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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
p3rcy
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Posted - 2003.09.03 23:09:00 -
[1]
I;ve been hearing rumours about changes going to be put in place to help defend against ppl who seal from cans in indy ships. Is it troo we will have the ability to attack them or wil they remain "invulnerable".
Really have to laugh at the way police prtect those stealing? Remind how that works again :)
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Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2003.09.03 23:14:00 -
[2]
I think it's going to be a "hostile" activity to open someone elses can.
It means you can shoot back.
Of course, this defeats the whole purpose the secure cans........
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
p3rcy
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Posted - 2003.09.03 23:15:00 -
[3]
secure cans only hold about 420 - 1000 units so there useless for mining with
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TekRa
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Posted - 2003.09.03 23:17:00 -
[4]
You're allowed to use more than 1 you know 
> With the lights out it's less dangerous. |
Cruise
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Posted - 2003.09.03 23:19:00 -
[5]
The only problem I see with the secure cans is when you get mass mining efforts and the belt is littered with cans. The lag could be horrid.
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Catapultam habeo. Nisi pecuniam omnem mihi dabis ad capul tuum saxum immane mittam.
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p3rcy
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Posted - 2003.09.03 23:19:00 -
[6]
yeah i know but you can only fdorp one every 5 mins so that nmakes it very impractical
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Baldour Ngarr
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Posted - 2003.09.04 00:20:00 -
[7]
 Quote:
yeah i know but you can only fdorp one every 5 mins so that nmakes it very impractical
Well, there you go. Mine slow and safe, or mine fast and take risks. Why do so many people have such a problem with this concept?
_______
"Soon" is an ancient Icelandic word meaning "some time before the next Ice Age." |
Scimitar
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Posted - 2003.09.04 00:51:00 -
[8]
No offence baldour but that post was utterly useless it also made no sense :S
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Morlocke
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Posted - 2003.09.04 02:47:00 -
[9]
Secure cans were a clumsy attempt to solve the problem in the first place. Now they're just generating litter in all the belts, since they last forever and people just leave them parked there.
Looking forward to shooting a few *****s, myself.
M
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Othnark
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Posted - 2003.09.04 06:36:00 -
[10]
Miners are using their jettisoned containers in a way that was never intended. (Go read the CCP support topic on ore theivery if you dont believe me) There is no way the jettisoned containers should be able to hold more ore than any cargo bay possibly could. Ore loss is the risk assumed with this kind of mining.
If they eliminate that risk by putting on criminal flags, I say they have to fix the cans so they dont hold a ridiculous amount of ore.
Further, I want thieves to be able to fire back and defend themselves. IE: treat the whole incident as a temporary declaration of war. Police dont get involved for say 15 minutes. That will make things very interesting indeed.
-Othnark
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Jolo
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Posted - 2003.09.04 07:15:00 -
[11]
I feel mining Veld and Scor should be risk free. No matter what. But for some reason, some people feel that you should be unsafe in any secrity area. If i want Omber or Bistot (or Ark and Spod...NOT) I will go to dangerous space. But I should be free in 0.9 and 1.0 space.
Long Discussion here: Click Me
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Baldour Ngarr
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Posted - 2003.09.04 08:00:00 -
[12]
Quote:
No offence baldour but that post was utterly useless it also made no sense :S
You mean I can write it in words of one syllable and you STILL don't get it? Geeze.
It's very, very simple. Anything that you jettison does not legally belong to you, so anyone who comes along and takes it has not committed theft. If you want to eliminate the risk of that happening, don't drop-mine; drag secure containers out to the belts, or mine to your hold and warp back to station every time it's full. Yes, I know it's slow, but that's the price you pay for eliminating the risk. If you want to drop-mine because it's an awful lot faster, you have to accept the risks involved - chief among them being, a scavenger might come along and grab all the ore you painstakingly collected. Too bad.
_______
"Soon" is an ancient Icelandic word meaning "some time before the next Ice Age." |
Baldour Ngarr
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Posted - 2003.09.04 08:02:00 -
[13]
Quote:
I feel mining Veld and Scor should be risk free. No matter what.
It *IS* risk free. Nobody can shoot at you without bringing Concord down on them. That has nothing to do with ore scavenging, which is about people thinking they should be able to leave stuff lying around, risk free. That's not going to happen, and no reason it should.
_______
"Soon" is an ancient Icelandic word meaning "some time before the next Ice Age." |
CT BadIronTree
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Posted - 2003.09.04 08:27:00 -
[14]
they tell that sec. cargo will be the same us not sec in your shippp if you die and you have sec. people can pick up the cargo and loot...
they will make sec. cargo to be sec only when you deploy it... so if it is in you ship will be able to put like 3000 cargo in it... but if you deploy it in space it will be secure and can take 15k of cargo so this rulz...
all the miners want.. + no more kill me na na na na i have sec cargo you cant pick it up i will come when you are not around and pick it up exploid :)
============================================
Colossus Technologies
The first and oldest corp in eve!
