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BugraT WarheaD
Astromechanica Federatis
8
   |
Posted - 2011.11.13 12:17:00 -
[1] - Quote
Hi internet people!
I'm here to talk about love and hate, I'm here to talk about our unwanted kid for certain, or about the prodigal son for the others GǪ I'm here to talk about the main feature (yeah I know) of Incarna-á: Walk in Station (WIS).
I'm not here to argue about WIS itself, so if you want it to disappear from the game, it's not the right topic, sorry. No, I'm here to talk about gameplay that CCP can (must?) implement to WIS to make it more interessant for the everyday player even if there's only Captain's Quarter (CQ) for now.
I apologize, if sometimes I write this in poor english, i've tried my best 
I'm dividing this into 4 categories that are-á:
1) More interaction with the Environement.
2) Real Computers, and TV must live-á!
3) UI and Immersion.
4) Housing and Nex
1) More Interaction with the Environement.
This is, I think, one of the most disturbing thing when you first enter your CQ. There's Quafe bottles on a shelf, bottles you can't take, books you can't read, and even a bed where you can't rest-á! I don't want to teach Game Design to CCP, I'm no Game Designer, but I can remenber hearing form Chris Crawford that an element of a game that it isn't used in the Game Design is just useless (Link).
So why can't we more interact with our bed, or with our TV screens-áfor exemple ?
2) Real Computers, and TV must live-á!
I remember my first steps during the first public launch of Incarna on the Test Server. I was like -½-áOh boy, it can be so cool if it's well handed !-á-+, so I asked the Devs about how cool it will be if we could interact with those three big TV screen on our CQ and he replies that it will surely be done. Well GǪ It's not afterall. But why-á? I may remind you that games like Doom 3 (Link) had so much better ideas about (again) interaction than this poor enlightement of the screen when you pass the mouse on.
Why can't we use that screen as a real alternate UI-á?
3) UI and Immersion.
Because one of the deepest problem of WIS is its lack of immersion and certainly the fact that devs didn't think that re-thinking the UI for a non-spaceship part of the game is relevant GǪ Wrong, it is relevant-á! Actual UI have its problem but it works for Spaceships and things we actual make in space, but for a third person game, it's just awful. Too much windows, and the UI is also too much present for really enjoying using WIS without removing it. The proble is when you remove UI, CQ is useless, because everything you clic on takes you back to the spaceship UI.
With wise use of -½-áReal Computers-á-+ as mentionned earlier, and several adds like this awesome phone we could see in the Eve Forever video (Link, 0:26). I can dream of a use like we could see one in GTA IV (Link), where the phone can open an Eve Voice Chat with anyone in the game, or to a group like your alliance or your corporation.
And if you want to Chat-á? Using the Market or view a Contract-á? Why are we still forced to use old Spaceship UI and not a cool tablet like an EveOnlinePad -¬. Think again of Doom 3, with the PDA (Link), or if you old like me, think of the PipBoy in the first Fallout, there's tons of things that can free WIS of the FIS UI, and tons of things that can reinforce immersion, like being seen as not log while you're not in your pod (Please CCP remembre this Link) or having a Podroom, etc.
And btw have you notice the UI of Third Person or First Person games-á? Discrete.
4) Housing and Nex
Oky, CQ is'nt our home, we get it, but why can't we buy a home (or two)-á? A special CQ where we can add or remove stuff and having a real personnal Quarter somewhere in New Eden, i can see that tons of MMO have their housing as a real part of the game (i heard that SW Galaxy was one of the best housing before the NGE btw), so why, instead of clothes, can't we buy something cooler like this totaly fashion rocking chair I saw on the Dodixie Wallmart the other day-á?
It is just ideas of making real what you (CCP) gives us as a feature.
Thanks for reading. |
boseo
Azure Horizon
8
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 12:35:00 -
[2] - Quote
some nice ideas, like the idea of making them screens more useful and having a Pipboy style thing for chat, just makes sense.
