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Rodamus Zero
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Posted - 2006.06.21 18:12:00 -
[1]
Gravity Well
Primary Affect - Localized Stasis Webifier with a certian radius of deployment.
Hampers speed of ALL craft (Including the user) and all drones within deployment range.
Has similar effect to Inderdiction Spheres but with a "Webifing" effect instead of a "Scrambling" one.
Secondary Affect - Anti Missile Module
"Webifes" all missiles within sphere of influence, making engagment range of missile boats closer. Forcing them to move nearer into possible danger.
Missiles would take alot longer to hit their target due to severly reduced velocity (Flight Time x Velocity (minus webifying affect)) = Shorter Engagment range of all missile type weapons.
This is not a missile "nerf". Even though I am a missile user, I have to agree that they are overpowered and lack a decent and effective countermeasure. 90% of the time, Defender Missiles are ineffective, while smartbombs dont activate within the nessecary time.
Only affects Ships/Drones/Missiles within the "field" of the Gravity Well, "attacking" missiles would slow down to "optimized" speed, while "retaliation" missiles would increase back up to their "true" speed upon exiting the sphere of influence.
In both cases, both sets of missiles will still lose initial flight range due to the velocity reduction they receive within the localized area of effect. This will give a longer reaction time for interception through the use of Defenders, Range, Smartbombs and of course Speed.
This module, while giving an awesome advantage over the use of missiles/drones and most notably, Interceptors, bares a huge disadvantage as it "webifies" the user and their own missiles/drones (untill leaving the sphere of influense), leaving them more vulnerable to Tracking Speeds and Missiles if/when they hit (assuming targets are out of the area of effect).
Like Smartbombs and most other modules, Gravity Wells would have different sizes for different ships, going from Micro (Those that fit upon a Frigate) to Capital Size for use on Carriers/Motherships, Dreadnoughts and of course, not forgetting the behemoths of space, Titans.
This would give new tatical dimensions into combat situations involving all types of craft. Dreadnoughts would no longer have to go into Siege mode to be effective in Fleet Battles. Interceptors would have to be more cautious when approching targets. Titans Superweapons would have a larger impact upon a fleet as the "webifying" effect would increase turning speed (Agility) to that warp out alignment. Destroyers would have a larger tactical advantage verses Frigates. Missile boats would have to be forced into engaging targets closer, which takes longer, making combat that bit longer added valuable seconds.
This would also benifit towards CCPs idea/goal of prolonging combat without the need for "nerfing" and "buffing" the damage and resistance tables. This would also give more time for tactical decisions and the ability to target specific subsystems (Read the Kail "In Development" Blogs).
This is just an idea that I would like the Devs to look at, all your opinions are well accepted (be it flame or praise) and because this is just an idea, I cannot put a fittings table into order. Though I would put the skill "Energy Pulse Weapons" as a prerequisite and maybe have two others that would increase the magnitude of the Gravity Well (its area or effect) and the other affecting the force of the Gravity Well (the procentual speed reduction).
Rodamus Zero.
Tell Them, Zero was Here. |
Gaul Cascade
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Posted - 2006.06.21 18:17:00 -
[2]
Like the idea, sounds logical as well, but for it to affect missiles... I dunno, sounds kind of overpowered.
And would it be allowed to run in the same area of a mobile warp disruptor? If so, you have just realized every gatecamper/sniper's dream - insta-scrambled and webbed target, easily taken down from miles and miles away. Hell, even multiple targets wouldnt be a problem
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Cascade
ááááááááiss NAVY |
ragewind
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Posted - 2006.06.21 19:46:00 -
[3]
nice idea but i feel the missile afect is pointless and will only nerf missiles as they have an even better chance to warp out.
this should be an ancored modual like the warp bubels but they should react with each other so its eather one or the other in the same area of afect stop the uber gate camp
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fix eves industrial sector!
advanced industrial ship |
Coran Ordus
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Posted - 2006.06.21 20:52:00 -
[4]
Neat idea, but it seems it would maybe buff snipers too much? Fast-approaching tacklers would get slowed down, giving you plenty of time to warp away. And it'd make for some wicked gate camps.
Perhaps make it so that a web-bubble and warp-bubble can't overlap? (Seems overly tricky to actually implement.)
How about if having the module active locks down your ship from warp? So you can slow people down and give yourself more of a fighting chance, but it's a do-or-die thing. (Unless you turn it off, of course. Which means it should be active on a 30-second cycle, so no insta-warp-on-disable.)
