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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
Maya Rkell	Posted - 2006.04.13 01:48:00 - [1] I'm saddened to read in EON that if you don't want to be a second class Eve citizen, you'll be needing DX10 and Vista. Firstly because this means no graphical upgrades for, likely, OVER another year. Secondly because the takeup rate of Vista will be far slower than even XP over 2k. Thirdly because there are NO other good reasons for the average gamer to upgrade to Vista Fourthly because DX10 will require a new graphics card, no matter what you buy in the interim. Fifthly because there are perfectly good ways to differentate rather than the "technical stuff" which EON talks about...you support certain cards, and the launcher auto-detects. Simple enough. I really look FOWARD to being a second class Eve citizen, I really do. It gives me great hope for the future of this game. (Sarcasm? ME? NEVER!) "The Human eye is a marvelous device, with a very little effort it can overlook all but the most glaring injustice" - Quellchrist Falconer
Nyphur	Posted - 2006.04.13 01:52:00 - [2] So your game won't look as pretty, big deal :p. Eve-Tanking.com - For the ultimate tanking spreadsheet and resources.
Sadayiel	Posted - 2006.04.13 01:53:00 - [3] Everytime i hear or read, that someone expect the brand new designs or projects of microsoft to do an awesome thing a cold feeling runs my spine... and TBH with currently graphic engines like half-life2 or doom3 CCP can make EVE graphics superb without a major upgrade needs -------------------Sig----------------------- S.S.E. currently recruiting new players. Convo me or leave an eve-mail. Suicide it's man way to tell God. You can't fire me so I quit.
The TX	Posted - 2006.04.13 01:54:00 - [4] and I have NO IDEA what we are talking about, or what exactly is changing... ----------------- LONDON PLAYER MEET Media Thread Mining
Maya Rkell	Posted - 2006.04.13 01:55:00 - [5] Originally by: Nyphur So your game won't look as pretty, big deal :p. Maybe. But there are likely to be bugfixes (or, well, different bugs) for GFX issues and such in the new engine...if I can have sound on with the new engine and get a deacent frame rate, that's an advantage. Ditto effects and turrets. Then quite possibly differences in the UI. And...and... Can'o'worms. "The Human eye is a marvelous device, with a very little effort it can overlook all but the most glaring injustice" - Quellchrist Falconer
Sadayiel	Posted - 2006.04.13 01:57:00 - [6] the TX in Eon there is some article about a new graphic engine for EVE that would come specially designed for directx10 user with Windows vista... -------------------Sig----------------------- S.S.E. currently recruiting new players. Convo me or leave an eve-mail. Suicide it's man way to tell God. You can't fire me so I quit.
Virtuozzo	Posted - 2006.04.13 02:04:00 - [7] Heh. Which Vista would that be :P Multiple editions coming out, even 32 and 64 bit versions. And if it's up to the damn EU possible yet another one. I hope the 2nd class type (ouch) eve engine will not conflict with the new one, and that CCP doesn't alienate the folks who play eve on the family PC rather then the tuned gaming beast :P I can understand people's concerns though, will be interesting. Virtuozzo RECRUITMENT TEASERS. Last words of a Caldari general: "Pull the Ravens back! Full retreat! they've got frigates!"
Nyphur	Posted - 2006.04.13 02:06:00 - [8] Originally by: Maya Rkell Originally by: Nyphur So your game won't look as pretty, big deal :p. Maybe. But there are likely to be bugfixes (or, well, different bugs) for GFX issues and such in the new engine...if I can have sound on with the new engine and get a deacent frame rate, that's an advantage. Ditto effects and turrets. Then quite possibly differences in the UI. And...and... Can'o'worms. Updates to the current engine would likely decrease FPS, not increase it. Eve-Tanking.com - For the ultimate tanking spreadsheet and resources.