BadIronTree Head of Production
CSM Chat Log September 25, 2003:
Fuhry> Some things we simply cannot test, and therefore we just put it on Tranq. cross our fingers and then get into panic mode.
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playing (or beta testing)since Sat, 2 Nov 2002 16:06 (beta 5)
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drunkenmaster
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Posted - 2003.09.04 08:27:00 -
[15]
If they are going to make opening jet-cans a 'hostile' act, I still don't see what people will be able to do about it. But, as long as this 'fix' makes them feel better, I don't really care.
Although if this *is* done, I suggest lowering the capacity of the 'trash-bags' as 27000 m3 seems a little excessive.
And like Joshua said, this makes secure cans a bit of a waste of database, as I can't really see many people using them.
Also, the 5 minute timer is totally irrelevant. I've not seen anyone be able to mine 27000m3 in 5 minutes. And tbh, I never expect to see such a thing.
Nice sig btw, Josh. 
.
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Tim Maser
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Posted - 2003.09.04 08:38:00 -
[16]
Guys enough of this about containers. If you jettison something, your tossing it into space as trash. Just because it shows up in a container that came from your ship doesn't mean that it some how is still yours and if someone opens it that Concord should blow the hell out of them.
Here, this sums up exactly what I feel about this subject and was just add into support by CCP:
Question
Why is it so easy to steal ore ?
Answer The regular containers were designed to jettison unwanted items into space or to hold loot from blown up ships. They were designed so that any player could take from them because that was essential for them to function as they were intended. Players later invented the "container mining" method after noticing that the containers could hold way more than any cargohold. This use for the containers was never intended and it has the obvious flaw that any player with a reduced sense of right and wrong can come by and take everything from the container and no one can do anything about it.
This risk should be known to all players and there will be no reimbursement for ore lost this way. Also, ore "theft" is not considered harrassment so no punishment will be dealt out to those who choose to "steal". Players who are thinking of taking up a career as ore thiefs should note that they will face a lifetime of unpopularity and unhappiness as a result.
CCP has decided to meet players halfway by implementing secure containers that can be bought on the market and have the advantage of being equipped with a password lock. These containers cost money and do not hold the vast amount of ore that the regular containers do. However, with good organization and frequent ore pickups using Industrial ships, they can be very useful for large scale mining operations.
The bottom line is: If you use regular containers to store your ore you assume all the risk. Having your valuables floating in space in an unsecure container is equivelant to throwing money on the street. Should you lurk nearby and wait for someone to take the money and then attack him, the police would deal with you, not him. The same goes in Eve. If you attack a player who just took "your" ore from a regular container in a system with a security level of 0.5 or higher. You will be destroyed by Concord.
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MissEvil
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Posted - 2003.09.04 10:57:00 -
[17]
Quote:
Players who are thinking of taking up a career as ore thiefs should note that they will face a lifetime of unpopularity and unhappiness as a result.
This is so true my friend. This week i've had a total of about 5 assasination attempts carried out upon me, numerous abusive messages and constant abuse in the local chat window. I think my days are numbered, anyway, it was fun whilst it lasted  |
Alexia Te'Len
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Posted - 2003.09.04 11:03:00 -
[18]
Yup, counter-measures are being brought in.
Won't stop me though, if a chance presents itself I'll take it.
Haven't made a Career out my "Pay or lose the cargo!" thing, but if it gets people to use secure cargo containers then at least I've done something for the Community.
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MissEvil
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Posted - 2003.09.04 11:18:00 -
[19]
And i thought i was the only female in the business. Im glad its not just me, its good theres more independent women out there who dont let men miners walk all over us and treat us like petty housewives. Girl power  |
Alexia Te'Len
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Posted - 2003.09.04 11:20:00 -
[20]
Quote:
And i thought i was the only female in the business. Im glad its not just me, its good theres more independent women out there who dont let men miners walk all over us and treat us like petty housewives. Girl power
Sorry to burst your bubble, love, bu I'm actually a sixteen year old bloke with too much spare time on his hands. 
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MissEvil
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Posted - 2003.09.04 11:21:00 -
[21]
If i was who i said i was then perhaps i might have been slightly hurt there, however im a 20yr old male with a lot of spare time as well |
Veruna Caseti
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Posted - 2003.09.04 11:23:00 -
[22]
Quote:
but if it gets people to use secure cargo containers then at least I've done something for the Community.
This is hilariously circular logic.
People need to use secure containers to avoid spineless punks like you. Now you say you do this so that people will start using secure containers and this is a good "thing for the community"... except it's only good because people like you exist in the first place!
You can't create a problem and then call yourself a hero for solving it.
