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NirvanaA
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Posted - 2006.03.08 04:59:00 -
[1]
Edited by: NirvanaA on 08/03/2006 05:00:42
Edited by: NirvanaA on 08/03/2006 05:00:21
Its time for me to move on from my claw to the hound. But is it really worth it? The training required and the training required to do decent damage with cruise missiles worth it? I have everything in navigation maxed out and some ok skills in electonics, gunnerey. But only 93,000 SP are into missiles.
Do I need everything in missiles, and for cloaking maxed out to be good, or can I have most of the things to lvl 4, have T2 items, and still be pretty good if I had some skill?
And one more question to all of those who are experienced and encountered a stealth bomber, or have flown one, is it truely a fun ship to fly and pirate in? What I mean is, can this thing pop haulers and frigs from over 50 km without the enemy noticing till what has happened to them? Or is it one of those things where you shoot the missiles, they see them, then they warp off? Is this ship good for taking out cruisers solo? And is this ship good for gang support?
Thanks in advance.
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Foulis
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Posted - 2006.03.08 05:11:00 -
[2]
I'm interested in this as well, as I am in pretty much the same position skill-wise. Not much in missles, but I'm training into stealth bombers.
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I <3 Taranis
Cake > Pie - Imaran
 Originally by: CCP Hammer
Boobies
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Idara
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Posted - 2006.03.08 05:52:00 -
[3]
I like my Manticore. Takes work to get it into situations where it will be useful and not die fast, but very rewarding strategy wise.
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Lieutenant
BSC Military
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Foulis
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Posted - 2006.03.08 05:54:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Idara
I like my Manticore. Takes work to get it into situations where it will be useful and not die fast, but very rewarding strategy wise.
That's nice to know, I've always wanted a ship that relies heavilly on strategy. Evens out the playing field =D
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I <3 Taranis
Cake > Pie - Imaran
Originally by: CCP Hammer
Boobies
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Nex Angelus
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Posted - 2006.03.08 07:12:00 -
[5]
Aaah yes, the good ol' stealth bomber.
Personally, I really liked flying my manticore, and yes, it is fun fo fly.
As for popping haulers and T1 frigs, you really don't have to be 50k away, as you outdamage them by far. However, I wouldn't try to solo a cruiser unless I knew exactly what he had fitted.
When flying it solo, you have to pick your fights carefully. I used mine mostly for NPC-ing in lowsec or as gang-support. In my old corp, (when I was really really bored) I used it to guard miners/haulers and actually got a few kills, mostly solo intys who didn't realize I had de-cloaked and fired until it was too late. 
Feel free to contact me ingame if you need help setting it up. or have further questions.
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Liet Traep
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Posted - 2006.03.08 07:53:00 -
[6]
I've got 500 k in missiles. most of the skills up to lvl 3 or 4.I can can one volley a t1 frig in my purifier and kill a hauler in 2 volley's. A hound can actually fit 3 bcu's fairly easily so it has a better potential for damage. Well worth it I'd think.
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Ralitge boyter
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Posted - 2006.03.08 08:35:00 -
[7]
As one of those crazy people with near 6Mil SP in missiles I have been told by like minded nutters, that these stealth bombers are really worth it.
Their potential for damage dealing is very big (for the size of the ship) and as so few people use them right now the element of surprize and amazment on the side of your prey is usualy enough to give you the upperhand.
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Should you disagree with me, well I guess that is because I disagree with you. If you have a problem with that please feel free not to tell me. |
Testy Mctest
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Posted - 2006.03.08 08:52:00 -
[8]
Don't take a stealth bomber unless you have friends to fly with. Solo, they're useless, as they essentially can't kill anything due to not being able to scramble (realistically) and cruises flying so slow.
In a gang, however, they are lethal, as they don't have to worry so much about being shot as there'll be your friends right on top of the target.
