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Farjung	Posted - 2006.04.24 03:36:00 - [61] Originally by: Valea Silpha Pretty much THE standard rax set-up is 1600mm rolled tungsten, small neutron II, viscious tank. Pretty much THE standard rupture set-up is 1600mm RT, 200mms II, NOS, viscious tank. Pretty much THE standard duramaller set-up is 1600mm RT, medium pulse II, viscious tank. Now if people who use such set-ups are newbies or not isn't really the issue. Its the fact that those set-ups get chured out time after time and they kick AF's to pieces. Apart from the duramaller, those setups were made obsolete with RMR. Without the ridiculous 8 heavy drones, and with more grid to play with, most decent rax pilots use medium guns. The rupture can fit a 1600mm plate + medium autocannons with only one RCU II, and a decent 800mm plate setup as well, and anyone who doesn't use medium autocannons when it has two damage bonuses to them is wasting the ship utterly. --- Reckless Wave of Mutilation
Meridius	Posted - 2006.04.24 04:11:00 - [62] Originally by: ALPHA12125 Edited by: ALPHA12125 on 23/04/2006 13:30:03 Originally by: Cherubior Hi! Can anyone tell me why does it worth the huge mones to buy an AF instead a cruiser for 1/3-1/4 price? Cherubior its not worth it a rax/rupture/maller/caracal rapes them all the only reason would be that they are slightly more agil for raids but that is it What he said. _ __
Aeaus	Posted - 2006.04.24 06:00:00 - [63] A cruiser will wipe the floor with an AF, but do not discount them as very good ships. My Guides (Recomended Reading)
Aziza	Posted - 2006.04.24 09:02:00 - [64] Edited by: Aziza on 24/04/2006 09:02:56 Aziza. How about a throax with 5 jamming drones a scrambler, web, mwd and 5 rails. Your drones will be dead very fast if I am in ishkur and I do have more drones then you any way. Originally by: Purifier Then low slots like med rep, kinetic hard, therm hard, explode hard, and dmg control/other novelty. You would die. That is my normal thorax outfit, no nos. You probably would lose your lock right after aggression, then get owned by the rails (small or med rails do well). Or I could just use 5 drones with drone interfacing 5 which would also promptly own you. Just noticed that sounded aggressive and aimed towards you, sorry didnt mean it that way. Just kind of wondering what kind of AF would stand up to that punishment. Don't forget that I also can use 5 drones and with 5 mil sp in drones i am pretty sure they will do good. Not to mention that your rax need to come close, but I can and will hit you 30-40km away. Bottom line: yes, cruiser will own AF, if cruiser setup for it and pilot know what he is doing. Otherwise, -- hello egg. But same goes for all ship classes. Bigger ship will always own smaller ship, IF it's setup to kill smaller ships. ------------------------- Thank you
Ras Blumin	Posted - 2006.04.24 11:04:00 - [65] Originally by: Farjung The rupture can fit a 1600mm plate + medium autocannons with only one RCU II It can actually fit 4 d180s, mwd and 1600mm plate without an RCU. You only need RCU if you want medium nosf on it really. A dirty job - Released 2006.01.02
Farjung	Posted - 2006.04.24 17:45:00 - [66] Cheats! - But yeah, it was with med nos that I was thinking of (and those who claim that fitting nos is "specifically fitting for kill AFs", lololol :\) --- Reckless Wave of Mutilation
Cloue	Posted - 2006.04.24 18:10:00 - [67] Originally by: Dark Shikari Edited by: Dark Shikari on 23/04/2006 18:23:02 I will give 50 million ISK to any AF pilot who can beat my caracal without using ECM. I promise I won't use NOS. Man do u ever stop talking about ur caracel
