Ok, yeah. There was only talk of a video. My mistake...its not like this news happened yesterday.

As was said in the comments to petition it....which Im sure happened.

So Im guessing that didnt go as well as expected, hence the tears we have here today.

Which is basically a Riptard post, hoping to stir up enough of a mess, to get better reaction from CCP.

Pretty petty, and childish, if you ask me. Be a man, take the loss, go about your day.

exactly what exploit was used? could you please go in to depth about this so called exploit? I see titans bouncing off each other. last time i checked, supers/caps do bounce off each other when they cyno in to a system.

i didnt see any of the n2 pilots go into the pos, nor breach the pos field.

Velocity can be achieved if part of the titan was sticking out of the POS shield and bumbed when Titans jumped in. Which is what happened here. No exploits no loop holes, just an unlucky Titan pilot that was to close to the edge of the POS shields.

yes you can be in the pos and part of your titan will still stick out, hence why he was bumped at over 1k.

Please dont let facts stop the crying about exploits and how CFC should never lose a Titan due to pilot error.

Only CCP knows what happened for sure, but after reading some of the replies I'mma going to guess that this was petitioned and is being brought to the General Drama forums only because CCPs answer was not well received.

True dat.

So, what was the result of the petition then?

Really? It's kind of ironic then that I first learnt about POS bowling when I was in the CFC a few years back. This was at the time of the Fountain war to evict BoB. We were dicking around in Fountain and the BoB pets were all POS'ed up when Vee said on comms that he would show us how POS bowling worked, at which my little ears perked up.

He had got hold of the POS passwords through spies and we landed in the centre of a red POS. I think the idea was that we would either bump the BoB pets out or they would change the password to eject us out at high speed which would have a small chance of us colliding with the enemy ships and bumping them out at high speed.

It was all fascinating stuff :)

Suspect, agreed.. It's too bad the (potentially) incriminating part seems to be missing.

That's a plausible supposition, but that's all it is: a supposition.

No Evidence to confirm it whatsoever. If the video in question showed that an exploit was used, well then all of the goonposters in this thread would have a very valid point. But the video doesn't show that, does it?

Also, if a Part of a titan is sticking out of a shield, and I bump the part that's sticking out, is that an exploit? I'm actually curious about this as I don't know the answer.

As I mention here, the bump could have happened before the titan became untargettable, at which point (as you say) it would be impossible to stop and it would coast all the way through the pos shield (as it did).

The problem is the video doesn't show the critical part of the action which would constitute an exploit. An exploit might have happened, then again it might not have happened.

Reimbursing for a might have been is not a good idea (IMO).

Nah. Just make it so that anything that interacts or intersects with a POS shield on jumping (in or out) explodes instantly, leaving nothing behind, before any other physics simulation effects are calculated.

That should put a damper on things.

Correct, except for the bit where an exploit was used. No evidence has been provided showing that the titan was in the POS at the time of the alleged bump.

Death to ALL supers.

Yeah, except it just isn't that clear cut. If it was, the titan would have been replaced, temp bans handed out, and you and I wouldn't be having this discussion.

That being said, it's ultimately CCP's decision whether or not to hand out a frwe Titan.

Eh, if those titans that bumped get a ban, I won't shed a tear.

Could've been bumped while a bit outside the POS.

No evidence has been provided to the contrary except a few people saying "Nope, it was in the pos the entire time", which really isn't evidence at all.

Where is your incriminating video?

Just to play Devils advocate here : nowhere in that video does it show that Vees titan was inside the pos when they bumped it.

Maybe they bumped it by accident :) Nothing in this video proves otherwise.

Could you point out the time in the video where you see exactly where the orange titan was before the footage began.

I'd be real interested to examine that bit.

So somewhere in that general direction *waves hand at left side of screen*. Very nice and exact, or "simple" as you put it.

I'm not ignoring an exploit, I simply don't see it. Maybe its a simple thing for you to pinpoint the exact position of every single ship in that video at every single sever tick before the footage began.

