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Why the hell are HAC's so expensive?

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 6 post(s)
Jowen Datloran	Posted - 2006.03.13 22:17:00 - [181] Originally by: Rodney Caston the BPO owners have been monopolizing the market for far too long. CCP needs to start seeding the T2 BBO's in more common drops to eliminate the rarity and and restore balance to the free market. I'm monopolizing YOU Rodney Caston. I've already started production of cheap copies. ---------------- Main as main can be. Freelance producer of: Spike M hybrid ammo (1k/unit) Damnation command cruiser (200m/unit) Now with BYOM deal, see bio for details.
Bazman	Posted - 2006.03.13 22:27:00 - [182] I kinda hate the prices. I can afford to fly and lose them, but I honestly can't justify buying them at current prices, i'm not gonna line the pockets of the price gougers anymore. Besides, close range battleships absolutely blooter HAC's, and its much more satisfying to pop a HAC with a BS than it is to pop a BS with a HAC :P, go on, pay 200 mil for your Vaga's and Deimos' now, just makes it more fun for the auto-pest's, Blasterthrons, and pulsegeddons when they pop ya :P ----- Hi TomB! All out Do or Die Blasterboat for tier 3 Gallente battleship please! Make it look cool too. Thanks.
Blacklight	Posted - 2006.03.13 22:43:00 - [183] I dunno what the fuss is, we always have about 20 in the corp hangar and they're only 40m a pop Eve Blacklight Style
Bazman	Posted - 2006.03.13 22:45:00 - [184] Can i join your corp? :P ----- Hi TomB! All out Do or Die Blasterboat for tier 3 Gallente battleship please! Make it look cool too. Thanks.
Avon	Posted - 2006.03.13 22:45:00 - [185] Originally by: Blacklight I dunno what the fuss is, we always have about 20 in the corp hangar and they're only 40m a pop A choice of colours would be nice. The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
0bsession	Posted - 2006.03.13 23:00:00 - [186] Originally by: Dark Shikari Yet again, the vast majority of people who have HAC BPOs actually worked their arses off (unlike you) to get that BPO. Why should they be screwed for their hard work and you rewarded for your laziness? Its much more effective to release more BPOs instead. Does that include the vast majority of people who sold timecards and screwed over all those hard working players and bought a HAC bpo thru an auction? Facts... 1. pre-RMR, HACs were all over, running around 80mil. 2. post-RMR, HAC makers whine about not enough RAMs and so prices increased. 3. RAMs were released in bpos... prices still increase. Why? 4. HAC producers have more than enough materials to keep those bps in the oven full time. 5. Supply and demand? Hogwash... more like greed and gouging. HAC producers control supply.. simple. It justifies the major price increase... it has nothing to do with the buyers. Sure, there are morons buying HACs for 250mil... prolly the same players selling timecards for isk. They dont have any sense of hard work and effort for their isk or for the game. Dig deeper everyone... this is a snowball effect of many things.
Gort	Posted - 2006.03.13 23:19:00 - [187] Originally by: GoGo Yubari Edited by: GoGo Yubari on 13/03/2006 21:41:02 I cannot for the life of me understand why some items can't be more expensive than others. The build price isn't everything, premiums will vary. And it's all good. Keeps the plebs away from the cutting edge. QFT. Anybody priced a Domination Large Armor Repairer lately? Or a full set of Halos? How about the very real fact that I can buy two Vagas on the open market for the price of one Fleet Issue Stabber? This isn't Doom, where you get the guns and ammo free, folks. You want to fly a Reaper, you pay the price for a Reaper. Same thing goes for any ship. Move along; nothing to see here.... Sig: "Use the Correct Dread...."