Veruna Caseti
Ishukone |
RAIDAKAOZ
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Posted - 2003.09.04 11:24:00 -
[23]
this wont work and I tell u why, simple.......
people mine together and one person mines while the other transfers it to a station is called teamwork, by doing this as u say ur are defeating teamwork.now ur partner u mine with cant haul ur ore cause its considered hostile acts , people need tp think
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If it looks like a duck, and sounds like a duck, it is probably a chicken that CCP ****ed up. |
Veruna Caseti
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Posted - 2003.09.04 11:26:00 -
[24]
Quote:
this wont work and I tell u why, simple.......
people mine together and one person mines while the other transfers it to a station is called teamwork, by doing this as u say ur are defeating teamwork.now ur partner u mine with cant haul ur ore cause its considered hostile acts , people need tp think
Umm, simple solution is that members of the same Gang or Corporation have access to each other's cargo containers.
Maybe you need to think. 
Veruna Caseti
Ishukone |
Alexia Te'Len
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Posted - 2003.09.04 11:27:00 -
[25]
Quote:
Quote:
but if it gets people to use secure cargo containers then at least I've done something for the Community.
This is hilariously circular logic.
People need to use secure containers to avoid spineless punks like you. Now you say you do this so that people will start using secure containers and this is a good "thing for the community"... except it's only good because people like you exist in the first place!
You can't create a problem and then call yourself a hero for solving it.
Nonononono, you mis-understood me (Although I didn't elaborate so it's my fault).
The chances I "jump" are those people in 0.5 space or above that use Cruisers with un-Godly amounts of Mining lasers and Harvester Drones....yet they use un-secure containers.
Why is that? If they have all this wealth why can't the at least fork out for a bit of extra security?
I target these people because, and I'm sure I'm not the only one, they're the ones who should have the common sense to use secure containers in the first place.
However, if it's a Frigate plugging away at an Asteroid, I'll leave them be....I just assume that they're either a newbie, therefore not knowing about the secure containers, or just don't have the money to buy one in the first place.
Is that a little more understandable?
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RAIDAKAOZ
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Posted - 2003.09.04 11:28:00 -
[26]
The other thing, u want this game as real as possible, u leave something out someone will steal it, if u shoot them and kill them even thought they stole ur stuff u go to jail. There is other ways to fix this, but this isnt one of them, simpley because it kills teamwork. I got my ore stolen from Fred Conquer , he wont go out of secure space cause he dont want azz whoopin. But in the end no matter what ccp does people will find a way around as ythey always have done and always will do............
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If it looks like a duck, and sounds like a duck, it is probably a chicken that CCP ****ed up. |
MissEvil
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Posted - 2003.09.04 11:33:00 -
[27]
Quote:
You can't create a problem and then call yourself a hero for solving it.
I wouldn't class myself as a hero, maybe more of an educator of the masses. People are ignorant and believe that they can simply use unsecure cargo containers, time after time i have warned people that there are evil people around, but will they listen to me? No. Instead, i now perform education and teach people. You would've thought im doing them a favour, however instead they turn on me and bite the hand that fed them!  |
Veruna Caseti
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Posted - 2003.09.04 11:44:00 -
[28]
Quote:
You would've thought im doing them a favour, however instead they turn on me and bite the hand that fed them!
Yuck yuck.
Get a real job, loser.
Veruna Caseti
Ishukone |
Scragg
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Posted - 2003.09.04 13:04:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Scragg on 04/09/2003 13:05:56
Can you imagine the exploitability of being able to shoot people who open your can?
You chunk out a can and warp to a planet. Your buddy spots for you in a newby ship about 15k past your can.
Unsuspecting greedy dweeb#1 comes up to the can, sees it is owned by someone besides your buddy and figures it is abandoned rat loot or somethign and loots said can.
You gang warp to your buddy and vaporize greedy dweeb#1 newby ship with your battleship you bough on eBay. Wow... your so kewl.
OMG people... have NONE of you actually played other games that had similiar lame ideas? This is like how years ago in Ultima Online you would be wandering down the road and you find a dead body in the middle of the road with no one around.... you decided to loot the corps and 8 guys apear from nowhere and gank you.
The loot stealing thing was fixed with secure containers. Use the or shut the hell up.
Scragg, Tyrell Corporation
Vice-Director Military Operations |
Veruna Caseti
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Posted - 2003.09.04 13:56:00 -
[30]
Quote:
Can you imagine the exploitability of being able to shoot people who open your can?
You chunk out a can and warp to a planet. Your buddy spots for you in a newby ship about 15k past your can.
Unsuspecting greedy dweeb#1 comes up to the can, sees it is owned by someone besides your buddy and figures it is abandoned rat loot or somethign and loots said can.
You gang warp to your buddy and vaporize greedy dweeb#1 newby ship with your battleship you bough on eBay. Wow... your so kewl.
Umm, how is this an exploit?
greedy dweeb #1 knows the rules of the game like everyone else.
If looting a can that doesn't belong to you is an aggressive act, it's the looters fault not the person using it as bait.
OMG.
Veruna Caseti
Ishukone |
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