Pages: 1 2 3 :: [one page] |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Grendel Sickswitch
61
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:19:00 -
[1] - Quote
EVE players like to tell people how "complex" and "deep" the game is, and when you start it certainly seems that way, but after a few weeks it becomes apparent that the game is no more complex than most and in fact, less so than many.
In EVE there are 5 things you can do;
PVP missions gathering (mining, salvaging, exploration) manufacture trade
In addition there are a few hundred skills that enable you to be a tiny bit better at one of the 5 activities.
This all happens in a few hundred areas that are all essentially the same.
and that's EVE.
|
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
17183
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:27:00 -
[2] - Quote
Eh, if you're going for reductionism, why not just boil it down to two things:
GÇó Play. GÇó Not play.
It's about as useful a breakdown. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Na Und
Galactronics
80
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:27:00 -
[3] - Quote
I subscribe, log on once in a while, and maybe make a post on the forums when the whining gets too fierce.
Play the game? Don't have time for it . . . although I rat the belts in my home system when I have 20 minutes to spare. Love those metal scraps, yay. |
Johnny Marzetti
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
935
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:30:00 -
[4] - Quote
It's all about posting. I hate space. |
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
6764
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:30:00 -
[5] - Quote
Please sir, regale us with stories of your homeland called WoW and how deep and complex the Pandaverse has become.
Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings? |
Grendel Sickswitch
61
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:34:00 -
[6] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Eh, if you're going for reductionism, why not just boil it down to two things:
GÇó Play. GÇó Not play.
It's about as useful a breakdown.
because playing eve is not about not playing eve.
|
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
17183
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:36:00 -
[7] - Quote
Grendel Sickswitch wrote:Tippia wrote:Eh, if you're going for reductionism, why not just boil it down to two things:
GÇó Play. GÇó Not play.
It's about as useful a breakdown. because playing eve is not about not playing eve. Of course it is. There are tons of stuff to do in EVE that entail not playing the game. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Grendel Sickswitch
61
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:36:00 -
[8] - Quote
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:Please sir, regale us with stories of your homeland called WoW and how deep and complex the Pandaverse has become.
WoW? is that like dwarf fortress? |
Jim Era
7621
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:36:00 -
[9] - Quote
I too play this game known as "EVE ONLINE"
|
stoicfaux
3303
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:38:00 -
[10] - Quote
Johnny Marzetti wrote:It's all about posting. I hate space. This ^^. Seriously, 100M skill points and I spend more time shiptoasting than flying. =/
edit: to be fair, it's: job and family and (sleep or eve-o). |
|
Grendel Sickswitch
61
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:38:00 -
[11] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Grendel Sickswitch wrote:Tippia wrote:Eh, if you're going for reductionism, why not just boil it down to two things:
GÇó Play. GÇó Not play.
It's about as useful a breakdown. because playing eve is not about not playing eve. Of course it is. There are tons of stuff to do in EVE that entail not playing the game.
if you're making a beef stroganoff while you mine or mission you are not playing EVE my dear. |
Abdiel Kavash
Paladin Order Fidelas Constans
1599
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:39:00 -
[12] - Quote
Confirming that EVE is both broken and down. |
Aiwha
Infinite Point Nulli Secunda
592
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:40:00 -
[13] - Quote
All life is breathing, eating, shitting, and *******. That's it. What a ripoff. We're winning the war if it says so on CAOD! -á
|
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
17183
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:42:00 -
[14] - Quote
Grendel Sickswitch wrote:if you're making a beef stroganoff while you mine or mission you are not playing EVE my dear. Actually, you are, but that's besides the point.
The point is that if you're going to skip a huge swath of activities in EVE and/or clump others together in incoherent and arbitrary clusters, you might as well do it properly and just boil it down to playing and not playing. That way, you can make any ridiculous claim and have it seem rather reasonable and compelling compared to the original assertion. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Black Dranzer
355
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:43:00 -
[15] - Quote
WoW combat is far more elaborate and sophisticated than Eve combat.
Go on, just try to deny it. Walking in Stations as a Social Hub: Business vs Pleasure in Incarna |
To Be Me
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
23
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:46:00 -
[16] - Quote
People say that eve is complicated because the majority of people that play eve is dumb.
And I dont mean it in an offensive manner, but its true. |
Grendel Sickswitch
61
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:48:00 -
[17] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Grendel Sickswitch wrote:if you're making a beef stroganoff while you mine or mission you are not playing EVE my dear. Actually, you are, but that's besides the point. The point is that if you're going to skip a huge swath of activities in EVE and/or clump others together in incoherent and arbitrary clusters, you might as well do it properly and just boil it down to playing and not playing. That way, you can make any ridiculous claim and have it seem rather reasonable and compelling compared to the original assertion.
calm down |
Sura Sadiva
Entropic Tactical Crew
675
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:49:00 -
[18] - Quote
Grendel Sickswitch wrote: EVE players like to tell people how "complex" and "deep" the game is, and when you start it certainly seems that way, but after a few weeks it becomes apparent that the game is no more complex than most and in fact, less so than many.
You can play EVE daily for years and you still see there's a lot to study or to learn. In any other game after 1 month you cap your level, in EVE after 1 year you're still a noob. And you never cap anyway.
One can like or dislike this, but it's so.
|
Captain Tardbar
Sons of Sam
575
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:50:00 -
[19] - Quote
Don't forget the forum warrioring. I mean Tippia doesn't actually log into EVE the game proper and play. Just the forums. Only reason they have an account. "Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
17187
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:51:00 -
[20] - Quote
Grendel Sickswitch wrote:calm down Huh?
I'm giving you pointers on how to structure your red herrings for best effect and you want me to calm down? That doesn't even make senseGǪ
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
|
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium
4213
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:54:00 -
[21] - Quote
Black Dranzer wrote:WoW combat is far more elaborate and sophisticated than Eve combat.
