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Rifter: Soloing... er.. how?

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mighty yarr	Posted - 2006.01.29 08:46:00 - [31] omg ive just realised how much of a waste of time reading your post was. i read it and i thought hey this dood knows some stuff im gonna keep an eye on this then i clicked the killboard link and realised that indeed you are not an experienced killer... i read the cruiser kills , all of which are from trading and mining corps who cant fit a combat ship and never fought back against anyone. NOTHING TO SEE HERE ... MOVE ALONG
Malka Badi'a	Posted - 2006.01.29 09:05:00 - [32] Originally by: mighty yarr omg ive just realised how much of a waste of time reading your post was. i read it and i thought hey this dood knows some stuff im gonna keep an eye on this then i clicked the killboard link and realised that indeed you are not an experienced killer... i read the cruiser kills , all of which are from trading and mining corps who cant fit a combat ship and never fought back against anyone. NOTHING TO SEE HERE ... MOVE ALONG Alts ftl. --------------
Balklanac	Posted - 2006.01.29 09:11:00 - [33] Malka if you are ever in Syndicate I have plenty of rifters on the market at a very reasonable price, with all available equipment for my setup as stated before.
R31D	Posted - 2006.01.29 10:42:00 - [34] As it was said in a different post, you need to change the way you think and pilot your ship. Minmatar and Amarr are like chalk and cheese, they play completely differently. The greatest asset a Rifter pilot has for pirating is being able to choose damage types to counter the type of NPCs the target will be tanking but this is only an issue for a Punisher if you decide to attack near Blood/Sansha space. Minmatar and long-lasting tanks don't go - you just nmeed to kill your opponent before he chews through all of your hp. Free bumpage for all
Famine Aligher'ri	Posted - 2006.01.29 10:46:00 - [35] Originally by: Sentinel Roqeze Originally by: theRaptor Please stop talking rubbish. The reason most Amarr ships don't get a damage bonus is because lasers have better base stats then other weapons. You normally need 4 levels of ship bonuses for other guns to match the DPS of lasers. Yes, it's true that lasers provide a better DPS. However, it's also true that lasers are restricted to the two racial damage types, take more grid and CPU to fit, and require cap to fire. Anything that saves cap and grid is going to help you tank, and for me the Punisher is more a tank frig than a damage dealer. We each have our own individual techniques, styles and ideas - I don't pretend that my own viewpoint is "the right way"... I'm simply pointing out the alternatives. But it doesn't suck either way. Lasers or no lasers it's a great ship for piracy as well the rifter.
Vanecrox	Posted - 2006.01.29 12:29:00 - [36] It all depends on what you like to fly and what you're using it for. Personally I don't like the rifter, although many corp-mates swear their undying love for the ship. The rifter has a lot less cap than the punisher, so nos is a must if you're going at it solo. It is a fast ship and works good as a tackler in groups, but as you know it doesn't stand up to much firepower. As far as T2 frigs, I don't even think there's a question there. AF/Inty always work great as pirate ships. The problem with using T2's is that most people don't have the balls to lose one. Put somebody in a T1 and they'll do anything you say.
Shaemell Buttleson	Posted - 2006.01.29 13:26:00 - [37] Originally by: Vanecrox It all depends on what you like to fly and what you're using it for. Personally I don't like the rifter, although many corp-mates swear their undying love for the ship. The rifter has a lot less cap than the punisher, so nos is a must if you're going at it solo. It is a fast ship and works good as a tackler in groups, but as you know it doesn't stand up to much firepower. As far as T2 frigs, I don't even think there's a question there. AF/Inty always work great as pirate ships. The problem with using T2's is that most people don't have the balls to lose one. Put somebody in a T1 and they'll do anything you say. I disagree that a NOS is a must. I can see how it can be usefull but there are plenty of people who never use them on Minmatar ships who are all good pilots. Personally I use rockets as well as autocannons and prefer the better firepower option. I fit small repairers, webbers and disruptors as well and never seem to run out of cap. Sure I couldn't run a rep continuously but if I needed to I think a change of tactics would be needed. In fact allthough the slot layout is different I think the Rifter is the closest minmatar T1 frig to a Claw that can web and scramble and fit a MWD or AB. In short the Rifter rocks. The only T1 ships I think are the real problem for it 1 v 1 are the ships like kessies that can in theory stay out of it's range and spew loads of missiles at it.
