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Digital Messiah
ShockGear
364
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Posted - 2014.01.17 04:45:00 -
[1] - Quote
Would it destroy eve? Would the change from botters to Asteroid interaction make for a better eve? How do you think this would change EVE.
After playing this game for almost 8 years I feel we are in dire need to rework a highly exploited and semi afk game play that gains the least reward of any other activity for play time. Something clever |
Caviar Liberta
Moira. Villore Accords
400
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Posted - 2014.01.17 04:51:00 -
[2] - Quote
Digital Messiah wrote:Would it destroy eve? Would the change from botters to Asteroid interaction make for a better eve? How do you think this would change EVE.
After playing this game for almost 8 years I feel we are in dire need to rework a highly exploited and semi afk game play that gains the least reward of any other activity for play time.
Mining is mind numbingly and blood shooting from the eyes boring. People do other things while mining, watch a movie, chat with friends on eve, run another account, etc. |
Kryptik Kai
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
5440
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Posted - 2014.01.17 04:51:00 -
[3] - Quote
Give it a mini game like hacking and ore spew! "Shiny.-á Lets be bad guys." -Jayne Cobb |
Felicity Love
Whore and Peace Forsaken Asylum
1449
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Posted - 2014.01.17 06:17:00 -
[4] - Quote
... ice anoms should be nerfed, too.
No reason why isotopes, ozone, heavy water, etc., can't be relocated to ice, storm, plasma, gas and ocean planets.... and then bring in "ring mining" as originally hoped to give barges something else to do other than asteroids.
Or maybe I'll win the lottery.
Can't have a proper Apocalypse without "The Man", Johnny Cash. -áTrue story.
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Job Valador
Sovereign Colonies Armed Forces
540
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Posted - 2014.01.17 06:30:00 -
[5] - Quote
Turn mining barges into deployables. I am sure nothing would go wrong "The stone exhibited a profound lack of movement." |
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
921
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Posted - 2014.01.17 07:01:00 -
[6] - Quote
Given PI is a terrible interface and in dire need of updating (A nice high/med/low slot system per 'district' to feel like it matches what goes on with a Dust map/district and their socket system for designing the maps would be great) lets not apply it onto other systems as well. |
Dave Stark
4209
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Posted - 2014.01.17 08:37:00 -
[7] - Quote
considering the PI interface is borderline abhorrent, i don't think this idea would work out all that well. |
Altrue
Exploration Frontier inc Brave Collective
860
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Posted - 2014.01.17 09:35:00 -
[8] - Quote
Kryptik Kai wrote:Give it a mini game like hacking and ore spew!
You're the sadistic type aren't you ? I'm signature tanking !
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Victor Andall
Complexes and Abaddons
4
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Posted - 2014.01.17 10:21:00 -
[9] - Quote
I'm not a miner, but here's my 0.02 ISK: if mining doesn't have any sort of risk attached, (ganking, can-flipping), or require you to be actively being there, doing something, not being safely tucked away inside your quarters with an unopenable door, then expect everyone to do it passively. If everyone is doing it, the market crashes.
This is my oversimplified analysis. I just undocked for the first time and someone challenged me to a duel. Wat do? |
Bi-Mi Lansatha
RillaCorp The Kadeshi
284
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Posted - 2014.01.17 10:27:00 -
[10] - Quote
Digital Messiah wrote:...If mining used the same system as Pi... Why do you hate Miners so much!
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Random Woman
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
120
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Posted - 2014.01.17 10:55:00 -
[11] - Quote
Digital Messiah wrote:Would it destroy eve? Would the change from botters to Asteroid interaction make for a better eve? How do you think this would change EVE.
After playing this game for almost 8 years I feel we are in dire need to rework a highly exploited and semi afk game play that gains the least reward of any other activity for play time.
Well but not the way they designed PI. PI is a ******** clickfest. I have a lot PI chars, and for most of em i havent even bothered setting up the planets, for the rest i was not using PI for a very long time. Because PI is as much fun as eating glass. |
corporal hicks
The Council
12
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Posted - 2014.01.17 11:42:00 -
[12] - Quote
Maybe its me but I enjoy mining with friends, have a good chat on voice and see what your teamwork effort is gaining when your filling up freighters. Mining solo i'll agree is boring and multi-boxers can be put in the same boring bracket, mining with 12 accounts is still mining solo from a player point of view.
but making mining something like PI that you check on twice a day would just crash the market, so much passive income flooding the market would either crash it or to make the risk v reward balanced the yeilds would need to be alot lower and would drive the prices of minerals to crazy heights and therefore everything else along with it.
Can you imagine the price of trit if a 30 min extraction cycle on a resource extractor only pullied out 3000 scordite! |
Ptraci
3 R Corporation Boarderline Cartel
1692
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Posted - 2014.01.17 13:26:00 -
[13] - Quote
Felicity Love wrote: give barges something else to do other than asteroids.
