This harmless singing humiliation thing. I've only heard about it in child's playgrounds... and mafia/military films.

Just for perspective Is Erotica in his teens yet? If so this is evidence of a compulsive uncontrollable age regression. The malice and forethought plus the regression is typical of most incarcerated criminals. Under the hardened skin is a child treating others as they themselves have been treated. They take on their parents or significant relationships role, Curse or Witch role depending on gender, They are similar except for repressed sexual content or lack thereof.

In most of the sympathizers response we see the banal script of powerlessness as it has been called. In the proponents of this action, through their referrals to legality are playing out the banal script of Inequality. This script has a lot to do with competition. Unfortunately the competition is between male and female psyches. Erotica is of course the female being the manipulator. When a woman does this to a man its amusing until it get destructive. Its actually a form of penile envy that expresses itself like most jealousies as a passive aggresive angry vengeance (oral violence). As the severity of the game progresses it develops from oral to anal elements. And yes, extreme obsessions with rigid structures is an anal compulsion.

In real life this is what women do to men when they lead them on and then reject them acting outraged. It can progress to actual charges of **** or violence against the person they are victimizing. Many have seen this in action in the clubs. You know, the ones that flash you then act as if they didn't do it and that your a meat hound. The only solution is to stay away, we know that, and thats why we stay away. The undercurrent is to prove the victim is lascivious, thereby justifying that all men are bad and avoiding the pain of dealing with her daddy issues.

One last point about the anal characteristics of this female game. According to Erickson human development theory, the perpetrator was perpetrated on a bit later. Probably between 3.5 to 8 years. Erotica would do well to isolate trauma(s) during this age, abandonment, abuse, and shame projections of others and have a professional help (HER) process it.

Barring Erotica's own seeking of help, do to the poor adaptation of these women, they do not tolerate antithesis well and usually run if not supported by others of peer to continue there justification of man hatred. Without admiration the patient flees treatment and is instead best counseled with groups of similar minded peers that have shown some reversal. These people don' t pile on the shame and pain on top of subconscious wounds. CCP would do many people a service including Erotica by not condoning this play-style. Its an illness.

As harsh as it may sound, scamming is a part of Eve.

However, the major problem I have is where they make fun of his speech impediment. There is no acceptable excuse CCP can give, that should allow this behavior.

This is bullying.

CCP should not tolerate this, and I'm quiet disappointed the permanent bans haven't already been handed out.

Why are people even siding with this *******? (the scammers)

are people just ignoring that they just went off and did the most **** move imaginable and instead some are saying how the victim should be punished instead

because it seems a third of the player base of eve are sociopaths, and a vocal minority - outright sadists, thats why.....


If I was CCP, I would boot E1 & Co. and pass therir IPs to law enforcement.

Calm and civil? CALM AND CIVIL!?!?!

Surely these be the hallmarks of witchcraft! Prepare the stake! BURN THE WITCH!

Oh, the death threats and racist slurs guy..naw..hes cool..let him go.

It seems to me that you come to EVE to be exactly what you really want to be. You've established a pattern of harassment against many people in the name of this "Bonus Round". This goes far beyond scamming people out of their money and assets in EVE - it's sadistic in its personal nature and invasion of privacy, coercing your marks into humiliating and distressing acts.

So because they didn't understand what was happening to them, they deserve that degree of humiliation? Is that what you're saying?

For certain degrees of ******* that incorporate sociopathic public mocking rituals, yes.

Is it "fun" to get your friend blind drunk and then handcuff him to a light post in the middle of the CBD just in time for peak hour?

Imo theres no need for any line. It is CCP policy to examin the cases one by one and deciding. Setting up a rule here is totally not needed, from both sides of the argument.

Does "Burn Jita" involve humiliating people outside the game?
....
They're not taking people to their own TS server to publicly humiliate them away from the domain of the EULA and TOS.
....
Did you get them to read Wikipedia entries out loud to mock pronunciation errors, write essays about how wonderful you are, post photos of themselves naked with "Erotica 1 for CSM" signs, and ridicule them while they were doing all this? Did you change the rules about the ransom while you had them on TS?