Atom HeartMother	Posted - 2006.01.29 17:55:00 - [38] well nornmaly i use 3 250 auto's and emp ammo 2 scrams 1 20km ( for the start and the pod) a 7.5 km 1 weber 2 100mm plates (0r is it 200mm (the one that use 10pg)) 1 a small armor rep (isnane armor here) use tactics and some dashing hoff looks and it cant go wrong
Suhadi	Posted - 2006.01.29 19:40:00 - [39] Didn't read all this thread but here's a slightly different idea: Hi: 3x 150mm AC 1x Rocket Med: 1x 1mn AB 1x Scrambler 1x Med Extender Lo: 2x PDU 1x Shield Relay A risky setup, but on the plus side you will know very quickly if you can tank your target or not. Only drones I've ever had a problem with were tech 2, heavy missiles are not usually a problem. Nicest thing about the setup is when you encounter someone who nos's you expecting your tank to die. Actually, that's probably the main strength of this setup; it's unexpected. -------------------------------------------------- - Suhadi
Malka Badi'a	Posted - 2006.01.29 20:05:00 - [40] Originally by: Suhadi Didn't read all this thread but here's a slightly different idea: Hi: 3x 150mm AC 1x Rocket Med: 1x 1mn AB 1x Scrambler 1x Med Extender Lo: 2x PDU 1x Shield Relay A risky setup, but on the plus side you will know very quickly if you can tank your target or not. Only drones I've ever had a problem with were tech 2, heavy missiles are not usually a problem. Nicest thing about the setup is when you encounter someone who nos's you expecting your tank to die. Actually, that's probably the main strength of this setup; it's unexpected. Now THAT sounds interesting, and something that people would flame regardless of how well it works. Relying completely on passive shield regeneration. You mentioned heavy missiles, are you talking about just one or two at a time, or could I engage a caracal and have time between for passive shield regeneration? --------------

Tecam Hund	Posted - 2006.01.29 20:55:00 - [41] IMO rifter will never be able to tank. Small armour repairer just doesn't repair fast enough if your resistances are low, and you can't afford to shield tank on a pirate ship. Your only hope is close in very fast, lock and start firing before that person realizes whats going on. Tracking disruptor and damage mods might do the trick. Drones however are going to chew you up in no time. What people say about t1 frigates not being able to take on combat setup cruisers is true. Medium NOS, light drones, light missiles, web will ruin your day. Autocannons and missile launchers are the only weapons that can operate without power, so Rifter gets a bonus to operating at 0 cap, but it can't take damage.
Tecam Hund	Posted - 2006.01.29 21:01:00 - [42] Originally by: Suhadi Didn't read all this thread but here's a slightly different idea: Hi: 3x 150mm AC 1x Rocket Med: 1x 1mn AB 1x Scrambler 1x Med Extender Lo: 2x PDU 1x Shield Relay A risky setup, but on the plus side you will know very quickly if you can tank your target or not. Only drones I've ever had a problem with were tech 2, heavy missiles are not usually a problem. Nicest thing about the setup is when you encounter someone who nos's you expecting your tank to die. Actually, that's probably the main strength of this setup; it's unexpected. This one is wicked, though can you deal enough damage without the damage mods? The setup is good, but will probably fail for solo pilot who is hunting larger targets.
Skoodwask	Posted - 2006.01.29 22:13:00 - [43] Originally by: Atom HeartMother well nornmaly i use 3 250 auto's and emp ammo 2 scrams 1 20km ( for the start and the pod) a 7.5 km 1 weber 2 100mm plates (0r is it 200mm (the one that use 10pg)) 1 a small armor rep (isnane armor here) use tactics and some dashing hoff looks and it cant go wrong I agree with 1 2 scramblers but not the web. Is there really reason for a web if your targets a cruiser and you have small turrets? You will have no problem tracking it i would think. Instead of the webber us 1mn mwd or if you cant fit it use a ab. will give you some added speed incase they have ab as well, most cruisers wont have mwd. If you can fit the mwd in lows i would suggest 2 cap relays and a nanofiber so you can keep it all going. I've never used Rifter before but seams like it would work.
