I'm considering putting bounties on them and turning them into normal rats.

I hate gunmining with a passion.

This thread is pretty awesome. You guys will get a few 0.0 changes this winter, smaller ones that should improve quality of life.

One thing I'm thinking about, but not entirely sure about is this: Putting bounties on drones instead of minerals. Mining used to be a viable way of making money in nullsec, but the increase in available minerals has driven the price down. I'm wondering if putting bounties on drones won't give mining a bit of a revival and put some life back in 0.0.

They need to reduce module scrapping effiency as well.

I have read somewhere DEVs reply about removing mineral drops from drones and putting something else on its place
Can you please give us update on this? Is this coming?

That's very nice change and players would be thankful.

The effect that drone minerals has had on the wider mineral market has been nothing short of catastrophic, but on the other hand I like the idea that the drone regions work a little differently and aren't just another NPC faction with bounties and loot drops like all the rest.

Is there some way to keep the drone regions unique, but changing them to drop something other than minerals?

Give them something similar to Sleeper 'tags' that are worth good Isk, but need to be 'handed in' for the bounty... and half the mineral drop, or more...?

drone ammo?
drone modules?
drone ships?
drone drones?

I have read somewhere DEVs reply about removing mineral drops from drones and putting something else on its place
Can you please give us update on this? Is this coming?

That's very nice change and players would be thankful.

Alongside Soundwave's drone region comments, something I'd like to see would be to stop modules dropping from NPCs altogether so that mining became the only source of minerals, and manufacturing of basic T1 items hopefully became a viable entry-level profession for hopeful industrialists. As things stand, alloy drops from the drone regions cripple the miners, and loot drops from the rest of space undermine the manufacturers (and the miners, if the loot is melted down).

If CCP ever gets serious about revamping the industrial side of the game, this would be a good start.

The ideal scenario would be for them to change to providing something that was neither a mineral faucet OR an ISK faucet but was still relatively useful and valuable.

That might require some fairly serious changes (stretching far beyond the drone regions themselves) though.

Maybe they could drop NeX items?

JES JES JES JES JEESSSSSSSSSSS!!!!

I should probably have added that as a consequence of ending loot drops, you'd need some way of manufacturing named modules.

Hmm.

A new line of manufacturing: meta 0 T1 module + looted drone alloy widgets = meta level 1/2/3/4 module?

They hinted at new faction items in the Exploration Dev Blog.

I am really hoping it is faction Drone Loot to go with possible bounties.

I might start running there Complexes then.

first they nerf the miniral ammount and now they take it away compleatly, now drone missions are going to be compleatly worthless.

I don't think CCP want to change invention too so no "kill named loot"

Maybe something like this:
- No minerals from drones!
- No dropping meta 0 items.
- Change amount of minerals you get when reprocess meta 1/2/3/4 items to very low amounts!

This way we are giving industry CPR and its easy to do.

Alongside Soundwave's drone region comments, something I'd like to see would be to stop modules dropping from NPCs altogether so that mining became the only source of minerals, and manufacturing of basic T1 items hopefully became a viable entry-level profession for hopeful industrialists. As things stand, alloy drops from the drone regions cripple the miners, and loot drops from the rest of space undermine the manufacturers (and the miners, if the loot is melted down).

If CCP ever gets serious about revamping the industrial side of the game, this would be a good start.

I don't think CCP want to change invention too so no "kill named loot"

Maybe something like this:
- No minerals from drones!
- No dropping meta 0 items.

This way we are giving industry CPR and its easy to do.

This only applies to DRF drones not the ones in deadspaces from missions or various sites.

Source.

I don't think CCP want to change invention too so no "kill named loot"

Maybe something like this:
- No minerals from drones!
- No dropping meta 0 items.

This way we are giving industry CPR and its easy to do.

^^ I love it... :)

DO IT CCP!
kill drone mineral drops!
kill meta 0 drops!

i just don't know... if all others know it... why CCP don't???
If all players proposing this for a long time... why CCP don't implement it??? or say why they don't want to implement it???

^^ I love it... :)

DO IT CCP!
kill drone mineral drops!
kill meta 0 drops!

i just don't know... if all others know it... why CCP don't???
If all players proposing this for a long time... why CCP don't implement it??? or say why they don't want to implement it???