+1 for honouring the ransom, BTW.

Lots of people in this thread would be defending the rapist and blaming the woman that dressed sexy and was having a little fun at the bar.

Sad.

You've got it backwards, read again.

This is about CCP allowing psychopaths to use their game as a tool to lure victims.

No more. No less.

I don't understand the controversy. The answer seems plain enough. Just because he manages to technically stay within the rules doesn't make it okay. It just means that like most psychos, he's clever. Hardly worth the hero worship I'm seeing in here.

I'd like to think that most of those supporting Erotica1 are just trolling or taking the ****, but I don't think that's the case. I think that these people actually think that taking what's encouraged in game and moving it out into the real world is perfectly acceptable behavior. And I am disheartened to see it.

Mr Epeen

So this DJ guy gets raging mad at me. Others can tell you who he is, most will get the reference. Anyway, I had the misfortune of having gotten on his radar and nothing I could say would calm this guy down. I was told to drop my CSM run and do a number of things otherwise they would expose some real life dirt they found on me, since I had released my NAME to address the people thinking the CSM thing was a troll. I had no idea people would stoop this low over internet spaceships. (oops again.)

If I get one more iota of harassment of this I will release the blackmailers eve-online name. Most people can guess.

Like a moron, I caved in to every single demand. I posted what they wanted me to say on goon forums. I sent silly apology mails, etc etc. You could say it was a taste of my own medicine notched up a bit. I felt this was the prudent approach, yet the onslaught against me continued and escalated, which led me to believe I made the wrong choice. I should have made a stand then. Instead, I took a breather from the limelight.

Guys, there were never any "mayo" pics. There were no underage girls, etc. In the campaign TS event I held, a BU guy's adult girlfriend linked racy pics with "ERO4CSM" written on her body. I did NOT ask for these. I do NOT have these saved. In her words, she "wanted to give nerds something to fap to." Look, I'm not complaining at all... I'm sure many nerds did "fap" to them to be quite honest. There were some funny pics with the clients' FACES OBSCURED with a sign. We said, look, if you want to link a pic that would be funny, but for God's sake, don't make it personally identifiable. Hold up a funny sign over your face. One of those is the Yodaknows pic on minerbumping. Like I said, only a handful, and they are extremely tame. Yeah one guy did write "Erotica 1" in peanut butter on his chest. Funny, gross, and totally not identifiable to the person.

The "dirt" isn't even all that big of a deal, just downright embarrassing. Some years ago, I sold some resale rights stuff online to make some cash. Made some money, cool. Anyway, a guy complains. I look into it, see he's right, apologize and refund his money. I spoke to a rights owner and straightened things out.

No, I am not saying he did. Someone else. Doesn't matter.

yes

a.) The schoolyard bully: This is the guy that asks to borrow your hat, and then refuses to give it back unless you do embarassing things on the playground. This bullying can be easily avoided (don't give him your hat). This bully can be easily defeated (give up your hat and walk away). The only power this bully has is the power you give them. In the wasy that count, this is type of bullying that took place on E1's "bonus room" soundcloud. An adult should be able to cope with this type of harassment without crying fowl and running to the police.

b.) The maleficent bully: This is the bully that steals your items, physically assaults you, vandalizes your home, makes you feel for your safety, and goes out of their way to make you miserable. This bully cannot be easily escaped, as they stalk you and maneuver to block your escape. This is they type of bullying that should involve bringing in the authorities and prosecuting, but this is NOT the type of bullying that went on here. This is what the cyber-bullying movement is trying to stomp out, and you calling E1's actions cyberbullying is a disservice everyone. It's simply a pathetic use of an inflammatory buzzword to force CCP's hand and gain media attention, and y'all should feel ashamed for following this path!

