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Draconian Arcane
Bastards Of New Eden
1
|
Posted - 2013.06.12 17:40:00 -
[1] - Quote
I was thinking, wouldn't it be nice to be able to hitch a ride on a carrier...
Since we can load assembled ships onto a carrier and even a super carrier, why not make it to where the pilot of those ships be able to stay in those ships and be able to dock up inside of the carrier... Obviously the limit would already be preset as you can only load so many ships onto a carrier, but further restrictions can be applied when loading pilots with those ships.
For example we could have the carrier have a 5 passenger limit and have the super carrier have a 10 passenger limit.
We pretty much have a means to move mass fleets via titan bridges, jump bridges and covert ops portals but I think it would be pretty awesome to see the carriers get an additional role, TAXI SERVICE lol...
My idea is to see groups of pilots getting hot dropped into the action then undocking from the carriers to provide support... Ultimately what it would probably be turned into is just what I wrote above "Taxi Service" ppl hitching a ride to avoid making the long trip in a sub cap from point A to point B.
As far as the docking graphics are concerned, screens shouldn't have to change to a hangar bay or station environment or anything like that, once docked the camera can just snap to the carriers view like if you were to right click the carrier and select "Look At", no extra graphics are required, no nifty in-ship walking, or ship spinning graphics from inside the carrier...
I don't doubt that someone came up with something like this already in a past post but I'm not Indian Jones accompanied by a small asian boy, so finding something relevant seems a bit time consuming...
Anyhow, post your thoughts and comments on whether or not this is a decent idea or something horrible and that I should be killed with fire...  |

Hopelesshobo
Red Dwarf Mining Corporation space weaponry and trade
26
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Posted - 2013.06.12 17:41:00 -
[2] - Quote
What would be the point of titans then? |

Captain Twinkletoes
Initech Exports
3
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Posted - 2013.06.12 17:45:00 -
[3] - Quote
Titans can continue to bridge people to cynos as they always have and that mode works far better for moving large fleets rapidly.
I really like the carrier suggestion though because it would make it more interesting to have smaller squadrons of pvpers led by a carrier pilot or someone in the parasite ship squadron and supported by carrier logistics. The engagements that could generate would be very interesting and could lead to some fascinating new dynamics in large scale fleet deployments. |

Jade III
Wolf Star Miners
19
|
Posted - 2013.06.12 18:23:00 -
[4] - Quote
+1 to this idea. This is a great suggestion. When I was reading your topic, I was thinking of the fishes that hang onto whales and other sea creatures. But there must be a time limit to being in a carrier, maybe like 10 minutes? Or when the person flying the carrier docks at a station, they will have to kick you and your ship out. Recruiting! WSMIN Recruitment page My Idea: Tags for Loyalty Points. Here's my tear jar > |_| < Fill 'er up! |

Vayn Baxtor
Community for Justice R O G U E
53
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Posted - 2013.06.12 18:48:00 -
[5] - Quote
I was under the impression that the engine could not handle people docking on player ships or something alike. You know, one of those physical lmitations of the game itself - at least that is what people tend to preach most of the time.
Indeed, great idea, hands down.
Quote:What would be the point of titans then?
I'd almost be for "Titan should find a new f'ing job". Pretty much just floating in PoSes, logged out due to possible awox/bumpers etc, or attempting to blow something up and get blown up itself. Somebody had even suggested to just reimburse everybody who invested in one with hefty sum and have titans removed for a while until the concept of territorial pvp has been expanded.
There are certainly more than enough creative heads to find new tasks for titan too. That's just me of course.
This idea however gives more of a feel of carriers, and it is by far more accessible and versatile than such like a titan. That idea would also give more of a chance for the frequent smaller "Scout Carrier" sort of ideas too. And I think people would love that FLOTILLA sort of a gang pvp than blobs
If this idea could work, too, it would be great to see a set of FTL capable Carriers for team-jumping. Using tablet, typoes are common and I'm not going to fix them all. |