Sorry but file Gǣforumsig.GIFGǥ is currently unavailable please come back laterGǪGǪ like in a year or so.
|
BugraT WarheaD
Astromechanica Federatis
9
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 13:37:00 -
[3] - Quote
Thanks, I'm thinking about all this since the beginning, and now i'm pretty sure some of those ideas aren't so bad, and certainly possible to add to the Carbon thing. |
Florestan Bronstein
The Waterworks
164
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 13:53:00 -
[4] - Quote
your proposals mostly seem to make existing functionality more cumbersome to access all in the name of "immersion" |
Karn Dulake
Souls Must Be Trampled
The.Alliance
87
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 14:06:00 -
[5] - Quote
Thumbs up from me because you seen like a nice guy and the other stuff seemed pretty relevent |
BugraT WarheaD
Astromechanica Federatis
11
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 14:17:00 -
[6] - Quote
Florestan Bronstein wrote:your proposals mostly seem to make existing functionality more cumbersome to access all in the name of "immersion"
I don't think so. If you want the Neocom, you are certainly in space. The Neocom doesn't make any sense while you are not in your pod. It always a struggle beetwen immersion and smooth gameplay, and as I said, i'm no Game Designer, that's CCP's job  . When WIS will be a real thing, not only a poor CQ lost in a station, immersion will be crucial for players, and having to much UI on the screen while trying just to admire the place isn't something people like.
Karn Dulake wrote:Thumbs up from me because you seen like a nice guy
Thanks, you want a hug ?  |
Jognu
French Kiss Singularity
Astromechanica Federatis
4
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 14:18:00 -
[7] - Quote
Good ideas!
A housing system like in SW Galaxy can be awesome, with some corporations appartement :D
EveAI |
BugraT WarheaD
Astromechanica Federatis
11
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 17:05:00 -
[8] - Quote
Don't go to far  |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
275
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 17:28:00 -
[9] - Quote
A well thought out point of view. Several of those things have been discussed (to one degree or another) when talking about future WIS development. Keep in mind the hurdle we just got over is actually getting the bare framework for WIS into game and running (albeit not very smoothly yet).
We are going to run into problems on the UI front from this point on however. A UI that actually works for an environment like WIS will be deemed redundant by those that wish to stick with their nuts and bolts UI from the FIS part of the game.
I suppose we could have a button to enable a strictly WIS UI when we are going to be doing (future) WIS only content. I"m not sure how practical that would be in application. Perhaps it should be just as simple as:
1: If you are going to be interacting with your ship (in the hanger), entering and exiting a lot, and do not want the WIS UI then you stick with seeing the hanger environment.
2: If you are going to be doing WIS content and activities, and will not be interacting with your ship in any significant way for a while you hit the load CQ button and the interface changes.
People will still complain that it doesn't have everything the FIS UI has, but at that point you've made the decision to work with WIS content... and can switch back to your hanger view and your familiar FIS UI instantly.
To kill the enemy and break their toys!
It's not so much a mission statement,-áit's more like a family motto. |
Angeliena
Eye of God
Controlled Chaos
1
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 17:45:00 -
[10] - Quote
We, the 99%'ers of EVE do NOT want to see WiS developed at the expense of FiS FULL STOP!
I have had enough of the 1%'ers demanding EVE devs focus away from FiS and core game mechanic improvements towards building unimportant features:
Space Pets are not important
Space station homes are not important
Space station furniture is not important
Space Barbies are not important
The 99%ers have spoken. We have had "Occupy Jita" CCP has heard our voice and has now focused on bringing us good things like:
New session change timer tweaks,
New Tier 3 BC,
New T2 mods,
New POS fueling,
Hybrid balance,
Time dilation,
New ship fitting screen,
Return of ship spinning,
New ship skins,
Capital rebalance etc.
These are the important things and thanks to the voice of the 99%'ers CCP is now listening and is delivering up the goods.
To the 1%'er "Space Barbie" lovers who want CCP devs to waste their time on WiS, We Say NO.
If you can not live without space housing then leave EVE and go play Final Fantasy 15 or Ever Quest 1, 2, 3 and hang out with the other snark and Grumpkin lovers!
This message has been brought to you by the Abaddon WiS now campaign |
BugraT WarheaD
Astromechanica Federatis
11
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 18:03:00 -
[11] - Quote
@Ranger1 :
The thing with UI is that it must be design for a specific way of playing a game.
Moving items from the Cargo to Corporate or Private hangar ISN'T something you can do while outside your pod. Your on your ship, spinning it again and again and moving stuff with love vith the good old UI.
You've said those point were discussed, but i haven't see a devblog about this or any dev post, but i admit that i don't read every post on the forum
But yes, Eve is in perpetual devlopement, and devloping all the parts of the game takes time.
Quote:I suppose we could have a button to enable a strictly WIS UI when we are going to be doing (future) WIS only content.
that's exactly what I want !
@Angeliena :
I think you haven't read the first post it's not about the right for WiS to live or not, it's about what must be the actuel WiS. Don't quote South Park man ! I hope CCP could continue to develop every part of the game, WiS, FiS, WH, Incursion, FW, etc. |
Generals4
Caldari State
323
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 18:17:00 -
[12] - Quote
Angeliena wrote:
To the 1%'er "Space Barbie" lovers who want CCP devs to waste their time on WiS, We Say NO.
