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Kill bords, love em or hate em?

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Helios Aquiness The Rising Stars Academy 20	Posted - 2013.06.26 19:33:00 - [1] - Quote Whats the popular opinion on kill bords, and do they add to or take away from pvp? On the one hand, kill bords give you highly detailed information on all the kills you've ever done. They allow players to brag and reminess about epic fights, and see at a glance just how well they are doing. On the down side, haveing a perminate record of your losses can work against you as there are many corps that place a heavy emphasis on kill bord efficency. The knolage that your loss is recorded forever causes some players to be more tactical and avoid loseing ships where ever they can. But does this allow for more stratigic pvp or does it infact hamper it by makeing some people skiddish about loseing something they could easly replace but dont want the bad record. Personally Im some what neutral on the subject since I really dont care what I lose and who knows it. I see isk as useless unless its spent. However Iv been bared from a number of perspective corps because of my less than spectacular pvp record. Im curous as to what other people think of them however.
Doc Fury Furious Enterprises 2647	Posted - 2013.06.26 19:38:00 - [2] - Quote Some people need a way to measure their epeens I guess. The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the ho's and politicians will look up and shout 'Save us!' and I'll look down, and whisper 'Hodor'.
Destination SkillQueue Are We There Yet 5327	Posted - 2013.06.26 19:46:00 - [3] - Quote I don't personally have any use for them outside the free intel they provide and I would gladly opt out of them, but I get why some people want and even need them. I have no strong feelings either way though.
Ace Uoweme Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 277	Posted - 2013.06.26 19:49:00 - [4] - Quote Helios Aquiness wrote: Whats the popular opinion on kill bords, and do they add to or take away from pvp? Worthless to me. Someone claims he got a 20mil kill on something I built off of leftovers, more so. If he gloats over leftovers he's truly a sad puppy. "In a world of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act." ~George Orwell
Bischopt Arbitrary Repossession 102	Posted - 2013.06.26 19:50:00 - [5] - Quote For someone who does a lot of solo pvp, killboards can tell a lot. Does your potential opponent usually run in a gang or is he usually alone? Does he do kity fits or does he brawl? Is he any good at all? and more. Whether or not that's a good thing... depends on who you're asking. Personally I like it.
Feer Truelight 133	Posted - 2013.06.26 19:51:00 - [6] - Quote Love 'em when you're a predator. Hate 'em when you are prey. That awkward moment when I'm salvaging a Minmatar wreck and after 10 minutes the player starts shooting at me.
Toriessian Helion Production Labs Mildly Intoxicated 132	Posted - 2013.06.26 19:51:00 - [7] - Quote KBs aren't much more than an activity monitor. Aside from that they're useless since everyone who shoots a ship is on the KM and that goes to their isk efficiency. It creates an ISK efficiency tracking situation where everyone who PVPs with any level of reasonable success has a good KB. I also hate the amount of intel you can get on people with them.
War Kitten Panda McLegion 2222	Posted - 2013.06.26 19:56:00 - [8] - Quote You can't win at EVE without a way to keep score. Killboards are one way to do that. I find that without a good mob to provide one for them, most people would have no mentality at all.
Rhea Rankin Nolen Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 11	Posted - 2013.06.26 20:05:00 - [9] - Quote Against it. Coincidentally I use it on a daily basis when pvp-ing, and it saved my ass or gave me the upper hand on more than a few occasions. But yeah..basically a free out of game intel tool. Makes absolutely no sense, especially with the new ingame kill logs. IMO killboards, alongside dotlan and other similar out of game tools, take a lot away from EVE's mystery and wonder.
baltec1 Bat Country 7031	Posted - 2013.06.26 20:27:00 - [10] - Quote Not only are they the only way to show that something died but we also get golden moments such as Emo TJ's Dramiel incident
Linna Baresi 13	Posted - 2013.06.26 20:47:00 - [11] - Quote I know a lot of people put great stock on things like kill boards and kill/death ratios... they work well for those for whom the kill count itself has meaning, I guess. I've seen groups of these kill oriented folk rake in massive numbers of kills during wargames and open world PVP (other games than EVE, of course, I'm new around here)... and I've seen them lose badly all the same because they forgot about the actual victory conditions and objectives. Personally, I prefer to be the one running away with the goodies, while the killers are otherwise occupied (preferably with something I arranged for them to be occupied with). There's something highly satisfactory about confused forum posts wondering 'how did that happen, we were winning' and 'where did out base go, I swear I paid the maintenance'. Member of <Fated> since 2003 fated.europefreeforum.com
CompleteFailure Polaris Rising Gentlemen's Agreement 53	Posted - 2013.06.26 21:47:00 - [12] - Quote boards reminisce having permanent efficiency knowledge losing wherever strategic in fact making skittish losing easily don't I'm somewhat don't I've barred prospective I'm *curious Man that was painful to read. I'd say that evaluating someone's KB record is one way to evaluate the skill and knowledge level of the player. While they certainly don't tell the whole story, they do provide good insight into how well the player might understand game mechanics, fitting concepts, what kinds of fits work in what situations, what kinds of ships work well against what, etc. While it may seem "elitist," it could just be that they're looking for people who have a certain level of competence so they don't have to spend extra time teaching them the more basic stuff. It's not always just about epeens, it could simply be a matter of how much time they're willing to invest in their members to get them to the level they expect them to be at.
