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Paul Otichoda
State War Academy
Caldari State
1
   |
Posted - 2013.06.19 16:32:00 -
[1] - Quote
Low Security space scares me.
The fact that anyone can engage me there meants that I've been trying to avoid it.
I just don't want to lose a ship or a pod.
Is this a good thing? |
Kahega Amielden
Rifterlings
Point Blank Alliance
788
|
Posted - 2013.06.19 16:57:00 -
[2] - Quote
No. The idea of losing a ship or a pod should not be terrifying. Many players lose multiple ships and/or pods daily. |
Nikolai Lachance
Happy Wheels Logistics
14
|
Posted - 2013.06.19 17:14:00 -
[3] - Quote
Early on in your EVE career, it is normal to feel a sense of attachment to your ships, both out of sentiment, and for financial reasons. You'll eventually learn to see ships and their modules as expendable tools. It is often said that the number 1 rule of EVE is never fly what you can't afford to lose. What this really means is that if the cost of a particular ship and its fittings makes you terrified of the idea of losing it, then you probably shouldn't fly that ship (or have purchased it in the first place). You are not your ship.
That said, it doesn't mean you should go gallivanting around lowsec carelessly getting all your stuff exploded. But you'll have to learn to get over that fear of losing ships if you really want to enjoy all that EVE has to offer. You can live in high-sec all the time if you want but you're likely to be missing out on a lot of opportunities for excitement and fun. But remember, sticking around in highsec doesn't mean you will never lose ships...
As far as being podded goes... well if you're properly prepared, it should be very difficult to lose a pod outside of nullsec space. Still, it's generally a good idea to have a jump clone with no or cheap implants for PvP activity.
|
NightCrawler 85
Phoibe Enterprises
744
|
Posted - 2013.06.19 17:17:00 -
[4] - Quote
It is possible to play EVE without loosing a ship or a pod. I wont say its easy, and it will make some things a LOT harder (like living in 0.0, and you basically have to come to terms with the fact that you will never PVP) if this is your goal.
But you should not be afraid to loose a pod or your ship. Always follow the rule "dont fly what you cant afford to loose", accept and come to terms with the fact that you most likely will loose a ship or pod at some point. And when it happens you will most likely also find that it did not feel as bad as you thought it would.
If your fear will prevent you from becoming successful in EVE...Well i cant answer that because i dont know what you consider successful. EVE allows you to set your own goals, and if you reach that goal you can call your self successful, even if someone else dont think you accomplished anything special or impressive.
Bottom line..
Loosing a ship wont hurt as much as you think, the ISK loss wont mean as much to you in the long run, and dont try to set goals for your self that are purely based on what others want to archive 
Phoibe Enterprises official recruitment thread
The Eve Reader - -áAudio Recordings of Eve Chronicles
|
Ned Taggart
The Scope
Gallente Federation
3
|
Posted - 2013.06.19 17:22:00 -
[5] - Quote
The ship isn't your character, its your gear. have you played other MMO's? How often did you replace your gear?
A rifter set up for tackling only runs about a mil. Get a jumpclone, build out a few Rifters and hop in a fleet, and lose it. lose lots of them. it won't hurt. |
Lost Greybeard
Drunken Yordles
354
|
Posted - 2013.06.19 17:31:00 -
[6] - Quote
Low sec is the most dangerous part of space as far as getting your ship blown up is concerned, but some of the least dangerous space as far as losing your pod.
Fly relatively cheap fits when you're working in low so that you can replace them easily and you should be fine.
As the other posters have stated or implied, one of the central skills and themes of this game is that you need to learn to let go of stuff like that. Prepare for the possibility of losing, and don't sweat it when you do.
... all that said, what would you normally be doing in low-sec that you're missing out on by avoiding it? I rarely go anywhere where there isn't something in it for me, either the entertainment of a fight or some sort of isk or materials profit involved. If you're enjoying running high-sec missions or whatever you don't HAVE to change things. |
Jonah Gravenstein
Khalkotauroi Defence Labs
9274
|
Posted - 2013.06.19 18:57:00 -
[7] - Quote
Avoiding lowsec is no guarantee that you won't lose ships, anybody can engage you in highsec as well if they're prepared to take the consequences.
