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John Zeppe
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Posted - 2003.09.05 18:53:00 -
[31]
 Quote:
2) The armageddon is the best miner....wrong again...may be #3 or #4...but clearly you must choose either upped drones or upped turrets
The Apoc has 8 turrets and 1500 drones
The Dom has 6 turrets and 5000 drones
The best is one of them period
Add in that the most drones a person can control is 8 or 9... and it becomes clear that anything beyond 1500 drones right now is useless vanity
Um, the megathron is a better miner than the Dominix since it's got 1 extra turret + the space for 25 harvesters...
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Shauna
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Posted - 2003.09.05 19:11:00 -
[32]
Quote:
Add in that the most drones a person can control is 8 or 9... and it becomes clear that anything beyond 1500 drones right now is useless vanity
heavy drones take 250m3 each, so 10 of em for a full wave is 2500m3 space. Extra space gives room for replacements... a dom that can send out wave after wave of drones isn't something to take lightly  |
KIATolon
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Posted - 2003.09.05 19:21:00 -
[33]
I dont think BShips were meant to be lone attackers. I think the leadership skills need to be introduced. Formations of cruisers & fighters supported by the BShips are the future of EVE pvp combat.
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Rase
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Posted - 2003.09.05 22:00:00 -
[34]
The point of my last comment was to refute that the armageddon was the "best miner" I asserted that either the Dom or the Apoc or the only possible "best miners"....nothing about combat and sending "wave after wave" of combat drones
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s0cks
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Posted - 2003.09.05 22:03:00 -
[35]
Quote:
I dont think BShips were meant to be lone attackers. I think the leadership skills need to be introduced. Formations of cruisers & fighters supported by the BShips are the future of EVE pvp combat.
Quite true, i belive the game was designed to have battleships as the ships who sit back at around 40km or more punching thru other heavier ships at distance, cruisers as a wing defence using EW and punching off smaller ships too, with frigates to fly around in bigish numbers trying to beat the crap outta wot they can (like drones). Obviously this is not possible atm because of the big issue of... LAG.
Would be great fun to wack out the joystick (no punn) and get a*****pit view while in a frigate, in a big battle 
Oh and The Wretch - its quite obvious a battleship would probably win 1v1 with a frigate/cruiser, but with the right equipment the frigate could keep him rendered useless and take a few pot shots at most... i'm talking 3 or 4 versus a loan battleship. Maybe a cruiser would win with enough strength (Moa with 3 ECM and 1 Warp Scrambler/Disrupter).
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Rase
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Posted - 2003.09.05 22:04:00 -
[36]
Mister "25" harvestors...you can control 25 harvestors..the most you can control is 8 or 9
so...the Apoc is the best miner...can handle the max possible controllable harvestors and the most turrets of any bship.
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Main
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Posted - 2003.09.05 22:09:00 -
[37]
What is the whole point of formations when the attacking force is just going to warp to a gate and start shooting, the defenders of the station and the gate won't use formations as they have no idea from which direction the attack is coming from.
Main
Everlasting Vendetta Veteran
Member of the Stain Alliance |
Acix
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Posted - 2003.09.05 22:14:00 -
[38]
I have heard a lot of things about large turrets not hitting. Last night I was using a stabber for recon/scouting (very fast no shields). I was going about 1800 m/s on a trajectory to use a battle ships turret tracking against it. The large lasers hit me every shot and dusted my stabber in a matter of seconds. There are a few large guns that have bad tracking, but large lasers isn't one of them. This guy had a apoc with sensor boosters, and at least one warp core stabilizer. So he had a few slots full of other things besides weapon bonus mods.
SNIGG is now officially open for business. We are a merc corp looking for contracts.
For more info click below
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=68313 |
s0cks
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Posted - 2003.09.05 22:20:00 -
[39]
Quote:
I have heard a lot of things about large turrets not hitting. Last night I was using a stabber for recon/scouting (very fast no shields). I was going about 1800 m/s on a trajectory to use a battle ships turret tracking against it. The large lasers hit me every shot and dusted my stabber in a matter of seconds. There are a few large guns that have bad tracking, but large lasers isn't one of them. This guy had a apoc with sensor boosters, and at least one warp core stabilizer. So he had a few slots full of other things besides weapon bonus mods.
You have to be close for starters, and fit a few tracking disrupters.
Plus large lasers have highest tracking speed then all large turrets, i think they are getting a slight drop nxt patch, while the rest are getting a slight boost.