Go on, just try to deny it.
I would have believed you back in the days when hunters needed to be at range to use their ranged attacks.
The major difference between the two is the timescale involved. WoW combat starts, and you make decisions that effect the outcome, then the outcome is resolved. In EVE you make decisions that effect the outcome, then combat starts, then the outcome is resolved.
In WoW you have more buttons to press, so the visual display can become more elaborate. There are combination moves which make combat more sophisticated.
In EVE there are a multitude of weapon types and environmental modifiers available to make the battle more elaborate (have I told you how much I appreciate the visual flair of a cruise missile raven). There are innumerable combinations of offenses and counters available which make combat more sophisticated.
Now certainly to the thirty-second attention span it may seem that EVE combat is boring, but I only consider that viewpoint valid if your interpretation of combat being the activity that takes place after the first shot is fired made sense. Combat in EVE starts the moment you undock. Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players |
Grendel Sickswitch
61
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:56:00 -
[22] - Quote
Sura Sadiva wrote:Grendel Sickswitch wrote: EVE players like to tell people how "complex" and "deep" the game is, and when you start it certainly seems that way, but after a few weeks it becomes apparent that the game is no more complex than most and in fact, less so than many.
You can play EVE daily for years and you still see there's a lot to study or to learn. In any other game after 1 month you cap your level, in EVE after 1 year you're still a noob. And you never cap anyway. One can like or dislike this, but it's so.
true. it would literally take you decades to learn everything. |
Grendel Sickswitch
61
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:58:00 -
[23] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Grendel Sickswitch wrote:calm down Huh? I'm giving you pointers on how to structure your red herrings for best effect and you want me to calm down? That doesn't even make senseGǪ
you're getting excited. and you're confused. |
Evi Polevhia
True Slave Foundations Shaktipat Revelators
353
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 01:00:00 -
[24] - Quote
OP, you forgot RP/Live Events |
Lipbite
Express Hauler
1131
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 01:00:00 -
[25] - Quote
Most complex part of EVE isn't hardcoded: it's social interactions within bigger corporations / alliances.
And you forgot at least two activity options:
Courier contracts
Incursions <= this one is the most fun group PvE activity among MMO games. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
17188
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 01:00:00 -
[26] - Quote
Grendel Sickswitch wrote:you're getting excited. and you're confused. No and no, in roughly that order. I'm just pointing out that if you're going to go for reductionism, reduce it all the way.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Galen Darksmith
Sky Fighters
60
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 01:05:00 -
[27] - Quote
Black Dranzer wrote:WoW combat is far more elaborate and sophisticated than Eve combat.
Go on, just try to deny it.
Yes, hitting the same 4-5 keys in rotation every few seconds with a few reaction based ones is totally more sophisticated than having to keep track of distance and traversal of all your adversaries to minimize their DPS on you while maxing DPS on the target. "EVE is a dark and harsh world, you're supposed to feel a bit worried and slightly angry when you log in, you're not supposed to feel like you're logging in to a happy, happy, fluffy, fluffy lala land filled with fun and adventures, that's what hello kitty online is for." -CCP Wrangler |
Grendel Sickswitch
61
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 01:05:00 -
[28] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Grendel Sickswitch wrote:you're getting excited. and you're confused. No and no, in roughly that order. I'm just pointing out that if you're going to go for reductionism, reduce it all the way.
but your reduction is nonsense.
|
Grendel Sickswitch
62
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 01:06:00 -
[29] - Quote
Lipbite wrote:Most complex part of EVE isn't hardcoded: it's social interactions within bigger corporations / alliances.
And you forgot at least two activity options:
Courier contracts
Incursions <= this one is the most fun group PvE activity among MMO games.
1. trading
2. missions |
Captain Tardbar
Sons of Sam
575
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 01:07:00 -
[30] - Quote
Well the combat itself in EVE is pretty simple and boring. Its the strategic layer that makes EVE interesting with the combinations of setups and actions you can do. "Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
|
Galen Darksmith
Sky Fighters
60
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 01:08:00 -
[31] - Quote
Grendel Sickswitch wrote:Tippia wrote:Grendel Sickswitch wrote:you're getting excited. and you're confused. No and no, in roughly that order. I'm just pointing out that if you're going to go for reductionism, reduce it all the way. but your reduction is nonsense.
It is, because it's based on yours. She just did it better. "EVE is a dark and harsh world, you're supposed to feel a bit worried and slightly angry when you log in, you're not supposed to feel like you're logging in to a happy, happy, fluffy, fluffy lala land filled with fun and adventures, that's what hello kitty online is for." -CCP Wrangler |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
17192
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 01:08:00 -
[32] - Quote
Grendel Sickswitch wrote:but your reduction is nonsense. Not really. It's actually more encompassing than yours.
So you can either start adding in the pieces you missed, which would defeat the point, or just keep reducing. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Captain Tardbar
Sons of Sam
575
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 01:17:00 -
[33] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Grendel Sickswitch wrote:but your reduction is nonsense. Not really. It's actually more encompassing than yours. So you can either start adding in the pieces you missed, which would defeat the point, or just keep reducing.
I don't know what you are going on about, but I'm sure personal bias keeps you from seeing both sides of the argument.
Also, if I didn't know any better I think you're are being trolled and you can't help but reply because it goes against every fiber of your being. "Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
Johnny Marzetti
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
937
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 01:34:00 -
[34] - Quote
Captain Tardbar wrote:Tippia wrote:Grendel Sickswitch wrote:but your reduction is nonsense. Not really. It's actually more encompassing than yours. So you can either start adding in the pieces you missed, which would defeat the point, or just keep reducing. I don't know what you are going on about, but I'm sure personal bias keeps you from seeing both sides of the argument. Also, if I didn't know any better I think you're are being trolled and you can't help but reply because it goes against every fiber of your being.
