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Shintoko Akahoshi
The Synenose Accord Celestial Imperative
388
|
Posted - 2013.08.28 16:08:00 -
[271] - Quote
Ava Starfire wrote:Aldrith Shutaq wrote:And yes, you too Ava. Funny, coming from a man who is fighting to place the whole cluster into a torturer's chains.
Are you saying he doesn't have a point, Starfire? Bio and writing
(Nothing I say is indicative of corporate policy unless otherwise stated) |

Fredfredbug4
Eve Defence Force Tribal Band
1146
|
Posted - 2013.08.28 17:15:00 -
[272] - Quote
Eran Mintor wrote:Fredfredbug4 wrote:Aldrith Shutaq wrote:Dear God, I hope the Empire conquers you all just so you lot will shut up. The Gallente and Caldari have proper intellectual debates, the Minmatar try to have proper intellectual debates (though regrettably get derailed by the Amarr), and the Amarr just throw temper tantrums hoping that someone takes them seriously. Hmm, this gives me an episode idea... Using "temper tantrums" to describe the Amarr is a statement much farther from the truth than you could make.
I fear that describing them in the manner they deserve to be described in would be too inflammatory for this setting, no matter how fitting. Watch Fred Fred Frederation and stop cryptozoologist! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it! |

Eran Mintor
Esoteric Philosophy
18
|
Posted - 2013.08.28 17:36:00 -
[273] - Quote
Fredfredbug4 wrote:Eran Mintor wrote:Fredfredbug4 wrote:Aldrith Shutaq wrote:Dear God, I hope the Empire conquers you all just so you lot will shut up. The Gallente and Caldari have proper intellectual debates, the Minmatar try to have proper intellectual debates (though regrettably get derailed by the Amarr), and the Amarr just throw temper tantrums hoping that someone takes them seriously. Hmm, this gives me an episode idea... Using "temper tantrums" to describe the Amarr is a statement much farther from the truth than you could make. I fear that describing them in the manner they deserve to be described in would be too inflammatory for this setting, no matter how fitting.
You may have an issue with how Amarr do business but there's no sense in making insults about how they act, especially when they're false, should you hope to debate or negotiate.
Or perhaps you're just another one of those tiresome pundits with no interest in talking but simply want to gain ratings and cheap points.
-Eran |

Fredfredbug4
Eve Defence Force Tribal Band
1146
|
Posted - 2013.08.28 17:58:00 -
[274] - Quote
Eran Mintor wrote:Fredfredbug4 wrote:Eran Mintor wrote:Fredfredbug4 wrote:Aldrith Shutaq wrote:Dear God, I hope the Empire conquers you all just so you lot will shut up. The Gallente and Caldari have proper intellectual debates, the Minmatar try to have proper intellectual debates (though regrettably get derailed by the Amarr), and the Amarr just throw temper tantrums hoping that someone takes them seriously. Hmm, this gives me an episode idea... Using "temper tantrums" to describe the Amarr is a statement much farther from the truth than you could make. I fear that describing them in the manner they deserve to be described in would be too inflammatory for this setting, no matter how fitting. You may have an issue with how Amarr do business but there's no sense in making insults about how they act, especially when they're false, should you hope to debate or negotiate. Or perhaps you're just another one of those tiresome pundits with no interest in talking but simply want to gain ratings and cheap points. -Eran
Ahem, I beg your pardon? No need to act tough when (I think) we are more or less on the same page. Watch Fred Fred Frederation and stop cryptozoologist! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it! |

Eran Mintor
Esoteric Philosophy
18
|
Posted - 2013.08.28 18:06:00 -
[275] - Quote
On the same page? What would you mean by that?
-Eran |

Aldrith Shutaq
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
409
|
Posted - 2013.08.28 18:07:00 -
[276] - Quote
You all do know I was making a sarcastic joke, right? Jeez, nobody can take a hint.
On another note, good to see you alive Eran! It has been quite a long time. I'd offer to get a drink with you but I am slightly preoccupied at the moment. Perhaps in a week or so? |