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Gravedancer
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Posted - 2003.09.05 22:42:00 -
[40]
Quote:
Heavy drones are evil. They eat my frigate for lunch. Not even lunch... more of a light snack - say a packet of wine gums or something.
Yep, and anyone who flies a dominix and DOESNT have drone interfacing and heavy drones skill (and lots of drones) is wasting their time. The true power of the Dominix is as a heavy drone carrier. Same thing with a Thorax really, or most Gallente ships. A Thorax without 6 or 8 heavy drones will get owned by a Moa or even a decently outfitted frigate. If you dont have good drones skills you will usually be better off in another races ships.
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Rizmordan Hillgotlieb
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Posted - 2003.09.05 22:48:00 -
[41]
Just a thought... were stuck on the frigates right now...
What about an ECCM BB?
Now team this guy up w/ his 2 Buddies in BB each with a decent weapon loadout...
All 3 are deploying 8 heavy drones of various types...
Each has the skills to back them up. Not just some n00b who just trained for his/her BB...
What's the result of an encounter w/ these guys?
Posting for Numbnutz |
Sc0rpion
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Posted - 2003.09.05 22:49:00 -
[42]
Quote:
You have to be close for starters, and fit a few tracking disrupters.
Correct. There is a big difference between an 1800m/s strafe at 5km range and an 1800m/s strafe at 500m range.
The closer you are to your target, the more radians per second you can cover, and the harder it is for them to track you.
Get in close (like 500m or less), open up with your tracking disruptors, fire a few volleys, then hit that MWD and get out of range FAST.
(Don't forget to web them before you fly off, if it comes down to a cap race, you WILL lose.  )
"The true secret to enjoying life is to live it dangerously."
-Freidrich Nietzche |
The Wretch
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Posted - 2003.09.06 03:40:00 -
[43]
As one example I have 0.0153 tracking speed with skills and a couple mods when using tacheons. I will hit pretty close on average 3 shots in 10 when qball's raven is in a 10-15k orbit around me with a MWD active. And roughly only 1 in those 3 shots gets in a decent dmg roll (hit). I think his orbit speed at that range is around 400 m/s - not for sure.
However if you set your ship to approach while someone is aggressively orbiting you the hit ratio gets a bit better since you decrease the rads/sec. One usefull purpose for agility I guess. But still the improvement is not that great.
So if your using the idea that frigates in mass at close range attacking a couple battleships are good then yes. But put all those folks in figates into battleships in the same situation, the argument again goes to the battleship.
I'll give the whole frig/cruiser argument some credit - there are more ppl in frigs/cruisers then ppl flying battleships.
The Wretch
Cyberdyne Systems CEO
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Agent Shield
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Posted - 2003.09.06 13:55:00 -
[44]
To the person who is refuting the Arma and my comment about the best, you are right. I meant for us, and our cost, and our BS skill of Amarr; it was the best for us. Sorry for the confusion.
To the person who mentioned skill levels for piloting, I agree with you. I have skills mainly going towards running our corp, so my fighting skills are not up to par as some. I see a lot of 3's in my skill set. However our Fleet Commander in our corp has battle skills I would love to have. But he cannot refine/produce/research or do some of the business side of the corp.
All in all though, the corp is balanced to proceed throughout Eve. There have been times though, where we wish we had 1 more player in the corp, but we don't want the corp to get way to huge. Adding another player would probably add 50% to our player base. 
Agent Shield |
John Zeppe
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Posted - 2003.09.06 14:06:00 -
[45]
Quote:
Mister "25" harvestors...you can control 25 harvestors..the most you can control is 8 or 9
so...the Apoc is the best miner...can handle the max possible controllable harvestors and the most turrets of any bship.
Um, my point exactly.
Therefor the Apoc is the best miner, with the armageddon/megathron split number two (both 7 turrets, both >1000 drone space for 10 harvesters).
The dominix is clearly a worse miner than the Megathron, since it can't control more drones, and has got one turret less.
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Asmodia
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Posted - 2003.09.06 15:08:00 -
[46]
Is the topic. : what is the best battleship to mine ?
If u go for Pvp many other attribute r important. take a look on ur gravimetric points and so on.
there are only 2 Battleships worth their money : Scorpion as Tactical overpower and Apoc for firepower the rest is between them.
Battleships for mining ........ whats next ... What Battleship is the best Indi ?
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CEO of Spectre Syndicate - Curse Alliance
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The Wretch
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Posted - 2003.09.06 16:55:00 -
[47]
"best Indi"
*cough* Titian *cough*
The Wretch
Cyberdyne Systems CEO
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Silinary
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Posted - 2003.09.06 22:03:00 -
[48]
Quote:
Battleships for mining ........ whats next ... What Battleship is the best Indi ?
