I'd be a pricey fit, and would love some opinions before I take the plunge.

100mn Tengu's are fine..

Just not as ridiculously op as they were. Stop being bad.

Personally I wouldn't even consider a 100mn tengu if I didn't have a boner ship in system..... but that's me.

consider a 100mn tengu if I didn't have a boner ship

boner ship

100mn Tengu's are fine..

Just not as ridiculously op as they were. Stop being bad.

They are really not fine anymore. I mean if you fight really easy gangs of only a few BC's armor cruisers fine- but the second you throw in some light tackle, and perhaps a recon / pirate cruiser, your dead. Its a poor platform for PvP nowadyas. Again im not saying that you can't go and get kills with it, but its very expensive for what it can do. While there are other ships that can do what a 100MN tengu does, and more for a much cheaper price. And you don't even need links!

A mutch better choice to look into, is a dual prop SCYFI or Nossprey. Speed is the name of the game. And with pirate cruisers easily hitting 3k/s with no heat, and having an align time of 4.5 seconds or less with an MWD on, there is no way a super unagilve 100Mn is ever going to keep up or get out.

They are really not fine anymore. I mean if you fight really easy gangs of only a few BC's armor cruisers fine- but the second you throw in some light tackle, and perhaps a recon / pirate cruiser, your dead.

Please note that HML's no longer apply any damage, and are complete garbage.

If speed is "the name of the game" and you are telling him to fly a SCYFI or NOsprey you are doing it wrong and you should feel bad. They are not bad ships but if you have a need for speed they are not what you want to be flying.

As for the 100mn, they work well still. They will require some attentiveness though.

Whot? 10% dps nerf and it's completely unusable? Did I miss a significant projection-nerf? Your heavies even still reach out to max linked RF pointrange. Only downside of now compared to earlier: Other cruisers and frigates aren't defenseless anymore, and ABCs can potentially give you trouble.

The on paper DPS still looks nice. However CCP have made changes to the application of that damage- which you will find have completely made the HML missile system useless. RLM missiles and Cruise are the new meta. As i have said before, a cruise phoon will apply more DPS to an MWD'ing cruiser than a 5 launcher Tengu shooting CN scourge at the same target. Its pretty sad, but it is the reality we live in. If you like I can show you very easily in EFT

you don't actually use missiles do you?

They are really not fine anymore. I mean if you fight really easy gangs of only a few BC's armor cruisers fine- but the second you throw in some light tackle, and perhaps a recon / pirate cruiser, your dead. Its a poor platform for PvP nowadyas. Again im not saying that you can't go and get kills with it, but its very expensive for what it can do. While there are other ships that can do what a 100MN tengu does, and more for a much cheaper price. And you don't even need links!

Obviously they're ok since you're still talking about engaging entire gangs solo with them.

Surprisingly cibtradictory information. I have no actual experience using eft and looking at applied dps i was surprised to see 500dps drp to 20 or so against say a tengu going 1500m/s. Which jives with the people who say ham hml have terrible application. Ill try rlm when i get home.

Then theres the people who say everything is fine even though people and eft are showing terrible application. So im hoping they know something others dont

HMLs do about half damage to MWDing cruisers nowadays, which is pretty awful. Honestly there's really no reason to use them over RMLs now (or HAMs with javelins when you're <30km), their damage projection is awful and they can't hit anything smaller than a BC for full damage. EVE-O pubs just look at the 10% damage reduction and completely ignore the massive nerfs to explosion radius/velocity, presumably because all they do is shoot painted/webbed rats all day

Honestly people on this forum are about 3 years behind the curve on the metagame, crying about how "OP" the drake and cane were when they were made almost totally obsolete by the introduction of tier3s. There are probably still people that think the cynabal is still a feared and powerful PVP ship lmao

Just plugged into pyfa the mods and stuff to get a Scythe FI to run 5km/s and afterwards put the same augmentations and links on a cheaped out tengu (1bil), which now goes 3.3km/s non OH, has a 14seconds aligntime, goes 4.8km/s OH. not scrammable, no sigbloom. DPS is only 430.

