Because we play EVE, its marketed as a sandbox game, it should be a sandbox game. The developers should be performing their required role as developers of a sandbox game which is to act as referee's. They are not. The game play is stagnant. The so-called emergent gameplay is ganking (been in game since M0o and Zombie), the PvP is largely still spawn point based (been in game since 2003), the sov warefare is themepark (theres only one way to do it), the ships are imbalanced to the extent one hull, class or module (supers, caps, blops, cyno's, cats, archons) are used to the exclusion of any emergent new methods / tactics.

Personally as someone new to the game, I do wonder why players try to "grief" other players out of the game. I mean don't they want the influx of new players?

EVE is changing all the time. These changes influence the balances between play styles and what is practically available experiences in the game. This in relation to established players as well as new ones.

I found Infinity Zionas post on the game experience in null very interesting as I have almost no personal experience of that. It seems to support that EVE is evolving in a way that limits the available gameplay. Even if the mechanics are there, the combined net result of players and game mechanics means that large parts of the possible experiences are not practically viable to engage in.

In short, EVE is becoming less of a game than what it could be. It is becoming more gamy, and less roleplaying and exploration friendly. Becoming less community oriented for non-combat players too.

The peaceful industrial high sec corporation is not viable as a lifestyle in EVE, not because it's not mechanically available, but because there are no mechanics to protect that lifestyle from other competing lifestyles in the game.

The amount of posts saying "can I have your stuff" leads me to believe otherwise. It's just another way of saying, quit and go cry about it.

Given Goons, a member of a coalition that has exploited the current state of null mechanics to almost have taken the entire conquerable map one would be wise not to put too much weight on a Goons comments regarding the state of null play.

There are indeed several actions that can be taken as a reaction to a war. Most if not all of them involves dismantling the the lifestyle I was talking about, which is exactly the point.

This does not make them less fun if you were to embrace them, but it doesn't change that the lifestyle is very hard to maintain, compared to the high sec war deccing lifestyle of griefers and mercenaries.

The combat lifestyle can impose on the non-combat through wars, but the non-combat cannot impose on the combat by barring a corp from high sec for a week for instance. You can pay Concord to be passive, not active.

Not to say that it should be possible, but the balance favors the combat lifestyle.

Is that your excuse for shooting fish in a barrel in highsec versus showing this loud mouthed pubbie consequences by blowing him up?

No its only easy to kill people if you choose to make it easy... I could sit in a 0.5 and gank people all day. Could sit on a gate and gank people all day. Could make friends and gank those. Could fake recruit and gank those.

I don't do it because I'd rather play football than touch football, just like I'd rather play cruel harsh EvE than your version of easy safe EvE, Baltec.

I find the current trend of 98-100% kill efficiency an embarassment. I'd be embarassed to have that ratio.

Or to put it another way, the simplest of precautions and the slightest hint of common sense would easily protect you from any of those situations.

If you chose not employ them, that's your problem... not the fault of the game or the other players.

In fact the reason we now see an almost industrial-less low and null is because its so easy to catch and kill industrial characters.

No its because you don't have a customer base big enough to support industry and probably would had you and the rest of the alliances not decided to murder all your customers.

Were there a better spread of players across EVE there would likely be justification for better mechanics to be implemented to support those characters. Since you prefer a null wasteland with your exclusive pre-industrial age tribal social systems you don't have those mechanics. Stop whinging.

Once again these issues are reduced to a question about a single pilot or a single corp. My interest is the combined result of the interaction between the different styles of play in the game.

I don't wish to complain. I'm sad to see the potential of the game being wasted as a whole. It is very difficult to run a non-combat corp in high sec of significant size. Not because it's dangerous, but because non-combat players find high sec combat boring.

A high sec war is the combat culture imposing on the non-combat. The combat culture impose on the non-combat on their own terms. They change the play for the non-combat to better fit the combat. I do not disaprove of this.

What is lacking is the non-combat culture being able to impose itself on the combat culture on the non-combat terms. Maybe it should be possible to exclude for a period, certain pilots and/or corporations that has become a menace to the industries of high sec? Or just make them legit targets for anyone in high sec for a period.

