Please stop comparing the two. You're intellectually raping me with your sheer idiocy and lack of critical thinking skills

TS has a built in recorder and is better quality then the in game voice.

Put your tinfoil down already.

And tell me, was it at any point non-consensual? No?

Then stop using sexual assault as the measuring stick with which you compare with. You cheapen actual victims across the world with your moral equivications

"I will hunt you mother ******* down and gut your ******* asses." -- Sohkar.

Sohkar makes Sohkar look bad all on his own. He doesn't need any help.

Does CCP really have jurisdiction outside of the game?

E1 did nothing against the EULA.

Have you?

Please quote the section that E1 broke.

You are the one saying E1 has broken the EULA. You have to show the evidence to back up your claim, not me.

Saying "It's against the EULA" is not an opinion. You're making a claim to something being a fact.

You should listen to the recording before you comment.

Okay let's recap:

You said it was against the EULA. You were asked to quote it. You made an excuse not to, and are now saying "well it's up to CCP's interpretation".

Just wanting to make sure I have this straight.

Is that true? If so, Mr. Epeen is not very smart. Pretty much why I never read or respond to his posts anymore.

What a ******* joke. I really wish bloggers were forced to fact check prior to posting something.

First off, how does Riptard know what goes on in a Bonus Round?

By his extensive cross-section of one case study?

We have literally had trolls roll accounts to play the Bonus Round. Trolls who play all the way through and then "manufacture" their "outrage" to the point where it is blatantly obvious they are trolling.

How about the winners? Do you ever hear about those? Of course not. Because no one wants to hear about a dozen or more dudes scrambling around looking for isk to payout a client.

No, EvE doesn't thrive on those stories.

ALOD on TMC is a testament to that.

The NC. renter Sov Drop heist is a testament to that.

Grand Theft Carrier (The YT video) is a testament to that.

Goons claiming, "We aren't here to ruin the game, we are here to ruin YOUR game," is a testament to that.

The Guiding Hand heist is a testament to that.

The EvE Bank heist is a testament to that.

These are the damn stories that attract players to EvE, a game universe that has been touted as cruel and unforgiving.

But instead of citing "other" examples, let's have a look at the Bonus Round.

Fact: Permission to record is asked EVERY SINGLE BONUS ROUND.

Fact: Format never changes. Sometimes people add in incentives during the normal format. Period.

Fact: No one holds a gun to the head of a client and says, "You have to play the Bonus Round, or you will die."

Fact: Multiple 100th clients opt out of the Bonus Room, choosing to lose their isk instead, as per bio rules.

Fact: There have been winners. Some in the form of isk. Others have won in far greater ways. One in particular I know of walked away with about 10b within two days of the Bonus Round he played. And agreed with our playstyles. As a carebear.

Fact: You never, ever hear an escrow or Ero be rude, hateful, hurtful, or anything else...to anyone during a Bonus Round.

Fact: The comms on which the Bonus Round is hosted has a strict anti-rascism/anti-homophobic stance, as does the Bonus Round itself.

Fact: The Bonus Round itself is simply an amalgamation of numerous "everyday" EvE traditions. Such as singing. Guess it was equally sociopathic when CCP Gargant was forced to sing to keep his Legion, while leading a new player experience fleet.

And fact: We have had so-called "EvE celebrities" sit in on the bonus round. I won't say who, for their sake, and out of respect, but still. Guess those individuals are to be held accountable because someone else, a so-called "victim," cannot control their composure during a game, amiright?

And how do I know these things as fact?

Because I do not have one, but...

Every.

Single.

Recording.

Made.

So Riptard's base analysis, is exactly that, base analysis. He couldn't take the time to check and see if facts are true, but rather use a fringe example to try and ruin the name of a fellow player.

As a representative of our community.

Last time someone singled out a player for a public audience, and sat on the CSM, he was given the boot.

Just saying.

Fact goes a lot further than conjecture, Rip. And attacking when you do not hold all of the facts, is usually not the wisest move.



*Side note: As a participant in escrowing Bonus Rounds, I will easily and willingly put myself on trial, hand over all of my recordings, screens, and logs; and wait patiently as you peruse hours of content that was created using your game, played as "evil space pirates," as per the marketing your game has made for itself across a decade.