You, among many others, are going to look pretty foolish if Erotica1 eventually drives someone to suicide with these antics.

Ethics has never been the question. It's about harm, and how fragile human minds are when they are pushed around by a master manipulator.

There are things that can be done or limits set that don't requiring banning and/or making everyone live in a padded cell.

Since I'm onto analogies:

Game shows are known for humiliating or otherwise embarrassing contestants, which is fine if the contestants know what they're getting into. The more extreme the humiliation/pressure, the better the ratings.

However, if a contestant were to completely break down and start screaming obscenities and engaging in unpleasantries, how many game shows would still air that episode? More importantly, why would a game show censor themselves like that? The answer is normally "community standards", i.e. society has ideas about how much humiliation is too much, and the game show is aware of that.


In that light, should Erotica1 have published that particular bonus room?

No Mr. Epeen, I, for one, do not find it acceptable.

I stand for keeping real-life terrorists, rapists, pedophiles, pimps, drug dealers, online predators and such out of EVE. I am sure CCP also holds such a stance.

E1 and friends have to go.

I can find you people, state and federal attorneys and law enforcement agents that would have great difficulty at finding humour in eBay scamming.

is often based on people's feelings aka standards

So yeah, Erotica is being judged by the community (aka people's feelings)

It's not ad hominem. It might be another logical fallacy, but it's not an ad hominem.

Equating internet griefers to rapists and paedophiles.

Wow.

175 pages in this is really what we're doing.

Until then, we're all just desperate for "high functioning sociopath" drama.

I'm beginning to suspect that Alp Khan is an alt of E1, being used to simply troll the thread from the other side.

If so, well played (but a wee bit over the top).

Hi, my name is Joe.
I have a reputation for kicking small children in the face.
A week ago this boy of age 7 stood in front of me in the grocery store line so I kicked him in the face.
Kid should have known better than to stand in front of me, after all I do have a reputation.
To punish his stupidity I kicked him in the face and stomach several more times.

He *is* the parent...

I believe it was in Uranus somewhere. Hmmm...trying to get a lock on the locale but there is a huge area to scan.

Hmmmmm, I'll have to confirm with local municipality law enforcement regarding their regions' policy on progeny; ownership of.

This shouldn't take long, brb.

stop posting
From: XXXXXXXXX
Sent: 2014.03.26 21:13
To: LUMINOUS SPIRIT,

Dude, 20 bil isk for you if you quietly stop posting.


Interesting. E1 thinks I can be quietly bought off for a mere 20 bil? Lol?

I'm also especially curious about this because it seems to me the people defending Erotica 1 are many of the same people who more or less wanted The Mittani burned at the stake two years ago.

I would agree, but in this case we're dealing with someone who has a history if this behavior and no apparent intent to let up.
I mean this is the reason he got kicked out of (whatever corp he was in, think it was WIdot) and GSF.

It's apparent that I'm convincing nobody here and I don't want to get too embroiled in the debate. It's not as if anything I say will affect CCP's judgment on this. But do expect that they will bring the hammer down one way or another - they really can't afford not to.

I think it'd be fair to say that both sides of the discussion would share this same sentiment.

Because when one of these "idiots" goes over the top, slots himself or harms someone else, then the game we love is going to be in some serious ****.

It demonstrates the need to put an end to the scamming sub-culture of EVE.

Wanting to remove scamming altogether is a valid topic for discussion, albeit a seriously unpopular one.

I might suggest it for it's own thread though. It's outside the pale of this one, in my opinion.

Mr Epeen

That's a good point.

Although is it an accurate comparison? The WoW deaths I've heard of have always been due to some pretty hardcore addiction, and not the result of a player being antagonized in some form.

The point is that there is, and always will be, a chunk of our community that is emotionally vulnerable like that and will overreact and take things hard. I'd argue against calling people like that part of an unstable fringe. It's very common. Do we write those folks off as "idiots" and just keep playing, or do we try to make our game as inclusive and reasonable for everyone as we can?