This could be used instead of a limit to the number of war decs. The more wars, the cheaper it becomes to use this tool. High sec needs mechanics to effectively police itself. The non-combat culture needs tools to bring the dangerous and challenging environment to the combat culture on it's own terms using non-combat tools.

Did we expect any less from goons and gankers online?

And IRL, we can all carry guns... at least in the United States... you cannot carry a gun on a miner barge or merchant ship in EVE... which is bullshit

Not interested in conversing with trolls sorry...

The game is a cess pit of horrible people and i agre with you. The corp i run is based on real life first and anyone who is not a decent person is ejected within 24 hours of joining.

The best thing to do is fine a corp like ours and just stick with them.

Also streaming is never a good idea mate. It truly isnt.

The internet brings out the worst in people and tbh

I have nothing but contempt for around 80% of the eve community.

They are disgusting excuses for humans who take delight in insulting others for the sake of it, and 90% of them are on this game 24/7 and have no lives. It is a sad state of affairs, but a true one.

I will be +1 your post because you are right. We have recruited people from other games straight into our corporation and they have expressed a disgust at the eve forums and reddit.

I 100% agree with you.

It needs to change but as most of the devs and gms are ex null players, they have the same attitudes.

Empress

it do not matter anymore.

Majority of the replies on this thread only imply that it is impossible for the hardened bitter-vet crowd to understand eve from the viewpoint of a new player playing outside of blob-warfare. Can you expect a new player to have similar view of eve as a veteran watching the game through blood-stained combat goggles?

Yet such a time was several years ago, likely in a very different environment.

Very true, and when we were new players, EVE was a very different place.

In the real world, Bullying is considered an offense, and cyber-bullying increasingly so these days.

Naturally, the offensive liability of The Mittani's actions never saw light of day as his victim never pressed any complaints, and so it remains based on opinions since then...

So it's a very easy case to dismiss and use for those with an agenda to push on for more apathetic retardation.

However, if people started making a habit of calling their lawyers to check on the liability of some of the **** they go through in this gameworld or the next, a tsunami of charges would most likely come pouring in, and certain people would finally start to stfu in defense of rampant retardation...

If you are about to pod or after you gank someone, wish him good luck next time, with smile, is that so much to ask? These people are certainly worth these words.

Still you can wish it to the pilot after you gank him and loot the wreck. All what is despised in the whole thing is a sompletely psychopatic effect when you did not bother even to say anything to a man. You look there like a rogue drone not a man. Be a man, not a complete jerk. Is that so hard?

Whoa, those people need a break, or tell them its only a game.

"No hard feelings Bro" too? What times we are living in....

If you had seen my corps pvp killboard, you would realise how stupid that comment is since that is ALL WE DO, however, we have strict rules, no smack in loca, no abuse, no stupid behaviour, treat people with respect.

There is no excuse for the behaviour of people in this game

More like nobodies rights were officially examined, and so, easy to self-conclude on it like you just did.

Anyway, back on the topic at hand, I countered you for what you were saying about individual rights in general, not just in the Eve universe.

But if you want Eve-specific, i'll give you one:

In my early naive days of Eve I wanted to get into mining, i'd read a bit about the unforgiving nature of the game and its players, so I was a bit informed on precautions to take as a hisec miner.

However, that didnt stop the occasional suicide gank from happening and setting me back several weeks as a penniless starting player with no friends and no resources.

But one day came when the gankings became more repetitive, several times a week, followed by waves of insults in local, tagging, "lolcarebear", "back to wow", and all the likes of abuse we all know and endure in this game.

At this point I realised I would have to make tremendous efforts to remain in the hisec mining activity and keeping it the way I wanted to play the game, but I no later realized those efforts in vain, as ganks became systematic, wherever I went, for nearly a whole damn month. This had tremendous effects on my personal life planning as I would have to dedicate considerably more ammounts of time in the game.