The one thing that is completely disregarded here is the capacitor. The Tengus endurance is different from any navy cruiser, difference compares to day and night.

So the tengu is - imo - just a ship playing in a different league, most things it can do a navy cruiser can't even remotely accomplish. They might be fine in null/low, but at least in wh-space, 100mn is another kind of ship compared to mwd. (I rather can talk about wh-space compared to low/null)

Can u post the fits implants u used? U say the tengu capacitor is much better. So u vouch for the 100mn tengu?

According to some earlier post stating a scythe navy, I just tried to get it up to the 8.5km/s that got posted, turns out that the dps is special (no further comment here) and you need HG snakes, a maxlinkloki with mindlink, and quafe and a zors, aswell as nano+overdrive. So really paper. That sythe would also have a cap life of around 2m10sec without an invuln, which is not really bad, but good is different.

Most kiting fights I personally have take more than 5 minutes against one notable target alone, and as most fights tend to take some time (atleast in wormholes, quick gank can require a few thousand dps to really be a quick gank), so I'm in general very grateful to have a large amount of cap and cap recharge to sustain my efforts.

The great thing about the tengu is: It's loleasy to fly. 100mn and missiles goes close to permamwd-drakes, especially as the tengu runs capstable at some 70% compared to a 100mn lokis 10-15minutes of cap using AB, point and 2 webs. As the tengu got 6 mids, you even got spare space for a web and a cap booster, making pinning you down a really annoying task. Moreso, most stuff that can pin you down just dies so quikly, must stuff that doesn't also doesn't pin you down.

So in a competent pilot's hands, tengu is one of the most threatening and annoying ships, as target selection and choosing your fights applies, you get free kills on mostly anything you can find in a small gang, with the few threats requiring always you being outnumbered to start with. A solo rapier can't kill you, a solo loki can't scratch your balls. If it happens to be able to tank you, it is slower than you are. And so on.

Afterall, it really is not the damage projection, or the fact that it runs capstable nearly all time, or the speed or the fact you can't be scrammed, neither the incredible aligntime (aligntime is 3.18sec before propmod) it's also not the ridiculous blaster/railgun resist that make it so good, it's the combination of all those more or less important traits that is afaik rather unique and that effective.

According to some earlier post stating a scythe navy, I just tried to get it up to the 8.5km/s that got posted, turns out that the dps is special (no further comment here) and you need HG snakes, a maxlinkloki with mindlink, and quafe and a zors, aswell as nano+overdrive. So really paper. That sythe would also have a cap life of around 2m10sec without an invuln, which is not really bad, but good is different.

Most kiting fights I personally have take more than 5 minutes against one notable target alone, and as most fights tend to take some time (atleast in wormholes, quick gank can require a few thousand dps to really be a quick gank), so I'm in general very grateful to have a large amount of cap and cap recharge to sustain my efforts.

The great thing about the tengu is: It's loleasy to fly. 100mn and missiles goes close to permamwd-drakes, especially as the tengu runs capstable at some 70% compared to a 100mn lokis 10-15minutes of cap using AB, point and 2 webs. As the tengu got 6 mids, you even got spare space for a web and a cap booster, making pinning you down a really annoying task. Moreso, most stuff that can pin you down just dies so quikly, must stuff that doesn't also doesn't pin you down.

So in a competent pilot's hands, tengu is one of the most threatening and annoying ships, as target selection and choosing your fights applies, you get free kills on mostly anything you can find in a small gang, with the few threats requiring always you being outnumbered to start with. A solo rapier can't kill you, a solo loki can't scratch your balls. If it happens to be able to tank you, it is slower than you are. And so on.

Afterall, it really is not the damage projection, or the fact that it runs capstable nearly all time, or the speed or the fact you can't be scrammed, neither the incredible aligntime (aligntime is 3.18sec before propmod) it's also not the ridiculous blaster/railgun resist that make it so good, it's the combination of all those more or less important traits that is afaik rather unique and that effective.

