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DigitalCommunist
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Posted - 2005.12.31 19:22:00 -
[31]
Its a good idea, but incredibly easy to circumvent even if you somehow managed to be affected severely by this. Utterly pointless with the way tech 1 drops from npcs like candy and the way 1-run bpcs flood the market.
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Josarian Lysandor
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Posted - 2005.12.31 19:26:00 -
[32]
 Originally by: Maya Rkell
Originally by: Khatred
Block or allow market purchases linked to standings. Eve is a PvP game so IMO this should be a feature. After all, some don't want to sell to their enemies (or intruders).
Escrow.
Is there a way to set escrows to be available to everyone but Maya Rkell?
~Victory is the weakness of the enemy.
I began as ActiveX, I am no longer. I became Sobeseki Pawi, I will be no longer. |
Kraven Kor
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Posted - 2005.12.31 19:26:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Galaxion
It could give too much power for people to unbalance the market. Example, you annoy NAGA and they set you to -10 (however unliekly in reality this would be). They could employ this method and, then, you are cut off from a large supply of tech 2 and ships.
It might breed a situation where the large production corps can basically say to everyone "make us happy or else" and I think that would be bad in the long run.
Yeah, because you wouldn't want anyone's bad reputation to catch up with them ;)
(This is a jab in good fun not a reflection of even my own true opinion)
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Maya Rkell
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Posted - 2005.12.31 19:36:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Josarian Lysandor
Originally by: Maya Rkell
Originally by: Khatred
Block or allow market purchases linked to standings. Eve is a PvP game so IMO this should be a feature. After all, some don't want to sell to their enemies (or intruders).
Escrow.
Is there a way to set escrows to be available to everyone but Maya Rkell?
Snort.
The mechanism is there, and it works. Or you can use a conq station / outpost, restrict the sell orders to that station and disallow docking from everyone not +10. Or you can kill everyone eho enters the system who's not in your alliance.
Or you can whine, moan and lash out at people who post soloutions. Guess you picked #2.
Warning: above post may contain traces of sarcasm.
"Corpse cannot be fitted onto ship. Only hardware modules can be fitted." |
Maya Rkell
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Posted - 2005.12.31 19:38:00 -
[35]
Originally by: DigitalCommunist
Its a good idea, but incredibly easy to circumvent even if you somehow managed to be affected severely by this. Utterly pointless with the way tech 1 drops from npcs like candy and the way 1-run bpcs flood the market.
Relevance?
Just because there might be a supply - which you cannot count on getting any single component and takes time - from NPC's or that you might have BPC's which you need to haul mienrals and build on-site, also taking time, this DOES NOT affect the logistics of selling bulk, for your alliance. Especially im 0.0.
Warning: above post may contain traces of sarcasm.
"Corpse cannot be fitted onto ship. Only hardware modules can be fitted." |
Danton Marcellus
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Posted - 2005.12.31 20:10:00 -
[36]
Just 'cause there's ways around it doesn't mean it shouldn't be put in.
As with numerable alt suggestions let the standings of the most developed character on the account affect the rest in terms of market access.
Remind me about The Maze.
I'm Danton Marcellus and I approve of this message. |
Maya Rkell
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Posted - 2005.12.31 20:15:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Danton Marcellus
Just 'cause there's ways around it doesn't mean it shouldn't be put in.
As with numerable alt suggestions let the standings of the most developed character on the account affect the rest in terms of market access.
Sigh. No.
The "most developed character" is an idea which would simply play into the hands of people willing to pay for multiple accounts. Or, bluntly, those willing to abuse trial accounts to get round that - which is what I woild end up doing.
Hopefully, the promised "black market" and improved contacts system which will supass and extend escrow will also make this far less of an issue. The market is just that - a market, and should remain open to all.
Warning: above post may contain traces of sarcasm.
"Corpse cannot be fitted onto ship. Only hardware modules can be fitted." |
MWEI
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Posted - 2005.12.31 20:21:00 -
[38]
I dont understand why would a producer restrict their customers? you only make money if people buys your stuff, if you a)prevent alts from buying stuff by setting starter corps to -10 and b)**** off everyone and set them to -10, where do their customers come from?
Merchants want to INCREASE their chance of selling something, not to put up walls to prevent everyone from buying their stuff.
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Clytamnestra
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Posted - 2005.12.31 20:24:00 -
[39]
Originally by: MWEI
I dont understand why would a producer restrict their customers? you only make money if people buys your stuff, if you a)prevent alts from buying stuff by setting starter corps to -10 and b)**** off everyone and set them to -10, where do their customers come from?
Merchants want to INCREASE their chance of selling something, not to put up walls to prevent everyone from buying their stuff.
It's called embargos and it's a powerful political tool.
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Maya Rkell
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Posted - 2005.12.31 20:26:00 -
[40]
It's more for alliance logistics, yes
Warning: above post may contain traces of sarcasm.