As others have said, your ship is a tool and is there to be used and abused. The best way to get over your fear of losing ships is to fit out some cheap ships and then go out and get them exploded, RvB or FW would probably be a good place to quash your fears cheaply, and learn to embrace the rush.
I eat your hatred for breakfast, then wash it down with your tears. |
Socks the Fox
Brave Newbies Inc.
Brave Collective
9
|
Posted - 2013.06.19 22:23:00 -
[8] - Quote
You should try getting some cheap ships for the express purpose of getting them blown up. Granted you should still try to fit them sanely, but go fly them until they're asploded. Eventually you'll find yourself living long enough that you'll need to log out before you've had a chance to asplode. Then you just take a quick trip to Rahadalon and we'll fix that for you. |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
1944
|
Posted - 2013.06.19 22:46:00 -
[9] - Quote
There is a tutorial mission that forces you to lose a ship.
The whole point is to not get emotionally invested in your ships.
Assume every ship you undock in is already lost.
"... I have it on good authority that if you type "Google" into Google, you can break the Internet.-á So please, no one try it, even for a joke!-á It's not a laughing matter!-á You can break the Internet!" GÇö Jen Barber |
Marmaduke Hatplate
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
12
|
Posted - 2013.06.19 23:05:00 -
[10] - Quote
I'm not so much scared of losing (only one o, btw) my ship as irritated by having to go through the process of buying another one, then buying all the bits for it and fitting it out again. As has been pointed out, after a fairly short while, we noobs build up a enough of an ISK pool that the cost isn't as much of an issue. But getting a replica space-ready can take a while depending on how far you have to go to pick up all the modules etc.
Is there some way to do this quickly? |
yopparai
ASTARTES CORP
Hashashin Cartel
1665
|
Posted - 2013.06.19 23:19:00 -
[11] - Quote
Marmaduke Hatplate wrote: But getting a replica space-ready can take a while depending on how far you have to go to pick up all the modules etc.
Is there some way to do this quickly?
Shop in a market hub, like Rens, Jita, Amarr. Save your fit once you get a good one, then you can open the fit buy all the mods then click fit to ship.
You should really go lose like 5 ships right now, and get over the fear.
Yopp
|
manutari
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
1
|
Posted - 2013.06.19 23:23:00 -
[12] - Quote
What others (including myself) do is buy X amount of ships at once, and fit them all up at same time, that way if you get blown up, you just go and grab your already Fitted Spare. I usually keep 5 fitted ships of the same type in my hanger, so I just pod myself over, grab a new one and I am back in the cockpit. I think it would save you some time if you just did them at the same time and doing it that way.
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Surfin's PlunderBunny
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
13416
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 03:11:00 -
[13] - Quote
We call it losec around these parts 
"Little ginger moron" ~David Hasselhoff-á
Want to see what Surf is training or how little isk Surf has?-á
http://eveboard.com/pilot/Surfin%27s_PlunderBunny |
Trudeaux Margaret
Open University of Celestial Hardship
Art of War Alliance
3
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 05:02:00 -
[14] - Quote
Honestly, a great many lowsec systems are dead. Back when I finally got the courage up to explore lowsec, I did the research. I fitted out a little Kestrel frigate for maximum speed and maneuverability so I'd have a decent chance of getting through any gate camps I might encounter. I watched a couple of YouTube video tutorials on using the directional scanner, then practiced using it in high sec for a while.
Then I jumped into a low sec system and found ... Nothing, except for a couple of nerds smack talking each other in Local and ignoring everything else. So much for big bad low sec. ;)
That's not to say that low sec doesn't have increased risks. It does. But a little common sense goes a long way. If you play EVE you will lose ships; there's no way around that. But you can minimize your risk by using the tools given you such as the directional scanner, the Statistics feature in the map, training Cloaking (and using it), etc. |
Ace Menda
Phoibe Enterprises
72
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 08:00:00 -
[15] - Quote
2 things....
