|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 29 post(s) |
Ammzi
Love Squad Pasta Syndicate
1761
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 18:31:00 -
[1] - Quote
We told you this was gonna happen. Every single one of you advocates for low slots and rigs to freighters. We told you they would take some of your candy away in return for giving you a cake. But ooh, did you listen? Nope.
The changes are to be expected, except JF align nerf. That's a bit uncalled for.
|
Ammzi
Love Squad Pasta Syndicate
1762
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 08:43:00 -
[2] - Quote
Dirk MacGirk wrote:baltec1 wrote:Dealin'lak wrote:Gotta appreciate the irony....
1- Use Fanfest to announce the "Awesome addition of rigs to Freighters and Jump Freighters".
2- Get everybody hyped up and expecting a nice addition for their ships.
3- Eventually come out saying that those "awesome additions" to Freighters and Jump Freighters hide what is actually an "intended" (to quote CCP Fozzie) nerf....
It's a REAL sad day when you realize politicians could learn a trick or two from CCP :( Cant blaim CCP for people thinking they would add rigs without nerfing the freighters to keep them balanced. They were warned this would happen. baltec - seriously does it matter if some players were warned by a handful of other players? Can we just stipulate for the record that a few people knew the outcome and were proven right. Yes, you were right. Dave was right, Trip was right. I completely agree some of you were involved in previous threads combating the idiots. You should get a medal from everyone else.
I am pretty sure you can dig up every single "buff freighter, give them rigs/modules" thread in the past 12 months and EVERY single one of them will have the "CCP could do that, but they would take something away to counter - is that what you want?"
That is not "some players, warned by handful of others". That is every single on-this-forum advocate being warned about it. ~told you so~ |
Ammzi
Love Squad Pasta Syndicate
1762
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 10:10:00 -
[3] - Quote
Esur A'saw Ti wrote:baltec1 wrote: I love when people with zero knolage of ganking shiptost about how how ganking is so easy and risk free. Tell us, if its so easy why are there so few kills considering the 500,000 to a million freighter trips made every month?
Oh but I know about ganking, it's not rocket science you know (well maybe it is for you, you don't seems very smart, no offense) and the answer to that question is really simple : lots of people move valuable stuff in t1 haulers, making solo ganking more efficient than any fleet stuff. Does that mean that we shouldn't change the math that allow a fleet of around 10 catalyst kill a freighter in 0.5 systems? My opinion is no, because it shouldn't happen, if you want to gank with a small fleet you have to use bigger ships. It's called balance, I'm being objective you are not all you want is more RISK AVERSE PVP PRESS F1 ECKSDEE that's the part of eve that should go like most carebear gameplay. Pls don't be upset because my logic and posting is superior.
You can't kill a freighter in highsec with just 10 catalysts. Please prove me wrong. |
Ammzi
Love Squad Pasta Syndicate
1763
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 10:34:00 -
[4] - Quote
Dirk MacGirk wrote:
Sorry dude, most people can't take the nonsense of these forums long enough to debate every wish list topic that comes up. When CCP actually starts talking about it, the broader playerbase takes notice. So yeah, the microcosm of standard forum warriors may have been quite active about this topic dating back to when freighters were first introduced. But the only thing that really matters is the here and now.
Hah, the only reason I am here is because of Dev posts. Regardless of what we may feel about this change which is a blatant nerf to freighters (not saying it's bad or good) - if CCP's goal with this it to heavily disrupt and nerf the ability to haul in order to make local-industry businesses more successful then the majority of complains in this thread are moot.
Yes, freighters are being nerfed and have to choose one of several things, which they all have now on TQ, with slight enhancements to attributes if they are willing to cope with massive penalty to the rest. However the fuel consumption nerf, heavy JF nerf and general freighter nerf across the board just seems like a targeted effort to impact mobility of goods in all of EVE negatively. W-Space, lowsec, nullsec, highsec. All of it is affected by this, but I wish they would use more carrot and less stick.
|
Ammzi
Love Squad Pasta Syndicate
1765
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 11:10:00 -
[5] - Quote
Maybe if Fozzie would like to edit the OP with a few paragraphs of their reasoning for this?
|
Ammzi
Love Squad Pasta Syndicate
1766
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 13:07:00 -
[6] - Quote
Axe Coldon wrote:
Not true. IF they lay in wait..put you on contact and all your alts and are out to get you..the high sec gank will happen. If someone is bound and determined to kill your jf in high there is nothing you can do. Yes dying in null is avoidable. I never undock without eye's on the station. but in high..they logoff at the gate and use alts to spot you.