R Dan	Posted - 2006.03.13 23:43:00 - [188] Originally by: spurious signal This is the exact same argument/discussion that happened 18 months ago regarding Interceptors. Back then Inties were new ships, and like any new technology the prices are always high to start with. You want to buy an HDCP LCD monitor now then you're going to pay a lot of money for it - "early adopters" pay for the privilege to use shiny new things before everyone else, and it's the same in EVE. Wait a while and the BPO supply will increase, the demand from the rich will slow down and the prices will drop. Eventually. In the mean time, if you want one of these ships you've got 3 choices: 1. Pay market price. 2. Get a BP and make one yourself. 3. Join a manufacturing corp that has BPOs for these things. Wrong Wrong Wrong! this stage has already happened with HAC's the price was high. dropped down and has steadily gone higher again. And its going to cntinue to rise for as long as 1) no new BPO's/BPC's arive and 2) people are willing to pay the higher price. In some respects its the same problem: they are rare. but unlike when the first come out a few weeks/months more of production isnt going to cover the demand for them. AS for the dudes that say you cant break into the T2 market. well the HAC BPO's are the pretty much the worst for that atm. feel free to check out the sales forum for other T2 BPO's though. there are many out there. People wont sell the HAC BPO's because the HAC's are such money makers atm. I will save you, but make sure you bring beer - Wrangler and cAKe - Imaran I thought it was bREe, omgi'mgivingawaymodroomsecwetsftl - Cortes when come back ... bring PIE. Me like PIE. -Capsicum
R Dan	Posted - 2006.03.13 23:50:00 - [189] Originally by: Jet Collins Now anouther thing I noticed in reading this forum, you builders( I would assume its the builders saying this) stated that it takes you 36hours to build a HAC... Well as I said above I manage to get a BPC and it was a long time ago but when I had mine built it only took about 10 hours, all say at most 24... so if its taking you guys 36 hours to build than I think you need to research your print a little and if your not than my guess would be doing this on prupose to keep the supply low(way to go builders), or maybe I'm totaly wrong. Firstly congrats on the BPC. Secondly you realise that creating that BPC has already taken longer/as long as building the ship would have taken. so an additional 10 hours would slow the production down from 1 every 36 hours to one every 46 hours..... secondly with prices how they are not using a BPO to its full potential is a REALLY stupid thing to do. and we aint that dumb. Those of you that know such things will know I'm part of a primarily T2 industrial corp. and i know we take the best care of our BPO's possible. I will save you, but make sure you bring beer - Wrangler and cAKe - Imaran I thought it was bREe, omgi'mgivingawaymodroomsecwetsftl - Cortes when come back ... bring PIE. Me like PIE. -Capsicum
Avon	Posted - 2006.03.14 00:22:00 - [190] Originally by: R Dan People wont sell the HAC BPO's because the HAC's are such money makers atm. Well, I buy my HACs at 40mil a pop, so our BPO's aren't exactly money makers. They are a huge strategic advantage, and it is hard to put an ISK value on that. The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
0bsession	Posted - 2006.03.14 00:42:00 - [191] Originally by: Avon Well, I buy my HACs at 40mil a pop, so our BPO's aren't exactly money makers. They are a huge strategic advantage, and it is hard to put an ISK value on that. woopie!
Al Thorr	Posted - 2006.03.14 01:11:00 - [192] Originally by: 0bsession Does that include the vast majority of people who sold timecards and screwed over all those hard working players and bought a HAC bpo thru an auction? Facts... 1. pre-RMR, HACs were all over, running around 80mil. 2. post-RMR, HAC makers whine about not enough RAMs and so prices increased. 3. RAMs were released in bpos... prices still increase. Why? 4. HAC producers have more than enough materials to keep those bps in the oven full time. 5. Supply and demand? Hogwash... more like greed and gouging. HAC producers control supply.. simple. It justifies the major price increase... it has nothing to do with the buyers. Sure, there are morons buying HACs for 250mil... prolly the same players selling timecards for isk. They dont have any sense of hard work and effort for their isk or for the game. Dig deeper everyone... this is a snowball effect of many things. Lets see how your "facts stand up to daylight shall we ...." 1) - Nope wrong - diemos 130 mil , cerb 85 mil. 2) - Nope - concerns were raised in tying HAC production to mission runners. Also Cerb got un nerfed and became the flavour of the month. 3) - as per answer to 2. 4) - Wrong yet again .You cant keep Bpos in the oven full time any more - otherwise you would never get anything out of it. Also CCP introduced even more un disclosed nerfs to t2 component building. 5) - You are so wrong yet again. And for that I feel sorry for you, as you havnt been able to grasp any part of any of the 7 pages of posts in this thread. As to Bpo holders controlling supply ..... well duh . One can only make the ships if you have the bpo / bpc - However you cant make more ships per week than the production time allows. So ergo the producers are being controlled by the Bpo. Congrats as to the people buying them for 250Misk - yup they are/would be morons - tho have yet to see a cerb go for that yet. It is painfully apparent that you have a problem about the game as it stands. And is a real shame, as to you not being able to post with you main character. no doubt to your own insecurity. Al Thorr "You cant polish a turd" - The new rendered font is living proof.