Who is more troll, the troll or the troll who trolls the troll?
Besides, Tippia is the calmest poster on this forum. If you're not reading all Tippia posts in a slightly amused but detached and maybe a tiny bit bored voice, you're not reading them right. |
Remiel Pollard
Shockwave Innovations Surely You're Joking
1875
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 01:50:00 -
[35] - Quote
Grendel Sickswitch wrote:Tippia wrote:Grendel Sickswitch wrote:you're getting excited. and you're confused. No and no, in roughly that order. I'm just pointing out that if you're going to go for reductionism, reduce it all the way. but your reduction is nonsense.
So was yours. You don't scare me. I've been to Jita. |
Captain Tardbar
Sons of Sam
575
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 01:54:00 -
[36] - Quote
Johnny Marzetti wrote:Captain Tardbar wrote:Tippia wrote:Grendel Sickswitch wrote:but your reduction is nonsense. Not really. It's actually more encompassing than yours. So you can either start adding in the pieces you missed, which would defeat the point, or just keep reducing. I don't know what you are going on about, but I'm sure personal bias keeps you from seeing both sides of the argument. Also, if I didn't know any better I think you're are being trolled and you can't help but reply because it goes against every fiber of your being. Who is more troll, the troll or the troll who trolls the troll? Besides, Tippia is the calmest poster on this forum. If you're not reading all Tippia posts in a slightly amused but detached and maybe a tiny bit bored voice, you're not reading them right.
I always read Tippia as an angry nerd mad about something. I mean I know I post a good deal, but Tippia will respond over and over again if you put forth the effort to get her to post. Tippia comes across as someone who has been educated and has a large vocabulary, but I think there is something not right which I can't put my finger on. Like there is an agenda of some sort which we aren't privy too. Something like Tippia's range of opinions are each their own agenda. I'm not sure if I'm phrasing this right.
Anways, I think Tippia ignores me now because she knows better. Its not that hard to make a 40 page threadnaught with Tippia involved. "Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
Remiel Pollard
Shockwave Innovations Surely You're Joking
1875
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 01:59:00 -
[37] - Quote
Grendel Sickswitch wrote:EVE players like to tell people how "complex" and "deep" the game is, and when you start it certainly seems that way, but after a few weeks it becomes apparent that the game is no more complex than most and in fact, less so than many. In EVE there are 5 things you can do; PVP missions gathering (mining, salvaging, exploration) manufacture trade In addition there are a few hundred skills that enable you to be a tiny bit better at one of the 5 activities. This all happens in a few hundred areas that are all essentially the same. and that's EVE.
First of all, there are way more things you can do than just these five things. This is a terrible breakdown, and even a rudimentary explorer could tell you a few things you've missed out.
Secondly, you add PVP as if it's just another little 'thing to do', but you fail to realise that every other thing to do in this game includes PVP to some degree or another. The moment you undock, you consent to PVP, which means that when you're on a mission, if someone scans down your mission site while you're salvaging in you Noctis and decides to gank you, you've just experienced PVP while missioning. Mining is also PVP. There are only so many resources to go around, even if they do refresh on a daily basis, how many times have you tried finding a rock to drill in a solar system only to discover all the belts are empty? Well, that's because other players got their first. That, therefore, is direct competition for resources between players, making it PVP. And trade? Trade's got PVP written all over it since the market is predominantly player driven.
Tippia's breakdown (while still ridiculous and, I do believe, made to demonstrate the ridiculousness of trying to over-simplify EVE to begin with) was still much more sensible than yours because it actually covers two realities in EVE. There are players that play the game, there are players that don't. You don't scare me. I've been to Jita. |
Remiel Pollard
Shockwave Innovations Surely You're Joking
1875
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 02:02:00 -
[38] - Quote
Captain Tardbar wrote:Johnny Marzetti wrote:Captain Tardbar wrote:Tippia wrote:Grendel Sickswitch wrote:but your reduction is nonsense. Not really. It's actually more encompassing than yours. So you can either start adding in the pieces you missed, which would defeat the point, or just keep reducing. I don't know what you are going on about, but I'm sure personal bias keeps you from seeing both sides of the argument. Also, if I didn't know any better I think you're are being trolled and you can't help but reply because it goes against every fiber of your being. Who is more troll, the troll or the troll who trolls the troll? Besides, Tippia is the calmest poster on this forum. If you're not reading all Tippia posts in a slightly amused but detached and maybe a tiny bit bored voice, you're not reading them right. I always read Tippia as an angry nerd mad about something.
She generally only posts if your thread meets at least two of three criteria: first, she obviously needs to notice the thread; second, it needs to be a hot topic; third, it needs to be either very attractive and well thought out content, or so incredibly dumb that it warrants thinly-veiled ridicule with the appearance of constructive criticism.
Can you figure out which of those criteria this thread meets? You don't scare me. I've been to Jita. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
17196
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 02:11:00 -
[39] - Quote
Captain Tardbar wrote:Tippia comes across as someone who has been educated and has a large vocabulary, but I think there is something not right which I can't put my finger on. Like there is an agenda of some sort which we aren't privy too. Something like Tippia's range of opinions are each their own agenda. I'm not sure if I'm phrasing this right. Oh, my agenda is hilariously simple.
1. Keep EVE challenging without resorting to fake difficulty. 2. Present a proper argument.
I'll grant you that the combination can be pretty nasty sometimes because even when people have what might be good ideas at the core, those ideas may be presented in such an appalling way that I just can't force myself to support it. Doing the right thing for the wrong reason is still doing it wrong.
Quote:Anways, I think Tippia ignores me now because she knows better. You'd think so, wouldn't you?