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LemmingNoWhereToGo
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Posted - 2006.06.21 21:04:00 -
[5]
Neat idea Rod. Reminds me of: 'The Slow Blade Penetrates The Shield' - Dune.
Perhaps CCP could also mod variations of the weapon to operate conversely and have less of an effect upon missiles, drones and other relatively slow moving objects than the faster equivalents, like for example the shots from blasters and railguns - making accuracy and subsequent damage much lower for these items. Equally, lasers could suffer from 'interference' from the field and deal similarly reduced damage as a result.
Also, gravity pulls in a certain direction - towards a large mass. Given the name of your weapon, would there be a direction that the affected objects would also veer towards?
Away from your ship would be an excellent direction! Otherwise, perhaps a 'randomly changing' pull might even things out - although now we're talking about another variation on the theme - 'repulsion fields'.
With all of these ideas of course, the higher the skill rank(s), the greater the effect and range and I reckon their Tecchy2.
IEEP ;o)
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Dragy
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Posted - 2006.06.21 21:40:00 -
[6]
Heh, why did i play homeworld so long ;) ?
Got some idea for it also. Maybe we could get specielized ships that could only use grav (even more speced than interdictors) and that they could be only used in 0.0. Me and my bright ideas :P If i repeated what was written in the main post sorry, didnt read the whole thing
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Viktor Fyretracker
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Posted - 2006.06.21 21:47:00 -
[7]
missles are fine TBH, sure they never miss if you use the correct size for the target but snipers are a bigger issue atm. they get instagib from nearly 200km.
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Malthros Zenobia
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Posted - 2006.06.21 21:57:00 -
[8]
A gravity well wouldn't slow down ships, it would disrupt their warp drives and any warp tunnels in the area (a dream i wish would come true). Also, it would actually PULL anything in the radius towards the user. Like a smart-bomb tractorbeam, only it would affect anything that isn't anchored.
I want to see T2 battleships beak down into flagships (all 4 bonuses would be gang-related, period, no exceptions, no 'bigger hacs' like with cbcs) and Heavy Interdictors, who would fit the Gravity Well mod, and when active, would project a 50km(maybe even larger) warp bubble, and also be able to break warp tunnels, meaning you would get knocked out of warp if passing through it, and drop out at a distance depending on the speed of your warp.
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Seidr
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Posted - 2006.06.21 21:59:00 -
[9]
A nice idea, but it might be a little too powerful of a module to be made available universally to all ship classes. Maybe limiting it to support/command craft would be an idea, just my 2isk.
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SemiCharmed
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Posted - 2006.06.21 22:12:00 -
[10]
I think... wait... no... I KNOW some of you have gone off topic here :/
It's a Very good idea Rod, and one ide like to see in action dispite me being a Missile lover.
Would be most fun to use as well. - i hope it gets made or at least something with a simaller effect.
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Remember Kids, Only YOU Can Prevent Fourm fires. |
Berrik Radhok
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Posted - 2006.06.21 23:21:00 -
[11]
The area effect web should be a highslot module and slow you down as well.
Sig removed, lacks Eve-related content - Cortes |
Jenney
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Posted - 2006.06.22 01:58:00 -
[12]
Are you finding gate camping with an interdictor too hard or somthing 
An area of affect webber would make gate camping way too easy would also make interceptors a bit more pointless after all you wouldnt need thae fast locks any more as every one will be scrmabled and webbed so you have all day to gank them
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Malthros Zenobia
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Posted - 2006.06.22 02:36:00 -
[13]
 Originally by: Seidr
A nice idea, but it might be a little too powerful of a module to be made available universally to all ship classes. Maybe limiting it to support/command craft would be an idea, just my 2isk.
See my idea, the Heavy Interdictors. Tackler T2 Battleship. (but lets not forget the T2 Flagship BS, which would give such uber gang bonuses it would be a crime in 4123 systems to not use one in a large gang/fleet).
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Rodamus Zero
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Posted - 2006.06.23 18:35:00 -
[14]
Im glad people are taking an interest into this thread.
Originally by: ragewind
nice idea but i feel the missile afect is pointless and will only nerf missiles as they have an even better chance to warp out.
This would add the CCPs goal of prolonging combat, it would add more tatical thinking to a given situation instead of just hitting "win keys" all the time, making you chase your target around if they warped.
Originally by: Coran Ordus
Neat idea, but it seems it would maybe buff snipers too much? Fast-approaching tacklers would get slowed down, giving you plenty of time to warp away. And it'd make for some wicked gate camps.