In return for that show of good faith, I would ask kindly for the betterment of the player base he is elected to represent, that you remove the CSM who resorts to lies and slander to further his own political machinations via hurtful analogies, and incomplete analysis.

Thank you, and as always I appreciate all of the work you do, CCP. Your game is one in a million. A social experiment of grand proportions. I hope you stay true to that vision.

We will see. I am betting teamspeak wont like to be in any way associated with words like, oh i dont know,

1) cyber-bullying
2) online predators
3) vulnerable victim
4) abuse

Teamspeak EULA

11. PROHIBITED CONDUCT

You represent and warrant that you will not violate any of the terms and conditions set forth in this Agreement and that:

You will not use TeamSpeak software to engage in or allow others to engage in any illegal activity.



And my job is done.

I see Erotica 1 did quite a bit of baiting in this thread.

He truly is a master baiter.

Oh I see, you're trying to play little semantic tricks here.

Fact is: You can't scam people out of something that they do not even own. None of his assets are owned by him, only CCP.

It is not criminal to scam people out of virtual currency. If it is, by all means: Call the police.

Let us know how it works out.

EULA:

You may not submit any content to any chat room or other public forum within the Game that is harassing, abusive, threatening, harmful, obscene, libelous or defamatory, encourages conduct that could constitute a criminal offense or give rise to civil liabilities, or is unlawful in any other way, including without limitation the submission of content that infringes on a third-partyGÇÖs intellectual property rights.

Read this once again outloud.

thankyou for your well rounded post sir.

So you believe physical violence isn't as bad as scamming for fake money?

Once again, fellow players.... your ire is misplaced.
We do NOT want to open this can of worms.

This is all I have to say on the subject:

Remember when everybody wanted Tank CEO banned (not for breaking the rules, but just because 90% of the players didn't like him)? Kinda the same thing, here. Tank pointed out loopholes and exploits that other people were using to get past the rules, and his conduct created new rules that have helped to make EVE thrive.
Like it or not, we needed Tank.

Now, Erotica 1 is running a high-stakes gambling event. Nothing more. He's not exploiting bugs, or pointing out flawed rules. He's asking you to risk, and offering a possible reward. End of story.
Erotica's "bonus round" is no different than any real life casino in Vegas. You walk in, and blow every dime you have, that's not the house's problem. You could have stepped away at any time. Nobody forced you to stay. They just made it a little easier for you to choose that option.

I wouldn't call a slot machine a form of bullying. Chances are it WILL take everything you put into it, and give nothing back.
Winners are paid by the "donations" of the losers.

Your saying criminal case. You are discussing the death threats towards Erotica 1 are you not? Or are you defending a racist?

Ero's already addressed this in a rather long post a few pages back. Perhaps if people were paying more attention instead of frothing at the mouth and seeing red, they would not have missed it.

And you most certainly have not sat down long enough with him to make the diagnosis required to form the conclusion that you have. In other words, you're talking out your anus.

Dat misdirection.

*Points at topic*

I am a CEO of a CODEdot corporation who requires Code compliancy in the bonus rounds, which are being called all sorts terrible names right now, yet you have clear and irrefutable evidence linked by me of thousands of hateful, racist, and otherwise vile comments throw around.

The only misdirection is away from your witch hunt and toward the heart of the matter.

ugh, more veiled threats.

I'm doing them a service by informing them of their stupidity. If they can handle the criticism, they will then go on to improve themselves and become persons of merit rather than mouth froth. It's a vital service that I quite enjoy providing.

That sounds like a threat. You should calm down before you do something you regret.

I might also add that effective communication is the responsibility of the communicator. People wouldn't be 'misrepresenting' your points if you were making them with more succinct clarity. You have, indeed, dodged a wide variety of questions. You do a lot of dodging. I believe you when you say you're a lawyer.

More mob mentality garbage. You're all far worse then what you think E1 is.

and how exactly is his main spelled?

It was funny how fast that worked. I don't think it was you, Agata, but someone just sent me 200mil.

So if Erotica 1 had used Eve Voice instead of TS everything would be jake right?

He says he consents to both.

There's really no wrangling your way out this, it's plainly stated on the recording, so I'm done responding to this asinine line of argument.

