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Wrangler
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Posted - 2003.08.31 23:30:00 -
[31]
The problem with insurance was, as i remember it, that you could get more cash from blowing it up than it cost to make one.
I think that it's best to simply have the ship BP(s) that you're using, so you can easily mine or purchase the minerals and make a new one. This ofc only works for corporations.
[Read the Rules!] - [Email the Moderators] |
SlightlyMad
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Posted - 2003.09.01 01:53:00 -
[32]
The possible leathal outcome of any situation that looks like its calm is the charm. This is a mmorpg. I feel that some people actually wanted to play a single game where they could do and try whatever they wanted and just hit "load" button and restart after each disaster.
If you "just" can afford one BS. Then maybe you should take it easy untill you have enough cash to risk it?
Insurance is good enough.
*
-"You know, we play the "good guys" right? We kill pirates, griefers, retards and general subversive elements in the EVE-Community. To the rest, we are friendly and always prepared to help out. Peo |
Arkonor
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Posted - 2003.09.01 02:21:00 -
[33]
i dont think that CCP was thinking that every man and his dog would be flying around in a battleship anyway.
they are currently the biggest and badest ship's in the game, they should cost a hell of alot of money and be out of the reach of most freelancers. to many people want the best ship's in the game to be disposable ships that you can fly around in without a worry in the world. ofcourse losing such a powerful ship should be a massive set back.
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Xelios
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Posted - 2003.09.01 02:24:00 -
[34]
I wasn't aware dying in this game could be any less of a disaster. Clones are a joke, and death needs some kind of penalty, otherwise everyone would be flying around on suicide missions, waving off lost battleships as if they dropped a penny on the way to the grocery store.
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Kimi
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Posted - 2003.09.01 11:49:00 -
[35]
Edited by: Kimi on 01/09/2003 11:50:10
Can't anyone in this game spell "LOSER" and "LOSING" correctly?
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Davian Windspear
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Posted - 2003.09.01 12:05:00 -
[36]
No NO NO NO NOOOOOO!! hheheh
Are you all crazy, changing insurance would totally change the feel of the game. The whole point of the game is that losing a ship is harsh, you dont have to have insurance if it is too expensive for you. Only buy it when you are doing something risky. And if you are doing risky things all the time then you should be able to have insurance all the time.
If you make insurance cheap and ships become throw away this will make the game terrible. The whole point is that a capital class ship (battleship) is not meant to be everyones ship. They are supposed to be a big loss and hard to replace when destroyed... grrrrrrr  Its no wonder moo are suggesting this after losing thier battleships to frigates, they want to have battleships for life so they can all fly round risking them all the time. That way fighting will take even less guts then it takes now for them 
It is near perfect as it is now, complain about something else"!!!!! |
Terrapin
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Posted - 2003.09.01 12:11:00 -
[37]
 Quote:
One option would be the following.
In stead of insurance per week in real time what about insurance per week of time you are actually online.
Yes, I agree. This is the way insurance should have been implemented from the start (imho).
Also, it should be possible to extend an already active insurance.
And thirdly it would be nice to receive a mail informing you your insurance is about to run out about a day before it actually does.
I mailed these suggestions to CCP several weeks ago, but was told to make a petition instead 
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ULTIMA TREX
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Posted - 2003.09.01 12:38:00 -
[38]
Even extending the insurance to 2 weeks instead of 1 will be alot betetr. and i like the idea of a weeks fly time u use the ship dwindles down to buy the enxt insurance quote. but instead of how long ur online y not make it to how long ur ship is actually flying around in space.
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Danton Marcellus
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Posted - 2003.09.01 13:18:00 -
[39]
Easily solved by making the insurance last as long as you pay the monthly fee that is substantially lower than that of the initial, which for all I care can stay the same as it is...
As is now the amount payed for the time it lasts makes people hellbent on squeezing the most out of it, shooting and killing just about anyone they encounter to get their moneys worth.
Convert Stations
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Noctoz
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Posted - 2003.09.01 13:48:00 -
[40]
What are you on Davian? We have never lost any battleships to frigattes.
Anyway... this is not the point. As several people have mentioned already the ship is not the thing that is hardest to replace if you really are a combat pilot. It's all the equpiment that have take months to collect.
I'm not flying around in a BS uninsured and I make sure to have a buffer of money but to actually require people to save up twice the cost of a BB before they can use it is harch.
It's easy for those already rich to say that the system is perfect and that you should get lots and lots of money but it's not easy for everyone.
Counting from day one when I begun playing it whould take me ALOT of time to afford one.
I agree with what some area saying that everyone should not be flying BBs but anyone who are seriously after PvP combat will need them. A blackbird can actually beat a BB and a much more skilled pilot in any of the top level cruisers can beat an ill equiped one as well but most of the time a cruiser facing a BB is spacedust 1 minute later.