Maya Rkell	Posted - 2006.03.14 01:22:00 - [193] Originally by: Avon Originally by: R Dan People wont sell the HAC BPO's because the HAC's are such money makers atm. Well, I buy my HACs at 40mil a pop, so our BPO's aren't exactly money makers. They are a huge strategic advantage, and it is hard to put an ISK value on that. You do?! Bah, I pay 50. Digital Communist> The Jin-Mei are probably more profficient in training for Tofu and Noodles than Spaceship Command
Kyoko Sakoda	Posted - 2006.03.14 01:24:00 - [194] Originally by: Maya Rkell You do?! Bah, I pay 50. Awesome. Because I'd have to pay 150-200. Learn what it means to be Caldari - www.omertasyndicate.com
Maya Rkell	Posted - 2006.03.14 01:25:00 - [195] Not if you can catch Yvonne. I admit this can be hard. Digital Communist> The Jin-Mei are probably more profficient in training for Tofu and Noodles than Spaceship Command
0bsession	Posted - 2006.03.14 01:47:00 - [196] Edited by: 0bsession on 14/03/2006 01:47:27 Originally by: Al Thorr Lets see how your "facts stand up to daylight shall we ...." 1) - Nope wrong - diemos 130 mil , cerb 85 mil. 2) - Nope - concerns were raised in tying HAC production to mission runners. Also Cerb got un nerfed and became the flavour of the month. 3) - as per answer to 2. 4) - Wrong yet again .You cant keep Bpos in the oven full time any more - otherwise you would never get anything out of it. Also CCP introduced even more un disclosed nerfs to t2 component building. 5) - You are so wrong yet again. And for that I feel sorry for you, as you havnt been able to grasp any part of any of the 7 pages of posts in this thread. As to Bpo holders controlling supply ..... well duh . One can only make the ships if you have the bpo / bpc - However you cant make more ships per week than the production time allows. So ergo the producers are being controlled by the Bpo. Congrats as to the people buying them for 250Misk - yup they are/would be morons - tho have yet to see a cerb go for that yet. It is painfully apparent that you have a problem about the game as it stands. And is a real shame, as to you not being able to post with you main character. no doubt to your own insecurity. Al Thorr 1. around 80mil... i'll say it again, around 80mil. 2. umm... duh, not enough RAMs... trying to prove a point by wording it another way... bad attempt by you. 3. prices STILL increased... why?????? 4. we all know factory slots are by far open almost all the time. when i said that... i was assuming you were smart enough to know I meant... MAKE THE DANG BPO ALL THE TIME 5. i'll agree that supply is the problem... but you cant say its not price gouging. oil supply drops... gas stations are known to gouge... when there is a blackout, no power, people hike up price for ice... there is a desperate factor in HACs as to why people pay insane prices. 6. (just added) yet another attempt for a main to knock down an alt to try and prove he's so much more better. i know much more than you... being who I am, where I'm at... how long I've played... (3 years this may) .. alts are sometime mandatory for argument purposes. so, my respose to that... get over it.
Redblade	Posted - 2006.03.14 02:05:00 - [197] Originally by: Kantar U got just as much chance as anyone else, i made enough isk to buy 2 t2 bpo's in a week and so can anyone else if they put there mind to it and are willing to make the effort it takes. That's the beauty of eve's economy, u don't need to have a whole lot, there are no restrictions, simply put u can get what ever u want if u are willing to work for it. Noboby can mine as fast as you do m8. Dispite the huge profits u make from veld mining in yulai i did not pick up a miner once to make that isk
Deja Thoris	Posted - 2006.03.14 02:43:00 - [198] Originally by: 0bsession 1. around 80mil... i'll say it again, around 80mil. Oh so wrong. The rest of your post is prolly drivel too. Long pre RmR zealots, vagas, deimos and ishtars were selling far north of 110mill. Sure, you would find sac's at 70 odd but who wants one of them?