But as a sorted of deleted-scene-DVD-extra, here's what I would have said if, by some magic, you could demonstrate that the client did not say what he said - who cares? CCP are not the police, and neither are we, and a grey-area TS recording is nothing to do with either.

The lack of people commenting, at the moment atleast, is because not everybody knows yet. If this hits RL news, like the battle in B-R there will be a ungodly amount of hate, hassle and bad press for CCP

http://www.rcfp.org/reporters-recording-guide/consent-and-its-limits

As with most legal issues the answer to the consent question is not clear. Erotica 1 would most likely escape any legal action because this is too small-time for anyone to be interested in it. But you never know.

What if the victim withdraws his consent to be taped, or to have the conversation distributed? In a context like this one, when the sole purpose of the recording is to embarrass this person, and when the recording serves no other purpose, I suspect that the consent could be withdrawn at any time.

To those of you who support the Bonus Room as a legitimate Eve activity, what is the line an Eve player would have to cross to get you to admit he did something wrong?

Could you link this?

CCP will ban everyone participating in this thread.

Gotta throw out the rabble for the future EVE Utopia where everyone will hold hands and sing until the UFO's come and them away.

If you keep throwing tantrums, I'm going to have to call your babysitter.

You do know this is a game right? None of these pixels are real.

Scamming is a cornerstone of EVE and isnt going away. Perhaps you should join another space MMO that does ban these things.

I don't have to try, you're all making yourself look stupid just fine without my intervention, I'm just enjoying the show. I've added plenty, and it's all been dismissed by mouth-frothing paranoid pitchfork-wielding over-emotional morality police that wouldn't know what being rational meant if they were born into Mensa.

Really, though, thoroughly enjoying the tinfoil-inspired assumption that I'm an alt of Ero. Especially considering I've stated numerous times I neither support nor condemn him. That, and I'm an Australian single-account holder with only a hauling alt on the same account. Not that I have to explain anything to you, I just want you to understand why you and your very presumptuous buddies in the 'burn ero but pretend sokhar is innocent' crowd sound like total morons to me.

What exactly and specifically must the victim do in order to win the Bonus Round?

No, I call you morons for jumping to conclusions.

Wait, what was it you said? "You got to be E1s alt" or something like that?

If you're so prepared to jump to conclusions about me, what's there to stop you from jumping to conclusions about anything else? Like the circumstances surrounding this 'incident'?

You're a moron because you're a presumptuous **** who ignores rational arguments and reasonable assertions because they don't make you feel angry at Ero like everyone really wants to. Because let's face it: how many of you have been just WAITING for something even resembling a legit excuse to rage about Erotica 1 and make so very much ado about nothing?

I hate scammers like you. At least Erotica 1 doubles your ISK. Your actions show you are morally bankrupt.

People like you should be banned by CCP based on MY feelings.

Scamming renamed ships and taking everything off someone is a different ballgame.

[
Or the 'victim' can turn off the game client, voice comm software, PC as he is unable to distinguish between real life and a video game? Don't get me wrong I'm not saying what Erotica 1 did was right, I'm saying that the victim in this case doesn't have to be a victim. And getting back on topic, what people THINK or FEEL about E1's actions should not be sufficient grounds for him to be banned.

Otherwise, I take offense at your stereotypes about Australians and the language (implied or not) you use and think you should be banned.

Guess you don't understand sarcasm. My bad shoulda put a /sarcasm at the end of my post.

Reading the other bit of my post helps too.

Many you should stop reading the words of an agitator ffs.

You have to be a special kind of stupid to allow a stranger on the internet to have that kind of control over you.

E1 did not harrass, insult or use racial and threatening language. The contestant, however, did.

E1 did not gain any out of game service for isk either. We have ransomed songs out of Devs before, its perfectly fine.

So whose side are you on? Or are you just here to hurl random insults?

By the way you grow out of the swearing every sentence phase when you hit adulthood.

And yet, it has been done to devs.

Are you trolling or actually this stupid? Genuine question.

Wow, you really, really don't understand what I've been posting despite my repeated emphasis. You must be as thick as that alt of Sokhar who needs things spelt out in black and white. Ok, final attempt:

A. Your feelings about the moral character of another player should not be justification that the person should be perma-banned by CCP.