Is 2400 not enough speed because rlm are short range weapons? How fast does a tengu have to be to be viable in this meta? Are ONLY 3500m/s ships being used nowadays? If slower ships are being used why can they be slower but tengu cant?

CNI can apply full light missile fury DPS even against linked / speed implanted intys

Just plugged into pyfa the mods and stuff to get a Scythe FI to run 5km/s and afterwards put the same augmentations and links on a cheaped out tengu (1bil), which now goes 3.3km/s non OH, has a 14seconds aligntime, goes 4.8km/s OH. not scrammable, no sigbloom. DPS is only 430.

The one thing that is completely disregarded here is the capacitor. The Tengus endurance is different from any navy cruiser, difference compares to day and night.

So the tengu is - imo - just a ship playing in a different league, most things it can do a navy cruiser can't even remotely accomplish. They might be fine in null/low, but at least in wh-space, 100mn is another kind of ship compared to mwd. (I rather can talk about wh-space compared to low/null)

The CNI does not have an explosion radius bonus for RLMs.

Don't read any of the comments in this thread. Everyone here has no idea what they're talking about. While the tengu can no longer apply 500 dps to cruisers and above at 100km the HAM fit is still really effective and contrary to what the geniuses in this thread tell you a tengu with HAMs fit can project to roughly 60km with faction ammo because it gets a double range bonus. The rest of the fit is pretty much the same.

Although, if you have to ask on the EvE-O forums whether a 100mn tengu is good and how to fit one I suggest you don't fly a 100mn tengu.

Don't read any of the comments in this thread. Everyone here has no idea what they're talking about. While the tengu can no longer apply 500 dps to cruisers and above at 100km the HAM fit is still really effective and contrary to what the geniuses in this thread tell you a tengu with HAMs fit can project to roughly 60km with faction ammo because it gets a double range bonus. The rest of the fit is pretty much the same.

Although, if you have to ask on the EvE-O forums whether a 100mn tengu is good and how to fit one I suggest you don't fly a 100mn tengu.

The gist is that HMLs are bad and any 100mn fit using them is likewise bad. Use RMLs or HAMs

Because I am calling bullshit, as the ship does not exist.

I just didn't do the comparison of HML tengu to RLM tengu. You're right, RMLs are flatout superior to HMLs. The little lack of range is - I guess - totally made up for with that projection. It really is a rad sad to see a tengu pushing near 400dps with RLMs against cruisers at unlinked point range :< And the fitting is suddenly way easier, and doesn't need 2 odd CN HMLs \o/



I doubt that asking a question about a ship disqualifies you from using it. To be fair, I doubt a lot of people have (especially those that fly something different from lowsec/nullsec-flavor-of-the-month) been aware of RML-tengus, at least I haven't been - and neither are the tengus I'm shooting at :) Lucky me.
I also have asked on some forums, wether or not a certain deimos fit is good and that surely doesn't disqualify me using it. And who did you ask before you fitted up your first tengu? Did everything right from the beginning? Guess, you've been watching 'crazy tengu' then :p

You are pvping with offgrid booster, pride yourself with a handful of kills, say its all because of RLM and now you call BS.

*facepalm*

You are pvping with offgrid booster, pride yourself with a handful of kills, say its all because of RLM and now you call BS.

*facepalm*

everyone pvps with offgrid booster it doesnt even need to be brought up anymore does it?

are you saying RLM arent superior? if not then why arent they? Because Im looking at applied dps and ham sucks, but i dont want it to suck so if Im missing a peice of the puzzle that will turn them back into being good then Im all ears.

As I would prefer to loose 4x cheap Tengus instead of 1 expensive Tengu and I am not a hero in pvp so far I am looking for the 100MN AB fitting.

Wouldn't this work?

Is the utility you gain with two webs for fighting off tackle really worth the trade off in tanking ability?