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My take on a Tier 3 Min BS

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Uglious	Posted - 2006.03.30 22:17:00 - [31] Quote: i really, honestly don't know what to say to that How about--why not save yourself two low slots and not fit a third and fourth in the first place? As a die-hard vagabond and Sleipnir pilot (i.e. I said screw that to training missles), I hope for the 8 turret 1400mm devestator with a few officer gyro's and officer tracking enhancers. :)
bumcheekcity	Posted - 2006.03.30 22:18:00 - [32] Originally by: Eximius Josari Edited by: Eximius Josari on 30/03/2006 22:01:47 Originally by: HippoKing Originally by: Eximius Josari As for the dmg mods...2 of each fits just fine. but everyone else fits 4 of one type and gets a bigger bonus (about 20% more DPS IIRC) Actually...the stacking penalty affects them more. Each of my dmg mod sets will be more effective than their 3rd and 4th dmg mods, so I get the greater benefit. Welcome to the school of being a complete idiot. So, you'd prefer a 14%-ish bonus to your 4 missiles, and a 14%ish bonus to your 4 projectiles (ior whatever), than a 20%-ish bonus to 8 projectiles? YOu must get through a lot of ships. -- bumcheekcity Interseted in skills? http://geeksonline.co.uk/eve/includedfiles/xmlparse.php
Naughty Boy	Posted - 2006.03.30 22:19:00 - [33] Fun stuff indeed :) Been there done that... (see here). I'm not that interested in a wannabe typhoon... projectiles all the way. Sincerly Yours, The Naughty Boy.
Zysco	Posted - 2006.03.30 22:21:00 - [34] Edited by: Zysco on 30/03/2006 22:21:39 Originally by: HippoKing Originally by: Eximius Josari Originally by: HippoKing Originally by: Eximius Josari As for the dmg mods...2 of each fits just fine. but everyone else fits 4 of one type and gets a bigger bonus (about 20% more DPS IIRC) Actually...the stacking penalty affects them more. Each of my dmg mod sets will be more effective than their 3rd and 4th dmg mods, so I get the greater benefit. i really, honestly don't know what to say to that Hes not entirely wrong really. Really only the apoc fits weapons in all 8 highslots. Lets say one guy is flying a tempest with 6 autos 2 nos and has 2 damage mods. Those 2 mods are effecting only 6 highs. Meanwhile a phoon fits a bcu II and a gyro II, less effect but its effecting 8 highs so the damage mods actually have more of a bonus, if that makes sense. Also I'm really high if it doesnt so. Phoon post change will do the most dps of anything cept maybe a blasterdom. You just need max drone, proj, and missile skills to get it all out of it. callon > I don't like traveling much, i think its cause my father used to beat me with a globe. http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=300438New vid: "we're back
HippoKing	Posted - 2006.03.30 22:25:00 - [35] Originally by: Zysco Hes not entirely wrong really. Really only the apoc fits weapons in all 8 highslots. Lets say one guy is flying a tempest with 6 autos 2 nos and has 2 damage mods. Those 2 mods are effecting only 6 highs. Meanwhile a phoon fits a bcu II and a gyro II, less effect but its effecting 8 highs so the damage mods actually have more of a bonus, if that makes sense. Also I'm really high if it doesnt so. what you say does make sense. it shows that fitting different types of damage mods on a ship with split bonuses (bonii?) and hardpoints is more effective than fitting a single type. however, what our friend here is trying to say is that it is more effective than fitting a single damage mod type on a single weapon type ship, which is hugely wrong. sigs of the 23/24/25 hijack just as well -eris yarrrr, i shall retake my sig -HippoKing Not a chance, our 1337 sig haXx0r sk1llz are too powerful! - Wrangler Ho-Ho-Hooooooo, Merry Saturday!11 - Immy Yo ho ho and a bottle of BReeEEEEeee.... - Jacques ARRRRRRchambault Stop spamming with "QFT" >:\|. - Teblin