1. Ships are tools. They aren't infinite.
2. High sec is not safe. You can and likely will be killed there too.
Are you in need of some nice chat? Are you new and want some help? Look no further and join: Crazy Dutch Guy |
Inxentas Ultramar
Ultramar Independent Contracting
Home Front Coalition
527
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 08:11:00 -
[16] - Quote
Paul Otichoda wrote:I just don't want to lose a ship or a pod. Is this attitude a good think or will it keep me from success in this game.
It's a bad attitude and it will not just keep you from success. It will steer you into an existential crisis where you ask yourself why the hell am I still playing this game and eventually a cancelled subscription.
Paul Otichoda wrote:Also are the rewards of low sec space (and null space) worth the risks of death?
I live in lowsec and I the loss of a BattleCruiser still stings... a little. The rewards are a bonus. The true reward is a sense of accomplishment when you see that ISK you collected affect other players. I feel the rewards of lowsec are in line with your chance of survival after your initial hazing period, when you learn Crimewatch well enough to fight with it instead of against it.
Every lowsec system is it's own little Game of Thrones, including barbarian hordes at the doorstep. Being a part of that, instead of slaving away at roids or the next mission pocket, is definately worth losing a few ships over. |
Nerath Naaris
Pink Winged Unicorns for Peace Love and Anarchy
470
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 09:15:00 -
[17] - Quote
I once felt the same avoiding Lo-Sec because "entering it means instant death". Also, everyone knows there be monsters and all that alarmist bla that gets perpetuated all the time (mostly by people that never went there at all).
Then I fitted an Atron for speed and with a cloak and just flew around to "get the feeling" for Lo-Sec. Well, the truth looked quite different from all the horror stories.
When I was finally ready, I took a cheapfit Rifter there with the express purpose to lose it (as well as getting some PvP experience; but mostly to lose it), considering getting blown up as an achievement. Repeat a few times - always with the mindset of getting popped as a success - and you will discover that losing a ship really means nothing.
BUT on the other hand, getting your first kill is an incredible exhilarating experience.
Forum-unbanned since 2011.10.20. |
Tixam Quri
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
5
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 09:18:00 -
[18] - Quote
[=Marmaduke Hatplate]I'm not so much scared of losing (only one o, btw) my ship as irritated by having to go through the process of buying another one, then buying all the bits for it and fitting it out again. As has been pointed out, after a fairly short while, we noobs build up a enough of an ISK pool that the cost isn't as much of an issue. But getting a replica space-ready can take a while depending on how far you have to go to pick up all the modules etc.
Is there some way to do this quickly?[/quote]
Buy fittings and ships in bulk. Never buy "one" of anything besides skill books if you can afford it. |
Paul Otichoda
State War Academy
Caldari State
1
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 09:29:00 -
[19] - Quote
Great I've just lost my cruiser to someone with a battleship and warp jammer.
Yeah I can afford to replace it (only just) but whats the point if it will just be shot up again.
I'm never leaving high security space again |
Ace Menda
Phoibe Enterprises
72
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 09:42:00 -
[20] - Quote
Paul Otichoda wrote:Great I've just lost my cruiser to someone with a battleship and warp jammer.
Yeah I can afford to replace it (only just) but whats the point if it will just be shot up again.
I'm never leaving high security space again
It ain't that bad.
You likely lost your ship cause you made a couple of mistakes which can be summed up into:
1. You came unprepared.
2. You fought on their terms, which puts you in a huge disadvantage.
I haven't lost a ship in low-sec in a long long time cause of the preperation I take when going in. And those that are lost are lost cause I knew I was going too (I always consider a PvP lost the moment I fit it up, if it survives more then a single fight, it's a bonus)
Are you in need of some nice chat? Are you new and want some help? Look no further and join: Crazy Dutch Guy |
Paul Otichoda
State War Academy
Caldari State
1
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 10:02:00 -
[21] - Quote
Ace Menda wrote:
It ain't that bad.