Dark Shikari	Posted - 2006.04.24 18:18:00 - [68] Originally by: Cloue Originally by: Dark Shikari I will give 50 million ISK to any AF pilot who can beat my caracal without using ECM. I promise I won't use NOS. Man do u ever stop talking about ur caracel I'll stop talking about it if people stop saying stupid things like "OMG my AF can beat any cruiser" or "caracals suck for PvP" [23] Member: Official Forum Warrior What's with the blue robots? Click my sig. RAWR!11 Sig Hijack!11 - Imaran
Harper04	Posted - 2006.04.25 23:25:00 - [69] I fly enyos/ishkurs and vexors/thorax's...there isn't a single AF that scares me when I'm in a cruiser. In groups, yes, solo 1vs1 against me, not even a close fight. Many gallente pilots use explosive or thermal drones, and skilled ones use t2 drones. Standard setups: Vexor nos's the hell outa you, you die to drones. End of story. Thorax hits mwd, rams/scrams/webs you. You die. On the off chance you have an mwd fitted also, he sends out his drones anyways...you can either tank or run your mwd. (Hint: Shut off mwd, he catches you, you die...shut off tank/repper...well...you die )
Viktor Fyretracker	Posted - 2006.04.26 00:22:00 - [70] Originally by: Dark Shikari Originally by: Cloue Originally by: Dark Shikari I will give 50 million ISK to any AF pilot who can beat my caracal without using ECM. I promise I won't use NOS. Man do u ever stop talking about ur caracel I'll stop talking about it if people stop saying stupid things like "OMG my AF can beat any cruiser" or "caracals suck for PvP" your Caracal is also fully insurable, the AF is not and is a greater loss when they loose to the Caracal.
Dark Shikari	Posted - 2006.04.26 00:24:00 - [71] Originally by: Viktor Fyretracker your Caracal is also fully insurable, the AF is not and is a greater loss when they loose to the Caracal. Technically true, but unfortunately my Caracal's setup costs as much as an entire AF [23] Member: Official Forum Warrior What's with the blue robots? Click my sig.
Wrench Head	Posted - 2006.04.26 00:30:00 - [72] AF has a special purpose that suits itself to 0.0 life and mission work. High resists, good agility, low sig radius and the ability to vary its setup are the reasons for their popularity. But their price like anything T2 is not reflective of their true value. An ECM+NOS fitted Arbitrator with T2 drones will ravage an AF. 10M Vs 25M is just a silly PVP event. Of course pilot skill could tip the balance but not always. You cannot skill for ECM+NOS+T2 drones. Not with an AF. "If it aint broke, I cant fix it"
Lien Chi	Posted - 2006.04.26 04:21:00 - [73] Originally by: Wrench Head AF has a special purpose that suits itself to 0.0 life and mission work. High resists, good agility, low sig radius and the ability to vary its setup are the reasons for their popularity. But their price like anything T2 is not reflective of their true value. An ECM+NOS fitted Arbitrator with T2 drones will ravage an AF. 10M Vs 25M is just a silly PVP event. Of course pilot skill could tip the balance but not always. You cannot skill for ECM+NOS+T2 drones. Not with an AF. Amen to that. As a mission ship or medium-sec raider, an AF is an outstanding ship that's worth considering if you can afford it. It serves a purpose in the game, just like every other ship. For those who bray on and on about an AF vs. Cruiser fight, the answer is simple. If I kit my cruiser actively knowing I'm going to hunt an AF, chances are I'm going to beat it. However, if I'm engaged in a standard PvE 'rat hunt and get jumped by a skilled PC 'rat in a well kitted AF, I might be in trouble; especially if I'm in the Caracal.
Astrum Ludus	Posted - 2006.04.26 08:47:00 - [74] What are you using it for? In terms of a Vs battle it comes down to the fact that most T1 Cruisers are flow by new players and have T1 fittings (probably bad ones) where as a T2 frigate will likely have T2 fittings and an experienced pilot. Equal skills, fittings and experience would probably give the fight to a cruiser though.