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NoctoZ
Black Reign
Curse Alliance |
Pychian Vanervi
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Posted - 2003.09.01 13:50:00 -
[41]
Come get some!!!!!!
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It's all about the fortune and glory, fortune and glory!
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Dark Elf
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Posted - 2003.09.01 14:15:00 -
[42]
Have to agree with moo but I was wasted by cudegel (ithink thats how it was spelt) at 4C whilst flying between 2 stations to check up on some impounded corp equipment in a thorax in less than 20 secs and podded this was with kinetic/emp shield hardeners running - unfortunatly i had just bought a load of BP's and no longer had the money to replace cruiser and never bother with insurnace as it is way way to expensive for the 2 times I have been killed (always by sinister)
I always like the JG system where you got the value of the ship back without modules
If there was not such a huge loss involved or insurance worked on the same principal as clones I would be personally be much more involved in PvP but since I only get 5-7 hours a week playing eve and the loss of a cruiser takes me a week to recover from...
eve is meant to be a PvP game not a mine/die/mine game. If you like mining/manafacture fine but if you like combat and spend more time trying to get enough isk for 2 cruisers and then once lost a cruiser constantly getting enough isk to give you a fall back then that is a lot of time spent doing mundane tasks for 10-20 secs of fun
Just my 2 isk's worth 
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Janus Rebelknight
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Posted - 2003.09.01 14:57:00 -
[43]
Quote:
The problem with insurance was, as i remember it, that you could get more cash from blowing it up than it cost to make one.
I think that it's best to simply have the ship BP(s) that you're using, so you can easily mine or purchase the minerals and make a new one. This ofc only works for corporations.
One way is to have 'agreed' value insurance.
The longer you have the ship (i.e. the older it is), the less you receive for losing it.
For example you might get 4mil for that lost Thorax if you lose it driving out the showroom, but only 1/2mil 3 or 4 months later.
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Janus
"I'm not a stripper, I'm a miner." |
Wrangler
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Posted - 2003.09.01 15:23:00 -
[44]
Quote:
Can't anyone in this game spell "LOSER" and "LOSING" correctly?
Sorry, spell what? Ah, you mean "LOOSER" and "LOOSING".. 
Personally, I blame Ace Ventura.
[Read the Rules!] - [Email the Moderators] |
Judicator
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Posted - 2003.09.01 17:36:00 -
[45]
Quote:
The problem with insurance was, as i remember it, that you could get more cash from blowing it up than it cost to make one.
I think that it's best to simply have the ship BP(s) that you're using, so you can easily mine or purchase the minerals and make a new one. This ofc only works for corporations.
You can still make a good living blowing up battleships, as has been discussed in other threads.
"I have tried for months and months to make m0o the most hated, the most despised corp in the galaxy and what happens? A stack of muppets named TTI comes along and just basically urinates on my bonfire."
Stavr0s
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Gitsom
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Posted - 2003.09.01 17:51:00 -
[46]
I dont know about anybody else, but if my insurance company charged me a 1/3 of the value of my car every week, for insurance, I'd be hitch hiking.
To all the people that think insurance is fine the way it is, please pay my 23 million a week insurance bill, cause I don't want to have to mine for another Mega!
People cry because no one wants to fight, make it easier to aquire ships and equipment, then people would be more willing to take that risk.
As it stands now risk vs reward for fighting is way too severe. As long as it takes days and weeks to get into ships and to lose them in 10 secs, you will never have the pvp most people would like to see!
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Funky Monkey
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Posted - 2003.09.01 17:54:00 -
[47]
Quote:
Nice to hear a member of a pirate corp coming up with some inteligent comments.
We all should be contributing to the game, regardless of gaming style.
now there is a sentiment worth paying attention to..
as to the loss of your ship? Depending on your level it is catastrophic... losing your new frigate is almost as bad as losing your new BS is to another. Insurance should reflect this, perhaps a "percentage payout" system that registers when you purchase your coverage it reads your current config. .. when you add or change items it updates (either auto or manual.. depending on if you want to refresh your char or not) .. so... your coverage can never go above say.. 90% of total value? Losing a BS then is a fair sting... but recoverable.. same for a frigate.. and its a CASH payout. thus forcing purchase of new replacement items from Market.. AND some work to replace the lost capital that insurance did not cover. Dunno but any thoughts on that solution? 
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Pappabare
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Posted - 2003.09.01 17:59:00 -
[48]
Wow, who would figure someone in MOo would make a good point. But I really like the original idea.
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Shintoko Akahoshi
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Posted - 2003.09.01 19:32:00 -
[49]
I'd like to respond to two points here in turn:
Quote:
eve is meant to be a PvP game not a mine/die/mine game. If you like mining/manafacture fine but if you like combat and spend more time trying to get enough isk for 2 cruisers and then once lost a cruiser constantly getting enough isk to give you a fall back then that is a lot of time spent doing mundane tasks for 10-20 secs of fun
This is a valid point. However, I'd like to point out that taking this attitude seems to be a sign that you might want to reconsider your ownership of said ship. As I see it, there are several models you can take when you decide to fly a given ship: Han Solo; Redbeard and Hornblower.