Maximus Aerelius
PROPHET OF ENIGMA
165
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Posted - 2013.06.12 22:29:00 -
[6] - Quote
+1 I like this. I also think that the ships "docked" in the carrier should add to it's All-Up-Weight but a carrier should carry...pilots! My Feature\Idea:-á Fast Character Switching "XP Stylee"
Here's my tear jar > |_| < Fill 'er up! |

max ericshaun
Ekchuah's Shrine Comporium Kill It With Fire
3
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Posted - 2013.06.12 22:36:00 -
[7] - Quote
Absolutely outstanding idea! +1 |

Sirinda
Ekchuah's Shrine Comporium Kill It With Fire
182
|
Posted - 2013.06.14 18:55:00 -
[8] - Quote
I'M THROWING MONEY AT THE SCREEN, BUT NOTHING IS HAPPENING! |

Lugia3
Pirates Incorporated
423
|
Posted - 2013.06.15 18:19:00 -
[9] - Quote
This could add a whole new element to small-gang PvP, I like.
+1 Yarr |

Darkness1NRW
Blitzkrieg. Insidious Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.06.15 18:33:00 -
[10] - Quote
I was thinking about the same idea some time ago.
That would make the carriers the supportship it is.. it carries ppl and equipment out there, if a carrier is killed whoever is inside also dies. if the pilot of the carrier logs out you have to pod yourself to get out..
But it will make the carrier game much cooler, and when we finally get walking in stations we might even be allowed to walk around inside the carrier while watching ops room before undocking and joining on the battlefield.. |

ExAstra
Echoes of Silence
158
|
Posted - 2013.06.15 19:06:00 -
[11] - Quote
I believe the core limitation for this is that anything "inside" or related to a ship is "owned" by the player according to the game code and server. This causes the player to "own" characters (whoever is a passenger) and winds up causing a giant mess server side.
Don't remember where I read it, but I know I read it. Something about the original purpose of the ship maintenance bays/hangars was to allow pilots to dock in carriers/supers/titans, cyno to a system, and then deploy.
But it didn't work out. Save the drones! |

Draconian Arcane
Bastards Of New Eden
7
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 17:22:00 -
[12] - Quote
Yeah, guess there is too many variables... Something like this would have to be an expansion all on its own... Still would be nice and would bring something new to PvP but as I understand it, it was tried, tested and written off... [supersadface] |

Vizvig
Savage Blizzard Bright Side of Death
93
|
Posted - 2013.06.17 18:47:00 -
[13] - Quote
Approve it.
Hopelesshobo wrote:What would be the point of titans then? This game needs titans? |

Darkness1NRW
Blitzkrieg. Insidious Empire
3
|
Posted - 2013.06.18 12:56:00 -
[14] - Quote
ExAstra wrote:I believe the core limitation for this is that anything "inside" or related to a ship is "owned" by the player according to the game code and server. This causes the player to "own" characters (whoever is a passenger) and winds up causing a giant mess server side.
Don't remember where I read it, but I know I read it. Something about the original purpose of the ship maintenance bays/hangars was to allow pilots to dock in carriers/supers/titans, cyno to a system, and then deploy.
But it didn't work out.
Well since that they changed the engine of the game to work with Walking in stations.. :D |

Janna Windforce
EVE University Ivy League
15
|
Posted - 2013.06.18 13:11:00 -
[15] - Quote
The engine already supports walking through station + as we saw on Fanfest, it handles flying above planet's surface (does DUST514 run on same engine btw?) - it should absolutely, positively and necesarilly handle undocking animation via one of the carrier's gaping hangar bays (those with forcefields).
More pros: - Saving mass on WH travelling - They will never know what's gonna undock from the carrier ;)
+1 |