What if the... unthinkable happened? You know, like... The JF jumped out of highsec when he started getting bumped because of these vicious people? If you always have an exit cyno ready in highsec I can guarantee you it is almost 99 % impossible to get ganked. The only thing I could remotely think about is 20 insta-locking tornados and even THAT is extremely rare. You'll need like 10 b+ of cargo or made the wrong people really mad. |
Ammzi
Love Squad Pasta Syndicate
1766
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 15:49:00 -
[7] - Quote
Maldiro Selkurk wrote:
Are we getting mods so we get the flexibility we wanted at the cost of paying for rigs and mods....NO!
I fear on behalf of all freighter pilots the day they can use a low slot module.
Take a watermelon, let it represent the ehp of a freighter. Now take an axe to the watermelon and you get to pick the smallest of the two sizes as your new freighter ehp after being given a low slot. |
Ammzi
Love Squad Pasta Syndicate
1766
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 16:13:00 -
[8] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote:Harvey James wrote: any thoughts on the JF tanking bonuses i mentioned?
It's an interesting idea, potentially combined with some other tank changes.
Is the overall plan with these rebalances to buff local industry and make it difficult to export to highsec and vice versa? Usually a few paragraphs are posted in your rebalancing threads to review your reasoning, this thread seems to lack it. Care to elaborate a bit on the reasoning? I am sure people would be a bit more understanding then when they realize it's not the goal to end up with a net buff. |
Ammzi
Love Squad Pasta Syndicate
1766
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 16:14:00 -
[9] - Quote
Pj Harvey wrote:In an age where you can't autopilot through high sec without a good chance of being suicide ganked, you make freighters even more fragile?
I keep seeing a pattern these days in the changes you make, it's like you want everything to be more expensive and less durable, probably with the aim of selling more PLEX.
What chance/risk? As long as you don't carry stupendous amounts of high value cargo then it's pretty unlikely for you to get ganked. |
Ammzi
Love Squad Pasta Syndicate
1767
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 18:27:00 -
[10] - Quote
No risk in ganking? Hah, I laugh at those people, when all you have to do to throw ganking out the window is a cheap t1 thrasher and just pop the wrecks as soon as they appear. Implying the loot fairy matters at all if the wreck goes pop.
Let's so some funny math though regarding ~risk~ to get ganked in a freighter based, not on cargo, but simply the risk associated with passing through choke point 0.5 systems. Every time you pass through the system there's a risk of you getting ganked.
Establishing assumptions:
To do this we have to throw out some relatively arbitrary, but well argumented numbers with regards to freighter sitings/trips throw 0.5 systems. We have: Niarja (amarr<->jita) and Uedama (Jita/Amarr<->many systems!) and Balle (Jita/Amarr<->Dodixie/Hek).
Let's say an average of 15 freighters pass through Niarja and the same value for Uedama per minute. Balle is probably a lot less, let's say 5 freighter a min. So we have 35 freighters/min. pass throw key choke point systems with high probability of getting ganked. That accumulates to just about 1.5 million freighter trips. About 1/40,000 chance you will get ganked passing through a 0.5 system. So about ~10 times more often to get ganked than hit by lightning. Pretty good odds I'd say myself. |
|
Ammzi
Love Squad Pasta Syndicate
1768
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 19:06:00 -
[11] - Quote
Digger Pollard wrote:
Currently avoiding gank is 100% impossible even for gods. You can make it less profitable, but not avoid it. Losing a freighter, even an empty one, is bad enough to call it a huge risk to pilot one.
100 % impossible? I can avoid gank with minimum effort. I can avoid almost all ganks with more effort. And webbing is only one of like 10 different tools you can use to protect your freighter. Alas people who think "My freighter is empty, therefore I should INVULNVERABLE!" are so utterly wrong. If people want to kill you for any reason what-so-ever they can probably muster the effort to do so. And if you know they are coming for you, you can prepare yourselves in a variety of ways.