Meeko Gloom	Posted - 2006.03.14 03:18:00 - [199] Originally by: Cvuos From a bigger perspective, the production shortage is pretty awesome. The T2 market in Eve is possibly the most realistic economics simulator ever made. Real people with real opinions about virtual objects they really want, with a complete supply chain from raw materials to resale. CCP is all "dance puppets! daaaance!" QFT but the difference with this and the real world is that we cant research and make our ships better, make newers ones or advance in to the future. Everyone sees what it takes to be the best and they all run at the door at the same time, this is what is thorwing it out of wack. CCP released the command ships as the "advancement in Technology" but it is unreachable for most players and make the HAC players even more desprate to compete with the new Command ship threat. IMHO i dont think this cant be fixed cuz and harpy will always beat a merlin and people know that. so thats what they will go because it will save their butts also cap recharger II are trashed because there is no named counterpart that is equal to it Tech II BS market wont be that bad imo because the pilots for them will be ALOT smaller than HACS and AF Last but not least is the forums. The forums GREATLY determines the prices of these ships. Ive seen the ishkur have a 100% increase in prices as the RMR date drew near. (even after Tuxford new drone thread) If you hear someone talk about having a bad experince with a ship you are alot less likey to fly it. I simply want a deimos cuz it is a GREAT LOOKING ship, VERY flawed but great looking. like a very sexy woman but very dumb Im done typing my fingers hurt -------------------------- Guns dont Kill People Drones Do
Sim Frost	Posted - 2006.03.14 08:10:00 - [200] This issue was discussed months ago, which sadly means there has been zero solution for months. It will supposedly be fixed by Kali which means again zero solution for months.
Moghydin	Posted - 2006.03.14 10:58:00 - [201] Edited by: Moghydin on 14/03/2006 10:58:46 Originally by: Redblade U got just as much chance as anyone else, i made enough isk to buy 2 t2 bpo's in a week and so can anyone else if they put there mind to it and are willing to make the effort it takes. That's the beauty of eve's economy, u don't need to have a whole lot, there are no restrictions, simply put u can get what ever u want if u are willing to work for it. I'm quite tired of ppl saying how hard they worked to get their tech II BPO.In any case it involves either luck (several faction spawns in 0.0) or tremendous amounts of free time devoted to mining. And surely it was different in "good old times". How much did a decent BPO cost then? 1 bill? 2 bill? You can earn that much by mining non stop or by being very lucky with faction spawn loot. How about now? How much does the BPO costs for a HAC or Exumer - 40 bill? 80 bill? How about getting THAT much through "hard work"?
Avon	Posted - 2006.03.14 11:19:00 - [202] Originally by: Moghydin Edited by: Moghydin on 14/03/2006 10:58:46 Originally by: Redblade U got just as much chance as anyone else, i made enough isk to buy 2 t2 bpo's in a week and so can anyone else if they put there mind to it and are willing to make the effort it takes. That's the beauty of eve's economy, u don't need to have a whole lot, there are no restrictions, simply put u can get what ever u want if u are willing to work for it. I'm quite tired of ppl saying how hard they worked to get their tech II BPO.In any case it involves either luck (several faction spawns in 0.0) or tremendous amounts of free time devoted to mining. And surely it was different in "good old times". How much did a decent BPO cost then? 1 bill? 2 bill? You can earn that much by mining non stop or by being very lucky with faction spawn loot. How about now? How much does the BPO costs for a HAC or Exumer - 40 bill? 80 bill? How about getting THAT much through "hard work"? Er, if making enough ISK for a BPO is so damn easy, how hard is it to make 200mil to buy a ship? You are talking yourself around in circles. The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
Moghydin	Posted - 2006.03.14 11:27:00 - [203] Originally by: Avon Originally by: Moghydin Edited by: Moghydin on 14/03/2006 10:58:46 Originally by: Redblade U got just as much chance as anyone else, i made enough isk to buy 2 t2 bpo's in a week and so can anyone else if they put there mind to it and are willing to make the effort it takes. That's the beauty of eve's economy, u don't need to have a whole lot, there are no restrictions, simply put u can get what ever u want if u are willing to work for it. I'm quite tired of ppl saying how hard they worked to get their tech II BPO.In any case it involves either luck (several faction spawns in 0.0) or tremendous amounts of free time devoted to mining. And surely it was different in "good old times". How much did a decent BPO cost then? 1 bill? 2 bill? You can earn that much by mining non stop or by being very lucky with faction spawn loot. How about now? How much does the BPO costs for a HAC or Exumer - 40 bill? 80 bill? How about getting THAT much through "hard work"? Er, if making enough ISK for a BPO is so damn easy, how hard is it to make 200mil to buy a ship? You are talking yourself around in circles. I think I said quite the opposite. It WAS possible to earn enough for a BPO in the PAST by lots of mining or by great luck with loot (I never said it was easy even then). NOW (not in the past) you can earn enough for BPO either by ISK made from BPO's you already have or by trading with many billions already in your wallet (both options cut off the vast majority of Eve players). Hope it's clear now.