Perhaps make it so that a web-bubble and warp-bubble can't overlap? (Seems overly tricky to actually implement.)
As I mentioned in my first post, I can not put a fittings or attributes table into order. Although if it had a "permenant" affect, I would have to agree that it would be far too overpowering, a cycle time does sound a little more plausable. I honestly dont know if its pratical for the game engine to "negate" differing effects, but I have no intention in seeing this module as a deployable/anchorable object.
Originally by: Seidr
A nice idea, but it might be a little too powerful of a module to be made available universally to all ship classes. Maybe limiting it to support/command craft would be an idea, just my 2isk.
I cleaver comment indeed, though for it to be limited to just Logistics and Command ships would make its instant use available to only the higher ups and veterans of Eve. I had the idea in mind for ALL players to skill up towards it and use it as they pleased.
Like the other modules of Eve, each "class size" has its increasing range, time/duration and capacity costs, I had the same thing in mind for this module but as I stated before, I can not but a fittings/attribute table into order. Though I would assume given the "power" of this module that it would have a very high capacitor drain and maybe to keep it from being too overpowered, a short cycle time thereby increasing its capacitor consumption.
While I was noting down my drafts for this module, I was also helping a new player of 5 days complete a mission who had a previous hard time of dealing with the Kestrels, He had his Defender skill to level 4 and was still having troubles on his own. Also, later that day I was helping out a friend do "Worlds Collide" (the level 4 variant) and was instantlly shocked at the amount of missiles that came our way.
I had this module in mind to help in all kinds of situations, from missions to gate camps. If you think long and hard about how to avoid/deal with Gate Camps, I think the module is a great addition.
Originally by: Berrik Radhok
The area effect web should be a highslot module and slow you down as well.
I did mention that the module would affect the user in the third sentance (assuming you can call a title a sentance).
Assuming that you are all thinking that this module would have the same "webbing" powers as that of stasis webifiers, you are wrong. I had in mind that it would not have the "insane" webbing abilities of its "cousin" (for instance -75% to -90%) but somewhere in the region of -40% to maybe -70%.
Rodamus Zero
Tell Them, Zero was Here. |
Arushia
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Posted - 2006.06.23 19:15:00 -
[15]
If implemented, it should be limited to s specific ship-type like Interdiction spheres are. Otherwise, it will turn large ships that don't rely on agility into solo pwnmobiles, somethign the devs are very much against.
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Nikolai Nuvolari
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Posted - 2006.06.23 20:31:00 -
[16]
Maybe make this only work with interdictors, just like interdiction spheres.
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Tom Thumb > for a nut case you rawk
[04:21:15] Mebrithiel Ju'wien > Nik's bio 4tw btw
[07:38:53] Graelyn > Nikolai for Dev 108!
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Rodamus Zero
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Posted - 2006.06.25 20:37:00 -
[17]
After much talk with several people across and out of the Eve community, I have decided that the mod will either work as a "global" webifier, or just have its anti missile priciples. Not both systems.
Most have agreed that a global webifier would be far too powerful, whether it can work within a Warp Bubble or not, even if the module effects the user.
The secondary affect has been praised by ALOT of people, even some Caldari Missile lovers and many mission runners that like to solo Lvl 4s that cannot complete them in time for the bonus or not at all without help.
So there you have it, 2 ideas stemmed from one, one option being alot more popular then the other simple because of its practicality and not so "overpowered" to buff gate camps.
Gate camps was the only massivly debated drawback to the modules use as a global wibifier. Its use vs Mass drones had very little mention as there is already plenty of ways to counteract drones.
The same skill requirments would still be nessecary for the anti missiles use, obviously the higher in the levels of the skills, the less effective the missiles Vs the modules user would become.
Rodamus Zero
Tell Them, Zero was Here. |
HippoKing
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Posted - 2006.06.25 20:39:00 -
[18]
As long as you make it slow down projectiles/hyrbrids too so all the cool kids can dodge bullets 
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Morreia
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Posted - 2006.06.25 21:43:00 -
[19]
I'd prefer it if they just made defenders work instead of making that.
I still never get why it should take more than 1 shot to take down a torp, would they really have that much armour if they were designed to explode?
I'd much prefer to just have working defenders or something along the lines of a module that scatters fragments, or flares... can't remember what their proper name in real life is, to confuse the missile and make it miss.
If it was an area of effect webifier it would make gate camps stupidly impossible to escape from if the also have interdiction spheres.
