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Darkcor
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Posted - 2006.04.24 20:19:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Darkcor on 24/04/2006 20:24:08
This is a Maller version of the famous Omen Vanguard but with an emphasis on tackling.
Purpose: A vanguard Maller is meant to be on the front lines quickly, able to tackle and deliver devestating damage to cruiser-class ships and higher.
This is a tight fit. It requires engineering 5, electronics 5 and weapon upgrades 5. If you don't have weapon upgrades 5, use named items for lower CPU useage, but since most of you will anyways, weapon upgrades 5 is not really "required" except in this hypothetical setup below.
As usual, replace any of the fittings below with named/T2 if your budget allows.
High slots:
5x Focused Pulse I
1x Medium Nosferatu I
Heavy pulses are too resource intensive so Focused instead. Use multifrequency or gamma M crystals for an optimal of between 6km to 8km. The medium nos will either somewhat counter any nos the enemy has or help you keep modules running.
Middle slots:
1x 10MN MicroWarpdrive I
1x Named Webber
1x Named Warp Scrambler I
A named webber/scrambler is required to keep CPU useage low, but you'll want one of those anyway. The MWD will allow you to close your target quickly. A T1 MWD and low skills will get you to 1000m/s -- with a T2 MWD and decent (lvl 4's) skills, you can easily do 1400-1500 m/s. A war scrambler is chosen for its -2 points, lower CPU/cap useage and the fact your optimal on the guns is sub-10km.
Low slots:
1x Medium Armor Repairer I
2x Capacitor Power Relay I
3x Heat Sink I
If you want more tanking, drop the heatsinks in favor of energized adaptive nanomembranes. With two energized adaptive nanomembrames and you can tank several hundred dps depending on the damage type.
Cap is stable with guns firing and scrambler/webber running. With the nos, you can use your medium reparier interminently.
It works out to be about 120-150dps average with this purely tech 1 unnamed setup above. With Tech 2 or best named tech 1 mods on everything, we're talking about 200-250 dps.
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Malka Badi'a
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Posted - 2006.04.24 20:21:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Malka Badi''a on 24/04/2006 20:22:29
Good adaptation  . I've learned that on the maller the relays help it recharge the ship quickly when the modules are all deactivated but it doesn't help with sustainability. How does the nos+CPRs balance out say.. all modules activated? This would have more staying power than the omen but with less damage output, which may end up being a good trade off. Let me know how your cap tests work. I know you already wrote a brief message about the cap, but I'm curious as to what would happen if you were singular medium nossed yourself or how long you could run everything until you hit 0 capacitor, in those "do or die" engagements.
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Darkcor
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Posted - 2006.04.24 20:45:00 -
[3]
My master has skills to lvl 4-5 on most things.
According to quickfit, without the NOS and MWD running, but with the medium repper ON continously, the ship runs out of cap in approximately 70 seconds. With Standard M crystals and named guns, its about 95 seconds. The Nos increases the survival time to about 2.5-3 minutes (continously repairing) which is pretty close to stable if you start using the med rep interminently when cap is about 35%.
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DeathWarrior
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Posted - 2006.04.24 21:49:00 -
[4]
Edited by: DeathWarrior on 24/04/2006 21:49:51
 Originally by: Darkcor
Purpose: A vanguard Maller is meant to be on the front lines quickly, able to tackle and deliver devestating damage to cruiser-class ships and higher.
High slots:
5x Focused Pulse I
1x Medium Nosferatu I
If your going to be aiming to kill those ships then put an rcu in 4 heavy pulse and 2 med nos or something. Because No point using focused pulses if your not going against intys/frigates/af's or the like. Especially considering you are tackling also ( you will have them locked down )
I will try come up with some setup on quickfit for you.