Making value judgments on ISK is besides the point. The issue is that he was humiliated and I think... wasn't so much looking for his ISK back but his pride.

getting them to gamble their stuff and then using that EvE virtual property as leverage to coerce them onto a team speak server where they are humiliated and harassed. They then post the recorded conversation on EvE forums to further humiliate that player.

The thing is though that in RL (at least here) Casinos are now bound by law to stop problem gamblers and addicts from gaming when they're spotted. Same with pubs and alcohol - the establishment is ultimately responsible for how drunk they allow someone to become.

We're seeing the same thing creep in online, where the sites are ultimately being asked to take responsibility for people who cannot meter their own interactions within the game.

Doesn't change the facts - they broke the rules in regards to harassment and harming CCPs reputation.

Regarding the choice thing it's not accurate. You left out the coercive element. You're also ignoring the fact he was deliberately led along a path designed to keep him engaged.

Do juries decide sentencing based on the pathology of the victim?

Already been cited multiple times. You may not harass other players.

You may not cause damage to CCP's reputation.

We did not lower him to cattle Ero did. But yes this is an issue that I call dehumanizing. When they profile violent criminals, this trait always shows up and the lack of it often signals a need for a different type of investigation. This trait shows up in serial killers in particular. Can't recall the citation, 3rd party ex-FBI training on profiling.

I do not think this should be about the victim's choice but the actions of the perpetuators and whether one considers them 'normal behavior' or not. The rest is gossip...

If you think this behavior is 'normal' then... I rest my case.

For you and all the rest that condone these actions, including Erotica1 and the gang, all I have to says is: what goes around comes around...

Do any of the folk speaking up for Ero think that the making fun of a person's speech impediment was acceptable?

I would like to think that even the most ardent 'Eve Online laissez faire' folk find the part of the whole sorry episode unacceptable.

While I do not like it, I can agree with the last sentence.

I'm curious.

Were you you as understanding of Somer, who essentially said exactly the same things you are attributing to Erotica1?

Mr Epeen

That's not really your call, is it?

It's up to CCP whether any rules were broken. CCP makes the rules and CCP interprets them. Not me. Not you.

I suppose we'll find out soon enough, so give it a rest about rules. It just doesn't wash.

Mr Epeen

should behavior like this or worse than this warrant a reanalysis of CCP's stance

I pointed out how difficult this would be in that current employees of CCP engaged in just this sort of behavior.

Any 'support' you provide is moot. And I don't make a habit of willfully misunderstanding your posts for some perceived advantage. Why don't you offer me the same respect?

Mr Epeen

I have just finished Funky Bacons blog on the matter and one thing struck me.

I noticed that it was stated somewhere in this thread that E1 stated that he has reviewed the EULA/TOS carefully to ensure that he does not break them, hence him making sure he uses 3rd Party Comms, and also makes sure he gain consent so he does not break any laws.

If what he is doing fine then why so be so careful you are not breaking any laws?

You would only check this as you know what you are doing is both morally and ethically wrong and want a way out if something goes wrong.

If you know that what you are doing is fine you wouldn't go to the lengths he has to cover his own ass.

Insulting the speach impediment already constitutes grounds for enacting the EULA and legal action.

What exactly are the tasks required to be fulfilled, and how are they to be completed, in order to win the Bonus Room?

I ask again, what exactly are the tasks required of the victim in order to win the Bonus Room?

It's pretty obvious that the whole point of the bonus room is just humiliation. If it were done with in-game chat, it would violate that bit of the EULA that I've quoted infinity times that nobody seems to notice because this thread is just going in circles now.

What makes this hwole ordeal more disturbing is that there is an entire network of predators working together in finding their targets. There is much focus on E1 in this, but that is only one piece of the network set up for this.

And there is no failsafes protecting groups as minors in this predatorical enviroment other than the ethics and morale of the group it self, which i hardly can say is worth a damn.

Stopped reading there. I'm mean really, it's an atrocity now?