B. If you think that personal feelings are sufficient grounds for CCP to ban another player, that implies that you are OK with CCP banning YOU if another player deems you to be offensive etc.

C. In this case, if I felt you were offensive, should CCP ban you too?

If you're still confused at this point, please read (A) above again to understand the point I'm trying to make. If you understand my premise now, well done, it only took 3 pages and 10 posts but we got there in the end.

Ok, to address your post itself: Humiliation of a player that can opt out at any time is more serious than issuing a RL death threat over a video game, because it is 'justified'? Does that mean that if I find your posting style offensive and it is driving me into a rage, I would be fully justified in issuing RL death threats to you?

(Sorry, I posted the above on the assumption you will get what I am inferring. To make it easy to understand what I'm talking about, I am responding specifically to your stated "One gets perma ban for doing this deliberately other gets a warning or a shortie for going bonanza (although he can be justified because he was simply pushed to the limit)")

Despite laying it out in very easy to follow chunks, you can still throw random arguments which have NO bearing to my posts. I give up. Sorry, English isn't my first language too but you are just really really really too thick to talk to.

Yes, you are quite thick. If the recording had been with ingame means (Eve voice) the result would have been a perma ban on shokar and kuddos to ero for not taking steps against him.

I'm gonna post this every time someone beats the poor dead horse;

What happend;
Ero: Give me your isk and I double it.
Adult ATC: Here's all my isk
Ero: haha, you need to come on teamspeak and win a bonus round where I invent the rules as we go
Adult ATC: ok
Ero: read this text please
Adult ATC: Ok, N-BOMB, Gaybash, shout, scream, rant
Ero: Sing songs
Adult ATC: NO! N-BOMB, Gaybash, shout, scream, rant
Adult ATC: I'l gonna kill you!
Adult ATC: My wife will come and scream at you some more

How it should have been;
Ero: Give me your isk and I double it.
Adult ATC: Here's all my isk
Ero: haha, you need to come on teamspeak and win a bonus round where I invent the rules as we go
Adult ATC: Wait what? Naaaah... You scammed me, well played.

What normal people do:
Ero: Give me your isk and I double it.
Adult ATC: No way dude, I know it's just pixels but I want to buy space bling with them.
D.

Do you even read what other people post? Do you know what tantrums mean?

See, thick as rock.

The scamming happened ingame. CCP encourages people to do it. So stick your head up your ass and keep telling yourself how great you are. Bigot.

D.

The key word here is 'ingame'.

You're welcome.

*counts down to the time someone kills himself due a scam or bonusroom in eve*

You have all of my respect; this is one of the few rational responses I have seen on this thread.

People have already died over stuffs in MMOGs.

So, it's ok to spew death threats and obscenely racist statements as long as someone on the internet made you mad?

Provocation does not equal vindication. Especially when the "provocation" is as flimsy as this.

So, we're in agreement then.

Permaban Sohkar.

Go back to SWTOR.

Dude, let's go back to the start where Sokhar WILLINGLY GAVE ERO THOSE ASSETS TO BEGIN WITH.

Okay, now that we're at the beginning, let's try some rational thought shall we?

Go.

Then why didn't Sohkar end it there?

So imma put aside the rage and ask an opinion of both sides;

Almost 300 pages and nary a peep from ccp. No matter what side you're on...ain't that weird?

Thank you.

I will also send this to the rating agency.

But its not a violation of any rule in Eve.

So you're gonna bring Erotica1 before the Hague? You're comparing online karaoke to the Holocaust?

Doesn't have to be illegal to be wrong.

Oh yes, Erotica 1 has asked and received from his victims nsfw pictures of their significant others. And then, he posted them on forums.

Of course, since you can falsely claim that Erotica 1 does not commit similar acts, you must be an Erotica 1 associate, and perhaps even one of the torturing company that we can listen to on Erotica 1 bonus room recordings?

No such links exist.
Ero NEVER asked ANYONE to do that stuff.

You are a lying little prick defending a racist bigot.

D.

I don't care of who's in on the crusade against another player. I'm posting in regards to this posse formed by a vindictive csm against someone who just scammed some players and asked them to sing songs.

