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Redundancy
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Posted - 2003.09.10 19:51:00 -
[1]
We've got the go-ahead for public testing of the following deployable items (complete list includes some from before):
 Quote:
Small Secure Container
Medium Secure Container
Large Secure Container
Huge Secure Container
Giant Secure Container
Guardian Sentry Gun I
Sentinel Sentry Gun I
Amarr Mobile Refinery
Minmatarr Mobile Refinery
Caldari Mobile Refinery
as well as the "Anchoring" Skill
These items are currently available in the 6th division hangar of FCC ("Test Deployables") and will also require the "Equipment Can Config" role to be set. In FCC, we will start making that role available and grantable for members, as well as the hangar access. Please bear with us as we try to get to a state where everyone who is a member currently has access.
I will also attempt to make these items available to FCC2, although I'm afraid I have no access and no control over the roles or hangars, and cannot guarantee that it will be possible to deploy these items while in that corp (it depends on who has what controll).
(again, this comes down to the problems we're currently having - I will update this post when I know more)
Please post your feedback from testing these items, as well as short descriptions of bug reports and problems in this thread, as an overall summary.
Redundancy |
Jarjar
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Posted - 2003.09.10 20:04:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Jarjar on 10/09/2003 20:12:51
If someone can give me the role to grant 'em, I can help with that as well (I'm currently helping with hangar access  ).
Edit: Um, great...
1) Skill training doesn't work on chaos
2) Anchoring requires corp management 3, refining 3
Can't help ya'. 
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Redundancy
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Posted - 2003.09.10 20:24:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Redundancy on 10/09/2003 20:27:28
0.5) We're looking into that, but this may eventually have to wait on the copy from tq to be finally sorted out.
1) I've just tried, no problems. Could you get a bug report with a log in please? that's an important problem if it exists
(update) Abort training before you try and start a new skill. will bug report.
2) I'll get those skills added to FCC2 hangars when I can - although they sound like strange requirements.
Redundancy |
Tico
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Posted - 2003.09.10 20:33:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Tico on 10/09/2003 20:34:47
This may be a little off topic but, would it be possible to get some kind of training speed increase or something. Since the last time Chaos was mirroreed was in August we would have to retrain our characters to be able to use the stuff we are trying to test(ie mobile refineries). For some that may be awhile.
I know I really want to test out some of the new things we are getting but I will have to take timeout to train my character again.
I know you guys have other pressing issues with trying to keep the community happy and all. By the way is there any word on when Chaos will be mirrored again?
"That which does not kill you makes you stronger"
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Michel Licari
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Posted - 2003.09.10 22:08:00 -
[5]
Why oh why? No Gallente mobile refinery? What this? Bigotry in EVE...
'To fight when others fold, pursue while others retreat. conquer while others quit and make right when all else is wrong' |
James Baker
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Posted - 2003.09.11 07:27:00 -
[6]
Ok, took some time off to test the edployable items last night. Tested a Caldari Mobile Refinery and a 2 Sentinel Sentry Guns.
First off I like the not too large sizes of both items, as I could easily fit all 3 into my Mammoth without using expanders. Good choice :)
There is no trouble deploying for corp (IIRC the "Deploy for Self" is not working, so a decision on whether to include it or not would be great. Could cause confusion) for either item. However, the mobile refinery refuses to be anchored. I trained Anchoring to level 1 prior to test these items. However, it just gives you a message that anchoring will take 60 seconds, but after 60 seconds, nothing has happened. When you try to put ore into the refinery, it'll tell you that it needs to be anchored. When you try to start a refininig run (of course with no ore), it'll tell you that it needs to be anchored. So not much luck there. Of course I forgot to switch on exception windows, but I hope to be able to test it again tonight.
As for the sentry guns, they deployed nicely and anchored just as well. As for them working, I could not test that, as everybody is in Fight Club. Looks like I'm going to have to get some of my members over to Chaos soon....
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Helison
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Posted - 2003.09.11 08:16:00 -
[7]
I tested first without having the anchoring-skill:
Small secure container: required anchoring skill
Sentinel Sentry Gun I: I was able to anchor it.
Caldari Mobile Refinery: required "mobile refinery operation" skill
questions: Is there a way to say, who deployed a sentry gun? Who can unanchor the sentry gun? Only the owner/corp?
Can someone spawn some mobile refinery operation skills for fcc2?
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ROFL
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Posted - 2003.09.11 12:19:00 -
[8]
2) Anchoring requires corp management 3, refining 3
Is this confirmed? If so, its awfully stupid. The prereq skill for anchoring should not be corp management it should be instead leadership. Refining skill should only apply the mobile refineries.
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Discorporation
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Posted - 2003.09.11 12:50:00 -
[9]
Quote:
2) Anchoring requires corp management 3, refining 3
Is this confirmed? If so, its awfully stupid. The prereq skill for anchoring should not be corp management it should be instead leadership. Refining skill should only apply the mobile refineries.
Indeed. Anchoring should not be for refining CEO people only. Rather, it should be for field operatives. I'd make it a Leadership (or perhaps Navigation based) skill as well  .