Rowells
Unknown Soldiers Unclaimed.
8
|
Posted - 2013.06.18 13:12:00 -
[16] - Quote
Hopelesshobo wrote:What would be the point of titans then? A Titan can bridge a couple hundred players on a single portal. With the passenger limits here you would need anywhere from 10+ supers to do the same job.
And as I remember they actually tried to allow people in each others carrier one time. It caused so much stress on the server that the idea got nixed. That's probably why the clone vat bay came about. You could still do the same job (kind of) but not nearly as cool or fun.
Maybe they could just have it so that your ship is in hangar but "you" remain outside carrier. You share the same exact location as the carrier pilot but they remove your pod or whatever is still in space a a placeholder from overview. I'm not a computer guy, so I have no idea if the code would allow that. |

Rowells
Unknown Soldiers Unclaimed.
8
|
Posted - 2013.06.18 13:15:00 -
[17] - Quote
Janna Windforce wrote:The engine already supports walking through station + as we saw on Fanfest, it handles flying above planet's surface (does DUST514 run on same engine btw?) - it should absolutely, positively and necesarilly handle undocking animation via one of the carrier's gaping hangar bays (those with forcefields).
More pros: - Saving mass on WH travelling - They will never know what's gonna undock from the carrier ;)
+1 I think the only problem with that is size. The model for a machariel is almost as big as the nidhoggur yet supposedly you can fit two of those things in the carrier. A lot of BS have a similar situation. Though not as big a deal for supers. |

Solutio Letum
Terpene Conglomerate
135
|
Posted - 2013.06.18 13:50:00 -
[18] - Quote
Rowells wrote:Janna Windforce wrote:The engine already supports walking through station + as we saw on Fanfest, it handles flying above planet's surface (does DUST514 run on same engine btw?) - it should absolutely, positively and necesarilly handle undocking animation via one of the carrier's gaping hangar bays (those with forcefields).
More pros: - Saving mass on WH travelling - They will never know what's gonna undock from the carrier ;)
+1 +1 to this idea I think the only problem with that is size. The model for a machariel is almost as big as the nidhoggur yet supposedly you can fit two of those things in the carrier. A lot of BS have a similar situation. Though not as big a deal for supers.
Wow? you can fit 2 Macheriels in a carrier? gotta buy my self a second Mach then!!!
But in all seriousness you can at maximum fit 1 BS in a carrier, it has 1 000 000 m3, all BS's are more then 500 000 m3 large. Yes in stats, they dont even really fit a carrier is mostly around 1 300 000 m3 big.
But who said it mattered? seriously you think 30Km3 of ore should fit in the 10m can or what ever? no in even cargo's can sometimes carry more then they seem to be able to carry, its true for small cares to! but in eve if you have a 10m3 cargo you can carry 30% more sometimes with the right technology!
Its the future right? |

Nikk Narrel
Infinite Improbability Inc Ex Cinere Scriptor
1900
|
Posted - 2013.06.18 14:27:00 -
[19] - Quote
The mechanics of this are not terribly difficult, just need to be adapted.
EDIT: Add in specified 2,000 meter range for this mooring line, I was thinking it in my head but saw I did not spell it out.
By docking to the carrier, the game will just depict a mooring line running between the ship and the carrier. (It doesn't need to be displayed as a space object, just listed like an effect above the capacitor the same way being webbed is, etc.)
If you move or direct your ship to leave or log out, the mooring line is released.
If the carrier jumps, your ship and you go with it.
Why does this work, when the previous problems existed in the past? Because the mooring line actually represents a standing command to jump-bridge, just like pilots using a titan or blops bridge need to click on the graphic. The mass of the ship is added to the carrier's, for fuel use calculation.
The mooring lines can be left in place after the jump, in the event it is a multiple jump event, or released so the individual pilots can go on their merry way.
Does this make carriers OP? No, in fact it places them at risk. The carrier lands in the target system with the other ships, unlike the Titan or BLOPs which stay safely at the starting point / staging area. Cloaking being on a ten minute manual cycle timer? (Author: Bree Okanata) Fine. As long as there is a ten minute timer for being docked in a station. Also, you can't stop moving in the game. Just add in a way so every ten minutes you are randomly warped to the nearest other player. Keeps people from going AFK. |