If you can not live without space housing then leave EVE and go play Final Fantasy 15 or Ever Quest 1, 2, 3 and hang out with the other snark and Grumpkin lovers!
This message has been brought to you by the Abaddon WiS now campaign
So just because they want FiS and WiS they should leave and play a totally different game? You do realize wanting WiS doesn't equate to disliking everything else and loving whatever game you mentioned?
And you also made the assumption people who want WiS want FiS not to get any attention. I hardly doubt so.
-Death is nothing, but to live defeated and inglorious is to die daily. |
White Carnation
SYNDIC Unlimited
1
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 18:20:00 -
[13] - Quote
BugraT WarheaD wrote:I hope CCP could continue to develop every part of the game, WiS, FiS, WH, Incursion, FW, etc.
Fair enough, and as a dedicated carebear I had similar hopes.
But, as has been said above, 99% of Eve's player-base do not want WiS in any way shape or form. To ignore this would be commercial suicide.
I'm sorry, but you need to face the fact that WiS is dead, and that what little of it we have seen (especially the memory-wasting CQs) will shortly be rolled back and comitted to Outer Darkness.
All I can suggest is that, if WiS is essential to your enjoyment of a game, play something based on this, not on Spreadsheess in Space. |
BugraT WarheaD
Astromechanica Federatis
11
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 18:39:00 -
[14] - Quote
I'm not here to talk about the pursue or not of WiS for Eve Online, I'm just interested in Gameplay we can imagine for the actual WiS feature and what can be done to improve love of the player base without making silly things as CCP does when launching Incarna (such as forgetting that we all play a massive multiplayer game about spaceship in space |
Henry Haphorn
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
74
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 19:17:00 -
[15] - Quote
White Carnation wrote:
But, as has been said above, 99% of Eve's player-base do not want WiS in any way shape or form. To ignore this would be commercial suicide.
I don't like that statement as I find that to be too biased. You're assuming that 99% of the player base doesn't want WiS without providing evidence to back it up. Personally, I would say that a large portion of the player base doesn't want WiS to be worked on too much at the expense of FiS. From what I have seen since the summer launch of Incarna, players wanted both WiS and FiS. Just each want to come in different ways than others.
EDIT: Fixed grammar |
Soulpirate
State War Academy
Caldari State
27
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 19:28:00 -
[16] - Quote
Great thread OP, CCP wants our input on what we would like to see in WiS
so this should be a great spot to share some ideas. +1
I totally agree on the UI issues. The first thing that bothered me was clicking on
the hanger for instance and all I got was the same clunky old-school "window"
of ships. I was dissapoint. I was expecting a 3d pop-up hologram of sorts which
you could toggle through images of the ships much like the one that is on the
coffee table.
For future game play of WiS, I for one would deffinately like to see missions that
involve going to a sub level(mission instance) of certain stations. completing a
task there that then requires you to jump in your ship and complete said mission.
Lots of possiblities in combining WiS with FiS to create a more complete and
expansive game experience. |
Anya Ohaya
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
32
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 19:34:00 -
[17] - Quote
Exploration using WiS could be interesting. Abandoned ships, mining outposts, that sort of thing. |
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
163
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 19:38:00 -
[18] - Quote
Soulpirate wrote:Great thread OP, CCP wants our input on what we would like to see in WiS
so this should be a great spot to share some ideas. +1
I totally agree on the UI issues. The first thing that bothered me was clicking on
the hanger for instance and all I got was the same clunky old-school "window"
of ships. I was dissapoint. I was expecting a 3d pop-up hologram of sorts which
you could toggle through images of the ships much like the one that is on the
coffee table.
With only years of conceptual development are you sure you're expectations aren't a little unrealistic?
We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |
Soulpirate
State War Academy
Caldari State
27
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 20:05:00 -
[19] - Quote
White Carnation wrote:BugraT WarheaD wrote:I hope CCP could continue to develop every part of the game, WiS, FiS, WH, Incursion, FW, etc. Fair enough, and as a dedicated carebear I had similar hopes. But, as has been said above, 99% of Eve's player-base do not want WiS in any way shape or form. To ignore this would be commercial suicide.....
Stop right there. That is total bull**** and you know it.
This thread is about sharing ideas of what would make WiS usefull and entertaining.