Eximius Josari	Posted - 2006.03.30 22:44:00 - [36] Whether I'm right or wrong, the following comes straight from QuickFit. All skills maxed. Megathron with 7x 425mm II = 261.022 DPS Megathron with 7x 425mm II and 4x MFS II = 457.224 57% increase Armageddon with 7x Tach II = 286.471 Armageddon with 7x Tach II and 4x HS II = 501.797 57% increase Raven with 6x Cruise II = 74.439 Raven with 6x Cruise II and 4x BCS II = 146.91 51% increase Typhoon with 4x 1400 II/4x Cruise II = 157.629 Typhoon with 4x 1400 II/4x Cruise II and 2x BCS II/2x GS II = 232.383 68% increase Now imagine that Typhoon with the soon to come launcher RoF bonus. ~From the maker of ActiveX and Sobeseki Pawi: The Third and Final Main :o
Eximius Josari	Posted - 2006.03.30 22:47:00 - [37] Originally by: HippoKing Originally by: Zysco Hes not entirely wrong really. Really only the apoc fits weapons in all 8 highslots. Lets say one guy is flying a tempest with 6 autos 2 nos and has 2 damage mods. Those 2 mods are effecting only 6 highs. Meanwhile a phoon fits a bcu II and a gyro II, less effect but its effecting 8 highs so the damage mods actually have more of a bonus, if that makes sense. Also I'm really high if it doesnt so. what you say does make sense. it shows that fitting different types of damage mods on a ship with split bonuses (bonii?) and hardpoints is more effective than fitting a single type. however, what our friend here is trying to say is that it is more effective than fitting a single damage mod type on a single weapon type ship, which is hugely wrong. How much does the stacking penalty affect module # 3? and how much does it affect module #4? all I have to deal with is #1 and #2 (twice over). I get more results for my slots. ~From the maker of ActiveX and Sobeseki Pawi: The Third and Final Main :o
Naughty Boy	Posted - 2006.03.30 22:50:00 - [38] Edited by: Naughty Boy on 30/03/2006 22:51:58 Originally by: Eximius Josari How much does the stacking penalty affect module # 3? and how much does it affect module #4? all I have to deal with is #1 and #2 (twice over). I get more results for my slots. ... but you get less from those slots to start with, regardless of stacking penalty, since each of those weapon upgrades affects less weapon hardpoints. Edit: it's going to be relatively worse for the typhoon (at least when compared to domi/arma) when CCP introduce drone damage mods. Sincerly Yours, The Naughty Boy.
Eximius Josari	Posted - 2006.03.30 22:52:00 - [39] Originally by: Naughty Boy Originally by: Eximius Josari How much does the stacking penalty affect module # 3? and how much does it affect module #4? all I have to deal with is #1 and #2 (twice over). I get more results for my slots. ... but you get less from those slots to start with, regardless of stacking penalty, since each of them affect less weapon hardpoints. Sincerly Yours, The Naughty Boy. That is immaterial Only the cumulative effect matters. The point of the 4 mods is to increase smg output period. it doesnt frickin matter how you have to do it, I get more for my 4 slots than you. ~From the maker of ActiveX and Sobeseki Pawi: The Third and Final Main :o
Eximius Josari	Posted - 2006.03.30 23:00:00 - [40] Originally by: Naughty Boy Edit: it's going to be relatively worse for the typhoon (at least when compared to domi/arma) when CCP introduce drone damage mods. Are they going to be high slot items? ~From the maker of ActiveX and Sobeseki Pawi: The Third and Final Main :o
Naughty Boy	Posted - 2006.03.30 23:01:00 - [41] Edited by: Naughty Boy on 30/03/2006 23:02:53 Originally by: Eximius Josari That is immaterial Only the cumulative effect matters. The point of the 4 mods is to increase smg output period. it doesnt frickin matter how you have to do it, I get more for my 4 slots than you. Okay. Originally by: Eximius Josari Are they going to be high slot items? Low slot, high slot "+1 drone controlled" mods are capital ships only. Sincerly Yours, The Naughty Boy.