It got to a point where I was forced into making a choice between my life and the game, as I was still paying a monthly subscription at the time (and who cares, it's just my money right ?).

It's at this time I thought on the real motivation behind all this rampant ganking, namecalling, PMs riddled with personal insults and abuse on my person, and all in the prevention of making my own money's worth of what I considered the game to play fun for me.

My right as a paying customer was in having fun with this game using a one of its safest advertised functions to do it with, but I was flat-out denied that right to start the game this way by people desiring nothing else but to stamp over your tracks and **** you, because they could.

At that point I also realized those same people had the choice in themselves not to perform such actions, and so, for a service I paid for, i refused to expose myself and money to actions i'd have next to zero control over, and so that ended up with an non-renewed subscription.

Did I have the choice to continue and choose another starting profession ? Sure.

Did I want to ? Nope.

Was it entirely my fault ? Precisely not one bit, as I was looking for my own way to play and have fun in the game using one of its advertised functions, but got prevented from it by an external force that could not care less about you, or why you joined and paid for this game in the first place.

the planet where that routinely happens on a daily basis.... see everything fom armored trucks to concealed carry laws.

Salvos, lets create a hypothetical situation to see how you would handle your preached outlook on social interaction:

You are married. I live across town. When you go to work, I come to your house and repeatedly make sexual advances to your wife. This is something I want to do. I want to sleep with her. I understand you and she are married, but according to you, I'm not suppose to let your feelings on a matter dictate how I feel, so I continue to do so. It's not even against the law.

She begins sleeping with me. She understands she's married to you and you might be upset, but according to you, she's not suppose to really take your feelings into consideration when choosing how she wishes to act and feel.

Your wife and I are now engaged in really outrageous, degrading sexual acts with no regard of your personal feelings on the matter.

You come home from work. She wants me to sleep with her while you watch. I want you to watch, and know that I am much more capable of sexually pleasing your wife.

Would this be wrong? I mean, none of us are suppose to care what others think and feel, everything we do is suppose to be about ourselves.

Right?

His refusal to address this will mean that he understands he is wrong and wishes to avoid it to not have to weaken his stance, proving him wrong. Wrong, something he feels he can never be.

Morality

no, because I'd rather not be a mindless cog in the wheel of a giant douche flavored blue donut.

It's a sandbox governed by choices. Morality exists.

in a pvp game ..... miners would have the ability to kill you with their giant space rock disintegration lasers

He's stating he's a good person even though he subscribes to a moral philosophy centered around doing whatever you want to other people because you're only suppose to care about yourself.

While I'm stating I'm a good person because my moral philosophy is centered around treating others fairly, taking their feelings and desires into consideration and trying to make them happy so I can be happy that I've had a positive impact on others.

I don't think he knows what a good person is. It's apparent his entire existence is wrapped up within himself, and he's all that really matters. .. . to him anyways.

Me though?

Well I'm #thebest

No, but the ones shooting others while calling them a "******" are bad people. Every competitive act can be experienced with honor and dignity. The one's who forgo it to upset others lessen themselves before their insults do any impact on the ones they aim them at.

Nullbears in particular.

very good proposition i must say....

i agree with the OP too, the community here can be so toxic sometimes, the EVE community has to set a rule of conduct for the game, something that regulates how people deals with people here, its not a set of prohibitions but more of a universal agreement for certain matters.

for example:

-PvP against new players is forbidden unless both use rookie ships for it (only civilian modules):

if a veteran wants to engage a noob(im talking people with less than 1 day in the game that has just started the tutorials), at least use something that is to lvl with him, rookie ships are replacable so both of you wont have problems of isk later, but the target has to know about this and the engagement must be of course, a duel.

-NPC null sec regions free of Bubble presence:

this regions should be an entry lvl place for people who want to try the null sec life, people may not put bubbles here, leave that for sov driven regions

there could be other ideas but this is the most i have thought about, it doesnt hurt people, unless you think that you need a bubble in order to put a gatecamp anyways, people doesnt need them in low sec, and null sec gates dont have sentries so there's no excuse.....