"Corpse cannot be fitted onto ship. Only hardware modules can be fitted." |
Danton Marcellus
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Posted - 2005.12.31 20:27:00 -
[41]
Why should the market remain open to all? Not much else is.
Also about wanting to sell to everyone, as mentioned, embargo, look it up and see how freely the US trades with Cuba to name one longstanding such embargo.
Remind me about The Maze.
I'm Danton Marcellus and I approve of this message. |
phillip duncan
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Posted - 2005.12.31 20:40:00 -
[42]
If there was profit in breaching an embargo people would act as middle men. Buy from corp X and transfer the goods to Corp Y for a "small Comission". Of cause corp X would have to start wondering were Corp Y was getting there supplies from. It happens in the Real world (shudder) and is call gray imports/ arms smuggling etc. 
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Maya Rkell
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Posted - 2005.12.31 20:46:00 -
[43]
Edited by: Maya Rkell on 31/12/2005 20:46:42
Originally by: Danton Marcellus
Why should the market remain open to all? Not much else is.
Also about wanting to sell to everyone, as mentioned, embargo, look it up and see how freely the US trades with Cuba to name one longstanding such embargo.
Exactly. Not much else is, and that's why it's important.
And yes, and HOW is that embargo maintained? Yes, anyone trying to breach it is stopped. NOT by a mysterious mechanism which stops you from buying Cuban goods.
Warning: above post may contain traces of sarcasm.
"Corpse cannot be fitted onto ship. Only hardware modules can be fitted." |
Guntaro
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Posted - 2005.12.31 20:51:00 -
[44]
It is an absolutely stupid and retarded idea which has passed through my own mind before in the past and then passed right out.
It is JUST A GAME GODDAMMIT and it doesn't need anymore griefing added from real life elements!
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Josarian Lysandor
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Posted - 2005.12.31 21:12:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Maya Rkell
Originally by: Josarian Lysandor
Originally by: Maya Rkell
Originally by: Khatred
Block or allow market purchases linked to standings. Eve is a PvP game so IMO this should be a feature. After all, some don't want to sell to their enemies (or intruders).
Escrow.
Is there a way to set escrows to be available to everyone but Maya Rkell?
Snort.
The mechanism is there, and it works. Or you can use a conq station / outpost, restrict the sell orders to that station and disallow docking from everyone not +10. Or you can kill everyone eho enters the system who's not in your alliance.
Or you can whine, moan and lash out at people who post soloutions. Guess you picked #2.
You didn't post a solution...
As for the rest of your pratpost...lol.
~Victory is the weakness of the enemy.
I began as ActiveX, I am no longer. I became Sobeseki Pawi, I will be no longer. |
Torquemanda Corteaz
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Posted - 2005.12.31 21:15:00 -
[46]
most tech 2 mass producers don't put THAT much stock on the markets anyway
but it is a nice idea
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Shadar Ishaan
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Posted - 2005.12.31 21:25:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Titen
This new option would change that to "Get all of item X in region/system/station Y; Loop through all results and get the pilot and corp standings toward the buyer; Display all items where buyer standings >= to those secondary results"
No. You would have to presumably (and I know nothing about the Eve Table Structure) join a few tables but there would be no need to "loop" through a result set. SQL Server is completely capable of handling this type of query. They'd just have to add a few more indexes.
Presumably.
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Ouzo
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Posted - 2005.12.31 21:30:00 -
[48]
Wont happen. Eats sever CPU cycles.
Oh, how I'd love a filter for market and escow not showing offers from certain indivisuals, or even whole corps ...
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Lorth
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Posted - 2005.12.31 21:35:00 -
[49]
Its actually a great idea, however as mentioned before, there are to many easy ways around it.
However, should it be implemented, it would do wonders for people in 0.0. Esp those who live in areas with NPC stations. Many alliences have the rule, no selling on the open market. Though it does end up hurting the producers in the region as they can't effectivly sell some of thier orders. However being able to set sell order standings, or restrict to allience/corp only would be great.
Heck I even know of one corp that produces mods and ships for thier corp members at a signifiantly reduced rate. The problem is, if they are put on the market at such a rate, they are bought simply because they are by far the lowest priced of thier kind. So the only solution is to have them in a hanger, and wait untill a high ranking member can sell them to the general population.
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Joshua Izblind
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Posted - 2005.12.31 21:37:00 -
[50]
So if no one likes my Ore-thieving ...i wont be able to buy anything? 
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Zaldiri
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Posted - 2005.12.31 21:39:00 -
[51]
Acctualy I thinks its a good idea, it could be circumnavigated but most alts are either in the same corp as the main or in a newbie corp, if you set the newbie corp to -0.1 (thus rendering them unnable to buy your stuff) you would cut out most of the alts. I known there are a few vets in newbie corps and unfortunatly they could be badly affected, however most people in newbie corps dont realy need rare gear.
BTW this would only apply to rare item since if you block people from your basic item orders they will just get from somone else just as easily.
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Admiral of King Frieza's Super Saiyan fleet.