There is no mother-of-all counter, on both sides. That's how it works. |
Ammzi
Love Squad Pasta Syndicate
1769
|
Posted - 2014.05.20 15:40:00 -
[12] - Quote
Alexis Nightwish wrote:Allison A'vani wrote:Every major alliance in the game would no longer have any logistical back bone if that were the case. As I said, win-win.
GrrrNullsec |
Ammzi
Love Squad Pasta Syndicate
1774
|
Posted - 2014.05.21 16:00:00 -
[13] - Quote
Azami Nevinyrall wrote:Can you, at least on the JF....maybe on the Freighter....put a little more wiggle room with the CPU to fit a DCU?
At least on the JF, which is extremely expensive! It should have ALOT more tanking abilities then it's T1 counterpart. With it's already smaller cargohold, players will be deciding to pick Cargohold expanders...which reduce tank, as we already know. Or go full tank and loose precious cargo space.
It's a good balance!
No - not unless hull is going to be cut by 60 %. DC is way too overpowered on a freighter. You are already looking at very high ehp post kronos. |
Ammzi
Love Squad Pasta Syndicate
1775
|
Posted - 2014.05.21 16:08:00 -
[14] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Ammzi wrote:Azami Nevinyrall wrote:Can you, at least on the JF....maybe on the Freighter....put a little more wiggle room with the CPU to fit a DCU?
At least on the JF, which is extremely expensive! It should have ALOT more tanking abilities then it's T1 counterpart. With it's already smaller cargohold, players will be deciding to pick Cargohold expanders...which reduce tank, as we already know. Or go full tank and loose precious cargo space.
It's a good balance! No - not unless hull is going to be cut by 60 %. DC is way too overpowered on a freighter. You are already looking at very high ehp post kronos. Well, unless you use cargo mods anyway. Now the price to get your old cargo numbers back is a higher hitpoint loss than before, since cargo modules cost structure, where rigs cost armor.
So you'd like 1 DCU and 2 cargo expanders right? A magnificent one-touch double your EHP button and 800k cargo. Why would any freighter fit anything else?
Azami Nevinyrall wrote:Ammzi wrote:No - not unless hull is going to be cut by 60% I never knew you were a Dev? (Only Devs can say no to something, not a player, get over yourself.)
Really? I am just discussing with you, way to throw a tantrum. |
Ammzi
Love Squad Pasta Syndicate
1775
|
Posted - 2014.05.21 16:15:00 -
[15] - Quote
Azami Nevinyrall wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Ammzi wrote: So you'd like 1 DCU and 2 cargo expanders right? A magnificent one-touch double your EHP button and 800k cargo. Why would any freighter fit anything else?
I've been vehemently arguing against giving freighters anymore CPU, because giving them a DCU would be rampantly overpowered. And I am rubbing my hands in glee thinking of the fools who will triple cargo rig these things and chop their hitpoints in half. 99% of players will do this, just so they don't have to do as much runs....which means ganks will increase, and so will the tears!
There's no need to protect the ~lesser intelligent~ against their own mistakes. They will learn in time, and if they don't that's their problem. It's EVE afterall. |
Ammzi
Love Squad Pasta Syndicate
1777
|
Posted - 2014.05.21 16:31:00 -
[16] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Daichi Yamato wrote:looking at that. EHP could be nerfed a bit. triple cargo expanded freighters dont seem to suffer very much in the way of EHP The thing is that they have almost universally gotten significant increases in non-hull tanking, on top of fairly small adjustments to account for bulkheads. And yes, some of those changes could (and should) probably be dialled back a bit.
The base ehp is so ridiculously higher in Kronos. I mean a vanilla kronos fenrir is gonna be able to tank more than a TQ obelisk.
That's a bit worrying. |
Ammzi
Love Squad Pasta Syndicate
1778
|
Posted - 2014.05.21 17:20:00 -
[17] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote:CCP Ytterbium wrote:TheMercenaryKing wrote:Love the new update, but one question, when will damage controls become passive mods? That indeed is a good question. The answer to this question is "not in Kronos, but possibly at a later date". Either way that's a discussion for another thread since these ships cannot fit Damage Controls.
Don't you think you went a little bit overboard in terms of raw EHP? - there's a very large gap between the obelisk and providence compared to the charon and fenrir - where the fenrir will be beyond the tank of a TQ obelisk according to this: http://eve.beyondreality.se/pics/Kronos/FreighterCargoTank.png
|
|
|
|