Zephyrlin	Posted - 2006.03.30 23:01:00 - [42] Originally by: Eximius Josari Originally by: Naughty Boy Originally by: Eximius Josari How much does the stacking penalty affect module # 3? and how much does it affect module #4? all I have to deal with is #1 and #2 (twice over). I get more results for my slots. ... but you get less from those slots to start with, regardless of stacking penalty, since each of them affect less weapon hardpoints. Sincerly Yours, The Naughty Boy. That is immaterial Only the cumulative effect matters. The point of the 4 mods is to increase smg output period. it doesnt frickin matter how you have to do it, I get more for my 4 slots than you. Wow, now we've found another substance more dense than lead.... your skull. Let's look at it this way. Ship A: 8 turrets Ship B: 4 Launcher 4 Turret Both fit 4 Damage mods, Ship B fits 2 BCS and 2 Turret Mods, Ship A fits 4 Turret Mods. I don't know the exact stacking penalty, but let's make up some numbers for example purposes. Ship A gets: 8 turrets * 2 * 1.8 * 1.6 * 1.4 = 64.512 turrets worth of damage. Ship B gets: 4 Launchers * 2 * 1.8 = 14.4 Launchers worth of damage + 4 Turrets * 2 * 1.8 = 14.4 Turrets worth of damage = 28.8 total turrets worth of damage. NOTE: These numbers are NOT real figures, but simply meant to demonstrate how 4 bonuses affecting 8 turrets (even diminishing) is more effective than 2 bonuses affecting 4 and 2 more affecting another 4. ---------- And God said... "Let there be lasers, and let them go... PEW! PEW! ...."
Eximius Josari	Posted - 2006.03.30 23:12:00 - [43] Originally by: Zephyrlin Originally by: Eximius Josari Originally by: Naughty Boy Originally by: Eximius Josari How much does the stacking penalty affect module # 3? and how much does it affect module #4? all I have to deal with is #1 and #2 (twice over). I get more results for my slots. ... but you get less from those slots to start with, regardless of stacking penalty, since each of them affect less weapon hardpoints. Sincerly Yours, The Naughty Boy. That is immaterial Only the cumulative effect matters. The point of the 4 mods is to increase smg output period. it doesnt frickin matter how you have to do it, I get more for my 4 slots than you. Wow, now we've found another substance more dense than lead.... your skull. Let's look at it this way. Ship A: 8 turrets Ship B: 4 Launcher 4 Turret Both fit 4 Damage mods, Ship B fits 2 BCS and 2 Turret Mods, Ship A fits 4 Turret Mods. I don't know the exact stacking penalty, but let's make up some numbers for example purposes. Ship A gets: 8 turrets * 2 * 1.8 * 1.6 * 1.4 = 64.512 turrets worth of damage. Ship B gets: 4 Launchers * 2 * 1.8 = 14.4 Launchers worth of damage + 4 Turrets * 2 * 1.8 = 14.4 Turrets worth of damage = 28.8 total turrets worth of damage. NOTE: These numbers are NOT real figures, but simply meant to demonstrate how 4 bonuses affecting 8 turrets (even diminishing) is more effective than 2 bonuses affecting 4 and 2 more affecting another 4. Your first mistake was entering the discussion, your second mistake was insulting me for no reason, and your third mistake was totally FUBARing your argument. The penalty is not measured in a straight line. Try this instead: The base effect is 10. The base value is 100 Mod 1 = 100% of effect Mod 2 = 75% of effect Mod 3 = 45% of effect Mod 4 = 5$ of effect 1.10 * 1.075 * 1.045 * 1.005 = 129.75 new value (1.10 * 1.075) + (1.10 * 1.075) = 136.5 new value The only difference is my 100 is a 50 + 50. ~From the maker of ActiveX and Sobeseki Pawi: The Third and Final Main :o
Zephyrlin	Posted - 2006.03.30 23:15:00 - [44] 8 * 1.1 * 1.075 * 1.045 * 1.005 = 9.935 4 * 1.1 * 1.075 = 4.73 * 2 = 9.46 cough Math rules :) ---------- And God said... "Let there be lasers, and let them go... PEW! PEW! ...."