Originally by: Tuxford
I once tried to kick my brother when I had my pants around my ankle. Probably not my brightest moments. |
DeathWarrior
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Posted - 2006.04.24 21:55:00 -
[5]
HIGH-SLOTS :
~~~~~~~~~~~~
> [ 193 | 23] Heavy Pulse Laser I
> [ 193 | 23] Heavy Pulse Laser I
> [ 193 | 23] Heavy Pulse Laser I
> [ 193 | 23] Heavy Pulse Laser I
> [ 175 | 23] Medium 'Knave' I Energy Drain
> [ 175 | 23] Medium 'Knave' I Energy Drain
MED-SLOTS :
~~~~~~~~~~~
> [ 150 | 50] Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive
> [ 1 | 25] Stasis Webifier I
> [ 1 | 34] J5 Prototype Warp Inhibitor I
LOW-SLOTS :
~~~~~~~~~~~
> [ 6 | 6] Small Armor Repairer II
> [ 2 | 30] Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
> [ 2 | 30] Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
> [ 1 | 30] Heat Sink II
> [ 0 | 15] Reactor Control Unit II
> [ 1 | 0] Co-Processor II
I tried to stay relatively low budget.. my I guess that aint me o.O I love to have t2 on everything... I put in some high/low grade named stuff and also theres some t2 stuff.. but it looks ok..
This setup aint tried, but I tried to give you something that you are looking for.
Originally by: Tuxford
I once tried to kick my brother when I had my pants around my ankle. Probably not my brightest moments. |
Darkcor
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Posted - 2006.04.24 22:29:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Darkcor on 24/04/2006 22:30:20
DeathWarrior, that setup has similar damage output to 5x Focused Pulses with 3 heatsinks, but inferior tanking because you only have one small rep.
Moreover, it's too reliant on NOS (you don't have any CRPs).
In general, fitting an RCU II AND a co-processor II in some combat setup means you're doing something wrong.
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fmercury
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Posted - 2006.04.24 22:46:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Darkcor
Edited by: Darkcor on 24/04/2006 22:30:20
DeathWarrior, that setup has similar damage output to 5x Focused Pulses with 3 heatsinks, but inferior tanking because you only have one small rep.
1 small rep and 2 EAN IIs is superior to 1 medium rep and nothing.
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Toy
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Posted - 2006.04.24 23:41:00 -
[8]
IF you're going to get that close and fight it out, can you show a set up with 2 2point warp scramblers on it?
I say this for these reasons:
1) people stab out, so 4 points of scram strength will stop someone... You might end up trading ur maller to bring down a HAC or AF, which is a pretty decent exchange... Also people who are stabbed up don't have a perfect combat layout as they exspect to run away...
2)when you MWD in close, you're doing it usually into a small gang or fleet of enemies... You could lock down two people so when the primary dies, the secondary is already scrambled and can't escape...
3) You have a backup-scrambler to lock pods so when a ship dies, you are ready to lock before the first scrambler deactivates...
What to fit?
Well, let's assume that people are going to kill you as they will say... OMG get that maller off me! I can't warp out my HAC... It's double scrambling me..."
Thus, you should fit a set-up that only remotely helps with damage...a set up with perhaps a surprise factor too.
This would be gatling or dual light pulse set up...The gatling pulse would allow you to ram the opponent and more or less tackle them the ole-fashion way by keep bumping them so they can't align. If it is a cruiser fitted with medium guns, then there is your "I win" button...
It could be with all T2 small smartbombs... They are incredibly cheap, will help kill enemy drones, and if you are cycling 4-5 of them, you might still pop a missile or two... The added benefit of this is that you can have a maller to all explosive damage...
It might be a full complement of energy vamps and neutralizers...
Since you are MWD into the enemy, as many small named NOS as you can fit... This might let you run the 1600 or 800mm plate, medium repairer... No cap is dead ship, so you might want to make a vampire maller...
Anyway, I loved the vanguard omen... The thread was well written and the ship did fly as delivered... |
smallgreenblur
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Posted - 2006.04.24 23:49:00 -
[9]
Plate it, for the love of god... Some hardners wouldn't go amiss either.
sgb
C6 is recruiting ... visit www.c6-eve.com or join channel c-6 for details. |
Darkcor
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Posted - 2006.04.25 01:39:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Darkcor on 25/04/2006 01:40:21
Originally by: smallgreenblur
Plate it, for the love of god... Some hardners wouldn't go amiss either.
sgb
It's not meant to be plated--it's a vanguard/tackler setup. A plate would add mass and reduce acceleration, ruining the MWD and tackling capability.