Yes it is.
If I actually replace the ship and all my equibment I'm looking at a balance of only about 2-3m ISK and it will take me forever to get back up to my previous balance. |
Ace Menda
Phoibe Enterprises
72
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 10:40:00 -
[22] - Quote
Paul Otichoda wrote:Ace Menda wrote:
It ain't that bad.
Yes it is. If I actually replace the ship and all my equibment I'm looking at a balance of only about 2-3m ISK and it will take me forever to get back up to my previous balance.
Hence the rule:
Dont fly what you cant afford to loose.
If you couldnt afford to loose that cruiser. You shouldnt have taken it into lowsec. Specially when you didnt use the correct precautions (you did use your D-scan etc I hope) and you were expecting people to play nice (which people never do in EVE anywhere). Low-sec isnt as bad....if you do use the mechanics at hand to keep you safe(ish).
But with your mindset. I'm not expecting you will end up playing for a very long time as you will find out that high sec is not safe either at one point.
Are you in need of some nice chat? Are you new and want some help? Look no further and join: Crazy Dutch Guy |
Marmaduke Hatplate
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
12
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 10:54:00 -
[23] - Quote
Tixam Quri wrote:Marmaduke Hatplate wrote:I'm not so much scared of losing (only one o, btw) my ship as irritated by having to go through the process of buying another one, then buying all the bits for it and fitting it out again. As has been pointed out, after a fairly short while, we noobs build up a enough of an ISK pool that the cost isn't as much of an issue. But getting a replica space-ready can take a while depending on how far you have to go to pick up all the modules etc.
Is there some way to do this quickly? Buy fittings and ships in bulk. Never buy "one" of anything besides skill books if you can afford it.
This is a typical piece of advice from so'eone who's possibly not been a noob for a long time lol.
I currently have 11m ISK. I could afford to buy and fit 3 Ventures or Tristans for that, probably, but I'd rather stay in hisec and be safer (Note I said safER, not safe) than in losec. At present, earning ISK is a fairly slow process.
Woring until I could buy three or four copies of a ship each time I want to upgrade my vessel seems a bit overly pessimistic. |
Marmaduke Hatplate
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
12
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 11:02:00 -
[24] - Quote
Ace Menda wrote:Paul Otichoda wrote:Ace Menda wrote:
It ain't that bad.
Yes it is. If I actually replace the ship and all my equibment I'm looking at a balance of only about 2-3m ISK and it will take me forever to get back up to my previous balance. Hence the rule: Dont fly what you cant afford to loose. If you couldnt afford to loose that cruiser. You shouldnt have taken it into lowsec. Specially when you didnt use the correct precautions (you did use your D-scan etc I hope) and you were expecting people to play nice (which people never do in EVE anywhere). Low-sec isnt as bad....if you do use the mechanics at hand to keep you safe(ish). But with your mindset. I'm not expecting you will end up playing for a very long time as you will find out that high sec is not safe either at one point.
This is the 'noob' forum. People like me are noobs. We dont know what the 'proper precautions' are, and generally, the advice we get from vets is 'do some research'. This thread is a classic example of missed points. The vets who 'haven't lost a ship in losec in ages' aren't flying Tristans, I'll wager.
The best advice for a noob about losec IMO is 'don't go there - skill up, build up ISK, build up your experience and practice in hisec first. Then fit a replica of your best ship, park it on a hisec station and only then venture forth into losec. But if you're posting in the new citizens forum, just don't go to losec'.
|
Tsukino Stareine
EVE University
Ivy League
394
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 11:09:00 -
[25] - Quote
plenty of veterans fly tristans
remember BIGGER IS NOT BETTER. Sometimes you need a smaller ship to do a certain job.