Barges can do other stuff. Bait and tackle comes to mind. Ever thought about the lock time on a mining barge? |
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
90128
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Posted - 2014.01.17 14:17:00 -
[14] - Quote
Digital Messiah wrote: After playing this game for almost 8 years I feel we are in dire need to rework a highly exploited and semi afk game play that gains the least reward of any other activity for play time.
My fuel block production just from a minimal amount of Ice Mining highly disagrees. "He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."-á - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882 |
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
90128
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Posted - 2014.01.17 14:18:00 -
[15] - Quote
Victor Andall wrote:I. If everyone is doing it, the market crashes.
This is my oversimplified analysis.
No kidding. Show us all these market crashes the past 10 years............ "He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."-á - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882 |
Victor Andall
Complexes and Abaddons
4
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Posted - 2014.01.17 14:21:00 -
[16] - Quote
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:Victor Andall wrote:I. If everyone is doing it, the market crashes.
This is my oversimplified analysis. No kidding. Show us all these market crashes the past 10 years............
You're implying that everyone is mining and doing so passively. I might be misinformed on this topic but it wasn't my impression. I just undocked for the first time and someone challenged me to a duel. Wat do? |
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
90129
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Posted - 2014.01.17 14:29:00 -
[17] - Quote
Victor Andall wrote:Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:Victor Andall wrote:I. If everyone is doing it, the market crashes.
This is my oversimplified analysis. No kidding. Show us all these market crashes the past 10 years............ You're implying that everyone is mining and doing so passively. I might be misinformed on this topic but it wasn't my impression.
Your statement makes absolutely no sense.
YOU implied that everyone is passively mining in YOUR post.
Jesus. "He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."-á - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882 |
Etria Issen
Imperial Varista
38
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Posted - 2014.01.17 15:01:00 -
[18] - Quote
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:Victor Andall wrote:Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:Victor Andall wrote:I. If everyone is doing it, the market crashes.
This is my oversimplified analysis. No kidding. Show us all these market crashes the past 10 years............ You're implying that everyone is mining and doing so passively. I might be misinformed on this topic but it wasn't my impression. Your statement makes absolutely no sense. YOU implied that everyone is passively mining in YOUR post. Jesus.
Because in the hypthetical scenario where mining was like PI, and thus anyone with the skill could do it passively, that everyone would be doing it. Most people don't do mining now as it's active, and by active we still mean "about as fun as watching paint dry. But it's paint drying that you can do nothing but watch." |
Batelle
Komm susser Tod
1290
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Posted - 2014.01.17 15:12:00 -
[19] - Quote
Caviar Liberta wrote:Digital Messiah wrote:Would it destroy eve? Would the change from botters to Asteroid interaction make for a better eve? How do you think this would change EVE.
After playing this game for almost 8 years I feel we are in dire need to rework a highly exploited and semi afk game play that gains the least reward of any other activity for play time. Mining is mind numbingly and blood shooting from the eyes boring. People do other things while mining, watch a movie, chat with friends on eve, run another account, etc.
And the market is balanced around this. There are enough ISBoxed fleets of retrievers and semi-afkers to supply the needs of the economy. Therefore, mining is fine. "CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"
Never forget. |
Maldiro Selkurk
CHEMO IMMUNO RESISTANT VIRUS type X
126
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Posted - 2014.01.17 15:24:00 -
[20] - Quote
Ive replied to similar posts before. I think some things are overlooked when people look specifically at mining.
1. Good game design allows not only for different things to do but different play styles including degree of interaction required. PI for instance, set it up come back in a couple days and profit, mining slow and steady game play, pvp bursts of high activity followed by inactivity or low activity (loot grab, ship repair, travel to next pvp conflict). We need all these different 'tempos' as I like to call them so that all types of players can find a niche for themselves in our big crazy space game.
2. I think we all understand that different 'risk' levels are important in EVE and mining, especially in high sec is one of the lowest risk activities you can do.
3. Easy of start up is another plus for mining, perhaps as you start to become the Ol' Veteran you forget how confusing many of EVEs game playing options where when you first started and how mining presented itself as an easy to understand beginner profession.
4. If you find mining boring the solution is obvious find a new profession EVE has a lot of them. Yawn,-á I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really. |
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Rhatar Khurin
Happy Asteroid Ltd
487
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Posted - 2014.01.17 15:27:00 -
[21] - Quote
Really bugs me when peeps call miners botters....
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Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
2555
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Posted - 2014.01.17 15:30:00 -
[22] - Quote
I'd like to see mining having another layer added to it.
Actually finding the asteroid to mine. Not something as simple as the current scanning mechanic, but something more involved. But once you've found a rich asteroid, you can take some time on it, with multiple ships, in the current fashion.
