But who's to blame for that? The vast majority of players who either does not know or care? CCP that does not give the CSM enough exposure? The CSM that doesn't communicate what they're doing to the players they're supposed to represent?

Can we fix it?

Funny how the CSM is supposed to represent all the players and not just a "vast minority". I'd call that a failure.

But who's to blame for that? The vast majority of players who either does not know or care? CCP that does not give the CSM enough exposure? The CSM that doesn't communicate what they're doing to the players they're supposed to represent?

Can we fix it?

The first one, and nope. Self imposed ignorance isn't curable over the internet.

Having attempted to engage the CSM on issues, I actually have to say the last one as well.
The CSM do not appear an approachable group of people in general unless you already have a specific in road to their desk via corp or player history.
To me this means that they are not likely to be doing a good job of representing the player base.

This is of course different from representing play styles, which aren't reliant on any individual view, though lack of engagement with players they don't already know is likely to impact on this negatively.

Fixing it requires people to interact, both CSM & Others though. Not voting says you accept whoever is on the CSM. It doesn't mean you aren't entitled to expect them to still listen, give feedback to you, and even act to pass on feedback from you to CCP to ensure it gets heard if it's relevant.

The CSM in of itself is tremendous work, of course they're not going to respond to every evemail you send them.

i call that "an elegant solution to the uninformed idiot problem"

Because, CSM is important man.

Folk like to moan about the CSM, but if CCP did away with the CSM, I would suggest that there would be a lot of folk complaining that we no longer had any player representation.

Don't like 'em or think they are useless?

Don't vote.

It has gottten to the point where when I see a CSM complaint post I wish CCP would permanently ban the account of the person that started the thread.

I also wish they would give us their address so we could go beat them with a stick.

It would have been a lot better if it had been better prepared. What they could have done:
-Gone through through the summits and shared some video footage from that, showing the CSM "in action"
-Presented an updated "minutes tldr;" since we now have some devblogs we didn't have
-Brought up some points where there was discussion and disagreement, supported by some slides outlining the iterations and the end results

With the exception of Ali, who was eager and still seemed to be in campaign mode, it felt like we saw a group of people that were really tired after a year of hard work, and had forgotten their notes and slides.

Null-sec may get the headlines but high-sec is the engine that drives EVE. Yet there is little if any high-sec representation on the CSM, and this is why the majority of players don't vote and perceive the CSM as nothing more than a token alliance syndicate.


Actually Ali was the only one I was impressed with. If you followed the Q&A session she was the only one that seemed to be genuinely interested in discussing some of the questions raised. The white papers were a great example when it was suggested to offer a "dumbed down" version. The response? Well, Jester did a blog writeup and many players actually prefer sifting through dozens of pages of materials. Even CCP Dolan can't seem to get behind the white papers so who are we kidding?!

The vast majority seemed more interested in stroking their egos about their tireless efforts and what a thankless job it is. Yes, I'm sure this is exactly what most players who PAID for their trip to Iceland were hoping to discuss or hear with this session. Most of us do get that it's volunteer - and that with the timezone and coordination it probably entails a lot of effort. On the other hand, the CSM members weren't f**king drafted, either.

It's too bad (or at least I didn't see) the real response as to why many players didn't vote: the CSM simply doesn't represent them.

And therin lies part of the problem, the idiot minion attitude. Do you really think our iqs are under 25?

So, anyone else feeling like that CSM panel has just said

1. CSM thinks they are important
2. CSM has been told by CCP they are important
3. CSM is important
4. CSM does things that are important.

Seriously, I listened to the stream expecting some sort of intelligent conversation about in-depth details.. Why none of this cee cee pee?

-Buhhd

No you pretty much summed it up

Luckily, even if the whole thing is a huge practical joke that ccp pull for the sheer pleasure of spending money, all you're out is 5 minutes a year to click a few names on a webpage.

To me it just looked like a holiday to iceland.

Fanfest is a holiday. You've had about a thousand hours of otherwise unpaid work from me; what more do you think I owe you?

Fanfest is a holiday. You've had about a thousand hours of otherwise unpaid work from me; what more do you think I owe you?

you don't owe us anything, but you go on about CSM not being a popular thing among the EVE community, and you sit there and grumble about it, and say things like "It only takes 5 mins to vote" sure it does, I like the CSM, i appreciate what you guys do as a team with CCP, but you need to make the fanfest stream panels more interesting if you want more people to get involved!