Doc Spectre State War Academy Caldari State 7	Posted - 2013.06.26 22:23:00 - [13] - Quote I play to have fun and I have lots of fun without kills...
Just Lilly 79	Posted - 2013.06.26 22:25:00 - [14] - Quote I don't hate em, but they give away 2 much intel imo Ship loss and the value of lost assets would be enough, not the fitting, location or what mods that dropped. Powered by Nvidia GTX 690
Marlona Sky D00M. Northern Coalition. 3951	Posted - 2013.06.26 22:30:00 - [15] - Quote baltec1 wrote: Not only are they the only way to show that something died but we also get golden moments such as Emo TJ's Dramiel incident Oh wow. Has it been that long ago? Feeling old now. .
Marlona Sky D00M. Northern Coalition. 3951	Posted - 2013.06.26 22:31:00 - [16] - Quote Kill boards tell a story, so they are a good thing. .
Emergent Game Play State War Academy Caldari State 0	Posted - 2013.06.26 22:40:00 - [17] - Quote Doc Spectre wrote: I play to have fun and I have lots of fun without kills... Impossible.
Grimpak Midnight Elites United Federation of Commerce 945	Posted - 2013.06.26 22:42:00 - [18] - Quote Marlona Sky wrote: baltec1 wrote: Not only are they the only way to show that something died but we also get golden moments such as Emo TJ's Dramiel incident Oh wow. Has it been that long ago? Feeling old now. 3 years already. dayum.... [img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img] [quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote] ain't that right
Jack Miton Aperture Harmonics K162 2061	Posted - 2013.06.26 23:03:00 - [19] - Quote Killboards are eve's score card in a way shrug some people take them way too seriously though.
Litair Donchian Stripes 146	Posted - 2013.06.26 23:27:00 - [20] - Quote Personally I think killboards are the sucks, especially because mine sucks as well. But seriously I often times like to have a fun fight, but I don't find it particularly exciting to ruin random people's day necessarily.. so I have on multiple occasions decided to let people go once they're someway into hull and the fight is evidently decided. Especially if they're new peeps. Besides there'll be more pew if they don't have to spend the next few days mining to buy a new ship :p Doesn't do squat for my killboard though, so I am an eternal noob on that point.. kinda annoying since a lot of people blindly care so much about it. I completely agree it's the closest to a score you can have in EVE, but in a total sandbox like this, I don't think you should have a score at all, as it inevitably favors one particular playstyle. A private killboard for yourself to contemplate your failures and smile at your victorious is fine though, and even share it with your friends.. but just being able to google it isn't really cool.
Herzog Wolfhammer Sigma Special Tactics Group 2935	Posted - 2013.06.27 00:42:00 - [21] - Quote baltec1 wrote: Not only are they the only way to show that something died but we also get golden moments such as Emo TJ's Dramiel incident OMG I remember that.
Invisusira The Rising Stars The Initiative. 177	Posted - 2013.06.27 01:12:00 - [22] - Quote Killboards are a pretty integral part of EVE. Honestly don't know why there isn't an official CCP one. Core Skills - train em up train em up!
Six Six Six Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 129	Posted - 2013.06.27 01:24:00 - [23] - Quote I don't like KBs, mainly because some people just turn it into a race to get the most kills and they don't care how they do it. But maybe that's because I'm the type of person that doesn't feel they have to prove themselves to anyone.