Adds a new profession (prospector)
Add, in highsec, the ability to 'claim' asteroids. Where if you mine them and you're not in the same corp/fleet, you go suspect (give someone a kill right?), and you have a new conflict driver. And a reason to leave the NPC corps. Steve Ronuken for CSM 9! http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/
Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter |
Notorious Fellon
Republic University Minmatar Republic
121
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Posted - 2014.01.17 15:36:00 -
[23] - Quote
Why do you care what other people do in the game?
Miners can stare at space rocks all day for all I care. I don't do it; but if they enjoy it, then more power to them.
I would like to see a mini-game integrated into the process to stop purely AFK and bot-like behavior; but I only see at most 1 bot miner group out of every 100 jumps at most. In that same space, I see easily 100 players all mining, chatting, etc.
I see no need in hijacking a 90+ day training path into the equivalent of purely passive PI style lameness. Let's add *FUN* and add interaction, not remove it. |
Etria Issen
Imperial Varista
38
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Posted - 2014.01.17 15:49:00 -
[24] - Quote
Notorious Fellon wrote:Why do you care what other people do in the game?
Miners can stare at space rocks all day for all I care. I don't do it; but if they enjoy it, then more power to them.
I would like to see a mini-game integrated into the process to stop purely AFK and bot-like behavior. Note that AFK miner-botting is quite rare. Most are indeed at the helm chatting in the areas I pass through.
I see no need in hijacking a 90+ day training path into the equivalent of purely passive PI style lameness. Let's add *FUN* and add interaction, not remove it.
I don't think Miners have ever used the word "fun" to describe what they do, usually. They just do it because they prefer it to the alternatives, or because of the money they make or some such.
I mean, I can understand it somewhat. I once thought of doing it, as the money (in theory) sounded pretty good. What stopped me was realizing how mind-numbingly boring it actually is. I don't even get to see things explode! |
Victor Andall
Complexes and Abaddons
4
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Posted - 2014.01.17 15:56:00 -
[25] - Quote
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:Victor Andall wrote:Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:Victor Andall wrote:I. If everyone is doing it, the market crashes.
This is my oversimplified analysis. No kidding. Show us all these market crashes the past 10 years............ You're implying that everyone is mining and doing so passively. I might be misinformed on this topic but it wasn't my impression. Your statement makes absolutely no sense. YOU implied that everyone is passively mining in YOUR post. Jesus.
Because this entire thread is based on the hypothetical of making mining more like PI.
i.e. passive.
In which case anyone could do it with just some initial effort.
I was talking about this hypothetical. And said the market could crash.
You asked that if my theory is true, then why hasn't the market crashed already?
So what you did, was take my conclusion to a hypothetical premise and called it false.
Which is a logical fallacy because the scenario does not exist.
And so I said that if you're telling me to prove that I'm right by showing you the market crashes that have occurred you're implying that the scenario I was describing in my first post had already happened.
I can probably explain it even more convolutedly, if you'd like. But I really think that most people undestood it. I just undocked for the first time and someone challenged me to a duel. Wat do? |
Lexar Mundi
EVE Pilots for the Ethical Treatment of Asteroids
95
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Posted - 2014.01.17 17:09:00 -
[26] - Quote
Job Valador wrote:Turn mining barges into deployables. I am sure nothing would go wrong omg yes!
I like this idea. Miners may actually learn how to play the game to protect their crap! |
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie
NEW ORDER DEATH DEALERS CODE.
185
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Posted - 2014.01.17 17:38:00 -
[27] - Quote
Maldiro Selkurk wrote:Ive replied to similar posts before. I think some things are overlooked when people look specifically at mining.
1. Good game design allows not only for different things to do but different play styles including degree of interaction required. PI for instance, set it up come back in a couple days and profit, mining slow and steady game play, pvp bursts of high activity followed by inactivity or low activity (loot grab, ship repair, travel to next pvp conflict). We need all these different 'tempos' as I like to call them so that all types of players can find a niche for themselves in our big crazy space game.
2. I think we all understand that different 'risk' levels are important in EVE and mining, especially in high sec is one of the lowest risk activities you can do.
3. Easy of start up is another plus for mining, perhaps as you start to become the Ol' Veteran you forget how confusing many of EVEs game playing options where when you first started and how mining presented itself as an easy to understand beginner profession.
4. If you find mining boring the solution is obvious find a new profession EVE has a lot of them.
1. Good game design requires players to actually play the game periodically. PI requires some strategy and planning. Mining requires you to come back to the computer, click once. Drag ore to the station, click undock, click warp to asteroid field, approach a rock and hit f1. That's a total of 7 mouse clicks, 1 drag and drop, and 1 keystroke. I don't notice any strategy there. Its better when there's a fleet involved, but any activity that only requires thinking when multiboxing needs to be looked at.
