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La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2195
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 21:29:00 -
[1] - Quote
Highsec as it is, is an abomination and must be nerfed.
Picture a rosebush, this represents the game. Sometimes it gets too unweildly and needs to be pruned and after pruning it grows back stronger than before.
Highsec has grown unweildly, the safety has been continually increasing much like an unweildly rose bush is continually growing in every which way except the way you want it to.
How has it done this?
It wraps newbies in bubble wrap and allows them to fall when it will most hurt them. For example a newbie that never leaves highsec or participates in any direct PVP hauls all of their stuff in a paper thin industrial which is suicide ganked. Had highsec not have been coddling them they would have died in much cheaper easier to replace things and learned how to manipulate risk : reward to their own advantage.
It allows blight to spread by protecting veteran players from consequences brought about by their own actions. For example the 5 year veteran NPC corp member who hauls billions around highsec completely risk and effort free thanks to wardec immunity/autopilot.
Finally and most insidiously it promotes a toxic ideology of risk aversion. Which is a threat to the economy and game as we know it.
Nerfing highsec by removing wardec invulnerably, by decreasing CONCORD effectiveness, by reducing npc corp advantage, and by actually limiting its resources would allow EVE to expand to new horizons. It would take niches currently filled by NPCs and allow players to fill them proving tonnes of new emergent game play.
One final truth, the highsec pubbie rapture is a lie, thousands of players will not be sucked up gigantic tubes of glowing light to new PVP-free spaceship MMOs if highsec is nerfed. The subscriber base will instead experience unprecedented growth. This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |

Divine Entervention
Abyss Cooperative 3
444
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 21:31:00 -
[2] - Quote
Do you personally feel that high sec should be nerfed in the fashion that this post of yours indicates? Proof of lying in thread.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4349703#post4349703 |

Liam Inkuras
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
943
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 21:32:00 -
[3] - Quote
2nd I wear my goggles at night.
Any spelling/grammatical errors come complimentary with my typing on a phone |

Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
4852
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 21:32:00 -
[4] - Quote
Look, it's this thread again.
--> Features & Ideas Discussion
The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the ho's and politicians will look up and shout 'Save us!' and I'll look down, and whisper 'Hodor'. |

Marsha Mallow
343
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 21:33:00 -
[5] - Quote
Nerfing as pruning bushes is a nice analogy. Waxing would explain the screaming (it's perfectly acceptable to scream).
Your turn next year? Shadowbanned and loving it Nerf Highsec AND Nullsec, unite the playerbase |

La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2195
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 21:33:00 -
[6] - Quote
This is a discussion of nerfing highsec not a new feature or idea. This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |

Divine Entervention
Abyss Cooperative 3
444
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 21:38:00 -
[7] - Quote
Do you personally feel that high sec needs to be nerfed as indicated by the thread creating post? Proof of lying in thread.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4349703#post4349703 |

Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
4852
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 21:39:00 -
[8] - Quote
La Nariz wrote:This is troll bait a discussion of nerfing highsec not a new feature or idea.
FYP
The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the ho's and politicians will look up and shout 'Save us!' and I'll look down, and whisper 'Hodor'. |

Thead Enco
47th Ronin
160
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 21:39:00 -
[9] - Quote
+1
-á"A Lannister always pays his debts."
-áTyrion Lannister |

La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2198
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 21:41:00 -
[10] - Quote
Divine Entervention wrote:Do you personally feel that high sec needs to be nerfed as indicated by the thread creating post?
For the health of the game yes highsec must be nerfed. It is in the same line as super caps and technetium were, its horribly out of balance to the point its warping the game. This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |

Rowells
Unknown Soldiers Fidelas Constans
495
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 21:42:00 -
[11] - Quote
*popcorn* |

Divine Entervention
Abyss Cooperative 3
444
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 21:44:00 -
[12] - Quote
Feel special friend, I compiled this for you:
Pix Severus wrote:
People whining that X is unfair get told to leave.
PotatoOverdose wrote:
Whining about how something is "unfair" is what gets you ridiculed.
Scipio Artelius wrote: That has little to do with the profession of the pilot and more to do with the attitude. If you complain and ask for someone else to take responsibility to fix what you perceive as a problem, you deserve to be called a carebear.
If you have a problem, work out how to solve it yourself and then solve it. Take responsibility for it rather than asking CCP to permit your play by stopping someone else's. You have all the tools necessary yourself to disrupt the play you don't agree with.
Mythrandier wrote:
Carebears on the other hand are a blight on this otherwise great game, they demand that the game is changed for their own personal benefit,
Proof of lying in thread.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4349703#post4349703 |