If you dont have anything to add besides you hate of growth and change, dont bother
posting please, not that I will notice anyhow, I have started blocking all the WiS haters,
this whole 99% I hate 'sapce barbies" BS is getting way too old. You may have thought
it was funny/cute at first, but now you are all just making asses of yourselfs. |
BugraT WarheaD
Astromechanica Federatis
15
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 20:22:00 -
[20] - Quote
Anya Ohaya wrote:Exploration using WiS could be interesting. Abandoned ships, mining outposts, that sort of thing.
I haven't thought of that, but yes this would be something really great to enter an ancient Sleeper Outpost and harvesting things, exploring the structure to find a special item ...
/me is dreaming about doing this with a bunch of Dust Marines to shot any Sleeper drone inside the Station ... Grrr !
Edit ---
Btw, Thanks for the support Soulpirate  |
Solhild
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
70
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 20:32:00 -
[21] - Quote
Soulpirate wrote:White Carnation wrote:BugraT WarheaD wrote:I hope CCP could continue to develop every part of the game, WiS, FiS, WH, Incursion, FW, etc. Fair enough, and as a dedicated carebear I had similar hopes. But, as has been said above, 99% of Eve's player-base do not want WiS in any way shape or form. To ignore this would be commercial suicide..... Stop right there. That is total bull**** and you know it. This thread is about sharing ideas of what would make WiS usefull and entertaining. If you dont have anything to add besides you hate of growth and change, dont bother posting please, not that I will notice anyhow, I have started blocking all the WiS haters, this whole 99% I hate 'sapce barbies" BS is getting way too old. You may have thought it was funny/cute at first, but now you are all just making asses of yourselfs.
I'd like my sub to keep me in a growing and evolving EVE universe, ships & avatars both. Just hope they keep it all integrated.
Imagine working through clues in a talocan relic on a world that ends up activating a device to give beneficial system wide effects etc.
If EVE was to narrow its scope a spreadsheet 0.0 fleet game only then my sub & PLEX money would go elsewhere.
CCP - stick to the big picture, keep learning etc. Good Luck |
Ardamalis
Vanguard Corp Bounty Hunters
22
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 20:44:00 -
[22] - Quote
I love your ideas OP. The idea of a capsuleer carrying a smartphone or an Ipad-like device in a station is an excellent compromise between functionality, look, style, and ease of use. This idea needs to be brought out to the public more.
I can imagine it now: You are playing space poker with someone. As you play, you recieve a IM from one your friends. A notification box on the bottom of the screen shows up for a few seconds. This is the Eve Online version of twitter. The text in the small box reads "Corp Op, 1 hour from now bro." You then hit the keyboard shortcut to access your handheld tablet. As the tablet comes into view, from a menu of options you select "Contact Dock Manager." All of a sudden a holographic rendering of your ship appears on the tablet screen. You cycle through a tab and select your mining barge, open the fitting, and make some changes. The dock manager then informs you via ingame EVE Twitter that the ship will be ready and fitted as the screen closes. You then put the tablet away and go back to playing space poker.
This WIS UI on a handheld tablet has the potential to be just as fast as the traditional UI but with additional ease of use and navigation. |
Leemi Sobo
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
1
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 20:49:00 -
[23] - Quote
One thing that has disapointed me is the missing action for this bed in my prison. At least there could be a 'log out'/'quit'-action on it 
as workaround for the UI-inconsitency i just close the stationpanel as soon as i leave my pod
For the insurance stuff i don't even want a WiS UI. If i leave my pod " I'm just an easy replaceable, carbon based peace of meat" without access to billions in assets/ships. To have access to this i can easy enter my hangar ^.^"
Angeliena wrote:The 99%ers have spoken. We have had "Occupy Jita" CCP has heard our voice
So if there were a statue inside the Jita 4-4 Station where all the WiS-NotHaters could meet and shoot this stature, what would you say, how many would it be? ^.^"
BugraT WarheaD wrote:I hope CCP could continue to develop every part of the game, WiS, FiS, WH, Incursion, FW, etc.
+1 |
Solhild
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
70
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 20:49:00 -
[24] - Quote
Ardamalis wrote:I love your ideas OP. The idea of a capsuleer carrying a smartphone or an Ipad-like device in a station is an excellent compromise between functionality, look, style, and ease of use. This idea needs to be brought out to the public more.
I can imagine it now: You are playing space poker with someone. As you play, you recieve a IM from one your friends. A notification box on the bottom of the screen shows up for a few seconds. This is the Eve Online version of twitter. The text in the small box reads "Corp Op, 1 hour from now bro." You then hit the keyboard shortcut to access your handheld tablet. As the tablet comes into view, from a menu of options you select "Contact Dock Manager." All of a sudden a holographic rendering of your ship appears on the tablet screen. You cycle through a tab and select your mining barge, open the fitting, and make some changes, the dock master then informs you via text that the ship will be ready and fitted. You then put the tablet away and go back to playing space poker.