2. Lets fix this
3. Easy start up makes it a trap for new players to fall into for awhile before getting bored and quitting. I do not disagree about complexity of any new system being an issue. If anything were implemented, it would need a simultaneous rework (and extremely heavy testing) of the tutorials.
4. Or you could join the new order and make mining less boring for the masses. It pains me every time I gank someone, but I take heart knowing that I have improved his gameplay esperience. New player resources: http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Main_Page - General information http://www.evealtruist.com/p/know-your-enemy.html - Learn to PvP http://belligerentundesirables.com/ - Safaris, Awoxes, Ganking and Griefing-á |
Notorious Fellon
Republic University Minmatar Republic
123
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Posted - 2014.01.17 18:02:00 -
[28] - Quote
Etria Issen wrote:Notorious Fellon wrote:Why do you care what other people do in the game?
Miners can stare at space rocks all day for all I care. I don't do it; but if they enjoy it, then more power to them.
I would like to see a mini-game integrated into the process to stop purely AFK and bot-like behavior. Note that AFK miner-botting is quite rare. Most are indeed at the helm chatting in the areas I pass through.
I see no need in hijacking a 90+ day training path into the equivalent of purely passive PI style lameness. Let's add *FUN* and add interaction, not remove it. I don't think Miners have ever used the word "fun" to describe what they do, usually. They just do it because they prefer it to the alternatives, or because of the money they make or some such. I mean, I can understand it somewhat. I once thought of doing it, as the money (in theory) sounded pretty good. What stopped me was realizing how mind-numbingly boring it actually is. I don't even get to see things explode!
I agree, and that is why I think we need to add fun and interactivity, not make it more passive.
PI is not fun once your first few facilities are set up. It is mostly passive and busy work (launching, hauling, moving heads, etc) |
Yonis Kador
KADORCORP
455
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Posted - 2014.01.17 22:35:00 -
[29] - Quote
-1 to the mini-game: (again) Mining already requires an insane amount of multi-tasking and math just to maintain a desirable level of efficiency. Folks who are mining afk do not care about efficiency. All miners do not earn isk at a constant or equal rate. 4 of the 6 mining ships in the game cannot mine efficiently without player involvement beyond 2 cycles and each ship type mines at a different rate. If you see a ship sitting in a belt doing nothing, bump it. That dude is afk. (But honestly, that dude should be ganked - not bumped.) However, if a ship is actively mining (or even better, actively mining in a system with no stations) - that dude either isn't afk or hasn't been afk for very long. Folks advocating for mini-games for sure aren't multiboxing or must be bored mining 'super-roids' in 'super-safe' null space. This is a terrible idea and it isn't getting any less terrible the more times it's introduced by people who apparently don't mine. If I could only mine efficiently by playing a mini-game, I would have no use for all accounts beyond this one. Multiply that by everyone else in a similar situation and I'm sure you'll quickly realize why this idea will never hit TQ.
-1 to claiming asteroids/belts: It has already been established that mining, like everything else in this game is pvp. But it is market pvp and doesn't involve beam lasers or missles. It's a mindgame. You're trying to outthink someone. If those guys were interested in combat pvp, they most likely wouldn't be mining. It's fine that people want to increase the amount of high-sec conflict drivers, but forcing miners to all become combat pilots isn't the way to do it. Suspect timers on exhumers for targeting my roid? Oh yeah. Great. Just reintroduce can flipping if you want to aggro miners. When someone targets a roid I'm mining, my response is to turn all my lasers onto every roid that person targets until they get frustrated and leave. They already have the option to wardec my corp, bounty me or gank me for my behavior. I see no reason they should be able to destroy my ships free and clear. And if they could, it sure isn't a buff to mining. You cannot force risk-averse players to become risk takers by starving them - and you cannot do it by bullwhipping them either. Miners already have to survey systems before commencing operations because belts respawn in reduced quantities. No large mining corp can exist in a single system now. I'm a peon and I mine in 3 regions. Most of my corpmates each mine in their own systems because each of us is capable of wrecking a system on our own. Now I need to have combat support everywhere I go? If this change is implemented, all belts should respawn fully-loaded and with increased volumes until they burst from being so 'super.' At least that way one system could support all of us and I'd have help at the ready. Otherwise, this is just a let's **** on the miners idea - again.
imo.
YK "High-five, fist bump, explode, implode, fist bump again, under-five, up-five, chest-bump...ohhhhh....call 911!"
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Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
4141
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Posted - 2014.01.17 23:17:00 -
[30] - Quote
Kryptik Kai wrote:Give it a mini game like hacking and ore spew!
Mwa ha ha ha ha!
We'll need to build an ark because the world will be flooded with botter and multiboxer tears.
Better yet, make it like DigDug where you gotta run around as some little dude making tunnels. |
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