Abrazzar
Vardaugas Family
2996
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 21:45:00 -
[13] - Quote
Well, you run the CSM, so get to work! Sovereignty and Population New Mining Mechanics |

Shrewd Tsero
Aventine Legion
57
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 21:45:00 -
[14] - Quote
Why do these threads continue to be phrased in this way and with this tone? Is this all that people in low and null think about? It feels a bit like the guy who is jealous of his neighbor down the road.
Every day, he's thinking about it. He brings it up constantly with his co-workers. "It's not fair. He has all the good stuff. I should be able to have his stuff. And his wife. 'Cause she's hot." And every night when he gets home from his lifeless job, he finds something new that pisses him off about his neighbor. The perfect rose bushes. The new Mercedes. And do you know what this guy's neighbor thinks of him? He doesn't even think of him at all.
I have no problem with people suggesting changes in mechanics in any sector of the game, but stop acting like making High more dangerous is somehow going to save the game. A) The game isn't dying. It's not even on life support. And B) There's no research to suggest that this will in anyway increase subscription or retention rates. And if any says there is, it should be posted so the argument can finally end.
So yes, please put forth the merit of your suggestions (because some do have merit), but avoid ridiculously overblown hyperbole ("Highsec as it is, is an abomination and must be nerfed.") High sec is neither as bad for the game as you make out, or as vital for the game as the folks on the other side suggest. It just is. It is good to have substance to one's existence.-á But in the absence of substance, one can do much yet with style. |

La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2204
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 21:49:00 -
[15] - Quote
Abrazzar wrote:Well, you run the CSM, so get to work!
I'm a minister preaching is my work! This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |

La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2204
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 21:51:00 -
[16] - Quote
Divine Entervention wrote:Feel special friend, I compiled this for you: Pix Severus wrote:
People whining that X is unfair get told to leave.
PotatoOverdose wrote:
Whining about how something is "unfair" is what gets you ridiculed.
Scipio Artelius wrote: That has little to do with the profession of the pilot and more to do with the attitude. If you complain and ask for someone else to take responsibility to fix what you perceive as a problem, you deserve to be called a carebear.
If you have a problem, work out how to solve it yourself and then solve it. Take responsibility for it rather than asking CCP to permit your play by stopping someone else's. You have all the tools necessary yourself to disrupt the play you don't agree with.
Mythrandier wrote:
Carebears on the other hand are a blight on this otherwise great game, they demand that the game is changed for their own personal benefit,
This is your reading comprehension problem bleeding through again fair=!balanced. I'm not advocating EVE become :foxnews: FAIR AND BALANCED. Merely balanced. This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |

Marsha Mallow
343
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 21:54:00 -
[17] - Quote
You spelt "unwieldy" wrong. Twice. Don't even try to say that's US spelling.
Proof ggr Goons need to be nerfed next.
Shrewd Tsero wrote:Why do these threads continue to be phrased in this way and with this tone? Is this all that people in low and null think about? It feels a bit like the guy who is jealous of his neighbor down the road. Aggressive marketing. Er no, we have alts there too - but the neighbours are gold farming chavs and when you poke one it explodes in a hilarious incandescent ball of rage. Shadowbanned and loving it Nerf Highsec AND Nullsec, unite the playerbase |

Haedonism Bot
Revolutionary Front
1129
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 21:54:00 -
[18] - Quote
Amen, sir.
I wouldn't call it "nerfing" as that implies that the change must be a bad thing for high sec. To me, this sounds like buffing high sec. Buffing it by making it more dangerous, more competitive, and more fun. www.everevolutionaryfront.blogspot.com
Psychotic Monk for CSM9 |