Alavaria Fera GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 3739	Posted - 2013.06.27 05:46:00 - [24] - Quote We have the crappiest killboard in the world. Not only does it not pull kills from anywhere, but it only seems to have information about our reimbursable ship losses. It is the best killboard ever. There are no goons. The goons' 0.0 dream is over. TEST Defence, Please Ignore
Landrae Sacred Templars Unclaimed. 538	Posted - 2013.06.27 06:56:00 - [25] - Quote I love how much I hate them? Welcome to Eve Online
Grimpak Midnight Elites United Federation of Commerce 945	Posted - 2013.06.27 06:59:00 - [26] - Quote Invisusira wrote: Killboards are a pretty integral part of EVE. Honestly don't know why there isn't an official CCP one. well, you have combat logs and you can see kills and losses on your corp. I don't think CCP needs to do anything else, since anything besides that is for gloating and chest-beating purposes, and it would probably make EVE a bit too much like COD or CS. [img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img] [quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote] ain't that right
Kaahles Retarded Extemely Dangerous The Predictables 25	Posted - 2013.06.27 07:20:00 - [27] - Quote Not really playing much these days but when I do PvP I stopped posting my kills on those boards quite a while ago. If an corporation/alliance wants them what the hell let them grab those things via API. I don't give a ****. Yeah sure way I posted some every now and again when it was some really cool kill with lots of shiny loot or a high comedy value but there is really no point anymore since I can just link the stuff in-game now when I feel like showing off. Do I actively look at / search killboards? Sometimes when I need a new fit. It's a great way to get crazy ideas for new setups. Overall I think they're an old idea that is overstaying it's welcome... or maybe it's just me getting old and bitter.
Inxentas Ultramar Ultramar Independent Contracting Home Front Coalition 542	Posted - 2013.06.27 08:41:00 - [28] - Quote Oops, double post. Please delete this one admins, sorry!
Inxentas Ultramar Ultramar Independent Contracting Home Front Coalition 542	Posted - 2013.06.27 08:44:00 - [29] - Quote Killboards are fine. I usually use them as teaching examples, for which they are excellent, but I do agree they take away a bit of mystery for the 3rd party that was not involved. They are also great to improve the fits of your less experienced friends by pointing out the typical fitting mistakes when you arent logged into the client.
Terrorfrodo Renegade Hobbits for Mordor 498	Posted - 2013.06.27 09:40:00 - [30] - Quote The killboard used to be very important to me. Nowadays I hardly look at it anymore, except for the records of hostile pilots I meet, to gather intel about them. I still like killmails... they are records of events. Sometimes I look at an old kill and still remember how the fight went. Sadly, most killmails do not tell the real story if you don't already know what happened. For a game where pvp is so important as it is in EVE, the devs do way too little to make killmails meaningful and accurate. Here are some major things that need to be fixed: -show involved Logistics and Carriers -show active booster ships -make damage numbers and involved pilots persistent over session changes (like system jumps) -remember what ship a pilot was in even if he dies during the fight so that we don't see people doing top damage in a capsule on killmails -clear the damage received number on a ship after a while so that we don't see 200k damage from rats on kills only because the guy had been ratting for an hour without session change before he was attacked and killed -automatically correct kill reports so that e.g. a friendly pilot who only used a web on the victim is not shown. I'd say people who were in the same fleet as the victim should not be shown. This will mess up awoxing kills but fix almost all others, I'd take that trade. .
Cannibal Kane Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation 1942	Posted - 2013.06.27 09:54:00 - [31] - Quote I don't like KB's. But for some reason it is a must if you want to join a pvp corp or get hired as a merc to shoot at people. "I saw him fight by the monument in Jita. -áHe flowed in his Machariel like a Shinto spirit, 800MM shells sprouting in his passing. -áHis hair flowed in the corona of his target's warp core breach. -áIt was truly majestic. -áAnd while everyone stared in awe I stole the loot and ran off.-áBecause I am like that." --áNEONOVUS
Muad 'dib The Imperial Fedaykin Amarrian Commandos 1165	Posted - 2013.06.27 10:25:00 - [32] - Quote I like to be able to track my own record of ships ive used over certain months doing certain types of pvp. I rarely use kill boards to judge others, however if somone is shooting their mouth off about being amazing i might check, but not to rub in their face. Cosmic signature detected. . . . http://i.imgur.com/Z7NfIS6.jpg I got 99 likes, and this post aint one.
Tiber Ibis Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 61	Posted - 2013.06.27 11:13:00 - [33] - Quote I dislike giving any of my information away to killboards. So generally I don't post up any of my kills. Unfortunately this means my killboard comprises of only losses and kills I was involved in. lol I don't really care though to be honest.
Diesel47 Bad Men Ltd. 656	Posted - 2013.06.27 11:16:00 - [34] - Quote I like killboards. I don't like ADHD kids that worship said killboards.
Helios Aquiness The Rising Stars Academy 20	Posted - 2013.06.27 13:08:00 - [35] - Quote CompleteFailure wrote: boards reminisce having permanent efficiency knowledge losing wherever strategic in fact making skittish losing easily don't I'm somewhat don't I've barred prospective I'm *curious Man that was painful to read. I am sorry about that, I usually use firefox so I have the spell check, but at work I'm stuck with IE so I have to reliy on my own intelimagence.