- No minerals from drones!
- No dropping meta 0 items!

That two things is a MUST!!!

and third
- Change amount of minerals you get when reprocess meta 1/2/3/4 items to very low amounts!
would be a nice change...

after you do that... you will see what industry can become.

That's a big problem when you train all related skills and metalscrap processing up to at least 4, do you know how much training time is needed to get this "small" reward?

The amount of minerals coming from drones is exponential compared with items reprocessing, remember loot from rats is already nerfed and very often even frigates give better loot than BS's.
If you really want to nerf that too then give back the sp from metalscrap skill and those related.

EDIT: Or make it so when you reprocess mods you have a chance of get T2 minerals or total 0, in very small amounts but this would compensate I guess

IF it gets implemented, mining will be THE way to go to farm.
Really, with a damn-big ISK faucet being created, and a damn-big mineral faucet being destroyed, we could expect minerals to soar retardedly.
minerals doubling over 6 months doesn't sound too strange.

It was soundwave who said he wasn't a fan of how things are. I'll get the exact quotes, so I don't get anything wrong.






There you have it. They are clearly planning to change things, but nothing seems to be concrete yet and they are still looking for feedback.

I don't see any problems in making 100m/h mining in Null.
Still, people will dust hulks only when it'll be more profitable than whatever else they're doing.
at 40m/h null, 15m/h hisec, it comes out as "just" 80/30 with 2x prices, which means that incursions are still up.
Multiboxers, on the other hand...

My point is that rorqual-boosted hulk mining on pure arkonor should be #1 income.
Apart of metagame/trading activities, ofc.
It should be over incursions, L4s, sanctums (apart of titans running these.. lol)
The problem on it is that it's easily multiboxable, even at 5-10 clients.

semi-afkable if you're in deep 0.0, and even then you should be watching intel.
Else, you're gonna lose two hulks a day.

CCP is prolly laughing at wild speculation in this thread.

Removing compounds from drones is a bad idea as it is one of the largest sources of morphite in game and minerals in general. IF they do this i think i will put a huge investment into minerals as trit will go back up to 5.0 per unit.

CCP is prolly laughing at wild speculation in this thread.

Removing compounds from drones is a bad idea as it is one of the largest sources of morphite in game and minerals in general. IF they do this i think i will put a huge investment into minerals as trit will go back up to 5.0 per unit.

first they nerf the miniral ammount and now they take it away compleatly, now drone missions are going to be compleatly worthless.

CCP is prolly laughing at wild speculation in this thread.

Removing compounds from drones is a bad idea as it is one of the largest sources of morphite in game and minerals in general. IF they do this i think i will put a huge investment into minerals as trit will go back up to 5.0 per unit.

CCP is prolly laughing at wild speculation in this thread.

Removing compounds from drones is a bad idea as it is one of the largest sources of morphite in game and minerals in general. IF they do this i think i will put a huge investment into minerals as trit will go back up to 5.0 per unit.

Terrible changes, miners need to learn their place, its at the bottom.... where they belong.

Alongside Soundwave's drone region comments, something I'd like to see would be to stop modules dropping from NPCs altogether so that mining became the only source of minerals, and manufacturing of basic T1 items hopefully became a viable entry-level profession for hopeful industrialists. As things stand, alloy drops from the drone regions cripple the miners, and loot drops from the rest of space undermine the manufacturers (and the miners, if the loot is melted down).

If CCP ever gets serious about revamping the industrial side of the game, this would be a good start.

*TinFoilHattery* So Goons can create even more market havoc by terrorizing Gallente-space belt miners due to a newly introduced supply bottleneck? *TinFoilHattery*

Giving credence to "helpful" industrial ideas from Goons is akin to putting the revolver to the temple -- never a good idea if you want to live long and prosper.

Multiboxers, on the other hand...

then whats the point of industry in EVE...

Industrialists manage quite fine, its just the natural order of things that miners stay at the bottom where all labour classes belong. If that upsets you perhaps you should have higher aspirations than being the EVE equivalent of a burger flipper.

Terrible changes, miners need to learn their place, its at the bottom.... where they belong.