Neon Genesis	Posted - 2006.04.26 09:01:00 - [75] t1 cruiser + brain > most AF's There, i just contributed nothing to your thread
Vanye Inovske	Posted - 2006.04.26 09:47:00 - [76] Yet another silly cruiser vs AF thread. Yeah, in a straight up 1v1 the AF will usually lose to the cruiser. On the other hand, the AF is vastly more likely to survive an encounter with a BS than a cruiser is. If you're a low sec pirate, maybe the question is "Which will do better at ganking a barge and then evading the miner's buddy's Raven?" (answer: neither, what you want here is an interceptor) If you're a mission runner, maybe the question is "Which will survive Portal to War 2/5?" (hint: not the cruiser) Maybe the question is "Which will provide better anti-tackler support in small gang combat?" (depends heavily on what the opponent fleet makeup is) In short, whether an AF or cruiser is better depends entirely on what you're looking to do with it. There are some things an AF can do with ease that will kill most any cruiser in about 30 seconds, and the reason some people pay "huge money" for an AF instead of a cruiser is because they want to do one of those things.
Usul Faust	Posted - 2006.04.26 09:54:00 - [77] I like AFs more than cruisers, but that's based purely on which ones i have more fun flying. anyway, the real question is: shuttles vs. noobships. no skills, just luck.
Undo Control	Posted - 2006.04.26 09:57:00 - [78] in my rettribution i can easily take on 14 crusiers at the same time (one of the cosmos spawns) and take them all down, i think i woud have trouble doing that in a maller So, for PVE, yes the AF is worth it
Dark Shikari	Posted - 2006.04.26 09:58:00 - [79] Originally by: Undo Control in my rettribution i can easily take on 14 crusiers at the same time (one of the cosmos spawns) and take them all down, i think i woud have trouble doing that in a maller So, for PVE, yes the AF is worth it I don't think you'd have trouble doing that in a maller, but yes the AF is generally better in PvE. [23] Member: Official Forum Warrior What's with the blue robots? Click my sig.
Frools	Posted - 2006.04.26 10:41:00 - [80] Originally by: Degale cruisers are better but AF have speed and agility, an AF can outrun anything it cant outgun. Speed is a pirates best friend. If you want to take anything that comes, fly a battleship. If you want to be able to chase things down that dont want to fight you, fly something with a little speed. my plated omen is only about 40m/s slower than my unplated retribution, both with t2 ab i love my retribution, its an excellent 0.0 ratting ship and its pwned every AF i've tested against (not pvp'd in it, prefer an inty or cruiser for that ) but my omen would shred it so fast only thing i'd have trouble killing is probably a wolf/jag, t2 minnie armour resists are just not fair
MuShRoOm ChAmPiOn	Posted - 2006.04.26 11:03:00 - [81] Assault frigates are good as tacklers and hit n run gangs. I've taken down cruisers in my AF, but mostly n00bs that give out less damage with cruiser sized weapons than my small guns. If your gonna beat a cruiser in an assualt frigate, your gonna need to play evasively. Nos isnt really needed either, most cruisers fitted for PVP can tank assault frigates, and deal damage that will easily take down an assault frigate.. They are basically a novelty toy :)
Testy Mctest	Posted - 2006.04.26 13:17:00 - [82] Cruisers beat AFs hands down assuming equal skilled pilots. A close range cruiser will hit an AF generally with no problems using medium guns and/or drones, and a long range cruiser will generally pop an AF pretty quickly. Where AFs shine is in destroying targets of their own size (other assault frigates, T1 frigates, and inties) or in packs versus targets much larger than their own size that have problems hitting them effectively (battleships, or long range equipped cruisers if they can get on top of them without dying). Testy's Eve Blog!
Antaran Karsh	Posted - 2006.04.26 13:19:00 - [83] Edited by: Antaran Karsh on 26/04/2006 13:19:13
Waut	Posted - 2006.04.26 13:20:00 - [84] Originally by: Cherubior Hi! Can anyone tell me why does it worth the huge mones to buy an AF instead a cruiser for 1/3-1/4 price? Cherubior AF's are sexier In Soviet EVE, roids pop YOU
Hungry Eyes	Posted - 2006.04.26 14:29:00 - [85] Edited by: Hungry Eyes on 26/04/2006 14:32:58 rupture with double webs, 2 med noses, a 1600mm, a rep and resists in lows will melt any frig, i swear doesnt matter what else is in the highs
Hungry Eyes	Posted - 2006.04.26 14:31:00 - [86] Originally by: Testy Mctest Cruisers beat AFs hands down assuming equal skilled pilots. A close range cruiser will hit an AF generally with no problems using medium guns and/or drones, and a long range cruiser will generally pop an AF pretty quickly. Where AFs shine is in destroying targets of their own size (other assault frigates, T1 frigates, and inties) or in packs versus targets much larger than their own size that have problems hitting them effectively (battleships, or long range equipped cruisers if they can get on top of them without dying). oh, inties also melt AF's.. due to a much higher damage output and small sig radius.
