the place). CCP has killed the market on these. It may recover eventually, but given the number of people I see exploring, this is not likely anytime soon. I used to make by doing exploring easily double what i could highsec mining in a day. Now, it is not even half. Without the ability to make enough money to buy a PLEX, i'm probably dropping out of what used to be a fun game.
Its easy for d*cks on the board to minimize the troubles of casuals like myself, but for CCP they need to look at this as making it tougher for newbs to get into a 10 yr old game.
What kills me about the explor changes is that it was completely unnecessary. They broke what did not need fixing. |
Ramona McCandless
Standards and Practices
Petition Blizzard
175
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Posted - 2013.06.10 17:28:00 -
[5] - Quote
Rhyonda Mcklenn wrote:
What kills me about the explor changes is that it was completely unnecessary. They broke what did not need fixing.
Citation needed
"You are even dumber than everyone says." - Kristopher Rocancourt
Tell The Others |
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CCP Bayesian
850
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Posted - 2013.06.10 17:40:00 -
[6] - Quote
We're revisiting the loot but a lot of this is due to the sheer increase in number of people using the feature. Six times more people doing it makes a huge supply side change! The data and relic sites in particular are seeing a awful lot of visitors. Things will obviously adjust as people drift off to other things and in part the depressed prices for the loot will help with that as it will move on those who are just taking part in the immediate gold rush post changes.
EVE Software Engineer
Team Prototyping Rocks |
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Diablo Aeglaeca
Diabolos AEGLAECA
Dark Empire Alliance
0
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Posted - 2013.06.10 17:56:00 -
[7] - Quote
CCP Bayesian wrote:We're revisiting the loot but a lot of this is due to the sheer increase in number of people using the feature. Six times more people doing it makes a huge supply side change! The data and relic sites in particular are seeing a awful lot of visitors. Things will obviously adjust as people drift off to other things and in part the depressed prices for the loot will help with that as it will move on those who are just taking part in the immediate gold rush post changes.
I guess it depends on the loot changes? Making what used to be valuable by making it valuable again through scarcity? Which will require even more sites to be run to reach the value of last? Ever heard of the term dilution? Adding more loot will just make those items added less valuable. Every item added, it's value will go down. Making certain items more rare just makes farmers just have to farm more....more work less reward at that point. We were told that we should be making about what we used to make before. That lasted a few days until everyone found out how EASY it is lol and that is the problem, it's too easy for everyone, not just too easy to get into as well.
Previously, out in null, I used to have to run a site with 1 probe/hack/salvage toono and 1 good PVE fit BC or something. what was the intent with the changes here? To make people buddy up? Because that's the way the old system worked before it was changed. there is no need to buddy up now. Does CCP want to ruin game play for mulit-boxers with 5 accounts or more (like myself)?
Now you are in catch 22 loot table equilibrium / market changes balancing act. Just seems to me to be a lot of work for CCP. I'd suggest re-adding the same rats that were there before. This brings back "team play" not "solo farming".
I put a lot of though, skill training and effort as well as real life money and in game isk into being able to run these sites Pre-Oddysey. Now all that effort seems a little wasted and look at all the problems CCP is going to have work through. Ugh, what a mess 
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Ramona McCandless
Standards and Practices
Petition Blizzard
176
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Posted - 2013.06.10 18:00:00 -
[8] - Quote
Yup there is no way a successful multi-million pound company like CCP ever considered the extremely basic and obvious market forces that this change would bring.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_mrNQBLSMU
"You are even dumber than everyone says." - Kristopher Rocancourt
Tell The Others |
Ioci
Bad Girl Posse
Somethin Awfull Forums
405
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Posted - 2013.06.10 18:07:00 -
[9] - Quote
CCP Bayesian wrote:We're revisiting the loot but a lot of this is due to the sheer increase in number of people using the feature. Six times more people doing it makes a huge supply side change! The data and relic sites in particular are seeing a awful lot of visitors. Things will obviously adjust as people drift off to other things and in part the depressed prices for the loot will help with that as it will move on those who are just taking part in the immediate gold rush post changes.
Anyone who cries about cheap decryptors needs to use them first.
They want to make ISK from their loot?