Malka Badi'a	Posted - 2006.01.29 22:16:00 - [44] Quote: Is there really reason for a web if your targets a cruiser and you have small turrets? You will have no problem tracking it i would think. Drone defence and MWD cruisers. Tactical versatility. Then again, it can't tank drones anyway. --------------
Suhadi	Posted - 2006.01.30 10:14:00 - [45] Originally by: Malka Badi'a You mentioned heavy missiles, are you talking about just one or two at a time, or could I engage a caracal and have time between for passive shield regeneration? Five heavies can prove too much for the tank, depending on the target's skills. My shield skills are still pretty weak though. Quote: The setup is good, but will probably fail for solo pilot who is hunting larger targets. I've killed BCs with this setup, but as usual when hunting with frigates it's more to do with picking targets and timing your attack than anything else. -------------------------------------------------- - Suhadi
Nival	Posted - 2006.01.30 10:14:00 - [46] Edited by: Nival on 30/01/2006 10:14:18 I have a setup that I am experimenting with and find quite interesting so far. It takes advantage of added midslot from RMR, which I chose to use not for tackling, but as an utility slot. Fitted a tracking disruptor in it instead of warp scrambler. From my experience, surprisingly many people take for granted that they are scrambled in fight and dont even try to warp off. And those that want to warp usually do despite scrambler due to WCS. Anyway, this setup is quite effective versus turret ships of course, but doesnt fair as well against missile boats. I experimented with one ECM multispec, but it is extremely hard to fit and uses too much cap. Maybe with better skills... Hi: 3x 200mm autocannon, rocket launcher Med: 1MN MWD, web, tracking disruptor Lo: small armor repairer, CPU coproc, nanofib/CPR/gyrostab
Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.30 11:13:00 - [47] Minmatar ships are rubbish apart from the vagabond.Now sniping is no more the tempest has no real purpose either - it always was a very poor tanker anyway - just like ur finding with the rifter.Try an assault frig wolf maybe - some claim they are invunerable now
Suladriel	Posted - 2006.01.30 12:14:00 - [48] Originally by: Malka Badi'a Originally by: Skoodwask Frigs don't work for real piracy, unless there tech 2. Right. Tell you what, I'll let you keep that opinion and I'll just continue with my killmails. Thanks for that clarification. I can see me hopping back into the punisher so I can reengage battlecruisers and similar. Well said. Don't give up on the Rifter too quickly, I use it a lot more now than I use a Punisher. 3*150mm ACs, named NOS named 1MN AB, scram, web Named small armour rep, 200 plate(I think, I'm at work atm), and either damage mod, resistance plate or cap relay. I'll contact you in game later today (half day 4tw! \o/) eep. Sig nerfed until Podbase gets fixed. I'm not famous, nor infamous.
Shaemell Buttleson	Posted - 2006.01.30 12:29:00 - [49] Originally by: Ginger Magician Minmatar ships are rubbish apart from the vagabond.Now sniping is no more the tempest has no real purpose either - it always was a very poor tanker anyway - just like ur finding with the rifter.Try an assault frig wolf maybe - some claim they are invunerable now How can you say this? With the T2 Tremor ammo i'd have thought sniping would be even more viable in that you can be over 200km from the gate so therefore safer. Plus the other type which admitedly I haven't used but I have heard it is possible to get wrecking hits aproaching the old damage that was possible before the RMR patch anf the stacking penalties.