La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2204
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 21:55:00 -
[19] - Quote
Shrewd Tsero wrote:Why do these threads continue to be phrased in this way and with this tone? Is this all that people in low and null think about? It feels a bit like the guy who is jealous of his neighbor down the road.
Every day, he's thinking about it. He brings it up constantly with his co-workers. "It's not fair. He has all the good stuff. I should be able to have his stuff. And his wife. 'Cause she's hot." And every night when he gets home from his lifeless job, he finds something new that pisses him off about his neighbor. The perfect rose bushes. The new Mercedes. And do you know what this guy's neighbor thinks of him? He doesn't even think of him at all.
I have no problem with people suggesting changes in mechanics in any sector of the game, but stop acting like making High more dangerous is somehow going to save the game. A) The game isn't dying. It's not even on life support. And B) There's no research to suggest that this will in anyway increase subscription or retention rates. And if any says there is, it should be posted so the argument can finally end.
So yes, please put forth the merit of your suggestions (because some do have merit), but avoid ridiculously overblown hyperbole ("Highsec as it is, is an abomination and must be nerfed.") High sec is neither as bad for the game as you make out, or as vital for the game as the folks on the other side suggest. It just is.
They are continually formed because its something that needs to happen. Highsec is preventing emergent gameplay, highsec buffs killed an emergent gameplay event. Anyone remember hulkaggeddon? The highsec AFK-miner advocated barge buff destroyed that wonderful event which drew nationally recognized news coverage and players from all sec areas together for an entertaining event.
Highsec is killing the game one small buff at a time and the only way to combat this is with many highsec nerfs. This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |

Benny Ohu
Beneath the Ashes Margin of Silence
3086
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 21:55:00 -
[20] - Quote
we're seeing the beginning of ccp removing highsec's ridiculous advantage with the upcoming industry expansion
i'd like to thank the 'highseccer'-identifying forum warriors, without their tireless and terrible defence of the indefensible this wouldn't be nearly as funny as it is |

Divine Entervention
Abyss Cooperative 3
445
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 21:57:00 -
[21] - Quote
La Nariz wrote:
This is your reading comprehension problem bleeding through again fair=!balanced. I'm not advocating EVE become :foxnews: FAIR AND BALANCED. Merely balanced.
You're suggesting the game be changed by CCP to fit how you feel it should be regardless of how it affects others desired game style. It exists as it does, and you're suggesting it be changed. You've even stated that it's your personal belief that this happen, and it's not just your attempt at propagating a discussion about it's possibility. You've stated that it's your desire that the game be changed to suit you.
By others definition, not my own of course because I merely quoted them, since you're trying to change the game to suit you at the expense of others, you are a carebear and they feel you should be told to leave.
Proof of lying in thread.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4349703#post4349703 |

Abrazzar
Vardaugas Family
2996
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 21:57:00 -
[22] - Quote
What needs to happen is that null-sec gets a proper sovereignty system that keeps the inhabitants busy and entertained, so they won't be interested in the going ons of high-sec anymore. Sovereignty and Population New Mining Mechanics |

Divine Entervention
Abyss Cooperative 3
445
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 22:00:00 -
[23] - Quote
La Nariz wrote:[
They are continually formed because its something that needs to happen. Highsec is preventing emergent gameplay, highsec buffs killed an emergent gameplay event. Anyone remember hulkaggeddon? The highsec AFK-miner advocated barge buff destroyed that wonderful event which drew nationally recognized news coverage and players from all sec areas together for an entertaining event.
Highsec is killing the game one small buff at a time and the only way to combat this is with many highsec nerfs.
According to you, since it's being "continually formed because it's something that needs to happen", then people suggesting that high sec be made "more safe" should be implemented because well, according to you, since people are suggesting it, it needs to happen.
Proof of lying in thread.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4349703#post4349703 |

Benny Ohu
Beneath the Ashes Margin of Silence
3089
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 22:00:00 -
[24] - Quote
Divine Entervention wrote:You're suggesting the game be changed by CCP to fit how you feel it should be regardless of how it affects others desired game style. no. especially considering how it affects carebears' desired game style |

La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2204
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 22:00:00 -
[25] - Quote
Abrazzar wrote:What needs to happen is that null-sec gets a proper sovereignty system that keeps the inhabitants busy and entertained, so they won't be interested in the going ons of high-sec anymore.
This is happening and it has started with the industry changes but, more highsec nerfs are needed in order to fix sov. This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |

Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
12771
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 22:01:00 -
[26] - Quote
Highsec is the "Helicopter Mom" / Overprotective parent of the regions. People who are raised by it, and are coddled by it their entire lives have no ability to cope with life outside of that cocoon.
Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings? |