Industrialists manage quite fine, its just the natural order of things that miners stay at the bottom where all labour classes belong. If that upsets you perhaps you should have higher aspirations than being the EVE equivalent of a burger flipper.

What's wrong with multi-boxers? Every account is another sub - paid for by PLEX or cash, either way it's money in CCP's pocket - even if paid for by PLEX. What use will your PLEX be if no one wants to buy it?

Full disclaimer: I'm a multi-boxer

Alongside Soundwave's drone region comments, something I'd like to see would be to stop modules dropping from NPCs altogether so that mining became the only source of minerals, and manufacturing of basic T1 items hopefully became a viable entry-level profession for hopeful industrialists. As things stand, alloy drops from the drone regions cripple the miners, and loot drops from the rest of space undermine the manufacturers (and the miners, if the loot is melted down).

If CCP ever gets serious about revamping the industrial side of the game, this would be a good start.

That's exactly why it should be changed. Mining should be the primary source of minerals. The reason that people don't mine high ends much these days is that the supply from the drone regions totally undercuts their market.

As mineral prices rise and the supply from drone loot disappears.... more people will mine.

...
Thing is, you can't exactely multibox over 2-3 chars in L4s/Incursions/sanctums.
However, you CAN multibox 10+ hulks, or even more easily, mackinaws, at 90%+ efficiency.
...
Which you can't do with just about every other active moneymaking activity...

A few points: Do you really think a few hundred people ratting drones and reprocesing their alloays are bringing more minerals into the economy then all miners? WHERE ARE YOUR SOURCES ON THIS ONE!?

This is incorrect. Plenty of people multi-box running anomalies, including sanctums and havens. Countless pilots run their super capitals, capitals, battleships and T3s simultaneously.

Same goes for level 4 and 5 missions. Multi-boxing is a very common practice in these activities.

I can not speak for Incursions as I rarely run their sites, but it isn't very different from a difficult DED complex or Sleeper site where I also know people multi-box.

Do not make assumptions where you clearly have no experience.

tl;dr - countless people PVE multibox using the most expensive of ships every single day.

We are touching on 4 inter related game elements in this discussion, mining, salvage materials (from rats, rogue drones and player ships), loot drops (from rats, rogue drones, and player ships). All must be taken into consideration.

I routinely multibox 3 accounts - and i'm very aware you can do that.
But you can run ten SHOOTING ships at the same time?
The best i can see is running three ships with fighters assigned - Any more than that and you're losing in efficiency big-time.
Perhaps you can get 4, or 5 - but you really think you can get 10-15 ships on field, shooting? And not in laggy fleet pvp, in pve - where you have targets every 10s, or less.

Thing is, you can't exactely multibox over 2 - 3 chars in L4s/Incursions/sanctums.

@ CCP
In this thread are some nice suggestion how to revive industry... please... give us response...
Are you going to do anything on subject of rebalancing mineral faucets/drains ratio???


In state in what EVE is now there are huge problems on this subject.
The most of all minerals in EVE are coming from drones. And when you add up on that loot drops you are at the point where mining dont play significant role at all.
That is WRONG.
Mining needs to be THE largest SOURCE (If not only) source of minerals in EVE.

Think a little about it...
- Is it normal to go to mine with shotgun to mine???
- Is it normal that shooting down planes give you more materials for making new planes then mining? (WOW we have here Perpetual motion here)
- Is it normal that profession for which you must have PhD is giving you revenue of burger flipper proffesion?
- Is it normal that profession for which you must have PhD give you place in society for whitch ppl are saying "they need to learn their place, its at the bottom.... where they belong."

Well... all that "normal stuff" we have in EVE.

Lets translate that on EVE:

- You load your weapons on your combat ship and kill drones and rats to aquire minerals.
- You aquire more minerals (much more) with shooting drones and rats then with mining.
- Mining skill tree is larger then for some other, much more lucrative professions (now), and you the least revenue.
- Mining skill tree is larger then for some other, much more lucrative professions (now), and ppl are saying to your face "miners need to learn their place, its at the bottom.... where they belong."

You see something wrong here???
Ppl in this thread have solutions for this problem!!!