This WIS UI on a handheld tablet has the potential to be just as fast as the traditional UI but with additional ease of use and navigation.
Additional input device, replicate the game tablet UI on a real tablet or 2nd screen?
Good thread OP, thx |
XIRUSPHERE
In Bacon We Trust
104
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 21:07:00 -
[25] - Quote
Ideas were shared for 6 years, many greater than these and many far worse. Concepts were peddled and abandoned and EVE online saw 18 months of the worst flat stagnation in it's history. After those 6 years we were given an abortion of code and concepts that is nothing less than an utter embarrassment to any gaming company.
You can fantasize all you want but we have all the cold hard truths we need about what a complete waste of time, money, and talent WIS and Incarna were to EVE online, it resulted in 20% of the workforce being terminated and still has the very real potential to still make this game go **** up because of this horrible adventure.
So please take your love of WIS, incarna, your foolish ideas that have as much chance as seeing the light of day as I do of winning the lottery and DIAF (love and ideas not people, im talking to you navigator). The damage has already been done and before there is even the slightest inclination to return to WIS this game needs to be fixed and actually be in a position to support it's development and that's not happening for a long long time.
The advantage of a bad memory is that one can enjoy the same good things for the first time several times.
One will rarely err if extreme actions be ascribed to vanity, ordinary actions to habit, and mean actions to fear. |
Henry Haphorn
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
74
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 21:15:00 -
[26] - Quote
I remember the Playstation Home has a similar thing going when it comes to interface devices. Each avatar comes with a portable device that sort of resembles a smartphone of sorts which allows players to view a wide range of things from news to seeing what to buy at the local market. That could actually be useful for Incarna. Personally, I prefer a tablet device with my avatar rather than a portable holographic projector phone.
But overall, it could serve as a reasonable alternative to having to Alt-F9 between the scenery and the UI.
EDIT:
XIRUSPHERE wrote:before there is even the slightest inclination to return to WIS this game needs to be fixed and actually be in a position to support it's development and that's not happening for a long long time.
We'll see what the winter expansion brings in that regard. If things go according to what CCP now claims to do, we could see a huge list of issues fixed with FiS in about 2-3 expansions (I'm just guessing here). My biggest pet peeves for now are the re-balance of the hybrids and the elimination of the RoF penalty for dessies.
But at the same time, there needs to be some attention given to Incarna in the mean time. Or at least that's what I personally believe. If you don't want CCP to focus on WiS, then that's your opinion. |
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
297
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 21:30:00 -
[27] - Quote
wasnt it like 20% found WiS agreeable and majority of the newest players dont mind wis?
|
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
277
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 21:47:00 -
[28] - Quote
Quote:We, the 99%'ers of EVE do NOT want to see WiS developed at the expense of FiS FULL STOP!
Entirely correct. This was CCP's biggest screw up... that being the development of WIS at the expense of the fundamental FIS portion of the game.
However a large percentage of people would like to see WIS content iterated on in meaningful ways with a REASONABLE portion of dev resources devoted to it.
At this point in time, those resources would and should be minimal. They have some catching up to do on the FIS front, and the majority of what needs to be done at this point in time for WIS content needs to be planning... lots and lots of planning.
There are only a few developers at CCP with the skills necessary to do this type of concept work, and I think few would begrudge them for spending a portion of their time coming up with an overall plan for WIS content that is:
Engaging and fun.
Has a purpose that makes sense for an Avatar to do instead of a person sitting in their ship.
Enhances and compliments FIS content.
Forms a solid link with upcoming DUST/EVE cross over content.
Running smoothly and efficiently BEFORE release.
Emphasizes multi-player interactions and environments.
Is fully integrated with the current EVE industrial structure.
So yes, few people want WIS development to curtail FIS development again... and even fewer want it to be pursued without a solid plan for it's implementation and content to be in place ahead of time.
To kill the enemy and break their toys!
It's not so much a mission statement,-áit's more like a family motto. |
BugraT WarheaD
Astromechanica Federatis
21
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 22:14:00 -
[29] - Quote
Ardamalis wrote:You are playing space poker with someone. As you play, you recieve a IM from one your friends. A notification box on the bottom of the screen shows up for a few seconds. This is the Eve Online version of twitter. The text in the small box reads "Corp Op, 1 hour from now bro." You then hit the keyboard shortcut to access your handheld tablet. As the tablet comes into view, from a menu of options you select "Contact Dock Manager." All of a sudden a holographic rendering of your ship appears on the tablet screen. You cycle through a tab and select your mining barge, open the fitting, and make some changes. The dock manager then informs you via ingame EVE Twitter that the ship will be ready and fitted as the screen closes. You then put the tablet away and go back to playing space poker.