Oh, and as for reading people's posts in a particular voice, can I pick Achie Cunningham, please? GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium
4214
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 02:22:00 -
[40] - Quote
Tippia wrote:So you can either start adding in the pieces you missed, which would defeat the point, or just keep reducing.
The utility of reductionism is in the point a reduction is intended to illustrate.
In engineering disciplines of all kinds there are attempts to reduce a truly complex problem to the level that is necessary for comprehension by a target audience. For example, "we are building a bridge across the Huangpu river," is how you might describe the construction of the second largest steel arch bridge in the world to someone at a party. To an engineering firm you are interested in contracting for the job, you might go into more detail such as pointing out that the foundation for the bridge needs to cater for the structure being build on a sediment-rich flood plain, the distance to be crossed being in the order of five hundred metres, and the required minimum clearance being 45m. There are very few people in the world who need to know every detail such as the number of welds, the type of weld employed at each weld point, the composition of each girder and cable, the precise mixture of concrete used, how many panels of what type of glass were required for the observation areas, and so forth.
So I dispute your suggestion that the solution to the OP's absurd reductionism is to add in the pieces missed or to reduce further. At what point do you stop adding in details?
If one examines St Mio's famous "Things to do in EVE Online" graphic, it is immediately obvious that there are three levels of reduction present in the one diagram: these reductions are represented as the hierarchy (solo, group, PvE, PvP etc), the nodes, and then the links to further discussion about each node.
It is thus not the level of reduction that is to be challenged, merely the composition of the reduction. This composition needs to accommodate the intended audience. The failure in the OP is to clearly state the intended audience, which led to an invalid reduction of EVE Online. Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players |
|
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
17197
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 02:26:00 -
[41] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:So I dispute your suggestion that the solution to the OP's absurd reductionism is to add in the pieces missed or to reduce further. At what point do you stop adding in details? WeeellGǪ my suggestion is really that he add the pieces missed and reduce further (since adding the missing pieces and reducing less wouldn't serve his purpose of calling EVE simplistic).
As it is right now, he's mixing and matching and presenting a wholly incomplete and incorrect picture either way . GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium
4214
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 02:34:00 -
[42] - Quote
Grendel Sickswitch wrote:In EVE there are 5 things you can do;
PVP missions gathering (mining, salvaging, exploration) manufacture trade
I am curious as to why "PvP" was presented as one element, while Industry was broken into three pieces, and all PvE content apart from missions was omitted.
Who is the intended audience? In the OP it is hinted that the intended audience might be people who don't play EVE. So here is now I would reduce EVE to the classic elevator spiel in as few dot points as possible:
EVE is a competitive multiplayer virtual world where you define your own goals and determine you own destiny, with the main activities being:
- PvP space combat
- PvE space combat
- Industry
- Trade & Business
- Media & Propaganda
- Government & Politics
See, at least I am trying to be constructive rather than being Doctor Nope. Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players |
ravill rivyll
Perkone Caldari State
12
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 02:35:00 -
[43] - Quote
OP is faggt... this game is sandbox you dumbsht first you should know what it is before you play it. Go feed yourself on some other retrded mmo that suits your style.. haha tell us what else you wanna do ingame instead of pvp,pve, trading and socialize... you wanna get preagnant or what. Its like you would say you can only drink eat sleep fck and enjoy IRL its not complex enough I got nothing to live for.. |
Captain Tardbar
Sons of Sam
575
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 02:40:00 -
[44] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Captain Tardbar wrote:Tippia comes across as someone who has been educated and has a large vocabulary, but I think there is something not right which I can't put my finger on. Like there is an agenda of some sort which we aren't privy too. Something like Tippia's range of opinions are each their own agenda. I'm not sure if I'm phrasing this right. Oh, my agenda is hilariously simple. 1. Keep EVE challenging without resorting to fake difficulty. 2. Present a proper argument. I'll grant you that the combination can be pretty nasty sometimes because even when people have what might be good ideas at the core, those ideas may be presented in such an appalling way that I just can't force myself to support it. Doing the right thing for the wrong reason is still doing it wrong. Quote:Anways, I think Tippia ignores me now because she knows better. You'd think so, wouldn't you? Oh, and as for reading people's posts in a particular voice, can I pick Achie Cunningham, please?
I think your greatest flaw is that once you pick a side of an argument you cannot see the oposing viewpoints validity even if its an emotional and/or illogical one.
If you acknowledge the opponents view as understandable fom their perspective, then you realize that arguing serves no purpose other than to increase post count.
I mean I understand that you think your opinions are always right and you are very wordy and thoughtful about your positions, but the lack of compromise and Rogerian argument really only results in making a very long thread.
That said, I find it highly doubtful this thread will last that long. No one has mentioned null sec incomes or safety of highsec.
Anyways, the point of whether or not this reductionism of EVE is valid or not is a moot point, either reducing EVE to simple subset of actions or making an extreme range of infinite actions does not change that EVE is a software program that lets you play internet spaceships and it will do what it does regardless of what people says it can or cannot do.
In that regard, philosophical debate on this matter will not change EVE in any fashion so both sides of this argument are wasting their time. "Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
Johnny Marzetti
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
940
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 02:42:00 -
[45] - Quote
Grendel Sickswitch wrote:Tippia wrote:Grendel Sickswitch wrote:calm down Huh? I'm giving you pointers on how to structure your red herrings for best effect and you want me to calm down? That doesn't even make senseGǪ you're getting excited. and you're confused.
ravill rivyll wrote:OP is faggt... this game is sandbox you dumbsht first you should know what it is before you play it. Go feed yourself on some other retrded mmo that suits your style.. haha tell us what else you wanna do ingame instead of pvp,pve, trading and socialize... you wanna get preagnant or what. Its like you would say you can only drink eat sleep fck and enjoy IRL its not complex enough I got nothing to live for..