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Clytamnestra
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Posted - 2005.12.31 21:41:00 -
[52]
Originally by: Maya Rkell
Edited by: Maya Rkell on 31/12/2005 20:46:42
Originally by: Danton Marcellus
Why should the market remain open to all? Not much else is.
Also about wanting to sell to everyone, as mentioned, embargo, look it up and see how freely the US trades with Cuba to name one longstanding such embargo.
Exactly. Not much else is, and that's why it's important.
And yes, and HOW is that embargo maintained? Yes, anyone trying to breach it is stopped. NOT by a mysterious mechanism which stops you from buying Cuban goods.
This is true, of course, that in real life we have policing authorities which, by force, enfore the embargo.
However, in EVE it's quite possible for a person to buy whatever he wants, and quite impossible for a person not to sell to whom he wants - that's why there's room for a game mechanic for it.
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Treborc
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Posted - 2005.12.31 21:47:00 -
[53]
Another part that should be added along with the standing is max buy quantites.
I don't want somebody using my forsale items as a means of cornering the market by reducing the visible supply of an item in an area therefore allowing them to crank the price up.
Treborc
CEO
Hellhound Industries.
HQ Hilaban System
Tash-Murkon Region
Miners, Refiners, Traders and Builders to the masses. |
Clytamnestra
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Posted - 2005.12.31 22:40:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Treborc
Another part that should be added along with the standing is max buy quantites.
I don't want somebody using my forsale items as a means of cornering the market by reducing the visible supply of an item in an area therefore allowing them to crank the price up.
On the other hand, that is a legitimate tactic, and a common one in the real world counterpart economy.
However, it all gets skewed out of perspective because some people have such vast wealth .
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Maya Rkell
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Posted - 2005.12.31 22:54:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Clytamnestra
Originally by: Maya Rkell
Edited by: Maya Rkell on 31/12/2005 20:46:42
Originally by: Danton Marcellus
Why should the market remain open to all? Not much else is.
Also about wanting to sell to everyone, as mentioned, embargo, look it up and see how freely the US trades with Cuba to name one longstanding such embargo.
Exactly. Not much else is, and that's why it's important.
And yes, and HOW is that embargo maintained? Yes, anyone trying to breach it is stopped. NOT by a mysterious mechanism which stops you from buying Cuban goods.
This is true, of course, that in real life we have policing authorities which, by force, enfore the embargo.
However, in EVE it's quite possible for a person to buy whatever he wants, and quite impossible for a person not to sell to whom he wants - that's why there's room for a game mechanic for it.
Rubbish. 0.0 alliances (and that is what this is ALL about) claim they close space - MAKE them, if they wish to use the market.
Warning: above post may contain traces of sarcasm.
"Corpse cannot be fitted onto ship. Only hardware modules can be fitted." |
kebab v2
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Posted - 2005.12.31 23:01:00 -
[56]
awsome idea, i do belive the last war i was in the "opposing force" bought out alot of the good market stuff in the region and then started re-selling at gouged prices.
imo this idea is a no-brainer for alliances.
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Rod Blaine
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Posted - 2006.01.01 00:15:00 -
[57]
Edited by: Rod Blaine on 01/01/2006 00:17:07
The idea has been floated before, alot, not to mention it being one of my pet peeves with Eve at this time.
However, there are many many many etc etc practical difficulties with it.
It more or less requires a solution for alt abuse to be imnplemented at the same time.
Tech1 npc drops don't worry me much in this regard tbh, since even if you could choose to rely purely on those when severely unpopular with producers, it means you need to put in lots more effort. That's a consequence too.
I think that standings could at least allow a working system that supports a degree of market pvp while not needing a full solution to alt issues as well. What I think might do it you can read in my sig linky.
The 'easy' way to introduce market pvp is to have abilities to differentiate markets for producers, or to set price according to standings, and to have mechanics to support default higher standings to groups that align along the same lines. Again, see my blog for some ideas. It might be old by now, but as far as I can see it'd still work.
_______________________________________________
Power to the players !
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Merenghi
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Posted - 2006.01.01 01:08:00 -
[58]
Yes, please implement this so I can resell all your goods and steal your profit.
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Maya Rkell
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Posted - 2006.01.01 01:27:00 -
[59]
You mean alt usage, period, Rod Blaine.
Because that'd be the net effect of any change large enough to matter, and it would then only hit the casual players, not those with multiple accounts.
If alliances want to restrict sales, they should use other mechanisms. They have quite a few at present, and they will get more with Kali.
Warning: above post may contain traces of sarcasm.
"Corpse cannot be fitted onto ship. Only hardware modules can be fitted." |
DigitalCommunist
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Posted - 2006.01.01 01:39:00 -
[60]
Why oh why does Maya Rkell reply to anything I say, no matter how factual, uncontrovertial or nonsensical it may be?
Reply to this:
Milk milk, lemonade.. round the corner, chocolates made.
UH OH.
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