Man ... You have sublimated my idea 
One thing is also a shame. Being forced to reenter the Character Creator just to leave a jacket is quite a pain in the a**. I hope CCP will work on that to ... The launch of Incarna for now reminds me (sadly) UrU - Ages Beyond Myst (great game btw) ... Hope it will not end like it. |
Henry Haphorn
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
74
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 22:26:00 -
[30] - Quote
Nova Fox wrote:wasnt it like 20% found WiS agreeable and majority of the newest players dont mind wis?
Perhaps. But I'm not sure if that's an accurate number without some data to base it on. |
Vigdis Thorisdottir
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
26
|
Posted - 2011.11.13 23:57:00 -
[31] - Quote
Henry Haphorn wrote:Nova Fox wrote:wasnt it like 20% found WiS agreeable and majority of the newest players dont mind wis? Perhaps. But I'm not sure if that's an accurate number without some data to base it on.
No less accurate than "99%", I'd guess..... :) |
BugraT WarheaD
Astromechanica Federatis
22
|
Posted - 2011.11.14 08:07:00 -
[32] - Quote
Vigdis Thorisdottir wrote:Henry Haphorn wrote:Nova Fox wrote:wasnt it like 20% found WiS agreeable and majority of the newest players dont mind wis? Perhaps. But I'm not sure if that's an accurate number without some data to base it on. No less accurate than "99%", I'd guess..... :)
I think that there's no real statistic on here |
Ciar Meara
Virtus Vindice
263
|
Posted - 2011.11.14 10:45:00 -
[33] - Quote
CCP has lots of good ideas and good potential for WiS. Once they get rid of NeX/Aurum influence to WiS they will be free to implement alot of the ideas they had before. With the Nex/Aurum everything you do will be based on what the system can provide and not what the market/players can provide.
If they remove the straightjacket they imposed on WiS they can make it a usefull, fun and active element in the sandbox where many things like manufactring, research, etc can be "optimised" by players. Just like any other MMO that has that kind of stuff. (jewellery making = implant production, crafting=research/production/repair/creation of clothing).
Linked witht he minerals out of space and the resources from PI those station that have acces to the best mix of planets/corps/minerals/transportation would grow into hubs of activity.
-
[img]http://go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/corp/janus/ceosig.jpg[/img]
[yellow]English only please. Zymurgist[/yellow] |
Lord Wamphyri
Starside Lost
78
|
Posted - 2011.11.14 11:25:00 -
[34] - Quote
It's all very easy to throw around figures like '99%' but you have to remember that a lot of players never use the forums. Granted there were a lot of people who so say unsubbed and/or shot the jita statue but how many more just went about their daily business?
I'm one of those who is eagerly awaiting WiS. Even with the return of Ship Spinning I've left my CQ active. That's not to say I want development on FiS to stop in favour of WiS, I don't - even though FiS has been the main focus for the majority of EVE's lifetime, but that's not the point here.
Sometimes you want to just kick back and relax while still being part of the EVE universe. For me at the moment that means sitting in station with chat windows open. Hopefully when WiS is expanded upon this will open up a whole new level of interaction.
Personally I'd love to see things like mini games available on a station promenade, like the holographic biplane game in the first Star Trek movie, or maybe the simulator idea in Wing Commander. I know a variant of one game - the name escapes me - was in the first ambulation demo. (The one involving capturing squares)
There is so much potential in WiS.
It's not about not liking the spaceship part of EVE, it's about being immersed in the complete SciFi simulator that has always been the goal of CCP. WiS is just another step in this direction. It's very easy to throw around tired memes about going to other games but they're not EVE.
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DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
185
|
Posted - 2011.11.14 13:15:00 -
[35] - Quote
Angeliena wrote:We, the 99%'ers of EVE do NOT want to see WiS developed at the expense of FiS FULL STOP!
I have had enough of the 1%'ers demanding EVE devs focus away from FiS and core game mechanic improvements towards building unimportant features:
Space Pets are not important
Space station homes are not important
Space station furniture is not important
Space Barbies are not important
The 99%ers have spoken. We have had "Occupy Jita"
First of all, speak for yourself. You're not the voice of the Eve community.