Xeros Black
Forced Penetration Here Be Dragons
8
|
Posted - 2013.06.18 15:13:00 -
[20] - Quote
I like this idea, because of all the reasons already posted. Due to the recent skill change your going to see a lot more carriers on the fields. I always liked the idea of carriers well carring ships between location instead of cynos. When you jump a carrier in you risk capital ships on the field vs titan bridging which you only risk the cyno ship. |

Draconian Arcane
Bastards Of New Eden
12
|
Posted - 2013.06.19 17:01:00 -
[21] - Quote
Nikk Narrel wrote:The mechanics of this are not terribly difficult, just need to be adapted.
EDIT: Add in specified 2,000 meter range for this mooring line, I was thinking it in my head but saw I did not spell it out.
By docking to the carrier, the game will just depict a mooring line running between the ship and the carrier. (It doesn't need to be displayed as a space object, just listed like an effect above the capacitor the same way being webbed is, etc.)
If you move or direct your ship to leave or log out, the mooring line is released.
If the carrier jumps, your ship and you go with it.
^^This |

Rowells
Unknown Soldiers Unclaimed.
12
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 04:00:00 -
[22] - Quote
Solutio Letum wrote:Rowells wrote:Janna Windforce wrote:The engine already supports walking through station + as we saw on Fanfest, it handles flying above planet's surface (does DUST514 run on same engine btw?) - it should absolutely, positively and necesarilly handle undocking animation via one of the carrier's gaping hangar bays (those with forcefields).
More pros: - Saving mass on WH travelling - They will never know what's gonna undock from the carrier ;)
+1 +1 to this idea I think the only problem with that is size. The model for a machariel is almost as big as the nidhoggur yet supposedly you can fit two of those things in the carrier. A lot of BS have a similar situation. Though not as big a deal for supers. Wow? you can fit 2 Macheriels in a carrier? gotta buy my self a second Mach then!!! But in all seriousness you can at maximum fit 1 BS in a carrier, it has 1 000 000 m3, all BS's are more then 500 000 m3 large. Yes in stats, they dont even really fit a carrier is mostly around 1 300 000 m3 big. But who said it mattered? seriously you think 30Km3 of ore should fit in the 10m can or what ever? no in even cargo's can sometimes carry more then they seem to be able to carry, its true for small cares to! but in eve if you have a 10m3 cargo you can carry 30% more sometimes with the right technology! Its the future right?
I was just referring to the undocking animation. And you're right, only one Mach in a carrier but other battleships can fit 2. And it's not the insane cargo mechanics in eve, but the actual animation problem of making something big come out of something small. |

Rowells
Unknown Soldiers Unclaimed.
12
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 04:02:00 -
[23] - Quote
Solutio Letum wrote:Rowells wrote:Janna Windforce wrote:The engine already supports walking through station + as we saw on Fanfest, it handles flying above planet's surface (does DUST514 run on same engine btw?) - it should absolutely, positively and necesarilly handle undocking animation via one of the carrier's gaping hangar bays (those with forcefields).
More pros: - Saving mass on WH travelling - They will never know what's gonna undock from the carrier ;)
+1 +1 to this idea I think the only problem with that is size. The model for a machariel is almost as big as the nidhoggur yet supposedly you can fit two of those things in the carrier. A lot of BS have a similar situation. Though not as big a deal for supers. Wow? you can fit 2 Macheriels in a carrier? gotta buy my self a second Mach then!!! But in all seriousness you can at maximum fit 1 BS in a carrier, it has 1 000 000 m3, all BS's are more then 500 000 m3 large. Yes in stats, they dont even really fit a carrier is mostly around 1 300 000 m3 big. But who said it mattered? seriously you think 30Km3 of ore should fit in the 10m can or what ever? no in even cargo's can sometimes carry more then they seem to be able to carry, its true for small cares to! but in eve if you have a 10m3 cargo you can carry 30% more sometimes with the right technology! Its the future right?
I was just referring to the undocking animation. And you're right, only one Mach in a carrier but other battleships can fit 2. And it's not the insane cargo mechanics in eve, but the actual animation problem of making something big come out of something small. |