Noobs can definitely go to lowsec but you need to prepare yourself to:
A: lose your ship
B: how to avoid losing your ship
|
lollerwaffle
Clandestine Vector
THE SPACE P0LICE
60
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 11:14:00 -
[26] - Quote
Marmaduke Hatplate wrote:Tixam Quri wrote:Marmaduke Hatplate wrote:I'm not so much scared of losing (only one o, btw) my ship as irritated by having to go through the process of buying another one, then buying all the bits for it and fitting it out again. As has been pointed out, after a fairly short while, we noobs build up a enough of an ISK pool that the cost isn't as much of an issue. But getting a replica space-ready can take a while depending on how far you have to go to pick up all the modules etc.
Is there some way to do this quickly? Buy fittings and ships in bulk. Never buy "one" of anything besides skill books if you can afford it. This is a typical piece of advice from so'eone who's possibly not been a noob for a long time lol. I currently have 11m ISK. I could afford to buy and fit 3 Ventures or Tristans for that, probably, but I'd rather stay in hisec and be safer (Note I said safER, not safe) than in losec. At present, earning ISK is a fairly slow process. Woring until I could buy three or four copies of a ship each time I want to upgrade my vessel seems a bit overly pessimistic.
Well, 11m will buy you 5-10 frigates with meta 3-4 fittings easily.
|
Ace Menda
Phoibe Enterprises
72
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 11:36:00 -
[27] - Quote
Marmaduke Hatplate wrote:Ace Menda wrote:Paul Otichoda wrote:Ace Menda wrote:
It ain't that bad.
Yes it is. If I actually replace the ship and all my equibment I'm looking at a balance of only about 2-3m ISK and it will take me forever to get back up to my previous balance. Hence the rule: Dont fly what you cant afford to loose. If you couldnt afford to loose that cruiser. You shouldnt have taken it into lowsec. Specially when you didnt use the correct precautions (you did use your D-scan etc I hope) and you were expecting people to play nice (which people never do in EVE anywhere). Low-sec isnt as bad....if you do use the mechanics at hand to keep you safe(ish). But with your mindset. I'm not expecting you will end up playing for a very long time as you will find out that high sec is not safe either at one point. This is the 'noob' forum. People like me are noobs. We dont know what the 'proper precautions' are, and generally, the advice we get from vets is 'do some research'. This thread is a classic example of missed points. The vets who 'haven't lost a ship in losec in ages' aren't flying Tristans, I'll wager. The best advice for a noob about losec IMO is 'don't go there - skill up, build up ISK, build up your experience and practice in hisec first. Then fit a replica of your best ship, park it on a hisec station and only then venture forth into losec. But if you're posting in the new citizens forum, just don't go to losec'.
A lot of veterans fly frigates. Cause they know that bigger isn't better. Your thinking that a veteran only flies big ships shows how little you know about EVE and the mechanics in place. I know whole alliances/corporations that are build out of veterans and only fly frigates and destroyers.
Tutorials I believe cover D-scan. If not, if you would have asked in advance about what you need for low-sec survival. Plenty of people would have helped and gave you advice and guides.
You are now just whining about how you lost a dual tanking caracal to a T3 cruiser (legion) and think that LLow-sec is "instant death", well it isn't. If you think and ask questions. Take Brave Newbies Inc. they have loads of new players and they mainly live in low-sec. I even have a new player that I keep in contact in game so I can help him with questions that went into WH space while not even being a month old. Sure he lost a ship or 2, but he took ships he can easily replace and knew by asking what to do to minimize the risk and knew that PvE fitted ships are no match for a PvP fitted ship.
Hell a PvE fitted battleship will loose against a couple of PvP fitted frigates.
As with anything in EVE, your successes aswel as failures are 99.9% the consequenses of your own actions. If something bad happened to you, it's more likely you made a mistake somewhere down the road that ended up in the filure of said thing then it is faulty game mechanics or cuase something is "impossible". Nothing in EVE is impossible, if you work hard enough for it.
Your mindset, well I have seen it before in the game many many times in the last 3 years, almost all of them didn't make it past their first 3 months becuse they expected the game to be suiting their needs instead of like it really is, where you have to make the game suit your needs, by all means neccesary. I hope you are different though.