As I said in my original post, if you want a better tank, take one or two of the heat sinks and replace them with passive hardeners.
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Furion35
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Posted - 2006.04.25 01:49:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Furion35 on 25/04/2006 01:49:49
Double Post
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Furion35
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Posted - 2006.04.25 01:49:00 -
[12]
No polite comments but I'll show you how to improve it.
This setup hardly follows the purpose you gave it.
First of all, the Maller is not meant to be a tackler. It is slow and only has 3 middle slots.
Of course, it is your choice to use it that way but you are not even using it as you claim. You have one warp scrambler and one webifier.
This kind of middle could be accepted as good for a kestrel tackler or a incursus since that is reasonable effectiveness for the money they cost plus they will be hit alot less than you (being a big heavy cruiser).
If you are thinking of making a heavy tackler then add a better tank and sacrifice some damage.
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Shallazar
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Posted - 2006.04.26 15:31:00 -
[13]
I like the look of this setup, similar to something I have been refining for tackling and using the small turrets seems to work much better, as (1) You can hit AF/Frigs and (2) You save cap.
I would personally drop the heatsinks completely if in small gang and focus on tank/speed or even a signal amp(never tried that though to see if much use).
Nice setup given though as a basis for finding your own preferences.
I'm also wondering can the Thorax also be adapted to this with same effectiveness?
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Montero
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Posted - 2006.04.26 16:59:00 -
[14]
you could tackle fairly well with it, but equally you would likelly then die in about a second. i'd seriously consider fitting a more meaty tank than just a medium rep. cruisers without tanks tend to die horribly.
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Darkcor
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Posted - 2006.04.26 23:17:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Darkcor on 26/04/2006 23:25:02
In response to more tankage, here's a slightly modified setup with an 800mm plate. It's slower because the MWD is gone and the mass of the plate. DPS is also down a bit (about 10%), but its got a SUBSTANTIALLY better tank.
Requires Engineering 5, Electronics 5, Weapon Upgrades 5 and Energy Grid Upgrades 5. If you don't have those skills, use named items with lower CPU useage.
This is a really tight fit (0.0 grid and 0.25 CPU remaining):
HIGH-SLOTS :
~~~~~~~~~~~~
> [ 120 | 21] Focused Medium Pulse Laser I [1xMultifrequency M]
> [ 120 | 21] Focused Medium Pulse Laser I [1xMultifrequency M]
> [ 120 | 21] Focused Medium Pulse Laser I [1xMultifrequency M]
> [ 120 | 21] Focused Medium Pulse Laser I [1xMultifrequency M]
> [ 120 | 21] Focused Medium Pulse Laser I [1xMultifrequency M]
> [ 175 | 25] Medium Nosferatu I
MED-SLOTS :
~~~~~~~~~~~
> [ 1 | 25] J5b Phased Prototype Warp Inhibitor I
> [ 1 | 20] 'Langour' Drive Disruptor I
> [ 50 | 25] 10MN Afterburner I
LOW-SLOTS :
~~~~~~~~~~~
> [ 150 | 25] Medium Armor Repairer I
> [ 2 | 25] Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane I
> [ 200 | 25] 800mm Reinforced Steel Plates I
> [ 0 | 15] Power Diagnostic System I
> [ 1 | 30] Heat Sink I
> [ 1 | 30] Heat Sink I
As usual, replace with T2/named if your budget allows.
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Viktor Fyretracker
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Posted - 2006.04.26 23:18:00 -
[16]
whenever i see Vanguard i think of the kickass New Conglomerate tank from planetside
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Alzion
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Posted - 2006.04.27 00:15:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Viktor Fyretracker
whenever i see Vanguard i think of the kickass New Conglomerate tank from planetside
150mm cannon for infantry instakill 
/derail
You guys should check out the difference in DPS and fitting between M autocannons and M pulse. I find that autocannon setups do better if your planning on going in web range.
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I hear Linux can cure cancer and raise your sperm count. - Dionysus Davinci
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