Draconian Arcane
Bastards Of New Eden
13
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 15:04:00 -
[24] - Quote
Guess I should re-title the topic to "Poor Man's Titan Bridge"
The Mooring idea is excellent
Make a navigation skill called Mooring Operations or Tandem Jumping Operations - Carriers +1 to Mooring/Tandem Tethering per skill level - Allowing a single carrier to jump 5 pilots with it - Super Carriers +2 to Mooring/Tandem Tethering per skill level - Allowing the super to jump 10 pilots with it
Give carriers and super carriers the ability to "Enable Mooring" or "Enable Tandem Tethering" or something to this effect.
All ships being tethered or moored need to be within 2500m of carrier or super carrier. All ships need to be at 0ms, any movement from a single ship will disconnect tethering line from that single ship, if carrier moves or warps then all ships disconnect from tether
Only sup caps can tether/moore with carrier/super carrier.
Obviously with rules such as these there will be ppl bumping carriers or ships to prevent a jump but the idea is to get from point A to point X, jumping into the "poop" and fighting it out. So starting out in a relatively safe system just long enough to get everyone tethered to jump is ideal.
|

Vic Teishikuro
Rescue Team
0
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 21:21:00 -
[25] - Quote
1+
this is a great idea.. |

max ericshaun
Ekchuah's Shrine Comporium Kill It With Fire
26
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 23:31:00 -
[26] - Quote
I'm really surprised that this thread has not picked up more support. The possibilities for small gang warfare are so great with this... I've +1 it before, and I'll +1 it again.  |

Meyr
Shiva The Retirement Club
0
|
Posted - 2013.06.21 06:20:00 -
[27] - Quote
+1
I've always thought a carrier should have the ability to move ships and pilots, creating the ability for a strong raiding force backed by capital-class firepower, but also risking a capital-class loss, as well as the loss of their ride home. |

Kenrailae
Mind Games. Suddenly Spaceships.
12
|
Posted - 2013.06.21 06:27:00 -
[28] - Quote
Draconian Arcane wrote:Guess I should re-title the topic to "Poor Man's Titan Bridge"
The Mooring idea is excellent
Make a navigation skill called Mooring Operations or Tandem Jumping Operations - Carriers +1 to Mooring/Tandem Tethering per skill level - Allowing a single carrier to jump 5 pilots with it - Super Carriers +2 to Mooring/Tandem Tethering per skill level - Allowing the super to jump 10 pilots with it
Give carriers and super carriers the ability to "Enable Mooring" or "Enable Tandem Tethering" or something to this effect.
All ships being tethered or moored need to be within 2500m of carrier or super carrier. All ships need to be at 0ms, any movement from a single ship will disconnect tethering line from that single ship, if carrier moves or warps then all ships disconnect from tether
Only sup caps can tether/moore with carrier/super carrier.
Obviously with rules such as these there will be ppl bumping carriers or ships to prevent a jump but the idea is to get from point A to point X, jumping into the "poop" and fighting it out. So starting out in a relatively safe system just long enough to get everyone tethered to jump is ideal.
Don't think Mooring would be the way to go, nor docking BS in carriers.
Eject->Store ship in Carrier-> Dock POD in carrier-> For now generic carrier/station environment(return to WIS could add walking in Carriers[So many evil ideas])-> Carrier has to start Jump sequence, receive jump confirmation from all pilots on board, or else boot them-> Once Jump is initiated, no one docks/undocks-> Jump-> Carrier must unlock ship bay after Jump/clear pilots for undock(accommodates session change)-> Pods undock, Carrier ejects ships(Or docks up, automatically spits out pods in station.
Little more complex, but doesn't just create moar, cheaper Titans. Creates a quicker transport system, but one that has some definite draw backs to the Titan system, preventing it from being too OP in combat but very valuable in alliance logistics for getting pilots from system to system without needing to Bridge, BLops, or have everyone in Caps.
Far more interesting, IMO. The Law is a point of View |