Are you in need of some nice chat? Are you new and want some help? Look no further and join: Crazy Dutch Guy |
Marmaduke Hatplate
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
12
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 11:46:00 -
[28] - Quote
Ace Menda wrote:Marmaduke Hatplate wrote:Ace Menda wrote:Paul Otichoda wrote:Ace Menda wrote:
It ain't that bad.
Yes it is. If I actually replace the ship and all my equibment I'm looking at a balance of only about 2-3m ISK and it will take me forever to get back up to my previous balance. Hence the rule: Dont fly what you cant afford to loose. If you couldnt afford to loose that cruiser. You shouldnt have taken it into lowsec. Specially when you didnt use the correct precautions (you did use your D-scan etc I hope) and you were expecting people to play nice (which people never do in EVE anywhere). Low-sec isnt as bad....if you do use the mechanics at hand to keep you safe(ish). But with your mindset. I'm not expecting you will end up playing for a very long time as you will find out that high sec is not safe either at one point. This is the 'noob' forum. People like me are noobs. We dont know what the 'proper precautions' are, and generally, the advice we get from vets is 'do some research'. This thread is a classic example of missed points. The vets who 'haven't lost a ship in losec in ages' aren't flying Tristans, I'll wager. The best advice for a noob about losec IMO is 'don't go there - skill up, build up ISK, build up your experience and practice in hisec first. Then fit a replica of your best ship, park it on a hisec station and only then venture forth into losec. But if you're posting in the new citizens forum, just don't go to losec'. A lot of veterans fly frigates. Cause they know that bigger isn't better. Your thinking that a veteran only flies big ships shows how little you know about EVE and the mechanics in place. I know whole alliances/corporations that are build out of veterans and only fly frigates and destroyers. Tutorials I believe cover D-scan. If not, if you would have asked in advance about what you need for low-sec survival. Plenty of people would have helped and gave you advice and guides. You are now just whining about how you lost a dual tanking caracal to a T3 cruiser (legion) and think that LLow-sec is "instant death", well it isn't. If you think and ask questions. Take Brave Newbies Inc. they have loads of new players and they mainly live in low-sec. I even have a new player that I keep in contact in game so I can help him with questions that went into WH space while not even being a month old. Sure he lost a ship or 2, but he took ships he can easily replace and knew by asking what to do to minimize the risk and knew that PvE fitted ships are no match for a PvP fitted ship. Hell a PvE fitted battleship will loose against a couple of PvP fitted frigates. As with anything in EVE, your successes aswel as failures are 99.9% the consequenses of your own actions. If something bad happened to you, it's more likely you made a mistake somewhere down the road that ended up in the filure of said thing then it is faulty game mechanics or cuase something is "impossible". Nothing in EVE is impossible, if you work hard enough for it.
I'm not having a go at you, but you aren't paying much attention. I'm not the one who's lost anything (that's another poster-I've only lost 1 shuttle in losec, and I'm nt whining about that at all, fair kill no complaints). I'm also not saying anything is impossible. I'm just pointing out that when you've got 10mil and no clue about the deep complexity of Eve, 'get a cloak' and 'buy in bulk' is useless commentary in a noob forum.
I have recieved some advice in the ships and modules forum which was v helpful, I do agree that often vets are v helpful. The HelpMyMission channel in game has also been extremely useful and there are some great people using it.
I do think however that when vets say 'do some research before you go into losec', what they mean is 'wait till you're a few months trained/rich'.
If someone could suggest a Tristan fit that would cost less thsn 20mil and 600k SP which will give me a fighting chance in losec, though, I'll be game for giving it a shot! :D
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Singu L'arity
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 11:52:00 -
[29] - Quote
If you want a fellow nub to do some stuff together, you can hit me up, if you wish :) At the moment I wanna try some FW out before my Trial ends (4 days), because solo mission running is such a bore  |
Trudeaux Margaret
Open University of Celestial Hardship
Art of War Alliance
4
|
Posted - 2013.06.20 11:54:00 -
[30] - Quote
Ace Menda wrote:Tutorials I believe cover D-scan..
They do not, unfortunately.
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