Eximius Josari	Posted - 2006.03.30 23:16:00 - [45] Originally by: Naughty Boy Edited by: Naughty Boy on 30/03/2006 23:02:53 Originally by: Eximius Josari That is immaterial Only the cumulative effect matters. The point of the 4 mods is to increase smg output period. it doesnt frickin matter how you have to do it, I get more for my 4 slots than you. Okay. lol okay now we are just getting into characteristics of weapons...not quite the discussion. Quote: Originally by: Eximius Josari Are they going to be high slot items? Low slot, high slot "+1 drone controlled" mods are capital ships only. Sincerly Yours, The Naughty Boy. I know the control ones will be cap only, and if the smg ones are low slot...that wont hurt the phoon at all, still has second largest dronebay and 7 lows. Unless you are refering to not fitting artillary for lack of powergrid. Which is also the case on the geddon as well. But my basic point still stands. Divided weapon systems are not inferior, just more skill intensive. ~From the maker of ActiveX and Sobeseki Pawi: The Third and Final Main :o
Kcel Chim	Posted - 2006.03.30 23:19:00 - [46] after reading just the first post i know why youre still in the patar tech school. The answer is no, we dont need such a ship. IF they actually planned on implementing such a ship i would suggest they just give everyone else their tier 3 and let the minnies hang with just tier 1 and tier 2 because such a tier 3 would really never be used (apart from the very special ppl who find the typhoon so welluseable and fitting) and from the rpers who kinda have to stick with it. P.S. we need more minnie nerfing. Our Skillpoint per ship ratio isnt high enough. I was thinking the other day about a tier 3 bs with boni to targetpainters and remote armor repairing. Simliar to our great carrier.
Naughty Boy	Posted - 2006.03.30 23:23:00 - [47] Edited by: Naughty Boy on 30/03/2006 23:23:15 Originally by: Eximius Josari lol okay now we are just getting into characteristics of weapons...not quite the discussion. It doesn't really matter which weapon/ship is compared, the graph shows exactly that you get more from 4 damage mods on a ship with 2 weapon types (guns + drones) than 4 damage mods on a ship with 3 weapon types. I could post more, even with analytic expressions of the whole thing, but i don't think it's needed. Originally by: Eximius Josari I know the control ones will be cap only, and if the smg ones are low slot...that wont hurt the phoon at all, still has second largest dronebay and 7 lows. Unless you are refering to not fitting artillary for lack of powergrid. Which is also the case on the geddon as well. But my basic point still stands. They won't hurt them, but in the damage scale they won't get such a potential damage increase from drone damage mods than ships like the arma and mega (even though those aren't likely to fit 2 times 3 damage mods in viable setups). Sincerly Yours, The Naughty Boy.
SargeMonkey	Posted - 2006.03.30 23:24:00 - [48] Don't we use Arty like railguns? Exept they draw more powergrid and CPU... I hate that. It's very odd that I can't fit 5 750's to my `Clone. Anyway, a 8 slot turret ship would be very fun, just make it so that it has a resistance to Nos and Webbers so it can use the 8 guns in either setting long or short range. Possibly moddify the fitting for Artillery so it can be used more efectivly. I think min ship's have the smallest grid of any faction... By making our long range turrets draw the most seems stupid by anymeans, its a freaking projectile weapon... Not a Laser or a Rail gun which both use a copiouse amount of power to opperate. That and they need cap to activate makes no sence, they sould at least have a 'free' fireing abillity. Also aren't we the fast ones? If so we should have fast BS's and our weapons should have HUGE traking rates. And a 10 m/s speed boost compaired to the others is... Dumb, also being the fast and close guys shouldn't the ships have an awsome Orbit rate?