[Heterocephalus glaber]
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Helison
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Posted - 2003.09.11 12:50:00 -
[10]
Quote:
If so, its awfully stupid. The prereq skill for anchoring should not be corp management it should be instead leadership.
Why leadership? Anchoring has nothing to do with leadership at all!
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Basilisk Bonita
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Posted - 2003.09.11 14:00:00 -
[11]
I¦m not playing on chaos due to lack of time, so perhaps someone could get some info through to me.
By which means do Sentry Guns interact? Can you tell them: "Hey, when player xyz shows up, start to shoot!"? Or do they act when they looked up the corp standing towards someone or a corp? Or do they look up the standing from the person who anchored the gun to the person who arrives? When dealing with sec-status, do they attack freely all -5.0? or all with +0.0? (when anchored by a -5.0 person)
[I can see Jim Raynor building up 100 guns at a gate, watching them and drinking coffee nearby. ;)]
What about refinerys? Can someone else come by, use them, and you (as owner) get the amount which is stated as "We take", which is dependant on the users refinery skill? Possibly an isk-charge in order to use the refinery?
Any info would be nice. :)
BTW, i would make the requirements for Mob-Refs something like:
- Refinery 5 (or even Refining Efficiency)
- Industry 4
Should be not so easy to anchor a MR in space and not possible for everyone from the start. It should be something the Producer/Trader is for. IMO
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2003.09.11 14:03:00 -
[12]
"Indeed. Anchoring should not be for refining CEO people only. Rather, it should be for field operatives. I'd make it a Leadership (or perhaps Navigation based) skill as well ."
... Maybe a combination of Science --one has to determine optimal point to anchor the object which can be tricky in space-- and Mechanic skill, being 'tis the aspect of objects one has to deal with when anchoring, no matter of what type the object is?..
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Lurk
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Posted - 2003.09.11 14:42:00 -
[13]
I'd suggest Mechanics 4, Science 3 and Navigation 3 for Anchoring and Refining Efficiency 3 as well as Industry 5 for a Mob. Refinery.
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Valeria
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Posted - 2003.09.11 14:48:00 -
[14]
As a CEO of my corp, I have lvl 1 corp management. My security officer (which has the role to deploy objects for the corporation) must now train up corp management 3? That doesn't make sense.
Refining does make sense... for mobile refineries!
For sentry guns, mechanic and leadership should do the trick.
Your 425mm Prototype I Gauss Gun perfectly strikes some nublar, wrecking for 1155.0 damage. |
Aki Ross
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Posted - 2003.09.11 15:02:00 -
[15]
I'd recommend a logical requirement - like Navigation (placement in 3d space) and Mechanic (used to handle large machines I believe?) or Industry - to Anchor.
Leadership and Corp? Machinery doesn't need discipline like players  . Mind you, Corp Management includes handling a Corp's assets, etc...
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Discorporation
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Posted - 2003.09.11 15:20:00 -
[16]
Quote:
I'd suggest Mechanics 4, Science 3 and Navigation 3 for Anchoring and Refining Efficiency 3 as well as Industry 5 for a Mob. Refinery.
I'd like the Anchoring pre-reqs like this (meaning I can train it instantly, hehe).
Suggestion;
Industry lvl4 + Anchoring lvl 2-3 for Mobile refineries (Secure containers then having Anchoring lvl 1 as prereq). Scale this all the way up to Advanced Anchoring lv x for stations ?
[Heterocephalus glaber]
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Basilisk Bonita
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Posted - 2003.09.11 17:17:00 -
[17]
uhh, yes. Advanced Anchoring. Stations. That sounds good.
No one any ideas on my other questions?
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ROFL
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Posted - 2003.09.11 17:28:00 -
[18]
Quote:
Why leadership? Anchoring has nothing to do with leadership at all!
Yes it does you silly goose! Imagine you're towing this big huge deployable thing. Someone has to make a COMMAND decision(leadership) and say when and where this huge expensive thing gets deployed. You're controlling corporation assets, as a leader.
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Snoop
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Posted - 2003.09.11 17:43:00 -
[19]
anchoring should need mechanic skills instead of corp management.
it makes more sense?
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Ruffles
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Posted - 2003.09.11 18:22:00 -
[20]
With all due respect, the skills should be easily accessible to all, low and high time in game.
After all, you have made secure cans the only way to drop-mine in a system, and the only option to ore theives, but you all seem to want to place such high skill requirements on them :S
Don't forget, people in the help channel advise newbies to the game to use secure cans, but they can't if they haven't the skills to anchor them, so for the first few days you are saying "Sorry, you need to use these to prevent that, but you can't use those until you trained level 4 this, level 4 that, etc".
Doesn't anyone else see that as rather unfair on them, and a potential support issue waiting to happen?
Mobile refineries, well, thats a different matter imo.
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Danton Marcellus
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Posted - 2003.09.11 18:45:00 -
[21]
No gallente refinary?
Convert Stations
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Silinary
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Posted - 2003.09.11 20:58:00 -
[22]
Quote:
With all due respect, the skills should be easily accessible to all, low and high time in game.