I can get about 2360 cargo space in my megathron ;p and soon to be able to get more with the new low slot comming on
Seriously tho, a wing of frigates can be dangerous ...as is a wing of cruisers, and a wing of battleships. It's all a matter of risk. If a wing of frigates can get the job done, use 'em ... if you lose a few oh well. If you need cruisers, use those.
Some don't have the option to chose.
Battleships are good for a number of roles. I wouldnt' suggest combat in them untill you're good with frigates and cruisers tho :) Just cause it can be used, doesnt' mean it should be.
You can do anything you set your mind to. |
Jash Illian
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Posted - 2003.09.06 22:24:00 -
[49]
Quote:
As one example I have 0.0153 tracking speed with skills and a couple mods when using tacheons. I will hit pretty close on average 3 shots in 10 when qball's raven is in a 10-15k orbit around me with a MWD active. And roughly only 1 in those 3 shots gets in a decent dmg roll (hit). I think his orbit speed at that range is around 400 m/s - not for sure.
However if you set your ship to approach while someone is aggressively orbiting you the hit ratio gets a bit better since you decrease the rads/sec. One usefull purpose for agility I guess. But still the improvement is not that great.
So if your using the idea that frigates in mass at close range attacking a couple battleships are good then yes. But put all those folks in figates into battleships in the same situation, the argument again goes to the battleship.
I'll give the whole frig/cruiser argument some credit - there are more ppl in frigs/cruisers then ppl flying battleships.
If the game engine could take it without causing masive lag and system shutdowns, I think you'd see more intelligent commanders attacking bships with cruisers and frigates. From a straight math standpoint, 5 cruisers is cheaper than 1 battleship. And 5 cruisers flown by mediocre pilots stand an extremely high chance of destroying the battleship.
5 Ruptures in a 3/3 setup, 425mm and cruise missiles, wouldn't be a fun prospect for any battleship pilot at 5km. From a cost analysis if I were the bship pilot, that battle wouldn't be worth the risk and I would warp. 5 Thoraxes with heavy drones would also have me plotting a course out of there because even if they launched drones at 50km, the prospects of killing all the drone before they started peeling away shields and armor would be extremely low.
People aren't attacking bship groups in larger cruiser groups, mostly due to what happens when 5 bships meet 25 cruisers: lag slaughter. If CCP ever gets around to solving the combat/warp lag problems, I think we'll see people straying away from their battleships back to their cruisers except in special circumstances. I have no problem tossing away 4 Ruptures to kill 1 Battleship. Only thing is the game's issues prevent people from making that trade.
I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather **** my enemy.- Rohann
Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!- Lallante |
Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2003.09.06 22:36:00 -
[50]
All I'll say is this:
After the next patch, fear the Caracal.
With the right setup this baby is going to KILL.
It'd come as no surprise if corporations reported that sales of Ravens had increased.
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
The Wretch
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Posted - 2003.09.06 23:26:00 -
[51]
hmmm
Emp resistances will now be fairly low even with shield hardeners.
Wonder how many ppl going to be crying after getting blasted by emp torps, cruise, and missles.
The Wretch
Cyberdyne Systems CEO
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Setec
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Posted - 2003.09.06 23:32:00 -
[52]
I definitely agree that battleships aren't everything. In all-out slugfest combat they are important. For non-combat characters, they don't really matter. And cruisers can hold their own extremely well in PVP fights provided that they make wise use of EW. Many times my corpmates and I have defeated battleships using only cruisers. I did not get a battleship until recently, even though I had enough money for it ages ago. The extra benefit was not worth risking so much of my money at once in one ship flying around space.
___________________________________________
Space Invaders website: http://www.si-corp.net |
Singular
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Posted - 2003.09.06 23:45:00 -
[53]
Posts like this are always made by people without Battleships.
Im Yo Huckleberreh |
Shintoko Akahoshi
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Posted - 2003.09.07 17:31:00 -
[54]
S0cks is right about the capabilities of frigates (our corps were at war for a while with Merc. Frigates, and I can attest to the good use they put them). Personally, I feel that most people don't consider frigates to be an effective fighting ship because most frigate pilots are new players who are trying to work their way up into something else. Get two or three good pilots in decent frigates, and they're a potent fighting force. You don't need large battle groups like some people have proposed, just a small flock of frigates.
There's no meaning to life when you cling only to common sense |
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