Regrettably, I have no such ability. All I see is an orange titan moving in some vague direction toward the right of the screen.

What I am seeing is someone making a thread in GD claiming an "exploit" in the thread title to stir things up and then the OP backpedals by later saying:



It's been 3 weeks since that video was posted, so either you guys petitioned and it did not come out the way you expected, or you didn't and are breaking the rules now regarding positing exploits and/or rumor mongering for :reasons:

The video may in fact show the *result* of POS bowling, it does not however show the exploit being initiated. Assuming that it was the exploit at issue, it would have happened at a time prior to the video you are showing as evidence. Also if true, CCP will have evidence to back that up.

This is up to CCP to decide, and if they already have and you guys just don't like the answer, I can certainly sympathize, but you are gonna have to show me something a LOT more convincing before I start sharpening pitchforks and calling for blood. I am otherwise 100% in agreement, IF this is in fact an exploit, punitive and corrective actions should be handed out.

You're saying: This footage is the result of POS Bowling.
I'm saying: There's no POS Bowling in that footage.

I'm not disagreeing with the possibility that you are right. You could be correct.
But there is no actual footage of POS Bowling. Which means theirs no evidence of POS Bowling. Extrapolation? Sure. But extrapolation isn't proof.

Well, first you need to actually catch them in the act on video.

No you haven't. You might have caught them after the act.

In order to know where any collision occurred, and at what time, you would need to know the speed of every single titan in that video and the rate at which each of them decelerated. Do you know this? If not, any extrapolation you do will be woefully inaccurate.

As for how much evidence I want?
I would like to see either (1) footage of the actual bump or POS-bowl taking place or (2) logged physical data from CCP. Either of those would be completely satisfactory.

I hate to be a pedant, but your use of the word "literally" would imply that the video showed the cause rather than the consequence.

Probably is bowling .. but no way to know for sure without actually seeing it happen.


Does the cut first part of the vid exist somewhere? Wouldn't it be better to post the "proof" rather than just make people speculate as to the cause?


The fact that the video doesn't cover the whole event is likely to make people sceptical, or at least suspicious as to the motivation of this thread.

Well, you kinda do if you are touting the vid as proof.

The bump could have happened just inside or just outside of the shield .. I guess we will never know.

Maybe the bump was unintentional? Who knows?
Got some proof?

Why is it hard to backtrack? It isn't, but equally it isn't conclusive.
It is almost as if you are being intentionally evasive.

Why is it so hard to post the start of the video?

Dear lord baltec you sound like a wailing pubbie.

Why the **** are you trying to persuade pubbies about us being exploited? THEY DON'T CARE.

And CCP aren't going to reply on matters of policy in a thread. File a petition. God damn man.

Yes, if someone posts a video of roughly the same type as in the OP that doesn't show you actually breaking any rules, but does show you killing an N3 titan, I will have a thorough laugh at the loser's expense.

Not that my opinion matters. Really only CCP's opinion matters, and they have access to the logged physical data. Maybe you should petition it, although I'm guessing you already did at the time and didn't like their answer. If that's true, it really doesn't bode well for your case, does it?

Good luck storming the castle!

That's not what I said but OK. You have my approval to bump titans, for whatever **** that's worth lol.

Yeah, but that does not really have anything to do with having any irrefutable evidence to back up the OP today does it?

I mean again, nothing in this video shows that the titans butt wasn't poking out of the shields. If it was, and that is what was bumped, is that an exploit?

Considering the cyno is clearly way more than 2km from the edge of the shield ...

Would you be so kind as to get a screengrab from the vid that shows when that happened?

The logical conclusion would be that the titan was outside the pos shield.

lol, desperate much?

I haven't had any affiliation with 0.0 powerblocs in a long, long time.

Mostly because of the idiocy I see in threads like this.


What doesn't the video show?
The alleged exploit.

What does the video show?
The location of the cyno.


The location of the cyno does not seem to fit in with the story we are meant to buy into here ... even if we draw all the pretty lines you want.


Your supposition requires an interpretation of what we can't see which does not seem to fit what we can see.


