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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 5 post(s) |
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
888
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Posted - 2014.01.15 03:13:00 -
[1] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote: So it's not hard enough to live in null, CCP should definitely make it harder.
If nullsec is soooo bad why do vast numbers of players pay the two major powerblocs tons of isk to rent? |
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
888
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Posted - 2014.01.15 03:20:00 -
[2] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:PotatoOverdose wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote: So it's not hard enough to live in null, CCP should definitely make it harder.
If nullsec is soooo bad why do vast numbers of players pay the two major powerblocs tons of isk to rent? how many is "vast numbers"? The whole of null sec was what, 11% of EVE characters and that sov alliannce members AND renters. Renters are not a real signifigant population in EVE. A look at dotlan of renter allainces (like the Goon's "co-prosperity sphere") wiill show you some relaly really small alliances. But....if the space is soooo bad, why are people paying to live there? Why not just stay in hisec? |
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
888
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Posted - 2014.01.15 03:48:00 -
[3] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote: It's like seeing an apartment building with 100 apartments and 3 of them rented and saying "if this building sucks so much, why are their 3 families in there?" lol.
Northern Associates. - 4859 members Brothers of Tangra - 5003 members Greater Western Co-Prosperity Sphere - 2856 members
Those are 3 of the 4 largest alliances in the game. Your analogy just doesn't hold water. Why would 11% of eve choose to live in sov if it was total ****? Objectively, that just doesn't make sense.
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PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
888
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Posted - 2014.01.15 06:01:00 -
[4] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote: Only if you ignore where people put the other 89%, sure.
Well, lets actually take a look at the different regions of eve. There are 5 distinct regions: Hi sec, Low Sec, NPC 0.0, Sov, and WH space. If there was an even population distribution, we could expect to see 20% of the population living in each region.
But, an even population distribution is a bit unrealistic. People can be risk averse, people could be inexperienced, people can simply be uninterested in pvp. Fact of the matter is, its unlikely that hi sec will ever have less than 40% or 50% of the general population.
So lets assume, for simplicity, that we have 50% of the eve population to distribute over Low sec, Npc 0.0, Sov, and WH. An even distribution between these more dangerous zones would put the population in each at 12.5%. Current Sov population levels are at 11%? Hmmmm, doesn't look that far off tbh.
Jenn aSide wrote: The problem isn't null sec sucking, it's that the rest of space has been buffed (or in the cas eof wormholes, 'added') while the last null sec buff (system upgrades scheme) was quickly nerfed soon after it's introduction. .... It's a broken situation, yet some people are in so much denial it's crazy.
Wrong. Facwar (and therefore lowsec isk generation) has undergone at least one high profile nerf in the last two years. Hisec underwent both the incursion nerf (which was quite significant) and the meta 0 nerf which removed a considerable source of minerals from missions and therefore revenue. The probing changes didn't do any favors for level 5 lowsec missions and unscannable eccm tengus. Both the probing changes and meta 0 nerfs affected NPC 0.0 income as well, since pirate missions are a significant source of income for those areas.
Just because you are ignorant of nerfs to other types of space does NOT mean they didn't happen. The only one in denial here seems to be you. |
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
938
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Posted - 2014.01.22 21:51:00 -
[5] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote: The ESS as it currently stands (the second incarnation anyway) is a fairly hefty nerf to highsec.
Not really. It just adds more competition on the production side of the lp market.
Interestingly, its pretty much the exact same thing that would happen if a portion of renters and nullbears moved out of null into hisec after a null nerf. More competition over lp markets. |
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
1036
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Posted - 2014.02.05 01:24:00 -
[6] - Quote
Honestly, I find it rather amusing that people have such a hard-on for hisec.
I mean, 130 pages of serious posting from Baltec of all people, god damn that's impressive. |
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
1049
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Posted - 2014.02.05 23:57:00 -
[7] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:Oh, one more thing: does a burger flipper get more reward for flipping burgers in a Macdonalds in The Bronx or in Wall Street? Nope, same minimum wage.
This is actually a pretty good point. |
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
1050
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Posted - 2014.02.06 01:37:00 -
[8] - Quote
Why should one group of burger flippers get payed more than another group of burger flippers? Whether you're running level 4's in a Raven, or running low end anomalies in an Ishtar, you're shooting the same exact red crosses (more or less).
There are high end anomalies in nullsec that are far more difficult than any mission in highsec, the kind of anomaly with a citadel torpedo of death at the end. Those sites are genuinely harder, require more effort and coordination, but also have a much higher payout.
I could get behind a change that made nullsec either have more high end sites, or make current low end sites harder/more rewarding.
But I think it's utterly dumb to nerf/buff one particular group of carebears over another group of carebears when both groups are doing the exact same thing. |
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
1050
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Posted - 2014.02.06 01:51:00 -
[9] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote: I know you potato, and I know from your posts you're smarter than that.
There is no anomaly in null sec or anywhere else that has a citidel torp. And the null sec "burger flippers" are supposed to make more (relatively speaking) because this video game has a risk reward scheme that says so (that scheme being one of the founding principles of EVE Online).
That "just buff null" thing is nothing more than "leave my high sec alone, even if the power creep involved in buffing null would hurt the game". It's irresponsible thinking.
https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/The_Maze
Its also not the only one with a citadel torp if memory serves. Of course this was from years ago when I actually did PvE, and maybe things have changed since then. vOv
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PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
1050
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Posted - 2014.02.06 01:59:00 -
[10] - Quote
I don't think nerfing hisec will solve anything. There exists a segment of the eve population that wants nothing to do with pvp or the large social structures in Eve. I don't pretend to understand their motivations, but they exist all the same.