After all, you have made secure cans the only way to drop-mine in a system, and the only option to ore theives, but you all seem to want to place such high skill requirements on them :S
Don't forget, people in the help channel advise newbies to the game to use secure cans, but they can't if they haven't the skills to anchor them, so for the first few days you are saying "Sorry, you need to use these to prevent that, but you can't use those until you trained level 4 this, level 4 that, etc".
Doesn't anyone else see that as rather unfair on them, and a potential support issue waiting to happen?
Mobile refineries, well, thats a different matter imo.
I'll have to agree with this. The actuall skill of anchoring should either have no pre-reqs, or very little. This will allow new players to use the secure cans which are their only defence against ore thieves.
Perhaps then, you get a second skill to allow the anchoring of mobile refineries, sentry guns, hangers, what ever. Let those more advanced items require a certain level in Anchoring, or, require lvl 1 anchoring to note that a person has it, and then various (1 or 2?) skills that actually pertain to the item. mobile refinery skill could have refining, or refining efficiency + the anchoring, factories needing industry, or production efficiency, mobile labs? ...
Point being, if you need to anchor secure cans to be able to use 'em, even the small ones, then the requirements need to be lower then what currently is in place as needed. other option is to just tell the new plahyers they are forced to transport it in ship as most people started out doing in the begining, or they take their chances untill they get the skill.
You can do anything you set your mind to. |
Athule Snanm
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Posted - 2003.09.12 10:06:00 -
[23]
I agree - anchoring should be a low pre-req skill, but everything tasty you can use with it (ie the lot apart from secure cans) should have at least one level 5 pre-req, possibly more. Quite possibly high rank level 5s too for the extreme stuff like mobile refineries.
Whilst I'm not a believer in the 'it all finished with the end game' ethos, it is nice to have goals to aim for that are a bit more exciting than an extra 5% damage per shot or something. If the pre-reqs are low then a large number of people will have reached them already, effectively having reached the new 'end game' without having done anything.
Love all the ideas though!
_______________________________
Doomheim - EVE's only hygiene! |
Aki Ross
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Posted - 2003.09.12 10:11:00 -
[24]
You could just give Anchoring a Mechanic Level 1 or 2 prerequisite... its logical and since everybody buys Mechanic for expanders...
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Ruffles
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Posted - 2003.09.12 10:39:00 -
[25]
Smarter call Aki I think.
I think it does highlight two different perceptions sadly.
One side they want anchoring to be a high requirement because of things like sentry guns, mobile refinerys etc. On the other side they forced this on people for secure container use, so you can't make it a high level requirement. That really defeats the whole purpose of high sec space ore theft prevention.
Personally, I think they have two lines here which are completely different.
Anchoring: Rank 1, Pre-reqs something like Aki said, Mechanic 1 should suffice, that is achievable in an hour for most newbies.
Structural Anchoring: Rank 3, other prereqs as this might cover things of a bigger nature. Guns, mobile kit, etc.
Please make it reasonable, 1 month for level 5 on a rank 3 skill is harsh to patiently wait for just to drop something into space. Making that a pre-req, well, perhaps for things like stations, but don't go too far. Spending 1 month waiting to be able to do something isn't exactly a fun use of that month :)
However, bare in mind peole are dying to have other stations out there, if we keep making pre-reqs too high and costs too high, you will see very few stations, and perhaps people will just build them inside empire space. Plenty of empty space, encourage their use of it by making it not too demanding. :) Only my personal opinion.
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Aki Ross
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Posted - 2003.09.12 13:26:00 -
[26]
Suggestions:
Secure Containers:
Mechanic Level 1 and Level 2 (for Huge/Giant)
Anchoring Level 1
Sentry Guns:
Anchoring Level 2 (or 3)
Gunnery Level 4 (equivalent to Large Turret, a Sentry Gun is similar)
Mobile Refinery:
Anchoring Level 3 (or 4)
Industry or Refining Level 4 (or 5)
Just vague suggestions, but it would be logical to use Skills like Gunnery, etc
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2003.09.12 13:44:00 -
[27]
Edited by: j0sephine on 12/09/2003 13:45:15
"Secure Containers:
Mechanic Level 1 and Level 2 (for Huge/Giant)
Anchoring Level 1"
... Just a note, since (per your earlier suggestion) Anchoring itself would require Mechanic skill, it doesn't need to be repeated as requirement for the container anchoring. Other than that, all seems very sensible. =)
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Robomonkey
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Posted - 2003.09.12 14:13:00 -
[28]
Yeah, seeing as everyone will want to anchour at least secure cans, Anchouring should be a skill with very low to no pre-requisites.
Then implement an advanced anchouring skill which relys on corp management (for corp assets) and basic anchouring, for anchouring large objects like MR, Factorys, Stations.
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Ur Nemesis
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Posted - 2003.09.12 18:14:00 -
[29]
no gallente ones? or cant they make a nice looking one ? 
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Fusion
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Posted - 2003.09.12 19:38:00 -
[30]
Will A dev please post, whether or not there will be a Mobile Refinery for gallente, and why?
Thanks
Fusion
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