And about Manufacturing...

Manufacturing of basic T1 items is... well... dead...
And that is the first step for young players that decide to go indy way in EVE, and it is dead.
I think thats just wrong.

I will not here be writing real world comparisons (but I could do it) about it but i'll say it directly.
That industry is based on T1 meta 0 items... isn't it easy ko just remove that items from loot drops???
Easy and efficiently problem solved.


Revive industry in EVE, please.

Thnx you in advance.


*used intelectual property of many ppl in this thread.


-> updated first post.

A few years ago CCP were looking at a full revamp of industry ( I think it was going to be in Quantum Rise) but the majority of the planned modifications never made it into the game and were shelved for a later date, and as we all know CCP put a halt on using expansions to add useful features to EVE until recently.

I'd like to see CCP drag the idea down from the shelf again and cover all of the areas you mention as well as some others.

I routinely multibox 3 accounts - and i'm very aware you can do that.
But you can run ten SHOOTING ships at the same time?
The best i can see is running three ships with fighters assigned - Any more than that and you're losing in efficiency big-time.
Perhaps you can get 4, or 5 - but you really think you can get 10-15 ships on field, shooting? And not in laggy fleet pvp, in pve - where you have targets every 10s, or less.

A few points: Do you really think a few hundred people ratting drones and reprocesing their alloays are bringing more minerals into the economy then all miners? WHERE ARE YOUR SOURCES ON THIS ONE!?

I call shenanigans! And just puting bounties on rats will jsut be another Fauet driving Inflation.....no thanks, perhaps a different kind of loot if minras really have to got, which I doubt.

Second: Why should a 99% afk acitivity as Mining be the most profitable thing in game? I aggree that the amount of money you make nowadays is lower than it should be. But for sitting in a belt and watching TV you shouldn't be better earning then other professions BY FAR. Even with all the skills (and the skills for Mining aren't THAT many!) its still a thing my dog can do...

reducing drops from rats: They already got nerfed. All Meta 1-4 prices dropped significantly and Meta 1-4 are reprocessing as nicely as Meta 0. What would reducing Meta 0 drops bring? Nothing. Eliminating all drops and higehr Bounty: INFLATION, hell yea....erm wait....NO

All are crying about higher PLEX prices, even you all....and you wan to increase ISK Faucets even more? no thanks, you sound pretty egoistic. If I were a miner I'd be lad with a more interactive profession with a nice income instead of wishin for a 99% afk profession with highes income. Why not just give you free ISK/hour so you dont have to play at all?

Well perhaps it was the way that Zydrine & Megacyte prices tumbled by about 2/3 within 3 months of the drone regions being introduced that led us astray. Did you know that Zydrine used to sell for almost 4k/unit?

Do you really think that the few people who mine ABC in 0.0 are supplying so much ABC ore that they're keeping high-end prices at less than 1/3 of what they were in 2006, despite the vastly increased demand since then?

Incidentally, where do you get the "few hundred" figure from? Even discounting the (how can I put this delicately?)differently organic nature of many of the drone region inhabitants, there are an order of magnitude more than that.

Remove this mineral drops from drones its stupid. If ppl likes to mine allow them ! Dont ruin this game anymore. It was game about mining and fighting for resources. Mining should be the only source of minerals in eve.

Thank you

Mining should be the only source of minerals in eve.

Thank you

It is possible to solo/multibox a 40 man incursion, it has been accomplish. However, it takes a special setup and you can read about it here and the corresponding setup.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=24921

Also multibox lvl 4's easily as I run in window mode and use missile chunkers, isn't hard.

Spoken as someone who has never taken the time to train Scrapmetal Processing V...

If mining is to be the only source of minerals suddenly a lot of null-bears are going to be pissed when mineral compression stops working...

Spoken as someone who has never taken the time to train Scrapmetal Processing V...

If mining is to be the only source of minerals suddenly a lot of null-bears are going to be pissed when mineral compression stops working...

Who Cares ? Its just a game right ?
Miners should be one of the most important part of this game. I want to see this game as whole experience not only part of if !! If you love to mine a have fun with it ? great !!