TeamBETAalpha	Posted - 2006.04.26 14:55:00 - [87] Originally by: Aziza Originally by: Wizie Originally by: Aziza Originally by: ALPHA12125 Edited by: ALPHA12125 on 23/04/2006 13:30:03 Originally by: Cherubior Hi! Can anyone tell me why does it worth the huge mones to buy an AF instead a cruiser for 1/3-1/4 price? Cherubior its not worth it a rax/rupture/maller/caracal rapes them all the only reason would be that they are slightly more agil for raids but that is it You have no clue about AF. neither do you. I do, actually. And unless your rax/rupture/maller ( caracal is different story) specifically fitted to kill my enyo or ishkur -- you pretty much dead. You also pretty much a dead meat against retribution, but infortunatly there is no way to stop you wrapping out. who the hell are you....go play with the carebears bonehead...kids lol Ever seen my sister, looks like me...would ya like a kiss?
Dark Shikari	Posted - 2006.04.26 15:17:00 - [88] Originally by: Hungry Eyes Originally by: Testy Mctest Cruisers beat AFs hands down assuming equal skilled pilots. A close range cruiser will hit an AF generally with no problems using medium guns and/or drones, and a long range cruiser will generally pop an AF pretty quickly. Where AFs shine is in destroying targets of their own size (other assault frigates, T1 frigates, and inties) or in packs versus targets much larger than their own size that have problems hitting them effectively (battleships, or long range equipped cruisers if they can get on top of them without dying). oh, inties also melt AF's.. due to a much higher damage output and small sig radius. What are you smoking? AFs are inty-killing machines. [23] Member: Official Forum Warrior What's with the blue robots? Click my sig.
Litus Arowar	Posted - 2006.04.26 15:27:00 - [89] Edited by: Litus Arowar on 26/04/2006 15:28:25 Originally by: Dark Shikari Originally by: Hungry Eyes Originally by: Testy Mctest Cruisers beat AFs hands down assuming equal skilled pilots. A close range cruiser will hit an AF generally with no problems using medium guns and/or drones, and a long range cruiser will generally pop an AF pretty quickly. Where AFs shine is in destroying targets of their own size (other assault frigates, T1 frigates, and inties) or in packs versus targets much larger than their own size that have problems hitting them effectively (battleships, or long range equipped cruisers if they can get on top of them without dying). oh, inties also melt AF's.. due to a much higher damage output and small sig radius. What are you smoking? AFs are inty-killing machines. absolutely... there isn't a single AF I'd try to pop solo with my crusader and I'm quite comfortable with it... even a retribution, even if I knew he had no web, I'd still be uncomfortable trying to charge at it, wether using ABs or MWD... maybe a stiletto could ruin a retri's day, maybe some 3 slot inties could if using tracking disruptors, etc, but against most AFs inties are toast *edit to add I'd rather face most cruisers in an inty than AFs...
Haniblecter Teg	Posted - 2006.04.26 15:43:00 - [90] Originally by: Malthros Zenobia Edited by: Malthros Zenobia on 23/04/2006 15:37:22 Originally by: Atom HeartMother tbh in a af i could take all of these proved they wenrt ubar nos setups Or skilled pilots. If they use T2 eq/ammo, you can have problems. A blasterax will shred an AF as well, and those 5 t2 med droms will be a bonus to help pwn it. A well-skilled, experienced pilot in a cruiser can/will be able to beat an AF. Or a n00b in a caracal with extenders/hardeners and 5 t2 heavies with precisions will do just as well. A crusier has to specially fit to take out af's. Otherwise, its dead. SO yea, a well skilled 'properly fitted' cruiser can...which you wont find normally. ---------------------------------------- Friends Forever

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