Totally not empty quoting any of this. |
Xen Solarus
Inner 5phere
596
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 03:05:00 -
[46] - Quote
You forgot:
- Scam
- Steal
- Gank
- Troll
- Corporation Management
- Alliance Management
- Setting up gambling sites for [REDACTED]
And lets not forget the allmighty ship spinning! Post with your main, like a BOSS! |
KnowUsByTheDead
Volition.
355
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 03:11:00 -
[47] - Quote
Grendel Sickswitch wrote:
*snip*
In EVE there are 5 things you can do;
PVP missions gathering (mining, salvaging, exploration) manufacture trade
Now, if the OP could please go back and divide each of those categories. You know what? I have time, I will do it for you.
PvP -subcapital fleet pvp roaming -subcapital solo pvp roaming -Capital pvp (usually in fleets, but station games are known to happen. -High-sec pvp (we won't sub-categorize this....because there is a lot. Wardec's, duels, ganks...you get the picture.) -FW pvp, usually contained within complexes that promote the use of small and cheap ships. -SOV warfare pvp (again, won't subcategorize, as then we would have to add BLOPS, structure bashing, etc.)
Missions -Level 1's - 4's High Sec -Level 1's - 4's Low Sec -Level 5's Low Sec -Level 1's - 4's Pirate Faction NPC Null -Fleet Missions, i.e. incursions, which was completely ignored, btw. -FW Plexing -Anomalies -In fact, let's just go ahead and file this under PvP, because you literally only have an "illusion of safety" while doing these things.
Gathering -Mining -Moon Extraction -Boosting/Compressing -Refining -Explo -Salvaging -PI -This, too, gets filed under PvP, due to the "illusion of safety" rule.
Manufacture -T1 manufacturing -T2 manufacturing -T3 manufacturing -Capital manufacturing -Again...PvP...screw it, you know the rules now.
Trade -Station trading -Margin trading -Character trading -Scamming -Oh, yea, and you have to compete against other players...PvP
Not to mention things that can be used across all disciplines... -Trucking -General Boosting -Fleet Commanding -Spying -Corp Management -Umm........PvP.
So next time you want to boil the game down to the bottom of the pan, metaphorically speaking, you might as well just say "PvP" and be done with it. And I just listed off the things in K-space, so now superimpose all of it to the wild-west of WH space, and add like 10 dashes of PvP.
Just PvP.
Only PvP.
Even right now, I am not even logged into the game, and I am PvPing.
So yea..
PvP.
Once you realize what a joke everything is, being the comedian is the only thing that makes sense. |
Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
553
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 05:03:00 -
[48] - Quote
KnowUsByTheDead wrote:Even right now, I am not even logged into the game, and I am PvPing.
So yea.. That's pretty much the main problem of the game. A lot of interesting things you can do in it doesn't even require you to log in. So the question: is it really CCP's EVE that is fun, or the one in our heads? I think it was OP's point all along. |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium
4215
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 06:01:00 -
[49] - Quote
This all CCP's EVE Online. This is why they say, "EVE is real." EVE is still going when you stop believing in it: when you have switched off the computer the game still plays you. Who will you encounter tomorrow? What will happen to foil your plans for the weekend? Will the other players at the coming EVE meet like you or will you still be a pariah despite your epic 99% KDR?
A significant portion of the game is politics, and the politics in EVE are far greater in extent than the guild-busting loot drama politics of World of Warcraft for example. Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players |
Treo 'Ssard
Hangar 55
34
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 06:15:00 -
[50] - Quote
ravill rivyll wrote:OP is faggt... this game is sandbox you dumbsht first you should know what it is before you play it. Go feed yourself on some other retrded mmo that suits your style.. haha tell us what else you wanna do ingame instead of pvp,pve, trading and socialize... you wanna get preagnant or what. Its like you would say you can only drink eat sleep fck and enjoy IRL its not complex enough I got nothing to live for..
What is this I don't even. |
|
KnowUsByTheDead
Volition.
355
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 06:39:00 -
[51] - Quote
Barrogh Habalu wrote: That's pretty much the main problem of the game. A lot of interesting things you can do in it doesn't even require you to log in. So the question: is it really CCP's EVE that is fun, or the one in our heads? I think it was OP's point all along.
I get what you are saying, and normally, I would be the first one to jump on the troll wagon, with some snarky, smug response.
However...I will debate this point to you, because Ironically, I was very near an EvE burnout period, and it is important that people do not give up on this game (complex or simple...fun or not fun...whatever), for several obvious reasons (CCP complacency, more people = more interaction, etc.), and several smaller reasons (for instance...It has, despite the tendency to troll, a very solid and helpful community, who work hard for it to run smoothly and like a well-oiled machine...i.e. Chribba and his various tools we use consistently.)
The OP's point was that the game lacks complexity, and can be boiled down to 5 activities, as seen here...
Grendel Sickswitch wrote:
PVP missions gathering (mining, salvaging, exploration) manufacture trade
He then goes on to say that the illusional "complexity" is based on several hundred skills that only serve to make one of the above 5 activities "better." As seen here...
Grendel Sickswitch wrote:
In addition there are a few hundred skills that enable you to be a tiny bit better at one of the 5 activities.
At which point, Tippia, in her usual logical fashion retorts with a comment with a little bit of smug...
Tippia wrote:
Eh, if you're going for reductionism, why not just boil it down to two things:
GÇó Play. GÇó Not play.
It's about as useful a breakdown.
Now notice the things I have highlighted in Tippia's post. All three pertain to the same thing...boiling "EvE" as a concept, game, whatever into 5 categories, and claiming a lack of complexity.