Electric Cucumber	Posted - 2006.01.30 12:34:00 - [50] Edited by: Electric Cucumber on 30/01/2006 12:34:07 Originally by: Ginger Magician Minmatar ships are rubbish apart from the vagabond.Now sniping is no more the tempest has no real purpose either - it always was a very poor tanker anyway - just like ur finding with the rifter.Try an assault frig wolf maybe - some claim they are invunerable now Ignore this post. Thanks

Corvus Dove	Posted - 2006.02.01 01:18:00 - [51] Don't try to tank in a Minmatar frig. And don't use artillery, it's wasted CPU and powergrid. Get halfway decent gunnery skills and use 150 or 200mm autocannons. I use Depleted Uranium because it has OK range and does 3 damage types, but any ammo is fine. Drones aren't much an issue because a Minmatar frigate can shred them. I suggest strapping on a 100mm or 200mm plate so you have decent armor (I use tech2 plates) and tear the drones apart. Minmatar frigs are fast and heavies miss them like none other. Use rockets, not missiles. With skills, they're more DPS and since you're at autocannon range already, they're great for taking down shields with Gremlins. You can take on pretty much anything if it isn't ready for you in a Rifter. Here's a good setup: Highslots: 2x Rocket Launchers, 2x 200mm Autocannons Midslots: Scram, Web, MWD Lowslots: 100mm or 200mm plates, Overdrive Injector 1 (multiple if no plates). The speed boosting from the O.I. 1's make you quick and hard to hit. Don't use the MWD once your in range, it makes you an easier kill, but use it to get nice and close fast. The key with this kit is to tear the target apart before it can react or even know you were there: blitz attacks make targets hesitate and panic. That leads to another lesson: if you're in a ship that isn't able to tank, you're in a ship that isn't able to ransom. Just kill them if in a Rifter. ------------------------------------ Join Channel MacroIntel!
upsideup	Posted - 2006.02.01 01:23:00 - [52] Originally by: Ginger Magician Minmatar ships are rubbish apart from the vagabond.Now sniping is no more the tempest has no real purpose either - it always was a very poor tanker anyway - just like ur finding with the rifter.Try an assault frig wolf maybe - some claim they are invunerable now wtb clue The key to piracy in a rifter is going to be speed. If you can operate outside 10km with an mwd and artils, you should be good. You'll need a cap battery to keep your cap going. DPS will be terrible but you'll have great survivability, pop any drones they send at you, and then you can probably turn your mwd off. Autocannons are an option too, but you'll die a ton. I wouldn't even use a tank tbh.
Tobiaz	Posted - 2006.02.01 01:24:00 - [53] Originally by: Ginger Magician Minmatar ships are rubbish apart from the vagabond.Now sniping is no more the tempest has no real purpose either - it always was a very poor tanker anyway - just like ur finding with the rifter.Try an assault frig wolf maybe - some claim they are invunerable now Another post from Ginger Magician that just oozes intelligence Back in business!
Scoundrelus	Posted - 2006.02.01 04:43:00 - [54] Heres was my punisher setup if you want to take anything from it. Hi ======= 3x Dual Pulse Laser II 1x Small 'Knave' Nosferatu Medium ======= 1x Afterburner 1x 7.5km Warp Scrambler Low ====== Pre-RMR 1x Heat Sink II 1x Overdrive Injector 1x Explosive Hardener 1x Kinetic Hardener (Hardeners can change depending on what im hunting) Post-RMR 1x Heat Sink II 1x Overdrive Injector 1x Hardener of your choice depending on your frigate skills 1x 200mm Tungsten Plate I havent tried the post-RMR setup to be honest but it should work fine. My pre-RMR setup killed everything it came across. Even a prophecy.