I don't care one iota for any internal politics in goons or who kicked who for what. It is irrelevant.
I listened to the recording and heard someone having a laugh and someone being a bigot, a racist and threatening a fellow man with murder.

Try and take it any direction you want but this says a lot more about you than it does about me.

My razor is quite sharp, thank you very much.

D.

Unlike you, I've read everything posted and have spoken to many of the people involved.
Unless you can provide me with proof to the contrary of what my proof points out, I'm quite confident in bringing this madness to light.

D.

Nice...

D.

Liar.

If I ask my daughter to sing and I give her a donut, but in the end I dont give here anything.

Is this mental abuse? Should I go to jail because of it?


Tell me about my wrong doings please.

Literally mental capabilities of a child

Are you about to form a circumstantial correlation as proof of something that doesn't actually prove anything?

The feedback in this thread is very much appreciated, and we've been watching it since it was first posted.

While we can appreciate that tensions are high, please remember to keep within the forum rules when posting.

We'll have more information for you guys in the coming days.

No, I never said you can't make observations. I just know what people who are prone to jumping to conclusions are likely to do with those observations.

Only because you haven't provided any proof.

Your assumption that anything you say is important amuses me. Please, continue.

Wow indeed.

Getting people to sing is not against the rules.

Getting them to read out the code isnt against the rules.

Stealing his stuff isnt against the rules.

So you think we should ban someone for breaking no rules?

No, but his money and assets weren't taken. He gave them away. Willingly.

"The National Crime Prevention Council defines cyberbullying as GÇ£the process of using the Internet, cell phones or other devices to send or post text or images intended to hurt or embarrass another person."

Hes a cyberbully, records it for his other cyberbully friends to see. Simple as that.

You have won, ladies and gentlemen, you are getting your witch to burn at the stake

You still have not posted what rules were broken.

LOL at the people that think the "bad press" over this hurts EVE. If stories about people losing thousands of dollars worth of stuff through a corp theft, AWOX, or suicide ganking are welcomed by CCP, so do you think they really give a rat's ass about this? I know minerbumping had a blog post about this a while ago, but I don't give a crap enough to go find it. I'm sure CCP has been aware of what happened here for quite some time. IMO the only person that did anything ban worthy was the "victim" for his racist rants and death threats. I've been pissed off enough at people to want to punch them, but never resorted to death threats and racist tirades, FFS.

Maybe you should go back to your bubbles if you think asking someone to sing stupid songs to get their pixels back qualifies as torture. Jesus Christ, you people are pathetic.

Logic and reason, baltec.

Not applicable to GD, unfortunately.

And evidently, those two things are construed as tears now too.

Here lemme try the other side of the fence for a moment.

EROTICA 1 SHOULD DIE IN A FIRE AND BE DRAGGED THROUGH THE STREETS STILL SMOLDERING BECAUSE HE MADE SOMEONE SING ON TS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Meh, nope. Not for me.

I prefer logic and reason. Y'know, truths, opposed to half truths and fabrications.

Guess I will always lose the GD battle. vOv

They point to examples where people "won 10b and had fun so it's all good." But wasn't it they're goal to all along to find a participant like Sohkar? Push someone enough until they crack and provide audio to play over and over. While Sohkar is 100% not excused for the racist tirade he went on, I think in the end they got what they wanted. Why else would they post it online afterward?

So he's shifting all his stuff ahead of the banhammer? Good to know - are you taking notes CCP?

Sorry, this doesn't even come close to cyberbullying. Sohkar is not a real person. He is an avatar in a video game. Did E1 and company track him down IRL and post stuff about him on Facebook? Did they publish any of his personal info or encourage people to harass him? Did they call his home or place of business and harass him?

In the event that CCP provides an exception due to my expired passport, allows anonymity due to death threats, and allows my candidacy at all by ignoring angry carebears with pitchforks, then I'm certain that whatever the final vote tally is, I would get far more votes due to this event than would have occured otherwise.

I believe I would make a fine CSM.

Do I think any of this will happen? LOL Of course not. But it does say something about the whole posting CSM names' thing. Ask for passports, fine. But the policy of posting the real names allows some people to take things way too far for an internet spaceship council.