Secondly, it wasn't 99% of the Eve community. Nor was it 75%. Or even 50%. The percentage is closer to 20%, and that's a generous estimation. There was about 50 K players online and maybe 10 k max did the emo-rage protesting.
Thirdly, nobody is demanding Eve Dev's to focus away from FiS and core game mechanic improvements. But if you really want to talk about some unimportant features, there's a few in your list below.
Angeliena wrote:CCP has heard our voice and has now focused on bringing us good things like:
New session change timer tweaks,
New Tier 3 BC,
New T2 mods,
New POS fueling,
Hybrid balance,
Time dilation,
New ship fitting screen,
Return of ship spinning,
New ship skins,
Capital rebalance etc.
These are the important things and thanks to the voice of the 99%'ers CCP is now listening and is delivering up the goods.
To the 1%'er "Space Barbie" lovers who want CCP devs to waste their time on WiS, We Say NO.
If you can not live without space housing then leave EVE and go play Final Fantasy 15 or Ever Quest 1, 2, 3 and hang out with the other snark and Grumpkin lovers!
This message has been brought to you by the Abaddon WiS now campaign
As I said above, you don't speak for the Eve community and it wasn't 99%. More like 20% which just happens to be a very loud vocal minority.
All the 'Important' things you listed is not new content. Most of it is just 'Fixes' that should have been done years ago. The only 2 things in your list that could be considered 'New' would be the T3 Battlecruisers and ship skins. Unfortunately those still don't add any new game content.
Also there are no new T2 modules, T2 items are created by players through invention. There has been some hinting of missing Faction/Deadspace modules that are already in the item database being seeded into the game. Module icon graphics on the UI is whats being changed or rather reverted back to original. They will still show the enhanced graphics on the info box and preview as well as on the ships.
By the way, you forgot to add Engine Trails, Nebula graphics, Ship buffing / balancing to your list. I believe there's a few other things being implemented as well pertaining to Docking range, suicide ganking, FW, PI, etc.
In case you didn't realize this, CCP's new direction of 'focusing on what makes EVE great', is mostly about fixing, balancing and hopefully finishing existing game content. Mainly it's more like a facade, a temporary 'Placebo' to placate a loud vocal minority.
Anyway, I'm pleased to inform you that CCP's vision for Eve Online has always been from the very start to create a Science Fiction Virtual Reality Universe. FiS is only one aspect of that. WiS is another aspect of that. CCP has stated over and over, time and time again, that is their vision and the direction they are going with Eve Online.
Referencing WiS as 'Space Sims with Space Barbies' and stating that it doesn't belong in Eve Online denotes an immature closed minded viewpoint. With that being said, you've made your point. You don't like the idea of WiS which is fine. Instead of trying to derail this thread, just turn off station environment and go fly spaceships. |
BugraT WarheaD
Astromechanica Federatis
23
|
Posted - 2011.11.14 16:46:00 -
[36] - Quote
I'm sure i've said that arguing for pro or con isn't the subject ^^ |
BugraT WarheaD
Astromechanica Federatis
25
|
Posted - 2011.11.16 11:55:00 -
[37] - Quote
Sorry for Bumping this thread, but i'm thinking of something ... Is there anyone who knows if CCP told us if we're going to interact with Dust Marines through WiS ? |
Kietay Ayari
Monopoly Money Operations
41
|
Posted - 2011.11.16 12:34:00 -
[38] - Quote
Personally I do not mind if they continue with WiS or scrap it because I will enjoy either more WiS content or FiS content, but I liked your post because of your typing style! ;D Everyone needs more smilies and less rude comebacks.
Keep up the good work capsuleer!
Ferox #1 |
BugraT WarheaD
Astromechanica Federatis
30
|
Posted - 2011.11.16 16:43:00 -
[39] - Quote
It's certainly due to my way of french-thinking a text before writing it done ! I can't help it, to hard to think in english
Thank Kietay, come visit my CQ one day  |
Kietay Ayari
Monopoly Money Operations
45
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 02:38:00 -
[40] - Quote
French... real French or French Canadian? >_> IT MATTERS
Ferox #1 |
Nypheas Azurai
Azimuth Enterprises
44
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 03:22:00 -
[41] - Quote
Angeliena wrote:We, the 99%'ers of EVE do NOT want to see WiS developed at the expense of FiS FULL STOP!
Thinking yourself the 99%: asinine. full stop.
No one knows who's for WiS or FiS because the issues are not fully separable (except for the die-hard lesser clods who think the game is solely about one thing). I don't think we can put any sort of credible percentage on it because there's no reliable way to tally the userbase, except to say a lot of people do want to see WiS and not at the expense of anything else other than EVE sinking into stagnancy.