Anabella Rella
Gradient Electus Matari
926
|
Posted - 2013.08.28 18:13:00 -
[277] - Quote
Shintoko Akahoshi wrote: Are you saying he doesn't have a point, Starfire?
Not to speak for Ava but in my opinion he has no point. He's made a biased, self-serving, overly broad generalization and attempted to pass it off as fact. I have no idea who Shutaq knows or associates with but, the vast majority of the pilots that I'm personally acquainted with have quite strong morals and strive to behave in ways that benefit others beyond themselves.
Perhaps you should both broaden your circles of friends and/or re-evaluate your perceptions if you see the majority of people as evil. I may be sarcastic, pessimistic and jaded but, even I can still see the good that exists in most people, including capsuleers. I used to be disgusted, now I try to be amused. |

Eran Mintor
Esoteric Philosophy
18
|
Posted - 2013.08.28 18:26:00 -
[278] - Quote
Good to see you're alive as well Aldrith. The drink will have to wait a bit longer than that, I'm afraid.
And Rella, the point is that just because you make friends with someone doesn't mean they're a good person. His bit about the Empire was a joke but the part about Ethan, I believe, was not. He can be your friend or he can be your enemy, but pray you're not a crew member aboard a neutral ship should you ever cross his path. Capsuleers tend to overlook these details, and that was the point.
-Eran |

Anabella Rella
Gradient Electus Matari
928
|
Posted - 2013.08.28 18:32:00 -
[279] - Quote
Not all of us do, Mintor. That was my point.
I don't pal around with criminals or other immoral types nor call them friends. I used to be disgusted, now I try to be amused. |

Eran Mintor
Esoteric Philosophy
18
|
Posted - 2013.08.28 18:36:00 -
[280] - Quote
Ava Starfire wrote:TomHorn wrote:Quote:I consider them to be true friends, even if I don't really know where Verone's got to of late. You say Ethan Veron is a true friend Stitcher. What he is, is a viscious crimelord. Boss of the Veto crime syndicate, and a Gurista mercenary cell. I am staggered you would call Ethan Veron true friend. Ethan Veron is a kidnapper,extortionist,hijacker,drug smuggler,unlicensed arms trader,murderer, has brought untold pain and misery upon thousands of citizens throughout New Eden. An enemy of the Caldari State these things he is. Ethan Veron stands for everything you speak out against, corruption, murder, the pain and misery of citizens. If you say Ethan Veron is a true friend you are a hypocrite Stitcher. If you say Ethan veron is a true friend you are an enemy to all the nations of New Eden. Ethan Veron is a criminal who should be hunted down arrested brought before a court of law to be judged for his crimes. He is no friend of the law abiding citizens of New Eden. Verone was, is, and will always be, one of my closest friends. Oh, dear. I hope that doesn't ruin people's opinion of me...
So then next time don't speak for your comrade, Rella.
-Eran
|

Fredfredbug4
Eve Defence Force Tribal Band
1148
|
Posted - 2013.08.28 18:46:00 -
[281] - Quote
Eran Mintor wrote:On the same page? What would you mean by that?
-Eran
Never mind, I was mistaken, pity. Watch Fred Fred Frederation and stop cryptozoologist! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it! |

Eran Mintor
Esoteric Philosophy
18
|
Posted - 2013.08.28 21:03:00 -
[282] - Quote
It's telling, though very sad, that people make such grand assumptions merely based on race.
-Eran |

Gabriel Darkefyre
Gradient Electus Matari
119
|
Posted - 2013.08.28 22:04:00 -
[283] - Quote
Eran Mintor wrote:It's telling, though very sad, that people make such grand assumptions merely based on race.
-Eran
Such is the way of humanity. Usually the most extreme of behaviour is what stands out, so people form generalisations based off those extremes. Those generalisations lead to prejudice which tends to blind people to the good as they focus on the bad. |

Pieter Tuulinen
Pyre Falcon Defence Cadre XV-01A Pyre Falcon Defence Combine
1567
|
Posted - 2013.08.28 22:31:00 -
[284] - Quote
Gabriel Darkefyre wrote:Eran Mintor wrote:It's telling, though very sad, that people make such grand assumptions merely based on race.
-Eran Such is the way of humanity. Usually the most extreme of behaviour is what stands out, so people form generalisations based off those extremes. Those generalisations lead to prejudice which tends to blind people to the good as they focus on the bad.
Getting surprised by the good in your enemies is never a serious problem. I remember one of my first meetings with Kyllsa Siikanen was her bringing me some of the best soup I've ever tasted when I was in hospital.
Getting surprised by the bad in your enemies, however... |