In the Han Solo model, you are an independant operator with your ship being your sole means of income and generally your major asset. You may not shy from combat, but you'll probably not seek it out. After all, if you lose your ship you probably can't easily replace it.
In the Redbeard model, you are also an independant operator with your ship being your sole means of income and major asset. However, as a pirate, you won't shy from combat. However, since you may not be able to easily replace your ship, you'll probably stick to targets of opportunity and make a bad name for yourself among the afk miners and traders in the game.
In the Hornblower model, you fly a ship provided you by a corporation based on your experience, position within the corp and/or prior proof of your ability to make good use of the ship. With the ship will come a contract, explicit or implied, concerning the use you will put the ship to. If you are a combat pilot, you will be expected to fight with the ship. If the corporation is properly organized and managed, it will be able to replace your ship if you lose it in combat.
In other words, if you want to engage in PvP action, you will need to consider the mode in which you operate, how you pay for your ship, and how you will replace it if you lose it. In other words, if you want to fight with your ship, you need to make sure you can afford to replace it. If you can't afford to replace it, you should be flying a cheaper ship.
Quote:
I dont know about anybody else, but if my insurance company charged me a 1/3 of the value of my car every week, for insurance, I'd be hitch hiking.
True. However, most of us do not drive our cars in demolition derbies -- which is what PvP combat entails. Flying within high security empire space is generally safe enough that you don't need insurance, which puts it in the realm of something you equip yourself with to mitigate the loss of your ship when you take it into hostile circumstances.
I know many of you will read this and consider me to be too harsh on the poor, independant pilot who only wants to fly around in her battleship. Think about it, though. We pay initially for the cost of our ship. Then we pay to equip it. After that, we never have to pay again save for repairing damage (and that's only if we can't repair it ourselves for free), and to replace it if it is destroyed. There are no costs for docking. No costs for maintenance. No costs for fuel. It is already far too easy for someone to fly a ship beyond their means. If we nerf the insurance system, then the game will devolve into a pure PvP deathmatch game. Gone will be the trade aspects of it (who would trade if you don't need to make much money to gain and hold that battleship. Who would trade if the game was filled with wannabe pirates who can attack you repeatedly with no fear of the cost of losing). Gone would be mining (same reasoning). Gone would be everything that sets Eve apart from Quake. Eve attempts to model the complete economy of a vast area of space. If you want to fly, and fight in, an expensive ship, you need to work within this economical model.
There's no meaning to life when you cling only to common sense |
Rust
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Posted - 2003.09.01 19:56:00 -
[50]
Lose of a ship is very severe in EVE, and does distort the PvP aspect of the game. How about having an option to use a 'surrender' button in non war situations. This button, when activated, would give a large previously deposited 'bounty' to the the person or gang that was attacking you.
This amount could be very large, and the attackers would have the satifaction of winning the engagment, and the loser would be returned to say their starting station, much poorer but with their ship and equipment (though perhaps cargo could be dumped in space).
War would be to the death, and of course you would also have the option to go down in flames. This would have some effect on making ships, though perhaps the increase in fights could stimulate the market.
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Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2003.09.01 20:30:00 -
[51]
Quote:
Lose of a ship is very severe in EVE, and does distort the PvP aspect of the game. How about having an option to use a 'surrender' button in non war situations. This button, when activated, would give a large previously deposited 'bounty' to the the person or gang that was attacking you.
This amount could be very large, and the attackers would have the satifaction of winning the engagment, and the loser would be returned to say their starting station, much poorer but with their ship and equipment (though perhaps cargo could be dumped in space).
War would be to the death, and of course you would also have the option to go down in flames. This would have some effect on making ships, though perhaps the increase in fights could stimulate the market.
the surrender button sounds a bit too much like the dreaded "consensual combat" option.
It has one good point though - imagine the severe taunting you'd receive for surrendering 
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
Mustard
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Posted - 2003.09.01 20:31:00 -
[52]
I have to agree, the insurence system as it is is very difficult to use for someone who is a casual gamer like myself. I like the idea of revising it. The clone type suggestion is a good one. I would also support a longer term on insurence. A month would be better. Weekly its a joke. I myself am someone who lost a nice ship because I couldn't afford the insurence. But thats something I've come to terms with.
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ULTIMA TREX
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Posted - 2003.09.02 12:30:00 -
[53]
another reason y insurance should be fixed is that were loosing ships to server crashes. things that are out of our hands. and were getting put down even more coz of it. we by the insurance to protect us against pirates, ye fine im happy witht hat. but we also have to buy it coz of the server crashing sow ere loosing money coz of that. im not flaming im putting a point accross.
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