At which point, I stumble upon the thread, and I further Tippia's smug reductionism to even further smug reductionism, with my post above, while simultaneously showing the OP exactly how complex EvE as a game, really is. Not that I needed to, because Tippia had already posted the "What to do in EvE" roadmap, but more because I choose to "Forum PvP" from time to time...as it can generate a wealth of tears, lol.
So it isn't an issue of "what is in our heads," but rather, an issue of fact versus fiction. And claiming a lack of complexity in EvE is wrong and a statement based in fiction.
Now, that being said, instead of showing you the flaw in your statement, I will give you my actual feelings on the subject. In order for me to properly explain, let's divide EvE into 4 things...The Game, The Tools, The Meta, and The Concept.
First, the game. The "game" itself is not complex. Because the reality is, intrinsically, a sandbox at it's "core" is not complex. It is four walls and sand. EvE can be boiled down to the OP, Tippia's opening statement, as well as my first post. All simultaneously. However, like any sandbox, you need tools...
The Tools are complex. Some examples...
-Manufacturing. I cannot wrap my head around it, I know a lot who cannot wrap their head around it, and I am sure many more to come, as well as others I do not know, cannot wrap their head around it. Some can, others can't. It is deeply complex.
-Pre-Odyssey Exploration. We all know the outcome of that. I used to spend forever pinpointing sig's, but now can usually find something in minutes.
Or perhaps, you'd prefer a more "hand's on" example of how complex the tools can be...
-Let's say you start a combat toon. Start's in a newb ship, like everyone else. Two days or less later...a frig. Now the flight similarities stop there. Your next jump is into a cruiser. A cruiser flies exponentially different than a frig. With a bunch of things to account for when you make the jump. Higher sig radius, more mass, etc. This impacts your fits, how you fly, and so on. You certainly are not going to use a kiting ship for brawling, or vice versa. Can it be done? Sure it can, but that is the complexity of the tool you have chosen to use. It's versatility. How about a cloaky? Or any number of other sub-cap "specializations?" What about the jump to capitals? How about switching from one weapon type to another? New sets of mechanics to worry about.
I could go on with that, but I am pretty sure you know how deep the rabbit hole can go on that one.
Now The Meta, is not so much complex as it is deep. I would count the meta as player interaction, "outside of client" gaming, etc. And The Meta can go as deep as you want it to. For instance...
Sorry for the vagueness, but I am sure you understand.
-I currently have an alt in Corp A. I also have an alt in Corp B. A very good EvE friend is in Corp C. Corp C provided me information regarding two of his personal enemies, and a rough outline of what he wanted. All three corp leaders were once previous corp mates. Now...via out of game means, as I hate playing on low SP characters, I am creating enough dissent in Corp A, so that Corp B can be aggressed by Corp A to gank the entity in question in Corp B. Very little has taken place in game. The ultimate goal, however, is not only to get a very specific ship kill from Corp B, but also, by using dissent, and a rocky past, getting bumped into a directorate spot for providing "solid intel," for the true prize...the complete destruction of Corp A.
Items used... -TS3 -Private Corp forums -"EvE Paranoia"
No in-game mechanics.
Then there is The Concept. The Concept is arguably the most complex thing of all.
EvE is a social experiment, plain and simple. Throw several thousand people into a world, with few rules, and see what happens. And we do not disappoint.
Once you realize what a joke everything is, being the comedian is the only thing that makes sense. |
Lugalbandak
Anunnaku Industrial Corp. Northern Associates.
231
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 13:17:00 -
[52] - Quote
nice example of your corp a b & c , dont want to bite the op but there is way more in eve then those couple of things you said op The police horse is the only animal in the world that haz his male genitals on his back |
KnowUsByTheDead
Volition.
373
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 13:25:00 -
[53] - Quote
Lugalbandak wrote:nice example of your corp a b & c , dont want to bite the op but there is way more in eve then those couple of things you said op
Thank you. And I am not meaning to bite him either, but the complexity is more than there, lol.
For instance, I have been playing for several years, and I literally just found out that you could fly a ship with T2 rigs, despite not having the skills for them. And I have read a lot about EVE. And I have come across a lot of people in EvE. And I only found that out a week ago. How crazy is that?
This is a game where you can literally learn something new every day, which is why I came back and posted proper, rather than troll even more. The OP's base analysis is fabrication of the mind. Once you realize what a joke everything is, being the comedian is the only thing that makes sense. |
Lugalbandak
Anunnaku Industrial Corp. Northern Associates.
231
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 14:02:00 -
[54] - Quote
KnowUsByTheDead wrote:Lugalbandak wrote:nice example of your corp a b & c , dont want to bite the op but there is way more in eve then those couple of things you said op Thank you. And I am not meaning to bite him either, but the complexity is more than there, lol. For instance, I have been playing for several years, and I literally just found out that you could fly a ship with T2 rigs, despite not having the skills for them. And I have read a lot about EVE. And I have come across a lot of people in EvE. And I only found that out a week ago. How crazy is that? This is a game where you can literally learn something new every day, which is why I came back and posted proper, rather than troll even more. The OP's base analysis is fabrication of the mind.
yeah lol its handy to have a tech2 rig fitter in your corp :) The police horse is the only animal in the world that haz his male genitals on his back |
Sexy Cakes
Have A Seat
475
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 14:03:00 -
[55] - Quote
Out of curiosity I'd like to know whats the highest rating anyone has achieved in WoW arenas. Not today spaghetti. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
17210
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 14:18:00 -
[56] - Quote
KnowUsByTheDead wrote:Now, that being said, instead of showing you the flaw in your statement, I will give you my actual feelings on the subject. In order for me to properly explain, let's divide EvE into 4 things...The Game, The Tools, The Meta, and The Concept. By the way, look up Hunicke, LeBlanc, Zubeck (2004) - MDA, A Formal Approach to Game Design and Game Research.