Fredfredbug4
Eve Defence Force Tribal Band
1150
|
Posted - 2013.08.29 01:07:00 -
[285] - Quote
Eran Mintor wrote:It's telling, though very sad, that people make such grand assumptions merely based on race.
-Eran
I can assure you it has nothing to do with race, I merely misunderstood what you were saying. Stop race baiting, it only makes you look like a fool. Only people who are insecure about their ethnic background would resort to such a thing.
When you said:
Eran Mintor wrote: Using "temper tantrums" to describe the Amarr is a statement much farther from the truth than you could make.
I personally interpreted it as "you didn't describe the Amarr bad enough" rather than "you didn't describe them in a good way". This fault is purely mine and I acknowledged it. As much as you would like to think, race has nothing to do with it.
It's quite ironic actually. You're calling me out on making assumptions, when the only one making assumptions here is you. Watch Fred Fred Frederation and stop cryptozoologist! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it! |

Kyllsa Siikanen
Gradient Electus Matari
12
|
Posted - 2013.08.29 02:20:00 -
[286] - Quote
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:Gabriel Darkefyre wrote:Eran Mintor wrote:It's telling, though very sad, that people make such grand assumptions merely based on race.
-Eran Such is the way of humanity. Usually the most extreme of behaviour is what stands out, so people form generalisations based off those extremes. Those generalisations lead to prejudice which tends to blind people to the good as they focus on the bad. Getting surprised by the good in your enemies is never a serious problem. I remember one of my first meetings with Kyllsa Siikanen was her bringing me some of the best soup I've ever tasted when I was in hospital. Getting surprised by the bad in your enemies, however...
Anytime, Pieter. People should share soup more.
I cannot help thinking we'd be better off for it. GÇ£Crying is all right in its own way while it lasts. But you have to stop sooner or later, and then you still have to decide what to do.GÇ¥-á
GÇò C.S. Lewis-á |

Pieter Tuulinen
Pyre Falcon Defence Cadre XV-01A Pyre Falcon Defence Combine
1571
|
Posted - 2013.08.29 18:01:00 -
[287] - Quote
Kyllsa Siikanen wrote:Pieter Tuulinen wrote:Gabriel Darkefyre wrote:Eran Mintor wrote:It's telling, though very sad, that people make such grand assumptions merely based on race.
-Eran Such is the way of humanity. Usually the most extreme of behaviour is what stands out, so people form generalisations based off those extremes. Those generalisations lead to prejudice which tends to blind people to the good as they focus on the bad. Getting surprised by the good in your enemies is never a serious problem. I remember one of my first meetings with Kyllsa Siikanen was her bringing me some of the best soup I've ever tasted when I was in hospital. Getting surprised by the bad in your enemies, however... Anytime, Pieter. People should share soup more. I cannot help thinking we'd be better off for it.
You're right - and I actually do have a soup recipe to share now.... I've been remiss.... |

Evi Polevhia
True Slave Foundations Shaktipat Revelators
296
|
Posted - 2013.08.29 18:26:00 -
[288] - Quote
Soup and fraternization with the enemy. And they say I derail threads.
|

Anslo
The Scope Gallente Federation
2688
|
Posted - 2013.08.29 20:17:00 -
[289] - Quote
Suuuure i try to keep you from lighting a cigar up and resting fully, so i don't get an honorable mention?? Damn Tuulinen, that hurts!
|

Repentence Tyrathlion
Tyrathlion Interstellar
413
|
Posted - 2013.08.29 21:13:00 -
[290] - Quote
Evi Polevhia wrote:Soup and fraternization with the enemy. And they say I derail threads.
You know, even if you weren't a toaster, you'd make no friends with that attitude. |

Evi Polevhia
True Slave Foundations Shaktipat Revelators
296
|
Posted - 2013.08.29 21:45:00 -
[291] - Quote
Repentence Tyrathlion wrote:Evi Polevhia wrote:Soup and fraternization with the enemy. And they say I derail threads.
You know, even if you weren't a toaster, you'd make no friends with that attitude.
Your concern is touching. |