Maya Rkell	Posted - 2006.04.13 02:09:00 - [9] So? Yes, there needs to be a new engine. Artificially restricting it to a small subset of your player base is what I call a questionable descison. Actually, I'd call it worse if I was to cut loose (I called the Frag Dolls shills on the front page of a website, for example). "The Human eye is a marvelous device, with a very little effort it can overlook all but the most glaring injustice" - Quellchrist Falconer
Nyphur	Posted - 2006.04.13 02:12:00 - [10] Originally by: Maya Rkell So? Yes, there needs to be a new engine. Artificially restricting it to a small subset of your player base is what I call a questionable descison. Actually, I'd call it worse if I was to cut loose (I called the Frag Dolls shills on the front page of a website, for example). As I understand it, they are making all the updates to the current engine that they can without taking advantage of Vista and DX10, then offering those that have these the extra options they afford by having a second graphics engine that takes advantage of them. They're doing the best they can, they can't magically make your game look as pretty without you getting the new software and hardware to support that capability. Eve-Tanking.com - For the ultimate tanking spreadsheet and resources.

Phoenix Lord	Posted - 2006.04.13 02:12:00 - [11] Originally by: Nyphur Originally by: Maya Rkell Originally by: Nyphur So your game won't look as pretty, big deal :p. Maybe. But there are likely to be bugfixes (or, well, different bugs) for GFX issues and such in the new engine...if I can have sound on with the new engine and get a deacent frame rate, that's an advantage. Ditto effects and turrets. Then quite possibly differences in the UI. And...and... Can'o'worms. Updates to the current engine would likely decrease FPS, not increase it. Not true. If the new engine will have compatability with DX9, then current users with nice graphics cards might experience an increase in FPS. This is because almost everything in EVE is run by the CPU right now, even the graphics. So offloading the graphics to the graphics processor may increase your FPS, it depends on what card you have. Oh and speaking of DX9... does the EON magazine (i still havent recieved mine -_-) say that current DX9 users will get prettier ships too? Please resize image to a maximum of 400 x 120, not exceeding 24000 kbs, ty - Cortes It was 24153bytes...
Maya Rkell	Posted - 2006.04.13 02:16:00 - [12] Vista and DX10 are not a magic wand, Nyphur. There is plenty of scope for building a modern DX9c engine which you can later upgrade to DX10. Moreover, a DX9c engine would be useable by ~95% (5% older laptop users) of players RIGHT AWAY, whereas Vista...by the END of 2007, there might, MIGHT be 33% of Eve's players using it. Being wildly enthusastic about its market penetration there. They're throwing a few scraps to DX9 users in the hopes we don't realise that we're going to be second class citizens. That stinks, afaik. "The Human eye is a marvelous device, with a very little effort it can overlook all but the most glaring injustice" - Quellchrist Falconer
Nyphur	Posted - 2006.04.13 02:32:00 - [13] Originally by: Maya Rkell Vista and DX10 are not a magic wand, Nyphur. I inferred nothing of the sort, but I do see what you're saying. I just don't think backward development is going to improve eve half as much as you think it will. They're doing a major overhaul, I'm sure they want it to remain effective for a long time and sticking to current technology might stunt the life of the upgrade. And right now, vista and DX10 are looking to be the next plateau in graphics capability so they're going with it. Eve-Tanking.com - For the ultimate tanking spreadsheet and resources.
Lorth	Posted - 2006.04.13 02:36:00 - [14] Do I also have to get Vista as well as a new graphics card?
Bhaal	Posted - 2006.04.13 02:36:00 - [15] You can't expect a gaming company to live in the past... At least they are giving us a choice, and we can still play the damn game even if we don't have the latest hardware & OS. I personally will NOT be switching to Vista any ******* time soon... Hell, I still prefer Win2k over XP... You can't expect CCP to not try to utilize new tech on the market... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero
Nyphur	Posted - 2006.04.13 02:39:00 - [16] Originally by: Lorth Do I also have to get Vista as well as a new graphics card? Only if you want your game to look uber pretty, as I understand. Eve-Tanking.com - For the ultimate tanking spreadsheet and resources.