I want to actually have a snowballs chance in hell of saving ISK when I invent and produce my own ships. It doesn't work out that way though.
R.I.P. Vile Rat |
Johan Toralen
Clockwork X3
94
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Posted - 2013.06.10 18:31:00 -
[10] - Quote
CCP Bayesian wrote:We're revisiting the loot but a lot of this is due to the sheer increase in number of people using the feature. Six times more people doing it makes a huge supply side change! The data and relic sites in particular are seeing a awful lot of visitors. Things will obviously adjust as people drift off to other things and in part the depressed prices for the loot will help with that as it will move on those who are just taking part in the immediate gold rush post changes.
The issue is multilayered. Just tweaking the loot tables will not fix the situation. It's a lose-lose situation really. Less loot = less income. Identical loot as now = less income due to falling prices. Main issue to me seems that the entry barrier to run the "hard" sites is way too low both in skill requirement and initial investment in ship and equipment.
As Diablo Aeglaeca mentioned you promised during the Sisi test that explorers will get roughly the same after Odyssey as before. This is all falling through the roof now due to the easy mode farming. Please reconsider to bring back the rats after failure. At least in null and low. That would go a long way already in my opinion. And if the number of explorers still stays so high please think about a wider variety in loot or ways to create more demand for the loot items. |
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Eru GoEller
State War Academy
Caldari State
74
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Posted - 2013.06.10 18:38:00 -
[11] - Quote
Arkenai Wyrnspire wrote:If lots of people are doing it, that's a successful expansion.
Of course, there's always going to be someone like you who cries about everything.
But, there's no expansion to be seen here, it's just an altered way of doing things the easiest
possible way. |
Diablo Aeglaeca
Diabolos AEGLAECA
Dark Empire Alliance
2
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Posted - 2013.06.10 18:39:00 -
[12] - Quote
Eru GoEller wrote:Arkenai Wyrnspire wrote:If lots of people are doing it, that's a successful expansion.
Of course, there's always going to be someone like you who cries about everything. But, there's no expansion to be seen here, it's just an altered way of doing things the easiest possible way.
quoting for truth |
Paul Uter
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2013.06.10 18:43:00 -
[13] - Quote
Eru GoEller wrote:Arkenai Wyrnspire wrote:If lots of people are doing it, that's a successful expansion.
Of course, there's always going to be someone like you who cries about everything. But, there's no expansion to be seen here, it's just an altered way of doing things the easiest possible way.
So it is actually a contraction ... |
Suicidal Blonde
Alchemical Aquisitions
53
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Posted - 2013.06.10 18:43:00 -
[14] - Quote
Please don't bring back the rats on failure. At the moment im happy to sit and see where this iterates too. ( loot spew still sucks)
I would add a higher barrier for entry in another way.
I dont know what but im not paid to come up with ideas. im just a forumite.
Hmm. Well that was a mostly pointless post.
Ho hum. |
Jonas Sukarala
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
226
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Posted - 2013.06.10 18:53:00 -
[15] - Quote
mm.. talking about doing relic and data sites i tried it last night for first time..
i made 5mil roughly according to my cargo-bay est price in about 1 1/2 hours half that time was trying to find any sites to enter they seem to get probed and completed very fast....
I would either suggest more sites with more items per can/more valuable items or start adding some faction items in there maybe some of the more expensive meta 4 items like meta4 damage control. some mining/ice meta items are expensive.
basically meta items that are expensive that should be cheaper... maybe add some new storyline items/buff current ones so they are worth buying.
it could be like a item price control if something becomes too expensive for what it does than increase seeded amounts and lower other items that become too cheap. etc..
'Tech3 ships need to be put down, like a rabid dog drooling everywhere in the house, they are out of line' CCP Ytterbium
Nerf missile range into place where is the TD missile change?-á ..projectiles should use capacitor.
ABC's should be T2 HABC and nerf web strength its still too high |
Johan Toralen
Clockwork X3
94
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Posted - 2013.06.10 18:53:00 -
[16] - Quote
Suicidal Blonde wrote:
I would add a higher barrier for entry in another way.
I dont know what but im not paid to come up with ideas. im just a forumite.