Anabella Rella
Gradient Electus Matari
933
|
Posted - 2013.08.30 04:26:00 -
[292] - Quote
I suppose you missed the part where I plainly stated that I wasn't speaking for Ava, Pilot Mintor? Or, where I said that I (a personal pronoun denoting myself, Anabella Rella) didn't associate with criminals?
Although it should go without saying, apparently some need the standard IGS disclaimer; opinions expressed in my posts are mine solely. I don't speak officially for any other individual or organization.
I used to be disgusted, now I try to be amused. |

Eran Mintor
Esoteric Philosophy
21
|
Posted - 2013.08.30 05:23:00 -
[293] - Quote
Fredfredbug4 wrote:...I can assure you it has nothing to do with race, I merely misunderstood what you were saying. Stop race baiting, it only makes you look like a fool. Only people who are insecure about their ethnic background would resort to such a thing or those wishing to take the moral high ground in a conversation. Unfortunately for you, I won't allow any of that. When you said: Eran Mintor wrote: Using "temper tantrums" to describe the Amarr is a statement much farther from the truth than you could make.
I personally interpreted it as "you didn't describe the Amarr bad enough" rather than "you didn't describe them in a good way". This fault is purely mine and I acknowledged it. As much as you would like to think, race has nothing to do with it. It's quite ironic actually. You're calling me out on making assumptions, when the only one making assumptions here is you.
Actually pilot, you are making assumptions. You've made several so far; one is that you assumed that I was stating "you didn't describe the Amarr bad enough", and two, that we are on the same page.
I wonder if you would've said the same things had I looked like a Ni-Kunni or Khanid? I would wager, if I was a gambling man, that the answer to that is a definitive "no."
Secondly, I have neither insecurity about my ethnic background, nor am I trying to take any kind of moral high-ground. I am quite proud of my ethnicity, and morals...well, I do my best to stick to mine but it often puts them at odds with each other. This prevents me from taking much of any "high-ground", and I'm quite aware of that.
Thirdly, if I may, the point I was trying to make wasn't that "you didn't describe them in a good way", which is another assumption you make, but rather that you were being purposefully inaccurate with how you describe Amarrians. I neither meant to say Amarr are good nor bad, but that painting someone as a child is not something befitting anyone who intends to have a real discussion with any human-being.
Now Rella, darling, I learned how to read as a boy on Eram.
I saw what you spoke and understand you didn't intend to speak for Miss Starfire, however you indirectly were when you said Aldrith had no point, in your opinion. He, in fact, had quite a good point, though you stated it had no merit because you didn't agree with it, and you don't associate with criminals. I won't take your word on that; I merely have to think about Colelie, where many crimes were committed, to know better, but I digress...
The mere point I'm trying to make is that, while you don't speak for Miss Starfire, you did in the sense when you said Aldrith was completely wrong in his statement. You may not have liked his generalization, but when you said that he was wrong, your words did involve the accusations he made towards Pilot Starfire.
-Eran |

Fredfredbug4
Eve Defence Force
1152
|
Posted - 2013.08.30 10:38:00 -
[294] - Quote
Eran Mintor wrote:
Actually pilot, you are making assumptions. You've made several so far; one is that you assumed that I was stating "you didn't describe the Amarr bad enough", and two, that we are on the same page.
I wonder if you would've said the same things had I looked like a Ni-Kunni or Khanid? I would wager, if I was a gambling man, that the answer to that is a definitive "no."
Secondly, I have neither insecurity about my ethnic background, nor am I trying to take any kind of moral high-ground. I am quite proud of my ethnicity, and morals...well, I do my best to stick to mine but it often puts them at odds with each other. This prevents me from taking much of any "high-ground", and I'm quite aware of that.
Thirdly, if I may, the point I was trying to make wasn't that "you didn't describe them in a good way", which is another assumption you make, but rather that you were being purposefully inaccurate with how you describe Amarrians. I neither meant to say Amarr are good nor bad, but that painting someone as a child is not something befitting anyone who intends to have a real discussion with any human-being.
-Eran
They were not assumptions good sir. As this is the first time I believe we've talked, I was unsure of your views and misinterpreted them. You can feel free to think otherwise, but I'm afraid your claims have no support behind them.
If you aren't insecure or trying to make yourself appear morally sound, then why do you feel the need to use the horribly cliche and outright silly "It's because I'm Minmatar" defense? It's as illogical as me claiming you are stereotyping me as a racist, because other Gallenteans are racist. Do you see how rediculous it sounds? Get a grip.
There is a difference between misunderstanding someone and making assumptions. I'm not sure why that concept is so difficult to grasp for you. Again, believe what you want, but the burden of proof lies on you. And yes, that is a challenge for you to find solid evidence that I'm making assumptions based on race. I doubt you can though, considering you just felt like throwing random accusations at me with no facts or logic behind them because you are a race baiter.
Finally, if an Amarrian can regularly look down on the rest of the cluster with a false sense of superiority I think someone should be able to paint them as a child once in a while. Watch Fred Fred Frederation and stop cryptozoologist! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it! |