The whole GÇ£mechanics, dynamics, +ªstheticsGÇ¥ perspective is very close to what you're describing. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
ravill rivyll
Perkone Caldari State
12
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 14:19:00 -
[57] - Quote
KnowUsByTheDead:
For me the game is based mainly on player interaction and the truth is if you got brain nothing can beat that. I played ultima, lineage II (pretty long time), I am even ex wow gladiator (beat that deepshit in few months - waste of money). I am not so much into scifi but the truth is the eve online is the best choice out there. Since lineage died after c4 tho it was the greatest mmo ever created if you ask me there is nothing that can compere to it. Not even eve yet its really close to it. I mean look at those mmos today. Its made for five years old bastards just to milk their money. EVERY mmo out there is just low and dumb as fck. Its made by fools for fools I mean really look at it and think about it. Not EVE thats why I stick with her and I WILL stick with her becuase there is no any other hardcore or mature mmo. And the people like the OP is one of the reasons why all that happend (dont take it personaly OP..or better do). That kind of people ruined mmo industry because they are cheap milking machines with taste for fun like 50years old ***** reading celebrity magazines. I am saying **** him ! Why should we suffer of his opinion while he is clearly idiot that cant entertain himself irl. This is not about game for me... |
Richard Ramlrez
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
11
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 15:15:00 -
[58] - Quote
Black Dranzer wrote:WoW combat is far more elaborate and sophisticated than Eve combat.
Go on, just try to deny it.
Wow combat system was greatest POS ever created in MMORPG (i know it copies Everquest combat system). You are delusional. |
YesYes NoNoNo
Karmic Rebalance
34
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 15:16:00 -
[59] - Quote
Grendel Sickswitch wrote:EVE players like to tell people how "complex" and "deep" the game is, and when you start it certainly seems that way, but after a few weeks it becomes apparent that the game is no more complex than most and in fact, less so than many. In EVE there are 5 things you can do; PVP missions gathering (mining, salvaging, exploration) manufacture trade In addition there are a few hundred skills that enable you to be a tiny bit better at one of the 5 activities. This all happens in a few hundred areas that are all essentially the same. and that's EVE.
Nah, http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Harry Forever
SpaceJunkys
856
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 15:22:00 -
[60] - Quote
Grendel Sickswitch wrote:EVE players like to tell people how "complex" and "deep" the game is, and when you start it certainly seems that way, but after a few weeks it becomes apparent that the game is no more complex than most and in fact, less so than many. In EVE there are 5 things you can do; PVP missions gathering (mining, salvaging, exploration) manufacture trade In addition there are a few hundred skills that enable you to be a tiny bit better at one of the 5 activities. This all happens in a few hundred areas that are all essentially the same. and that's EVE.
it has to be that simple, to assure all goons can play it ... |
|
Desivo Delta Visseroff
Cedar Knolls Research STEEL BROTHERHOOD
43
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 15:27:00 -
[61] - Quote
So, OP........Can I have your stuff then???
I'll put it to no use, as there is evidently nothing to do in EVE, but at least you won't have to worry about having stuff with no use.
Just trying to help a brother/sister out |
Johnny Marzetti
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
945
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 17:44:00 -
[62] - Quote
Desivo Delta Visseroff wrote:So, OP........Can I have your stuff then??? I'll put it to no use, as there is evidently nothing to do in EVE, but at least you won't have to worry about having stuff with no use. Just trying to help a brother/sister out
Don't ever post again. |
Jythier Smith
WATERSHIP HOLDINGS Harmonic Convergence
4
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 18:04:00 -
[63] - Quote
There are really only 4 things you can do in EVE.
Gather stuff. Build stuff. Destroy stuff. Sell stuff.
The ways you do these things are complex.
The ways you interact with others are complex.
The way you decide what to do next can be complex.
The rules of the game are pretty simple and laid out well in most cases.
IE, you need X resources to make Y. You mine X m3 per cycle and the cycle is Y long. You do X dps and can tank y damage.
It's all very clearly laid out but the emergent gameplay of combining a system where you can produce stuff, move it around, and destroy and be destroyed, well... that's complex.
EVE is not really a simple game, you can make it sound simple though. It is complex. It's even more complex when you put the different pieces together and make a whole out of it. While |
Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
631
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 18:08:00 -
[64] - Quote
Grendel Sickswitch wrote:EVE players like to tell people how "complex" and "deep" the game is, and when you start it certainly seems that way, but after a few weeks it becomes apparent that the game is no more complex than most and in fact, less so than many. In EVE there are 5 things you can do; PVP missions gathering (mining, salvaging, exploration) manufacture trade In addition there are a few hundred skills that enable you to be a tiny bit better at one of the 5 activities. This all happens in a few hundred areas that are all essentially the same. and that's EVE.
You fTHINK?
How about infiltration on enemy corps? Betrayal? AWOZING, Stealing, Scamming, Incursions, Wormholes , infinitely huge conga lines..
its a sandbox.. the limit.. is your lack of imagination. "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!" |
|
ISD Tyrozan
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
173
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 18:51:00 -
[65] - Quote
Personal attack was removed.
Forum rule 4. Personal attacks are prohibited.
ISD Tyrozan Captain Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department @ISDTyrozan | @ISD_CCL |
|
Jythier Smith
WATERSHIP HOLDINGS Harmonic Convergence
8
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 20:17:00 -
[66] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:Grendel Sickswitch wrote:EVE players like to tell people how "complex" and "deep" the game is, and when you start it certainly seems that way, but after a few weeks it becomes apparent that the game is no more complex than most and in fact, less so than many. In EVE there are 5 things you can do; PVP missions gathering (mining, salvaging, exploration) manufacture trade In addition there are a few hundred skills that enable you to be a tiny bit better at one of the 5 activities. This all happens in a few hundred areas that are all essentially the same. and that's EVE. You fTHINK? How about infiltration on enemy corps? Betrayal? AWOZING, Stealing, Scamming, Incursions, Wormholes , infinitely huge conga lines.. its a sandbox.. the limit.. is your lack of imagination.