Common Fallacies:
EVE is only about FiS
FACT: the existence of everything from markets to PoS to industry disproves this. EVE is a multi-faceted game, it's about time WiS became one of those facets
FiS suffered because of WiS
FACT: FiS *and* WiS suffered because of WoD and DUST. CCP rightfully shifted work away from these projects, but wrongfully thinks its now ok to throw the baby out with the bath water and neglect their distant cousin: WiS in EVE.
WiS cannot be developed in tandem with WiS - it's one or the other
FACT: CCP is in the business (the business we put them in) to do just that. Every year they come out with (for better or worse) two expansions; expansions that are developed *alongside* and in tandem with the core of the game including FiS. CCP is capable of working on both, unless they allow the playerbase to think they're not.
We already have our expansion this winter: Crucible
FACT: Crucible represents a long-standing list of changes that were planned and requested but neglected over several years. While they are a substantial set of fixes and updates, the amount of "new and expansive" content (not updated, retextured or improved) is limited to a handful of ships, and not nearly on the order of what we can expect from an expansion that comes only twice a year (that last part is opinion, but I hope you share it, otherwise we set the bar pretty low).
The rest is opinion. It's my opinion CCP recognizes the disgrace that was Incarna, and knows that they are in debt to the playerbase for a proper expansion. However they cleverly believe they can pull off a mega patch that should have been incrementally introduced over the years to serve as this expansion, offering false penance to FiS at the expense of everything else including the future of their game. This is wrong, FiS should not be an either-or with WiS, but an inclusive-and.
While it's true they need time to refocus on FiS, they at least owe us the respect as peers in EVE to lay us out a plan for its future, the future of WiS, and more so than just "maybe sometime later". |
Crystal Liche
ACME Mineral and Gas
29
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 04:01:00 -
[42] - Quote
On #3 to me the UI we had was always basically the wired in UI of our pod. Immersion wise all that data is being fed to us by our pod computer which is interfacing with our ship.
So yes, when we leave our pod how are we getting those displays, are they on the inside of my glasses
I would also like to see ships where we walked in the ships and it takes like 5-xx players to fly it and man all of its systems.
To go with that I'd like to see a contract type for hourly labor: Ships Gunner Wanted
New players could get a job on a ship. |
Arya Greywolf
Tasty Beverage
3
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 04:12:00 -
[43] - Quote
BugraT WarheaD wrote: Environement...
This is really bugging me, I can't help it. It's spelled environment, with no e between n and m.
Good post and ideas though... As long as they keep absolute and primary focus on FiS > WiS.
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BugraT WarheaD
Astromechanica Federatis
32
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 11:35:00 -
[44] - Quote
Kietay Ayari wrote:French... real French or French Canadian? >_> IT MATTERS
Real French
JAMBON BEURRE FROMAGE PUTAIN, LA BOURSE OU LA VIE ?
Arya Greywolf wrote:This is really bugging me, I can't help it. It's spelled environment, with no e between n and m.
Good post and ideas though... As long as they keep absolute and primary focus on FiS > WiS.
Sorry ... French word in an english text 
But yes, as long FiS is being improved, developped and enhanced, WiS could (must !) leave its life too.
Quote:I would also like to see ships where we walked in the ships and it takes like 5-xx players to fly it and man all of its systems.
To go with that I'd like to see a contract type for hourly labor: Ships Gunner Wanted
Don't sure about this. Capsuleers were as gods on a starship, so multiples capsuleers in a ship is at best strange, at worse a heresy. But taking Dust marines in a new ship class like landable ships for transferring them from a point to an other should be nice.
Never forget that capsuleers get in pods before getting in their ships, they don't have something like a CIC ;)
Btw, i'd like to read devs about this matter of immersion in Incarna. |
Patient 2428190
DEGRREE'Fo'FREE Internet Business School
4
|
Posted - 2011.11.17 11:47:00 -
[45] - Quote
I'm sure the first step in getting WiS gameplay would be having netcode, being able to render more than 1 avatar in real time and generally making the Carbon engine less utter s*** in every way.
Once you get past the technical hurdles (and keep in mind, its been about 4 years to get to this point for Carbon, the last 2 years using the majority of CCP's resources), you'll have to find somebody who can convince the coke loving Vikings not to put microtransactions all over it. |
BugraT WarheaD
Astromechanica Federatis
32
|
Posted - 2011.11.18 11:45:00 -
[46] - Quote
Yes but reworking the UI before presenting this to the players would have been nice [:/] |
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