Kyllsa Siikanen
Gradient Electus Matari
17
|
Posted - 2013.08.30 11:09:00 -
[295] - Quote
Evi Polevhia wrote:Soup and fraternization with the enemy. And they say I derail threads.
I do not believe I have said anything of the sort, nor claimed that I did not engage in such behaviour myself! GÇ£Crying is all right in its own way while it lasts. But you have to stop sooner or later, and then you still have to decide what to do.GÇ¥-á
GÇò C.S. Lewis-á |

Repentence Tyrathlion
Tyrathlion Interstellar
416
|
Posted - 2013.08.30 11:25:00 -
[296] - Quote
Fredfredbug4 wrote: Finally, if an Amarrian can regularly look down on the rest of the cluster with a false sense of superiority I think someone should be able to paint them as a child once in a while.
Superiority based upon a feeling that one's culture is the best, and that everyone else should follow it...
Pot, kettle. |

Pieter Tuulinen
Pyre Falcon Defence Cadre XV-01A Pyre Falcon Defence Combine
1573
|
Posted - 2013.08.30 12:19:00 -
[297] - Quote
Evi Polevhia wrote:Soup and fraternization with the enemy. And they say I derail threads.
Fraternization? I really didn't have the energy - I was recovering from injuries! |

Anja Suorsa
Pyre Falcon Defence Cadre XV-01A Pyre Falcon Defence Combine
191
|
Posted - 2013.08.30 13:03:00 -
[298] - Quote
Injured again?
You're just a serial skiver.
I'm on to you, Tuulinen! |

Fredfredbug4
Eve Defence Force
1153
|
Posted - 2013.08.30 13:58:00 -
[299] - Quote
Repentence Tyrathlion wrote:Fredfredbug4 wrote: Finally, if an Amarrian can regularly look down on the rest of the cluster with a false sense of superiority I think someone should be able to paint them as a child once in a while.
Superiority based upon a feeling that one's culture is the best, and that everyone else should follow it... Pot, kettle.
The kettle being genocidal, slaver, zealots and the pot helping other civilizations to the stars and treating member states equally.
Sure, we have similar desires, but our differing methodologies make it pointless to try and draw any parallels. Watch Fred Fred Frederation and stop cryptozoologist! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it! |

Repentence Tyrathlion
Tyrathlion Interstellar
416
|
Posted - 2013.08.30 14:21:00 -
[300] - Quote
Fredfredbug4 wrote:Repentence Tyrathlion wrote:Fredfredbug4 wrote: Finally, if an Amarrian can regularly look down on the rest of the cluster with a false sense of superiority I think someone should be able to paint them as a child once in a while.
Superiority based upon a feeling that one's culture is the best, and that everyone else should follow it... Pot, kettle. The kettle being genocidal, slaver, zealots and the pot helping other civilizations to the stars and treating member states equally. Sure, we have similar desires, but our differing methodologies make it pointless to try and draw any parallels.
The parallel is that the Federation and Empire both firmly believe that they're entirely correct, and are dreadful at listening to any other points of view. You yourself have demonstrated this more than once recently. I actually liked the Federation until you and that Bete idiot came in and started spouting off. Guess my memories of the place when I lived there are a little rose-tinted. |
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