Ccp forgoten about some players and they are paying for it... Right here , right now .. Coz some devs like soundwave etc.. Got WET DREAMS about holy molly umba power pew pew ! And now they may loose theirs jobs !! so manny misstakes...

Dear ccp try not to forgot that games are not only about pew pew.. Yes mr soundwave you to. I can give you eg. like farmville!!! yes yes dear ccp farmville! imagine those millions of Dollars without pew pew :)

Btw. Ccp here is a tip and its for free. If you want more female players.. You should know what to do. Mining !!! I know many female Miners! Some of them are moms etc but in most they are bored coz they cant get iskies !! Do something with it! Or hire me in advisory group :) (im game dev in rl and got some AAA titles under my belt. not joking :)

Anyway... Im not miner but i love to watch at huge mining OPs ! Its freaking great ! Really ! 20 hulks just after dawn!!! Nothing can match this

Im that one null-bear but without pve XD and i dont care about drones.. But drf and theirs bot-net cares.. For sure..

Fight for asteroids digging !!! Remove min drop !!!

Using multiboxing tools, ala click replicators, is (or atleast was) a bannable offense, i actually remember someone using 12 mouses stomped together to get around that.
With use of those out, i don't think he could manage 25 accounts: but stil.
You CAN do 10 accounts, but it'll be at a big loss of efficiency, and the point becomes more "woot 10 acconts" and less "woot 10x the isk" - running 3 separate missions on 3 separate chars is already kind of harsh (but perhaps i'm not trained enough)

Random Thought that needs working out:

Why not have drones drop moon-goo.......

Pros:
The lack of local sources of moongoo is one of the major hindrances to null-sec industry. Drone plexes are available in all spaces, thereby potentially providing a small source of goo to all regions.

The isk from tech moons rarely goes to individuals, but to Corp / Corp leaders. This would move some of that value back into Average Joe's pocket.

Cons:
The isk from tech moons is a major source of conflict within EvE. If you devalue the moon too much, it will no longer be such a tasty target.

Drone Belt Farming (*cough* botting ) has already shown its ability to massively influence the EvE market. If this is not properly balanced, the results could be devistating.

Can we please get ONE CCP-s response over here???
ONE thought on this subject???
Tell us are you even in a brief moment considered that some other part of game apart pew-pew would need some attention???

you have a point... I don't have hard evidence...
but...
read a little all forum discussions about mining and drones and loot in last 2 years and you will see many many good points on that...
like...
prices before and after drone regions were implemented... but... that's rubbish evidence to you... i know...

And where is your evidence on "few hundred people ratting drones" LOL
few hundred??? ...you must be joking... right???

I didn't say "put bounty" or "make more inflation"...
but...
whats the difference about monetary inflation and inflation of some goods???
I don't see a difference... minerals ARE isk for indy ppl!!!

And if you can AFK mine in low sec or WH or 0.0... then i applaud you...
then you are botter that make so much isk that would not give a damn even about few hulks lost per day... or are member of one huge 0.0 empire and mine in protection of large fleet...

and when we are at AFKing... whats then with AFKing lvl4 missions???
much more isk in there and are done afk...

And skills... no... they aren't long at all... hulk/orca skilling for max yield (no one would mine at all for anything less) and ok defense... that you can do in trial... /sarcasm off

and about drops... did you read what i wrote and what other ppl wrote... at least a little?
didn't think so...

end egoism... well... you are definition of it... just looking whats good for you... and not give a damn do you hurting other group of ppl...
even not not give a damn do your egoism hurting EVE itself...
it would be great for EVE that things get a little more $$$ so that ppl use T1 things too...
it would be great for EVE that ppl use smaller ships too... ships that are driven only by noobs and then forgotten...
it would be great for EVE that we see all range of ships in space and not only T2 and T3 variants with faction/deadspace fit...
it would be great for EVE that ppl use sub-caps over only SC blobs in low/zero sec...
but some ppl think larger -> better... well that's telling something about them...

"If I were a miner"
I know that you are not because you don't know what you are talking about...
and i think that CCPs intention isn't to make game with only one profession... because that game would be dead a long time ago...


* writing in hurry - sorry for errors

lol... gallente ice

Sounds like a troll spreading rumors there for must be a troll.