Also, with other stealth bombers, they can be evil as you can single volley many targets. Tech 1 cruisers are my personal favourite to pick on :P
Grouped SBs also make the 'lesser' versions - The Amarr and Gallente ones - more useful. Even though they're not up to the standards of Minmatar and Caldari bombers, they become much better with scale. A Purifier with a Hound, striking with a volley of EM followed by a volley of Explosive, works out quite well.
The Eve Guild Wars Project! |
Twilight Moon
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Posted - 2006.03.08 09:33:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Testy Mctest
Don't take a stealth bomber unless you have friends to fly with. Solo, they're useless, as they essentially can't kill anything due to not being able to scramble (realistically) and cruises flying so slow.
Could you not just stick a passive targeter on it? They wouldnt know they were being attacked until the missiles slam into their ship...unless they spot the missiles in flight.
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Herko Kerghans
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Posted - 2006.03.08 09:35:00 -
[10]
In most scenarios, people will notice you have just popped up in their overview.
Barriers - an EVE novel |
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Phoenicia
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Posted - 2006.03.08 09:39:00 -
[11]
Also, a passive targetter only removes the yellow "you have been locked by this person" box. As soon as you fire, the red "This guy just shot at you" box still appears as usual.
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The mods keep removing my siggies so all I get is this stupid text. |
VanDam
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Posted - 2006.03.08 09:44:00 -
[12]
tbh if u come across a smart ceptor pilot and u shoot him u r dead i love it when stealth bombers shoot me they die so quickly
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Arkios Odymei
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Posted - 2006.03.08 23:06:00 -
[13]
with passive targeters, they wont auto-target you back, which buys you a few more seconds while they have to manualy target you.
Originally by: Toros Revoke
ships are for carebears. Give me a fish bowl for my head (to keep space out) and smear me with lard, then armed with a toasting fork and an ak I'll take you all
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babylonstew
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Posted - 2006.03.09 00:29:00 -
[14]
dont train for them
and ill tell you why
the more people who fly them, the more demand and hence price goes up and i hate spending lots of isk on my tech 2 ships lol
And I have a brand new sig hijacker - Wrangler
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Isonkon Serikain
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Posted - 2006.03.09 00:41:00 -
[15]
I fly every combat ship except capital class. I found stealth bombers to be lame playing solo. train for it if you really think you'll be able to play in gangs of stealth bombers. Otherwise, spend you sp on something more rewarding...
Ison's notches |
Kyoko Sakoda
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Posted - 2006.03.09 00:44:00 -
[16]
Worth training for? Certainly, to level 4s. Worth specializing in, with Cruise Missiles 5 and Covert Ops 5? That's a different story. These ships have a very limited role, as previously explained. I have Cruise 5 and Cov Ops 5, but I don't hop into a bomber often at all. They're expensive to lose and really don't have much use except against arrogant interceptors and frigates.
Learn what it means to be Caldari - www.omertasyndicate.com |
Herko Kerghans
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Posted - 2006.03.09 02:44:00 -
[17]
What the Achura-Deteis lady said.
Bear in mind that SBs are probably the most expensive t2 frig to fly right now.
Using the Caldari t2 frigs as comparison:
A manticore is in the 25m ballpark (granted, it is the most expensive of them all), and in the regions I fly the Improved Cloak is around the 30m mark.
This means:
-Off the bat, you are paying some 50m. That is more than two Harpies, or four Hawks, or three Crows, or six Raptors.
-If you die, there is a good chance that your opponent will gain the cloak (30m); that puts your rival 80m ahead of you (you lose 50, he gains 30)
All in all... cooooool ships, but with current prices, they have a somewhat too narrow a use.
Barriers - an EVE novel |
Lienzo
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Posted - 2006.03.09 02:56:00 -
[18]
Their utility is strictly constrained by the environment in which they are deployed.
1)Can't quite belt hunt more efficiently than anything else.
2)Can't be used at a lowsec gate on a non-wartarget.
3)Dull to use at an underutilized 0.0 gate.
Anything else they are quite useful though.
They also get a hidden bonus to cruise missile sig radius or explosion speed or something. So having high missile skills is probably key to finding expanded use for them.