velocoraptor	Posted - 2006.02.01 04:52:00 - [55] Originally by: upsideup Originally by: Ginger Magician Minmatar ships are rubbish apart from the vagabond.Now sniping is no more the tempest has no real purpose either - it always was a very poor tanker anyway - just like ur finding with the rifter.Try an assault frig wolf maybe - some claim they are invunerable now wtb clue The key to piracy in a rifter is going to be speed. If you can operate outside 10km with an mwd and artils, you should be good. You'll need a cap battery to keep your cap going. DPS will be terrible but you'll have great survivability, pop any drones they send at you, and then you can probably turn your mwd off. Autocannons are an option too, but you'll die a ton. I wouldn't even use a tank tbh. Now, that's good. No really it is. You see I got totally nood gunnery skills and only fairly good drone skills. Still I have killed many T1 and also T2 (jaguars seem to be the best victim) frigs in my small rails, 5xmed drones, 2xmed nos, webing thorax. Everytime they let me come close they die.Quickly. However I really would like to see what would happen against a good pilot who would orbit me at speed outside web/nos range. Only frig I'm afraid now and I guess that's why the pre-RMR RAX owned, cause u could have 2 or more sets of drones (so use small against that setup). But tbh, I don't thik that rifter would have been able to break my tank and if I was clever enough to NOT get my drones out and have them killed, well, then it would be a draw(?) Also, I think that with mwd and good piloting skills (which I don't have ) I could wait for him to close the mwd and then align and approach just fast enough to web and nos. Then, he's dead. Anyway, i'm not really a pvpier but i would like to have a more experienced point of view on the probable outcome of that interesting 1v1 Sorry for my long post
Famine Aligher'ri	Posted - 2006.02.01 06:09:00 - [56] MWD with arties is very bad mmk?
Suhadi	Posted - 2006.02.01 09:50:00 - [57] Originally by: velocoraptor Now, that's good. No really it is. You see I got totally nood gunnery skills and only fairly good drone skills. Still I have killed many T1 and also T2 (jaguars seem to be the best victim) frigs in my small rails, 5xmed drones, 2xmed nos, webing thorax. Everytime they let me come close they die.Quickly. However I really would like to see what would happen against a good pilot who would orbit me at speed outside web/nos range. Only frig I'm afraid now and I guess that's why the pre-RMR RAX owned, cause u could have 2 or more sets of drones (so use small against that setup). But tbh, I don't thik that rifter would have been able to break my tank and if I was clever enough to NOT get my drones out and have them killed, well, then it would be a draw(?) Also, I think that with mwd and good piloting skills (which I don't have ) I could wait for him to close the mwd and then align and approach just fast enough to web and nos. Then, he's dead. Anyway, i'm not really a pvpier but i would like to have a more experienced point of view on the probable outcome of that interesting 1v1 Sorry for my long post You're right, an arty Rifter would be dead if you webbed and nos'd it. Probably any Rifter setup would be dead, perhaps even including the one I posted above which doesn't use hardly any cap. However, this thread is about piracy in a Rifter, not PvP in general. Your primary targets are going to be NPCing cruisers (and miners, natch). In my experience not that many people bother to fit webbers to their cruisers for NPCing in lowsec, and even fewer fit nos. Practically no-one I've encountered fits a scrambler while NPCing, so even if you get caught out with a web/nos, you are free to leave any time you want. And if you do get caught by someone with web, nos and scrambler.. they were setup for PvP and probably waiting to be attacked anyway. Bad luck. -------------------------------------------------- - Suhadi
vanania	Posted - 2006.02.01 14:32:00 - [58] I use the Rifter soley on it's speed. Dicth the rockets for a nos and you can run a shield booster forever. Speed is key here so always keep the AB running at all times. With Evasive Manuvering 4 i can stop on a dime and turn 180 easily and warp almost instantly. I don't have many killmails admitantly but I have 45mil isk from ransoms instead. On another note, the Rifter is the perfect terrorst weapon when fighting huge corps or an alliance, warp into their mining ops and pop cans then warp before they can do anything
pertinent zero	Posted - 2006.02.01 14:32:00 - [59] I use the Rifter soley on it's speed. Dicth the rockets for a nos and you can run a shield booster forever. Speed is key here so always keep the AB running at all times. With Evasive Manuvering 4 i can stop on a dime and turn 180 easily and warp almost instantly. I don't have many killmails admitantly but I have 45mil isk from ransoms instead. On another note, the Rifter is the perfect terrorst weapon when fighting huge corps or an alliance, warp into their mining ops and pop cans then warp before they can do anything
vanania	Posted - 2006.02.01 18:37:00 - [60] Edited by: vanania on 01/02/2006 18:37:10 FFS!



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