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Rodamus Zero
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Posted - 2006.06.27 16:50:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Morreia
I'd prefer it if they just made defenders work instead of making that.
I still never get why it should take more than 1 shot to take down a torp, would they really have that much armour if they were designed to explode?
I'd much prefer to just have working defenders or something along the lines of a module that scatters fragments, or flares... can't remember what their proper name in real life is, to confuse the missile and make it miss.
If it was an area of effect webifier it would make gate camps stupidly impossible to escape from if the also have interdiction spheres.
In my honest opinion, Defenders do work, but you need to max out the Defender skill and the other missile skills that increase flight time and velocity in order for it to have a succesful chance, but in same cases, when used against ships that have missiles bonus` (The Cerberus for example) its difficult to use correctly and in time.
Countermeasures are the category Flares and Chaffs come under.
I gave the module two options and so instead of starting a new thread which would be identical to this one, minus the weberfying effect. I just made up my mind, with the help of many others to have the Module only do one of the options, Either having it as an overpowered gatecamping module (which I dont think anyone including myself would like) or an anti missile system based upon webing principles.
Rodamus Zero
Tell Them, Zero was Here. |
Liu Kaskakka
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Posted - 2006.06.27 17:17:00 -
[21]
Meh, I thought this was about 'Nothing at all' by the Amateur Transplants.
King Liu is RIGHT!!
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Nikolai Nuvolari
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Posted - 2006.06.27 19:02:00 -
[22]
Hey Liu, haven't seen you on the forums for a while...where've you been?
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Tom Thumb > for a nut case you rawk
[04:21:15] Mebrithiel Ju'wien > Nik's bio 4tw btw
[07:38:53] Graelyn > Nikolai for Dev 108!
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Verdon Teraskun
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Posted - 2006.06.27 20:50:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Rodamus Zero
Secondary Affect - Anti Missile Module
That one line makes me think you've been playing too much Empire at War.
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Pah Triac
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Posted - 2006.06.28 08:05:00 -
[24]
Idea is Great
and i might have some addit ideas for it
Base Rad signature of the well source 1Km -> Improvement over skill lvl by 25%
Can only be fit on Logistic cruisers or the Flagships for the Highslot version.
That would give those ships a extra use so they would appear more often in the field wich they should.
(The logistic version of the new upcomming BC that can place 4 well modules :)
should be High slot for static field (Command ship affected) of Probe for temporarely field (not commandship affected)
The Basic Idea could be that the grav well starts at point of impact of the sphere
Energy source should be each racial Ice isotopes for each race has his own propusion type so for each we can have a Diff kind of grav well.
appropiate skill books could be the Graviton fisics (base well radius increasemend)
Logistics (fuel reduction)
Fusion / Ion / Magpulse / Plasma Graviton well understanding (speed decresemend of that racial propulsion type)
*** People are stupid. They will believe anything they want to be true or fear to be true. *** |
Liu Kaskakka
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Posted - 2006.06.28 16:09:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Nikolai Nuvolari
Hey Liu, haven't seen you on the forums for a while...where've you been?
Hush, don't tell anyone you saw me, I'm in disguise.
/me moonwalks off the forums
King Liu is RIGHT!!
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Rodamus Zero
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Posted - 2006.06.30 14:50:00 -
[26]
Please could you not use my thread for personal conversations, no offense, I just dont want to get off topic.
Bump 
Tell Them, Zero was Here. |
Hugh Ruka
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Posted - 2006.06.30 15:21:00 -
[27]
one grav well + large smartbomb - dream combo for any mega or tempest pilot fighting a raven.
NO
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if you want peace, prepare for war ...
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Removed due to offensive content - Laqum
I realy liked my signature. Oh well |
Dethis
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Posted - 2006.06.30 15:38:00 -
[28]
I skimmed through but would it not be kind of counter productive as this would produce "slingshotting" of ships inside the bubble? effectivly making them get away quicker?
again i skimmed if this has already covered forgive me
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Kill em all and let god sort em out
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Angelic Resolution
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Posted - 2006.06.30 16:02:00 -
[29]
Basically you expanded on the idea I had here: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=356324
/signed as I liked my idea and yours just expands on it..
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zevex
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Posted - 2006.06.30 16:18:00 -
[30]
I didn't read every post here, so perhaps this was already said, butà
This would actually increase missile damage once the missile reached its target. The velocity of your target is a factor when determining missile damage, which is why there are skills you can train to compensate for this. Even though it would take longer for the missiles to reach their targets, you would effectively be giving all missile users an explosion velocity bonus.
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