These people won't move to null to become renters, fleet members, or targets. It won't happen. Nerfing hisec will alienate these people, nothing more. So we know the cost of this hisec nerf, alienating existing subscribers and maybe making some of them leave. Fine.
But what would be gained? I just don't see it. I see the downsides well enough, but I don't see the upsides. |
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PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
1052
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Posted - 2014.02.06 02:21:00 -
[11] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote: What is to be gained is that WE could ditch our high sec alts and actually live in our space (instead of being encouraged by the realities of the game to rent out the space for alliance income and make personal isk in high sec). We keep saying that, it isn't about making any of you do anything, it's about freeing us from a horrible imbalance.
Ok, we nerf hisec. Where does this train stop?
95% (statistic pulled straight form my ass) of Sov is **** compared to Running Lvl 4's in Stain or doing capital escelations in wormholes.
Will people then complain that they can't live in sov because their wormhole alts make far more isk? We nerf wormholes. Fine. Will people then complain that they can't live in sov because their npc 0.0 mission runners make far more isk?
Your problem isn't that you can't live in your space. You can, and you'll still make isk. Your problem is that the income from your space is sub-optimal compared to other options. Well guess what, it will still be sub-optimal after a hisec nerf (for most of sov anyway). |
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
1052
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Posted - 2014.02.06 02:26:00 -
[12] - Quote
La Nariz wrote:Nullsec alts that dwell in highsec will return to nullsec and become targets for other people, strengthening the farms and fields/bottom up income.
This bit would probably happen. But nerfing hisec seems to be an unnecessarily roundabout way of buffing null. |
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
1053
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Posted - 2014.02.06 04:12:00 -
[13] - Quote
E-2C Hawkeye wrote:La Nariz wrote: Citation needed. The data I provided that you still refuse to look at shows that is not the case.
Why do you think people would want to waste their time with your data? Your credibility is exactly zero. Surprisingly, Nariz, Baltec and their side of this discussion has been mostly constructive throughout the past 130 or so pages. They've provided reasoned arguments with data to support their position.
If you could point out any discrepancy in their data, that would be a far better way to support your position. Sitting in a tree and tossing your fecal matter at the other monkeys is not a good way to support your position, quite the opposite in fact. |
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
1057
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Posted - 2014.02.06 05:20:00 -
[14] - Quote
E-2C Hawkeye wrote: Please feel free to read back thru the 130+ pages where I stated why he has zero credibility . On top of that is his idiotic moronic claim to be a scientist . ( I am the Popes son)
This is irrelevant and a non-sequitor. What does him being or not being a scientist have to do with anything?
E-2C Hawkeye wrote: To provide viable data you first need to gather that data from an unbiased position. He cannot do this.
Wrong, in an actual scientific process anyone can submit data for peer review. This data is then checked for quality, errors, and veracity in that process. If the data survives the process of peer review, it is then published in a journal, where it is read and again examined for quality, errors, and accuracy. This is why later issues of scientific journals often have errata/corrections from previous journals.
They have provided data. Unlike certain conservative media networks in the U.S., when someone in the scientific community sees controversial data, they don't say "LOL BIAS," they inspect the data for faults. If they find them, they attack the data and the methods used to collect that data, not the author.
If you cannot find those faults, saying "LOL BIAS" or "OBVIOUSLY Wrong" won't help you, no matter how much you yell. Either show us in the data provided exactly where he's obviously wrong, or GTFO. |
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
1057
|
Posted - 2014.02.06 05:43:00 -
[15] - Quote
E-2C Hawkeye wrote: I am not the one providing bogus data and crying because my income was nerfed.
Looking at that data, could you point to any specific entry that is misleading, and why you think it is misleading?
Just calling something "bogus" without supporting evidence is kinda dumb. Instead of attacking the author of the data, why not attack the data itself? |
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
1061
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Posted - 2014.02.06 06:54:00 -
[16] - Quote
Kimmi Chan was kind enough to provide me with a link to stoicfaux's thread here, and also data that Kimmi Chan collected here.
The more or less consistent message from these 2 sources I see is that non-SOE level 3-4 missions can earn 30-60 million isk/hr.
Looking at the information from La Nariz, provided here, we see that an anom running ishtar can earn 65-75 million isk/hr. No data for carrier ratting has yet been provided, but given how increasingly often it is occurring in eve, I'd wager they make a wee bit more than the ishtar.
I suspect, given these figures, that rather than a blanket nerf to hisec, it is mainly SoE missions that may need some adjustment. This is also something CCP has alluded to. Whether the current changes that CCP applies to SoE missions will be sufficient is questionable. |
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
1073
|
Posted - 2014.02.07 00:44:00 -
[17] - Quote
Basil Pupkin wrote: b) The main goal of gankers were not freighters, but T1 industrials - they can be ganked solo and pay 50:1 to 100:1 rates on gank gain-loss ratio.
Is there a pamphlet or brochure somewhere on this? I feel like it would be negligent not to pursue solo 100:1 payouts. |
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
1076
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Posted - 2014.02.07 03:12:00 -
[18] - Quote
Scipio Artelius wrote: Hard too it seems. About 5 pages less now than a few minutes ago.
...
E-2C Hawkeye wrote: I feel like Mr. Smith from the MatrixGǪ.your very stench penetrates my every pour and seeps into my soul making me despise Goons and the CFC even more with every syllable I have to endure spewing from your vile putrid mouths.
Maybe not hard enough. |
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
1080
|
Posted - 2014.02.07 05:52:00 -
[19] - Quote
I tried reading this thread from the beginning. I tried reading it from the middle. I tried reading it from the end.
Holy **** this thread is a train wreck.
If you guys honestly believe this thread will sway CCP's (or anyone else's) opinion, well.....I do have an amarr-jita jump bridge for sale. |
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