One thing that i suggested several times is higher skill requirements for virus strenght and coherence. For example in the null sites the strenght and coherence of firewalls, suppressors etc could be doubled. But players could go around that by spending 1-2 months for new skills "hacking specialization" and "archaeology specialization" to double their own stats. Or it could be tied to the existing skills for the racial encryption methods. That would make lot of sense actualy because thers plenty of these books around in profession sites.
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Steve Spooner
Mordu's Military Industrial Command
Circle-Of-Two
84
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Posted - 2013.06.10 19:05:00 -
[17] - Quote
I'm not complaining, I used to have to risk a tengu to make 100 mill a hour, now I use a 2 mill fit heron and make double that from a decent site.  |
Diablo Aeglaeca
Diabolos AEGLAECA
Dark Empire Alliance
2
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Posted - 2013.06.10 19:11:00 -
[18] - Quote
anybody who ran the sites last week, before the weekend, needs to run them again. Try tonight. Sites that last week were putting good isk out are diluted now since the value of items crashed. |
Ramona McCandless
Standards and Practices
Petition Blizzard
178
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Posted - 2013.06.10 19:15:00 -
[19] - Quote
Diablo Aeglaeca wrote:anybody who ran the sites last week, before the weekend, needs to run them again. Try tonight. Sites that last week were putting good isk out are diluted now since the value of items crashed.
Nope, not where I am.
You should try harder.
"You are even dumber than everyone says." - Kristopher Rocancourt
Tell The Others |
CompleteFailure
Polaris Rising
Gentlemen's Agreement
42
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Posted - 2013.06.10 19:19:00 -
[20] - Quote
Diablo Aeglaeca wrote:I put a lot of though, skill training and effort as well as real life money and in game isk into being able to run these sites Pre-Oddysey. Now all that effort seems a little wasted and look at all the problems CCP is going to have work through. Ugh, what a mess
Is it CCP's fault that you chose to skill a certain way and spend real and in-game money on something that you assumed would always stay the same? When has Eve ever not gone through iteration and changes? |
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Johan Toralen
Clockwork X3
94
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Posted - 2013.06.10 19:27:00 -
[21] - Quote
Ramona McCandless wrote:
Nope, not where I am.
You should try harder.
Log off from Sisi and come to TQ for a moment. |
Destination SkillQueue
Are We There Yet
5178
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Posted - 2013.06.10 19:45:00 -
[22] - Quote
Ramona McCandless wrote:Diablo Aeglaeca wrote:anybody who ran the sites last week, before the weekend, needs to run them again. Try tonight. Sites that last week were putting good isk out are diluted now since the value of items crashed. Nope, not where I am. You should try harder.
What items are you relying on that unchanged income on? I can see the low chance/low quantity items being largely unaffected, since they are either rare or exploration provides only a small fraction of the overall pool for some items. Things like faction/deadspace items and salvage should keep their value. Other items coming directly from exploration seem to be pretty clearly tanking at a fast pace. Decryptors naturally being hit the hardest having lost more then half their value already in a matter of just a few days with prices continuing to drop. |
Haulie Berry
1010
|
Posted - 2013.06.10 19:57:00 -
[23] - Quote
Diablo Aeglaeca wrote:anybody who ran the sites last week, before the weekend, needs to run them again. Try tonight. Sites that last week were putting good isk out are diluted now since the value of items crashed.
Even a cut to 40% of what I've been getting would still leave data/relic farming as a very competitive profession. In the right regions, I was pulling as much as 400 million isk from a single relic site, which is preposterously high.
Ideally, it should end up as a profession that is simply comparable, isk/hr wise, as other "Active" professions. |
Royal Executioner Shazih
Viziam
Amarr Empire
14
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Posted - 2013.06.10 20:12:00 -
[24] - Quote
I see absolutely no problem here. It used to be hard and loot value was higher, now exploration is a 'starter' profession and almost as easy as mining and so get what you deserve i.e. 1-2 mil decryptors. There were prosoped a bunch of idiotic ideas like:
-adding faction modes. That would simply crash their prices as well as even more players will start exploring
-adding specialization skills. The game is already full of unnecessary SP requirements that players have to grind.
-adding rats. Kind of to promote dual-boxing, right?