PROTOCOL	Posted - 2006.04.13 02:39:00 - [17] Everytime a thread like this pops up I oft wonder of anybody looks at this from a business standpoint. They already have a decent dx9c engine. They have identified the need for a significant investment in a new engine, one that will carry them into the future. Developing any significant piece of software is a tremendous capital investment, an investment in a new graphics engine for CCP will have to return on their investment for quite some time, can you honestly say that a new dx9c engine will have a significant ROI in 2 years from now? How about 3? You may like to classify yourself as a second class citizen, the folks over at eve will more than likely refer to you as a first gen engine citizen.
Nyphur	Posted - 2006.04.13 02:40:00 - [18] Originally by: Bhaal Originally by: Lorth Do I also have to get Vista as well as a new graphics card? New GPU, Vista and I believe a min of 2 GB of RAM... As well as probably a 64 bit CPU, if you don't already have that... A whole new rig, basically. Eve-Tanking.com - For the ultimate tanking spreadsheet and resources.
Bhaal	Posted - 2006.04.13 02:40:00 - [19] Originally by: Lorth Do I also have to get Vista as well as a new graphics card? New GPU, Vista and I believe a min of 2 GB of RAM... As well as probably a 64 bit CPU, if you don't already have that... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero
Bhaal	Posted - 2006.04.13 02:42:00 - [20] Originally by: Nyphur Originally by: Bhaal Originally by: Lorth Do I also have to get Vista as well as a new graphics card? New GPU, Vista and I believe a min of 2 GB of RAM... As well as probably a 64 bit CPU, if you don't already have that... A whole new rig, basically. By the time Vista actually comes out, yes... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero

Lorth	Posted - 2006.04.13 02:43:00 - [21] Originally by: Bhaal Originally by: Lorth Do I also have to get Vista as well as a new graphics card? New GPU, Vista and I believe a min of 2 GB of RAM... As well as probably a 64 bit CPU, if you don't already have that... Errr... that esentually means for most gamers here, they will be required to upgrade most if not all of thier computer. That sucks, as I have a nice system now, yet will have to spend a fair bit of cash to play eve in 'pretty' mode.
Justus Imperius	Posted - 2006.04.13 02:44:00 - [22] Only thing I foresee really being bad with this upgrade and the fact that not everyone will be able to use the new engine, is that people using the old engine will still need QA and tech support for the old engine, and people with the new engine will need it aswell. That creates double the bugs. Or would people with XP still have the new engine just not the graphical intensity?
Phoenix Lord	Posted - 2006.04.13 02:46:00 - [23] Originally by: PROTOCOL Everytime a thread like this pops up I oft wonder of anybody looks at this from a business standpoint. They already have a decent dx9c engine. They have identified the need for a significant investment in a new engine, one that will carry them into the future. Developing any significant piece of software is a tremendous capital investment, an investment in a new graphics engine for CCP will have to return on their investment for quite some time, can you honestly say that a new dx9c engine will have a significant ROI in 2 years from now? How about 3? You may like to classify yourself as a second class citizen, the folks over at eve will more than likely refer to you as a first gen engine citizen. Since when did EVE-O use any DX9 graphical components? Please resize image to a maximum of 400 x 120, not exceeding 24000 kbs, ty - Cortes It was 24153bytes...
Fanjita	Posted - 2006.04.13 02:46:00 - [24] Originally by: Lorth Do I also have to get Vista as well as a new graphics card? If you wish to take advantage of directx 10 and its new graphical capabilities you would need vista as directx 10 wont be released for xp and a new dx10 graphics card. Although all current directx9c games will run just fine if not faster on vista with a current dx9c card. Vista will also be available as 32bit and 64bit versions. Will be a long time b4 i switch to vista though
Ovanvarr	Posted - 2006.04.13 02:50:00 - [25] I'm having a fleet battle at 1 FPS because all the ships I see are bump mapped and have missiles explode upon them in a fully DX10-esque explosion!