Avon	Posted - 2006.03.14 11:37:00 - [204] Edited by: Avon on 14/03/2006 11:40:21 Originally by: Moghydin I think I said quite the opposite. It WAS possible to earn enough for a BPO in the PAST by lots of mining or by great luck with loot (I never said it was easy even then). NOW (not in the past) you can earn enough for BPO either by ISK made from BPO's you already have or by trading with many billions already in your wallet (both options cut off the vast majority of Eve players). Hope it's clear now. Well, you are wrong. 40bil? That is what, a couple of weeks work for a decent corp? - an alliance should be able to make it much quicker. You said in the past it was easy to buy a BPO because they only cost 1 or 2 billion ISK ... well, that is still 5 - 10 HACs from the market. Are you trying to say it is harder now to earn ISK than it was then? I'd still disagree. The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
Alyth	Posted - 2006.03.14 11:58:00 - [205] Originally by: 0bsession 4. we all know factory slots are by far open almost all the time. when i said that... i was assuming you were smart enough to know I meant... MAKE THE DANG BPO ALL THE TIME Just to point out there....the changes that came to manufacturing with RMR means that the item no longer pops into your hangar as it completes. You now have to wait for the entire batch to complete. So if someone sets, say, a Deimos BPO going for a 20 run batch thats (20x36)/24 = 30 days that BPO is locked up and can't do anything with until the batch is complete. Then at the end of those 30 days you hit the deliver button, put 20 Deimos on the market and they are gon within a day or two. Sure it's 3.6 bill in the wallet but it's taken 30 days of sitting on your hands to get it. Perma-production just isnt feasible any more.
Moghydin	Posted - 2006.03.14 12:02:00 - [206] I wouldn't consider BoB corps an indication of what average corp in Eve can do. Not all corps are the same as not all players are the same. I think we have the situation here similar to the situation where I'd argue with some guy from Sudan that McDonald's hamburgers are crap and I prefer Italian cousine, while he'd be happy to eat anything.
Avon	Posted - 2006.03.14 12:03:00 - [207] Originally by: Moghydin I wouldn't consider BoB corps an indication of what average corp in Eve can do. Not all corps are the same as not all players are the same. So some corps are better than others, and thus manage to earn an advantage from that? Good. The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
Moghydin	Posted - 2006.03.14 12:08:00 - [208] Not all corps were founded 3 years ago by players with 100 bill in personal wallets. I'm talking about the situation where market and the whole system prevent even the slightest chance for most corps to be even somehow competitive to the chosen few corps.
Reiisha	Posted - 2006.03.14 12:16:00 - [209] Anyone who doesn't know exactly how supply and demand works should refrain from whining in this thread. We're getting basic economy in middle school as a mandatory course over here, but i refuse to believe we're the only country in the world that does that.
Testy Mctest	Posted - 2006.03.14 12:20:00 - [210] CCP's system is to blame, nothing more. Please don't pretend that if you could make 150% markup on selling anything, you would. I would. We all would. When they change the lottery (and they will), and/or add T2 BPCs as mission rewards, or something similar, prices will drop. Until CCP change the system, don't get angry at players for making money. The Eve Guild Wars Project!

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