Draconian Arcane
Bastards Of New Eden
16
|
Posted - 2013.06.22 05:13:00 -
[29] - Quote
Kenrailae wrote:
Don't think Mooring would be the way to go, nor docking BS in carriers.
Eject->Store ship in Carrier-> Dock POD in carrier-> For now generic carrier/station environment(return to WIS could add walking in Carriers[So many evil ideas])-> Carrier has to start Jump sequence, receive jump confirmation from all pilots on board, or else boot them-> Once Jump is initiated, no one docks/undocks-> Jump-> Carrier must unlock ship bay after Jump/clear pilots for undock(accommodates session change)-> Pods undock, Carrier ejects ships(Or docks up, automatically spits out pods in station.
Little more complex, but doesn't just create moar, cheaper Titans. Creates a quicker transport system, but one that has some definite draw backs to the Titan system, preventing it from being too OP in combat but very valuable in alliance logistics for getting pilots from system to system without needing to Bridge, BLops, or have everyone in Caps.
Far more interesting, IMO.
EDIT: Interesting Afterthought to this: If Fighters are going to, in the relative near future, become playable(as was done for fanfest), then this concept could be an excellent way to get people ON carriers to fly fighters. Further development of this idea could lead to mannable point defense turrets in all caps. Would make a gorgeous way to get Dusties into space and being transported around by Eve players as well, merging the two games a whole lot better than just us bombing them and them hurling stuff at us. Not to forget the even further developed stage of this idea as Dusties being deployed as boarders to take over and neutralize carriers/dreads/stations/TITANs. Oooh man, that line of thought is amazing.
Problem with the whole docking bit is the "Ownership" of docked vessels. For example, what happens when pods are docked and the carrier docks in station? can the carrier pilot move the pods to his ship hangar? Can the pods undock from a carrier while the carrier is docked in station. Then there is the issue with afk docked pilots or if and when someone should log while docked.... etc etc... There is alot of variables that have to be reworked, The mooring options just allows a short cut, add new code, fish and edit a lil bit of old code and bam... Dunzo!
Granted its not that simple but I would imagine its easier then going over old code and figuring out what needs to be edited, cut or added in place of another line of code but with all that aside, I would like to see walking in ships, docking in carriers and all that jazz, but it just seems like a lot of work and would need a lot of attention and would most likely be an expansion in itself. If its easier to do the mooring bit, then lets get it done just so theres something to work with to allow more time for whats mentioned above. |

Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
469
|
Posted - 2013.06.22 05:34:00 -
[30] - Quote
Prohibit logging out while docked in someone else's carrier, or make the act of logging out automatically undock you. Rather than leaving your ship to dock, just dock in your ship. If the carrier pilot logs out, we do have timers now that prevent your ship from disappearing. Carrier pilots naturally have the ability to forcibly eject any/all docked pilots. Set it up so that while anyone else is docked in your carrier, your ship will not disappear on log-off. If the carrier pilot docks at a station, all the pilots who he's transporting are transferred to the station dock rather than remaining in the carrier. Just for fun we'll allow a pilot to be transferred to the station dock even if that station wouldn't allow them to dock normally.
They did not 'change the engine for WIS", they created a new engine for it. That long "Loading" screen is the CARBON engine starting up and loading the required texture files. |
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