PROTOCOL	Posted - 2006.04.13 02:50:00 - [26] Originally by: Phoenix Lord Originally by: PROTOCOL Everytime a thread like this pops up I oft wonder of anybody looks at this from a business standpoint. They already have a decent dx9c engine. They have identified the need for a significant investment in a new engine, one that will carry them into the future. Developing any significant piece of software is a tremendous capital investment, an investment in a new graphics engine for CCP will have to return on their investment for quite some time, can you honestly say that a new dx9c engine will have a significant ROI in 2 years from now? How about 3? You may like to classify yourself as a second class citizen, the folks over at eve will more than likely refer to you as a first gen engine citizen. Since when did EVE-O use any DX9 graphical components? since when I don't know, but it is indicated in the sys reqs from the FAQ Minimum System Requirements: Windows« System 2000/XP OS Intel Pentium« III 800 MHz or AMD Athlon 800 MHz 512 MB or more of RAM DirectX« 9.0c (included) and latest video drivers 6.0 GB available HD space 4x CD-ROM drive A 56k or better Internet connection 32 MB 3D graphics card with Hardware Transform and Lighting, such as NVIDIA« GeForceÖ 2 class card or above To check whether your card meets these requirements check with your card manufacturer:
Rimme Ettakar	Posted - 2006.04.13 02:59:00 - [27] Does it really matter? I'm sure I'm addicted to Eve for the gameplay, not the pretty pictures or the the GUI (which can be pretty frustrating at times). I remember when I first got beta, my laptop wouldn't run Eve at all - that really sucked. Having an option for my laptop to run Eve on a "Second Class Citizen Version" will be great ... and hopefully my desktop can run Eve in "First Class Citizen Mode". RE
Phoenix Lord	Posted - 2006.04.13 03:12:00 - [28] Originally by: Double TaP Question: I've noticed people say you have to get a new graphics card to take advantage of the new system. Well I recently bought an invidia 7800 gtx... one of the best on the market i believe. I'm not going to ahve to buy a new gc to take advantage of vista dx10 right? It depends if DX10 will have new features like a new Shader Model or Pixel Shaders (the card you have has SM3 and PS3). But Vista seems a bit far off, so by the time it comes out, you might need a new card. Please resize image to a maximum of 400 x 120, not exceeding 24000 kbs, ty - Cortes It was 24153bytes...
Double TaP	Posted - 2006.04.13 03:15:00 - [29] Originally by: Nyphur Originally by: Double TaP Question: I've noticed people say you have to get a new graphics card to take advantage of the new system. Well I recently bought an invidia 7800 gtx... one of the best on the market i believe. I'm not going to ahve to buy a new gc to take advantage of vista dx10 right? dx10 cards don't exist so yes, you'll need a new card. Or you could jsut be like everyone else and not upgrade at all. Nothing wrong with how eve looks now. That was a rather expensive card. Kind of dissapointing tbh... I planned on buying Vist 64bit soon after the release. Hmm, will have to consider some things now.
Montague Zooma	Posted - 2006.04.13 03:20:00 - [30] Originally by: Lorth Errr... that esentually means for most gamers here, they will be required to upgrade most if not all of thier computer. That sucks, as I have a nice system now, yet will have to spend a fair bit of cash to play eve in 'pretty' mode. 'tis the bane of being a pc gamer. I buy a new system about once every four years. The first year is great...the second year it seems pretty good but not quite good enough...the third and fourth year I make do with lowering all the graphic settings and grumble a lot about needing a new rig. If it weren't for gaming, I could get by with my current pc (2003 vintage) for at least ten years. The 400mhz celeron system I bought back in '98 still works well for Internet stuff. But noooooo, I'll be getting yet another gaming rig sometime next year. ____________________________________________________________________ Open skies policies are signs of strength and courage, not weakness.



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