Divine Entervention
Abyss Cooperative 3
445
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 22:07:00 -
[27] - Quote
Benny Ohu wrote:Divine Entervention wrote:You're suggesting the game be changed by CCP to fit how you feel it should be regardless of how it affects others desired game style. no. especially considering how it affects carebears' desired game style
Which is not his place to deem as the defacto justification because the reality of the situation is, CCP has made this game in the image they see fit.
Because CCP has created High-sec to exist as it does, it's apparent that CCP wants it to exist as it does. Granted, a change to industry is being implemented, but that too is a change CCP has chosen to implement to better shape how they want the game to be. If CCP wanted concord mechanics changed, they'd have done it.
Now demanding the game be changed outside of the scope of what CCP has already created and fostered for 10 years is a selfish request echoed by the egotistical belief that his vision supercedes that of the people who's livelihood is at stake, CCP themselves. Proof of lying in thread.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4349703#post4349703 |

La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2204
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 22:07:00 -
[28] - Quote
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:Highsec is the "Helicopter Mom" / Overprotective parent of the regions. People who are raised by it, and are coddled by it their entire lives have no ability to cope with life outside of that cocoon.
I hadn't considered that perspective before but, I think you are on to something. I can remember a job or two ago an interviewer telling me that there was a candidate with better credentials but, that candidate brought their parents to the interview hence I got the job.
In EVE context newbies have their hand held so much that they cannot cope with meaningful loss to the point that it impacts their own experience of the game. This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Proof Highsec reward needs to be nerfed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqC-BTui2uSGdDlxa2dWOG5ieHB0QXBVWW82bGN5TFE&usp=sharing |

Gully Alex Foyle
Black Fox Marauders Repeat 0ffenders
144
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 22:08:00 -
[29] - Quote
Ugh... I wanted to go to bed early tonight...
Oh well, though I understand this is completely off-topic , I'll just say I don't mind people staying in highsec if they're so inclined, funding my game with their subs, manufacturing stuff I use (until Summer expansion of course ), etc... as long as they're never 100% safe, because that would destroy the game.
Sane people that get bored of highsec will 'just say no' and move to low/null/WH. |

Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
12776
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 22:10:00 -
[30] - Quote
La Nariz wrote:I hadn't considered that perspective before but, I think you are on to something. I can remember a job or two ago an interviewer telling me that there was a candidate with better credentials but, that candidate brought their parents to the interview hence I got the job.
In EVE context newbies have their hand held so much that they cannot cope with meaningful loss to the point that it impacts their own experience of the game.
Here are some things that are paralleled between Helicopter Parenting and Highsec:
Quote:1. Need for control: Moms and Dads can't control Bin Laden. They have no control over the pedophiles or the kidnappers they read about in the paper. They can, however, control how their children spend their time and of course, with whom.
2.Bigger, Better, Faster: Children who are learning skills are usually slower and less adept than their parents. Therefore, it's not surprising for parents to feel that "It will be faster, bigger, bolder, and just plain better if I take charge."
3. Fear the failure: These Moms and Dads can not stand by and watch their child feel inadequate, unprepared, or miserable in any way. It is too heartbreaking. They believe that it's their job to shield their child from these negative emotions.
4. Desire to live vicariously: These Moms and Dads spend their time doing a large amount of their child's work and looking for acceptance and approval for their own performance. They get personally invested in every aspect of every activity their child engages in and take it to heart when their child fails.
5. Entitlement: These parents are constantly checking to see how you are treating their child in comparison to others. They keep their eyes on everyone else's plate. They believe that their child should get more of your time, additional energy from your staff, and lots of free "extras." If it will help their child, they will ask for it.
6. Need to keep them young: Some Moms and Dads are saddened by the idea of their children maturing and needing them less. When children are dependent on their parents, parents can feel needed and wanted.
Now if we apply these to Eve:
Quote:1. Need for control: CCP BAN ALL GANKERS, SCAMMERS, BAITERS, GREIFERS, WARDECCERS, MEAN PEOPLE.
2.Bigger, Better, Faster: Its never good enough, make it better CCP.
3. Fear the failure: But without 120mil SP I cant possibly be suited for life outside highsec!
4. Desire to live vicariously: Why go and take part in large fights, when our nullsec wing will regale us with the tales.
5. Entitlement: Self explanatory.
6. Want to be protected as if a brand new player regardless of age. Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings? |
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