Eximius Josari	Posted - 2006.03.30 23:38:00 - [49] Originally by: Zephyrlin 8 * 1.1 * 1.075 * 1.045 * 1.005 = 9.935 4 * 1.1 * 1.075 = 4.73 * 2 = 9.46 cough Math rules :) So you managed to figure out that all 8 slots being affected by 4 dmg mods is ultimately more effective than 4 + 4 being affected by 2 each. but not by much. 7 slot ships still fall behind. And if I really wanted to, I could add more dmg mods and leave every other ship in the comparative dust. My way is definately not common, but its much more versatile and arguably as effective. And I would rather see that on a tier 3. Reward those of us who really invest sp into weapons and not just gunnery OR missiles. Besides an 8 turret min BS would eliminate the need for the Tempest as the gunship. Thor at least wont make the Typhoon obsolete. Infact Thor could be made slower (130 m/s) with a smaller drone bay (75 m3) and fullfill the line just fine. The people crazy about guns can just fit one less than the pest + 1 more nos, and the people crazy about missiles can do the same in reverse. I like the idea our tier 3 could be a gunship, missileboat, or hybrid...all in one package. And for those really picky types, give it a 'type' 25% dmg bonus. ~From the maker of ActiveX and Sobeseki Pawi: The Third and Final Main :o
Eximius Josari	Posted - 2006.03.30 23:45:00 - [50] Originally by: Kcel Chim after reading just the first post i know why youre still in the patar tech school. Uh ok...how about this is my third main and I haven't been arsed enough to move him out of PTS yet? It's only been like 2 days. Quote: The answer is no, we dont need such a ship. We don't need an 8 slot gunship either. Quote: IF they actually planned on implementing such a ship i would suggest they just give everyone else their tier 3 and let the minnies hang with just tier 1 and tier 2 because such a tier 3 would really never be used (apart from the very special ppl who find the typhoon so welluseable and fitting) and from the rpers who kinda have to stick with it. If it is so important for you to only train gunnery...why are you Minmatar? Quote: P.S. we need more minnie nerfing. Our Skillpoint per ship ratio isnt high enough. I was thinking the other day about a tier 3 bs with boni to targetpainters and remote armor repairing. Simliar to our great carrier. This is the wrong thread for complaining about your race selection. And why would a BS have those bonuses? That's just silly. Our Carrier sucks...but that has zero to do with this discussion. ~From the maker of ActiveX and Sobeseki Pawi: The Third and Final Main :o
Eximius Josari	Posted - 2006.03.31 00:05:00 - [51] Ultimately I see these possible things for Min Tier3 BS: 8/6/5 7 or 8 turrets/2 launchers and has 2 projectile bonuses. 8/6/6 5 guns/5 launchers and has my bonuses. 8/7/5 6 guns/2 launchers with a gun RoF and a shield tanking bonus. 8/6/6 4 guns/6 launchers with 2 missile bonuses. Of those 4...I can see only one that doesnt mess up the BS line and doesnt screw with other race's uniqueness. ~From the maker of ActiveX and Sobeseki Pawi: The Third and Final Main :o
Zephyrlin	Posted - 2006.03.31 00:37:00 - [52] Originally by: Eximius Josari Originally by: Zephyrlin 8 * 1.1 * 1.075 * 1.045 * 1.005 = 9.935 4 * 1.1 * 1.075 = 4.73 * 2 = 9.46 cough Math rules :) So you managed to figure out that all 8 slots being affected by 4 dmg mods is ultimately more effective than 4 + 4 being affected by 2 each. but not by much. 7 slot ships still fall behind. And if I really wanted to, I could add more dmg mods and leave every other ship in the comparative dust. My way is definately not common, but its much more versatile and arguably as effective. And I would rather see that on a tier 3. Reward those of us who really invest sp into weapons and not just gunnery OR missiles. Besides an 8 turret min BS would eliminate the need for the Tempest as the gunship. Thor at least wont make the Typhoon obsolete. Infact Thor could be made slower (130 m/s) with a smaller drone bay (75 m3) and fullfill the line just fine. The people crazy about guns can just fit one less than the pest + 1 more nos, and the people crazy about missiles can do the same in reverse. I like the idea our tier 3 could be a gunship, missileboat, or hybrid...all in one package. And for those really picky types, give it a 'type' 25% dmg bonus. If you want, I can grab a crowbar so you can pull your foot out of your mouth, since you're so fond of putting it there. 7 Turret BS with 4 Damage Mods: 8.69 3(4) Turret/4(3) Launcher BS with 2/2 Damage Mods: 8.27 If you can wrap your mind around the simple math of this example, and the previous example I did the math on, you'll see that this percentage difference is actually LARGER than the straight 8 Turret/4Launcher&4Turret comparison. So, refer to what you originally told me after my first post. That applies to you. Learn to operate a calculator before making false statements. ---------- And God said... "Let there be lasers, and let them go... PEW! PEW! ...."