Conclusion.
Video is evidence that no exploit took place.

If the titan was not fully inside the pos shield when they cynoed in they would have bumped the part of the titan that was outside the shield. This would have caused the effect seen in the video. Or :aliens:

I'm sure you can back that up, with a video or something, right?
Because, otherwise, it is kinda like "he said, she said"

But can we agree that nowhere in the video is this made clear? Because thats my main point of contention here.

Is that the long way of saying "No, I cannot prove my assertion"?

I wouldn't be making excuses if the video showed that they exploited. Exploits are bad.

I seem to remember you being much better at forums baltec1 - either my memory is failing me or your ability is failing you.

I did not see your fleet in that video either.

So, they weren't actually witnesses to the alleged act then?

This post shows you have absolutely zero knowledge of what POS bowling was.

Let me give you a tiny hint here:


You can't POS bowl anymore because they changed the way the POS shields work, everything else has been and is legal.

Baltec, if the video in question showed someone pos bowling no one would question that an exploit happened, the titan need to be replaced, and the people responsible banned.

As it stands, the provided video supports one of two conclusions:
1) The titan was bumped just inside the POS shield - Exploit.
2) The titan was bumped just outside the POS shield - Not Exploit.

You claim that the titan must have been inside the POS for ~reasons~ but provide no supporting evidence of that. Maybe after whatever op Vee went afk and drifted out of the POS. Stranger stuff has happened.

Of course its legit, we've done it several dozen times, its 100% legit, and when they put the newest exploit notification out this summer they were very specific about it being a legit tactic still to bump them out of a pos.

Pretty sure everybody (CFC included) have bumped titans out of POS's before.


Its not POS bowling either, that was something entirely different that related to the shields being semi permeable even without the pass word, you could charge in, and like a rubber band you'd stretch in then get flung back out, on the way in using a big enough ship would fling the things out.

That is POS bowling, bumping a titan out of a tower isn't that, its just that, using your knowledge of the POS pw to your advantage and bouncing the AFK titan out.

No idea. But that doesn't exclude the possibility. Motivation for an action, or lack thereof is not evidence as such.

No its not because POS shields stopped working that way 5 or 6 years ago.

If any part is sticking out you can still bump it, any part at all.


If you have the PW however it becomes a non issue.


Because NCdot have cut the first half of the video you can't really know if it was a single Phoon that did it (notice how much slower Vee's titan is going than all the rest? Looks like it was bumped by something smaller) or if the Titans simply had the PW in and jumped near the shield edge (less likely, Vee's titan would likely be around the speed the other titans were which would have taken him much farther away from the POS than he actually drifted).

Its shocking to me that in an organization the size of Goons that "its a spy" is somehow an unacceptable answer to the line members of the CFC.

Its not only possible, its actually the most probable.

This is absolutely not true, stop telling stories to an actual titan owner.

Even when you own the tower, like its your actual corp tower, its hard to get it to plop you in the tower, its sheer luck every time, however if you're not in the alliance, there is literally ZERO chance of it happening and you absolutely 100% can't penetrate the shields -even on jump in- if you're not equipped with the password


EDIT: The fact that you're trying to tell me how titans work is astounding in of itself but to tell it completely wrong is shocking.

Dude, they bounced away from the tower because thats the ONLY direction they could go, they CAN"T go through it, they have to go away.

And how do you know one of those handful of EG dudes aren't dirty?


Stating flatly in this case 'its not a spy' has a fairly huge potential to make you look silly, I mean holy **** man, Vee can die just like everybody else in game for being lazy and doing dumb stuff with spies around.

Yea, did CCP give the titan back?

Whats that, no they didnt?

Interesting, seems like you might be wrong here junior.

Knowing it was Vee's? Maybe, maybe not but it wasn't my spies working there, everybody handles their spy network differently, yours is used to disband and rob people, ours is used for information gathering only and hardly ever direct damage, NCdot handles theirs differently than either of us, who's to say.





Because I've been here for a few years and know how the process works?