Dinsdale Pirannha Pirannha Corp 1081	Posted - 2013.06.27 13:55:00 - [36] - Quote If Eve was truly immersive, there would be no detailed killboards. The Eve universe is a big big place. It has 7500 systems. It is filled with thousands of disparate groups, many that have zero interest in letting others know who, or what they are killing. To suggest that there should be an organized over-arching group that tracks every kill is ridiculous, and not immersive. Yes, Concord is an over-arching group that sees all in this game, but it in any real world analogy, Concord would not be releasing specific data on ship fits, and value of fits. Space fighter pilots should have general reputations that are built over time, with no true verifiable method parsing fact from hyperbole. Billy the Kid may know specifically how many people he killed, but he would be the only one who knows with absolute certainty, and he sure never knew how much his victim's weapons were worth to the penny. And in large wars, even in today's age of instant information, do countries give out public details about precisely what a casualty was wearing and what equipment he had on him? As far as I know, in the chaos of war, even a soldier's immediate superiors would not have that knowledge. If organized groups in Eve (for sake of argument the equivalent of armies) want to keep track of generalized kills and losses, no problem. They can keep track of the general value of a kill, but not detailed on what dropped, what was destroyed, and not how much to the penny it was worth. And if said organizations want to release generalized data to the public, fine. But there should be no way for the public to confirm the veracity of it, with something like an API key. So API specific detail is ridiculous and non-immersive, and completely unrealistic, even within the confines of the Eve universe.
Kult Altol Confederation Navy Research Epsilon Fleet 522	Posted - 2013.06.27 16:42:00 - [37] - Quote As a carebear, I like em. I don't know how pvpers would stroke their epeens with out it. PVP would die overnight w/o KB \/\/horing. An open mind is like a fortress with its gates unbarred and unguarded. A narrow mind is a focused mind. -irregardless, I'm with Yolo Swaggins, and the followship of the bling.-á
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops 15268	Posted - 2013.06.27 16:46:00 - [38] - Quote Third option: never used with them; don't care. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0.
Karl Planck Heretic Army Heretic Initiative 328	Posted - 2013.06.27 17:16:00 - [39] - Quote Toriessian wrote: KBs aren't much more than an activity monitor. Aside from that they're useless since everyone who shoots a ship is on the KM and that goes to their isk efficiency. It creates an ISK efficiency tracking situation where everyone who PVPs with any level of reasonable success has a good KB. That is hilariously untrue And to answer the OP. KB chasing CAN get out of hand. People whoring on expensive kills can be misleading about how much someone really contributed to something or what it means. Isk efficiency is a common problem with those as getting on a few expensive kills makes it look like you know how to kill expensive ** and never die, when normally all the isk being destroyed is really facilitated by a few people (eve-kill problem). Similarly, BC has the problem of point whoring to inflate what is going to on. Nuetral logi, boosts, etc all inflate whats really going on. However, kb's are, when viewed carefully, amazing metrics to judge a pilot/corp/alliance by in addition to be strong intel tools. Intel tools go both ways so those that *** are just to lazy to use the intel. As far as a metric, people will most often paint themselves in the best light, but the tools are there for you to judge them by. I f*cking love KB's Proud CEO of Heretic Army and loyal servent to Mother Amamake. COME AT ME BRO! Forums: http://forum.heretic-army.biz/index.php-á Killboard: http://kb.heretic-army.biz/ Follow me on twitter @KarlPlanck
Azriel Geist Shinrei Syndicate Brigands of New Eden 77	Posted - 2013.06.27 17:45:00 - [40] - Quote They're pretty ghetto patchworks of PHP... and useful for intel. Beyond that, meh. Pretty neutral.
Helios Aquiness The Rising Stars Academy 20	Posted - 2013.06.28 13:00:00 - [41] - Quote I had a thought, if kill boards were changed so that you could see everything you can now EXCEPT who was piloting it, how much would that change things?
Tyrell Cadabra Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective 1	Posted - 2013.06.28 13:44:00 - [42] - Quote For me to care about killboards, there would have to be ONE central board, not 15 of them, all claiming to be 'the' board.
Val'Dore PlanetCorp InterStellar 345	Posted - 2013.06.28 14:12:00 - [43] - Quote Too much information is on kill boards. Remove all fitting and cargo information from kill mails. You don't need to see how a dead ship is fit. Now the winning ship... that is the fit I want to see. Star Jump Drive I invented Tiericide
Sunshyn LaBlond 24th Imperial Crusade Amarr Empire 19	Posted - 2013.06.30 16:38:00 - [44] - Quote They mattered for about a week when I first got into PvP. Very quickly they become irrelevant other than as a reference for those rare comedy wins/losses that make for good conversation.

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