Kcel Chim	Posted - 2006.03.31 01:45:00 - [53] Originally by: Eximius Josari Uh ok...how about this is my third main and I haven't been arsed enough to move him out of PTS yet? It's only been like 2 days. commonly known as "alt" i guess ? Quote: We don't need an 8 slot gunship either. a 7 or 8 turret ship would be nice for a race whose base weapon is projectiles not missiles. So IF (and im not a real fan of tier 3 bs as a whole) we get a new bs, it should be "minmatar" and not caldari pansy crap. Quote: If it is so important for you to only train gunnery...why are you Minmatar? Im actually caldari, thank you. However since i play for more then 2 days (like your 3rd main) i have both gunnery skills and other skills maxed out or close to maxed out. tyvm. However that doesnt make a crap design better, especially since we cant assume everyone has 10 mil in gunnery, the average player prolly has 3-4 mil max. Quote: This is the wrong thread for complaining about your race selection. And why would a BS have those bonuses? That's just silly. Our Carrier sucks...but that has zero to do with this discussion. Im not worried about my race choice, im just tired of 2 day old alts coming to the forums telling how they think something should be fixed. When the main is either 2 month old and hasnt even reached this content yet (or enough experience to make a well thought through comparison) or when the main is some "insert random race" lover who just dumps another crap suggestion for a race he doesnt play. In short, your setup is craptastic, has bad boni, bad loadouts and prolly will suck. And before u make any further posts tell us what kind of role you had in mind for it and a "fitting" which would rock. As thats usually where the prank posts can be shed from the ones with a little thought behind.
Eximius Josari	Posted - 2006.03.31 01:45:00 - [54] Originally by: Zephyrlin Originally by: Eximius Josari Originally by: Zephyrlin 8 * 1.1 * 1.075 * 1.045 * 1.005 = 9.935 4 * 1.1 * 1.075 = 4.73 * 2 = 9.46 cough Math rules :) So you managed to figure out that all 8 slots being affected by 4 dmg mods is ultimately more effective than 4 + 4 being affected by 2 each. but not by much. 7 slot ships still fall behind. And if I really wanted to, I could add more dmg mods and leave every other ship in the comparative dust. My way is definately not common, but its much more versatile and arguably as effective. And I would rather see that on a tier 3. Reward those of us who really invest sp into weapons and not just gunnery OR missiles. Besides an 8 turret min BS would eliminate the need for the Tempest as the gunship. Thor at least wont make the Typhoon obsolete. Infact Thor could be made slower (130 m/s) with a smaller drone bay (75 m3) and fullfill the line just fine. The people crazy about guns can just fit one less than the pest + 1 more nos, and the people crazy about missiles can do the same in reverse. I like the idea our tier 3 could be a gunship, missileboat, or hybrid...all in one package. And for those really picky types, give it a 'type' 25% dmg bonus. If you want, I can grab a crowbar so you can pull your foot out of your mouth, since you're so fond of putting it there. 7 Turret BS with 4 Damage Mods: 8.69 3(4) Turret/4(3) Launcher BS with 2/2 Damage Mods: 8.27 If you can wrap your mind around the simple math of this example, and the previous example I did the math on, you'll see that this percentage difference is actually LARGER than the straight 8 Turret/4Launcher&4Turret comparison. So, refer to what you originally told me after my first post. That applies to you. Learn to operate a calculator before making false statements. That's well and good, but I don't know the actual stacking penalty. All I know is the DPS boost was much higher in quickfit. I could try with an apoc and see how close it gets. ~From the maker of ActiveX and Sobeseki Pawi: The Third and Final Main :o
Eximius Josari	Posted - 2006.03.31 01:50:00 - [55] Originally by: Eximius Josari Whether I'm right or wrong, the following comes straight from QuickFit. All skills maxed. Megathron with 7x 425mm II = 261.022 DPS Megathron with 7x 425mm II and 4x MFS II = 457.224 57% increase Armageddon with 7x Tach II = 286.471 Armageddon with 7x Tach II and 4x HS II = 501.797 57% increase Raven with 6x Cruise II = 74.439 Raven with 6x Cruise II and 4x BCS II = 146.91 51% increase Typhoon with 4x 1400 II/4x Cruise II = 157.629 Typhoon with 4x 1400 II/4x Cruise II and 2x BCS II/2x GS II = 232.383 68% increase Now imagine that Typhoon with the soon to come launcher RoF bonus. Apoc with 8x Tach IIs = 245.547 Apoc with 8x Tach IIs and 4x HS IIs = 430.133 57% Well what do you know? Quickfit disagrees with my math and yours too...(11)+(11) wins. ~From the maker of ActiveX and Sobeseki Pawi: The Third and Final Main :o
burek	Posted - 2006.03.31 01:58:00 - [56] Edited by: burek on 31/03/2006 01:59:04 Who would fly the split weapon BS = you Who would fly the 8 turret BS = all of us Ok, so surely we're all clueless... Majority of the minmatar purists have A LOT of skillpoint in gunnery. There is a reason for this. We like our guns!