Sounds like gathering stuff, destroying stuff, building stuff, and selling stuff to me. :D |
Black Dranzer
361
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 22:03:00 -
[67] - Quote
Galen Darksmith wrote:Yes, hitting the same 4-5 keys in rotation every few seconds with a few reaction based ones is totally more sophisticated than having to keep track of distance and traversal of all your adversaries to minimize their DPS on you while maxing DPS on the target. For what it's worth, I was talking about PvP, not PvE. Mind you, PvE in Eve is an even bigger joke than it is in WoW; Case in point, AFK missioning in a Dominix was(is?) a thing, as is AFK mining. For all that can be said about WoW, at least you had to be at the keyboard to turn a profit.
Speaking of keyboard, I love this misconception that you only need to press 5 buttons in a WoW fight. It's like people played a warrior up to level 10 and went "Yep, this is how it stays the entire game". And, in a sense, it does; The gameplay certainly remains a basic constant. But in a good arena fight in WoW I've got 36 hotkeys at my fingertips and I need to use at least two thirds of them, and that's on classes that don't require much real skill. Positioning actually makes a far bigger difference when your server isn't running at 1FPS, too.
If Eve actually supported macros, you could probably reduce your combat interface to around 3-5 keys, depending on the ship.
And yes, it is true that fights in Eve are typically decided before combat even begins, but I don't consider that a point in Eve's favor.
I love Eve, and I support Eve, and I'll probably keep playing Eve (on and off) until the day the servers croak, but I am not blind to its flaws. I'm not blind to WoW's flaws, either. But right now we're not talking about WoW, we're talking about Eve.
And Eve's combat sucks. Walking in Stations as a Social Hub: Business vs Pleasure in Incarna |
Knights Armament
Operator Chan
85
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 22:14:00 -
[68] - Quote
Grendel Sickswitch wrote:EVE players like to tell people how "complex" and "deep" the game is, and when you start it certainly seems that way, but after a few weeks it becomes apparent that the game is no more complex than most and in fact, less so than many. In EVE there are 5 things you can do; PVP missions gathering (mining, salvaging, exploration) manufacture trade In addition there are a few hundred skills that enable you to be a tiny bit better at one of the 5 activities. This all happens in a few hundred areas that are all essentially the same. and that's EVE.
EvE is an online role playing game, you can experience it however you want. I like to play factions and talk to people, you can say its like a chatroom with graphics that you pay for, or you can say that its a game with potential that you keep subscribed to in the hope it will be a real **** pleaser in the future.
In world of warcraft you
que for pvp battleground que for dungeon/raid do daily quests for reputation grinding or gold level up an alt to raid on socialize with people in the game
except in eve, you can kill anyone, and people cry sometimes when they lose stuff. Also remember that EvE isn't the kind of game you just jump into for an hour a night because you want to be casual, you have to spend time to travel to a system and get a mission or pvp, its how an mmorpg was designed to be, an immersible time sink.
All games are really one trick ponies, in battlefield 4 I can play engineer,assault,support,recon, I can sit on a roof and snipe, fly a plane/helicopter drive a tank, or spawn on squadmates to revive them, I can capture control points/flags/pick up the bomb.
Games are not a replacement for real life yet unfortunately. https://secure.eveonline.com/trial/?invc=29554516-05f9-4eca-a942-32e1701a6569&action=buddy |
Grendel Sickswitch
66
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 22:20:00 -
[69] - Quote
EVE is essentially pong.
|
KnowUsByTheDead
Volition.
391
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 22:44:00 -
[70] - Quote
Grendel Sickswitch wrote:EVE is essentially pong.
If you are equating EvE to the progenitor of gaming, I would contend that EvE does in fact have a solid formula, which other MMO's should cull pieces from.
It essentially could be the progenitor of the future of MMO gaming.
So try again, kid.
This is a battle you will never win. Once you realize what a joke everything is, being the comedian is the only thing that makes sense. |
|
Richard Ramlrez
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
12
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 22:51:00 -
[71] - Quote
Grendel Sickswitch wrote:EVE players like to tell people how "complex" and "deep" the game is, and when you start it certainly seems that way, but after a few weeks it becomes apparent that the game is no more complex than most and in fact, less so than many. In EVE there are 5 things you can do; PVP missions gathering (mining, salvaging, exploration) manufacture trade In addition there are a few hundred skills that enable you to be a tiny bit better at one of the 5 activities. This all happens in a few hundred areas that are all essentially the same. and that's EVE.
In all other MMORPGs theres leveling to max level and endgame grind only. So EVE still wins if you out that way. |
Grendel Sickswitch
66
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 22:55:00 -
[72] - Quote
Richard Ramlrez wrote:Grendel Sickswitch wrote:EVE players like to tell people how "complex" and "deep" the game is, and when you start it certainly seems that way, but after a few weeks it becomes apparent that the game is no more complex than most and in fact, less so than many. In EVE there are 5 things you can do; PVP missions gathering (mining, salvaging, exploration) manufacture trade In addition there are a few hundred skills that enable you to be a tiny bit better at one of the 5 activities. This all happens in a few hundred areas that are all essentially the same. and that's EVE. In all other MMORPGs theres leveling to max level and endgame grind only. So EVE still wins if you out that way.
true. you can never reach level cap.
but thanks for you cash every month! |
Grendel Sickswitch
66
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 23:20:00 -
[73] - Quote
has anyone played plants versus zombies 2 yet?
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 2 3 :: [one page] |