Some inty pilots say they have no trouble popping them, some bomber pilots say they have no trouble popping an mwding cepter. I've never been on either side of that problem, so I can't really say.
I tend to think ganking haulers with nanofibers might be a bit hard unless you uncloak <20km away.
Assault Missile Launcher Improvement
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Erotic Irony
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Posted - 2006.03.09 04:19:00 -
[19]
While the direct skill training seems light compared to the other tech two frigate ships, Frigate V and Electronics Upgrades V, I'd argue the indirect number of support skills needed is extremely high. The Nemesis and Manticore are especially hard, not only to fit, but to fly well without high capacitor, advanced weapon upgrades, electronics and navigation skills for example.
Add in cloaking, covert ups and the missile skills and you may be much more effective in an interceptor or assault frigate for a less than or equal skillpoints
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Herko Kerghans
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Posted - 2006.03.09 05:05:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Lienzo
They also get a hidden bonus to cruise missile sig radius or explosion speed or something. So having high missile skills is probably key to finding expanded use for them.
Small correction: the bonus is a reduction of sig radius (with max skills, makes cruisers hit as hard as std missiles against frigs), but it is not a missile skill: it's a ship bonus, increased with the Covert Ops skill.
Barriers - an EVE novel |
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PhalHell
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Posted - 2006.03.09 21:02:00 -
[21]
Edited by: PhalHell on 09/03/2006 21:05:16
To give you an impression of how hard they hit :
I have all missile skills at level 4 and cruiser specialisation level 2
I use precision missiles
Base damage is 607 kinetic HP for a radius 40 :
I use a target painter giving me 28% extra damage :
So base damage is 777 for a radius of 40
That is 19,4 damage per radius:
A crow has 36 radius so each misille hits 698
An avarage frig has 45 radius, so each missile hits 873
Manticore has 3 launchers; so each volley is 2619 damage.
Of course you need to deduce the ships resistance from that number.
The ares has the best kinetic resistance both shield and armor 45% and 50%. A tech 1 frig has an average of 30% kinetic resistance.
You stil are looking at at least 1300 Base damage per volley.
The opinions expressed herein are not necessarily those of my corps, not necessarily mine, and probably not necessary.
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Shinnen
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Posted - 2006.03.09 21:47:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Shinnen on 09/03/2006 21:48:05
Originally by: Ralitge boyter
As one of those crazy people with near 6Mil SP in missiles I have been told by like minded nutters, that these stealth bombers are really worth it.
Their potential for damage dealing is very big (for the size of the ship) and as so few people use them right now the element of surprize and amazment on the side of your prey is usualy enough to give you the upperhand.
exactly, in a small fleet these things are the winners.
edit: large fleet also i suppose... just make sure you cloak, shoot cloak shoot and ALWAYS DAMPEN!!!
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A Selfdestruct Proposal
My sig is good now?-Shinnen |
Shamis Orzoz
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Posted - 2006.03.09 22:12:00 -
[23]
They are good in small groups while extremely outnumbered, especially with a few recon ships.
But for most purposes, they suck.
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Fuazzole
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Posted - 2006.03.09 22:44:00 -
[24]
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
further more,....the ship's under covert ops are terific fun for scouting....nuthing mroe
the bomber is a poor atempt to give scout ships guns and fails badly
thier is fun in the ship, but unless your max the skills your not gonna get any were at all in combat, personaly i dont use any other missle ship so i would luve to have those Cruise missle skill points refunded
take those 2 months it takes to make the ship decent and put them into trainign Dread's...you'll wish u did some day
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Mikesnail
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Posted - 2006.03.09 23:55:00 -
[25]
manticore makes lvl4 encounter missions easy ;)
I did one in it earlier today against a mission total of 7 cruisers and 5 battleships (500k each BS).
Warp in at 100km, cloak and get a little further from them, then uncloak and start firing cruise missiles off at them, and they dont shoot back because of the distance. I didnt get shot at once during the mission.
I have to say though, i tried it because i thought it would be fun and challenging... it actually got quite boring
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