Eximius Josari	Posted - 2006.03.31 02:03:00 - [57] Edited by: Eximius Josari on 31/03/2006 02:02:41 Originally by: Kcel Chim Originally by: Eximius Josari Uh ok...how about this is my third main and I haven't been arsed enough to move him out of PTS yet? It's only been like 2 days. commonly known as "alt" i guess ? Hmm...no not really. I don't have a main other than this one anymore...or won't once I sell my old one. Quote: Quote: We don't need an 8 slot gunship either. a 7 or 8 turret ship would be nice for a race whose base weapon is projectiles not missiles. So IF (and im not a real fan of tier 3 bs as a whole) we get a new bs, it should be "minmatar" and not caldari pansy crap. So the Tempest isn't Minmatar? The Typhoon isn't either? What about the Cyclone? None of them? I don't want a missile boat, what I want is a ship that uses both missiles and projectiles. Or did that obvious fact miss you? Quote: Quote: If it is so important for you to only train gunnery...why are you Minmatar? Im actually caldari, thank you. However since i play for more then 2 days (like your 3rd main) i have both gunnery skills and other skills maxed out or close to maxed out. tyvm. However that doesnt make a crap design better, especially since we cant assume everyone has 10 mil in gunnery, the average player prolly has 3-4 mil max. I happen to think Minmatar ships are great, especially with more than just gunnery skills. Amarr is the lazy race, not Minmatar. Quote: Quote: This is the wrong thread for complaining about your race selection. And why would a BS have those bonuses? That's just silly. Our Carrier sucks...but that has zero to do with this discussion. Im not worried about my race choice, im just tired of 2 day old alts coming to the forums telling how they think something should be fixed. When the main is either 2 month old and hasnt even reached this content yet (or enough experience to make a well thought through comparison) or when the main is some "insert random race" lover who just dumps another crap suggestion for a race he doesnt play. In short, your setup is craptastic, has bad boni, bad loadouts and prolly will suck. And before u make any further posts tell us what kind of role you had in mind for it and a "fitting" which would rock. As thats usually where the prank posts can be shed from the ones with a little thought behind. You have no real argument other than laziness, you want two gunship BSes...for no good reason? What would the Tempest be if your uber pest came out? PS: I was flying Min BSes 4 monthes before you even started playing this game. Oh...and I understand why you want simpler Min ships now...just to quote your corp title 'one day I might play Eve again instead of WoW'. Nothing further. ~From the maker of ActiveX and Sobeseki Pawi: The Third and Final Main :o
Eximius Josari	Posted - 2006.03.31 02:05:00 - [58] Originally by: burek Edited by: burek on 31/03/2006 01:59:04 Who would fly the split weapon BS = you Who would fly the 8 turret BS = all of us Ok, so surely we're all clueless... Majority of the minmatar purists have A LOT of skillpoint in gunnery. There is a reason for this. We like our guns! I love my guns too, but its silly to cater to just them when we are a two weapon race. ~From the maker of ActiveX and Sobeseki Pawi: The Third and Final Main :o
burek	Posted - 2006.03.31 02:09:00 - [59] Oh wait, I just thought of something... When do people choose to post with alts? When they are saying something that is or could be rather embarrassing to their main. That's right. Argue with that all you want.
Eximius Josari	Posted - 2006.03.31 02:20:00 - [60] Originally by: burek Oh wait, I just thought of something... When do people choose to post with alts? When they are saying something that is or could be rather embarrassing to their main. That's right. Argue with that all you want. Have you even looked at my sig? Yeah, omg what a revelation, the last two mains I had, one isn't even mine anymore, and the other won't be mine much longer either. I'm not an alt, stop intimating I am just because your argument is paperthin at best. I don't care what you think of me (most of you don't seem to realize that) what matters is the idea put forth. Either why it is good or why it is bad. Sofar I haven't heard much of why its a bad idea...just a bunch of whining and that cool sidediscussion about split weapon dmg mods. ~From the maker of ActiveX and Sobeseki Pawi: The Third and Final Main :o

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