Easy mode = trash loot. Fair? |
Sven Viko VIkolander
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
76
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Posted - 2013.06.10 20:27:00 -
[25] - Quote
How about this: low the loot drops in high sec, where these sites can be farmed without risk, and increase the loot drop in low/null, where there is risk. |
Vincent Athena
V.I.C.E.
Aegis Solaris
1953
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Posted - 2013.06.10 20:35:00 -
[26] - Quote
There are alot of options for increasing loot variety.
Skill books. Just make sure fewer of of any one Skillbook drop than are currently being bought from the NPCs. (Otherwise we get the same price crash)
BPOs. Just the same ones as can currently be bought from the NPCs. Same proviso as with skillbooks: Limit the number to less than current NPC sales.
But there are so many SBs and BPOs this can really increase the variety.
http://vincentoneve.wordpress.com/ |
Torrentula Chromus
Tax Evasion 4 me
2
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Posted - 2013.06.10 20:44:00 -
[27] - Quote
Destination SkillQueue wrote:Ramona McCandless wrote:Diablo Aeglaeca wrote:anybody who ran the sites last week, before the weekend, needs to run them again. Try tonight. Sites that last week were putting good isk out are diluted now since the value of items crashed. Nope, not where I am. You should try harder. What items are you relying on that unchanged income on? I can see the low chance/low quantity items being largely unaffected, since they are either rare or exploration provides only a small fraction of the overall pool for some items. Things like faction/deadspace items and salvage should keep their value. Other items coming directly from exploration seem to be pretty clearly tanking at a fast pace. Decryptors naturally being hit the hardest having lost more then half their value already in a matter of just a few days with prices continuing to drop.
I'm sure deadspace items are going to tank soon as well. Before the update ded sites were hidden along with normal combat sites.Now those are filtered out . I've quit playing because the amount of time it now takes to find a site is unreal. Everyone is scanning and guess where ded site are. They ruined this game. |
Haulie Berry
1010
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Posted - 2013.06.10 20:46:00 -
[28] - Quote
Torrentula Chromus wrote:Destination SkillQueue wrote:Ramona McCandless wrote:Diablo Aeglaeca wrote:anybody who ran the sites last week, before the weekend, needs to run them again. Try tonight. Sites that last week were putting good isk out are diluted now since the value of items crashed. Nope, not where I am. You should try harder. What items are you relying on that unchanged income on? I can see the low chance/low quantity items being largely unaffected, since they are either rare or exploration provides only a small fraction of the overall pool for some items. Things like faction/deadspace items and salvage should keep their value. Other items coming directly from exploration seem to be pretty clearly tanking at a fast pace. Decryptors naturally being hit the hardest having lost more then half their value already in a matter of just a few days with prices continuing to drop. I'm sure deadspace items are going to tank soon as well. Before the update ded sites were hidden along with normal combat sites.Now those are filtered out . I've quit playing because the amount of time it now takes to find a site is unreal. Everyone is scanning and guess where ded site are. They ruined this game.
I spent a good amount of time doing exploration since odyssey dropped and i've been tripping over DED sites left and right. Consider leaving high sec. |
Johan Toralen
Clockwork X3
94
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Posted - 2013.06.10 20:54:00 -
[29] - Quote
Royal Executioner Shazih wrote:I see absolutely no problem here. It used to be hard and loot value was higher, now exploration is a 'starter' profession and almost as easy as mining and so get what you deserve i.e. 1-2 mil decryptors. There were prosoped a bunch of idiotic ideas like:
-adding faction modes. That would simply crash their prices as well as even more players will start exploring
-adding specialization skills. The game is already full of unnecessary SP requirements that players have to grind.
-adding rats. Kind of to promote dual-boxing, right?
Easy mode = trash loot. Fair?
The only idiotic thing is your incoherent and condescending babbling. It was harder because of rats and higher skill barrier. Now that's suddenly idiotic? But the easy mode is idiotic too and people deserve getting crap loot, right? Gotcha.
How about some constructive comments instead. |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
4253
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Posted - 2013.06.10 21:00:00 -
[30] - Quote
Our criminal element is just lagging slightly behind in developing efficient ways to discourage/profit from people doing exploration sites. Give them a bit of time, it's been hectic for them lately. 
To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors.
If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
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