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Manza Plus	Posted - 2006.07.05 04:43:00 - [1] My friend signed up for the 14 day trial today. He says he likes the game a lot... until he was killed three times by other players during his tutorial. The first two times was him getting blown up outside a station after undocking. The last time he was doing the mining tutorial and someone popped him. All different players. And now he doesn't like this game so much. I mean, he's aware for the worldwide pvp aspect of this game. He liked that idea, but come on, during his tutorial? It doesn't even matter if the other players' ships got concorded to hell, they probably have too much money anyway. This is definately not the way to get new players playing this game.
Delene	Posted - 2006.07.05 04:58:00 - [2] When starting a new char, the game warns you before every auction that it can get you killed by other players with a nice pop up window that needs to be closed before proceding. Tell your friend to READ THE FRIKKING WARNINGS. Sorry but EVE is not a game where you'll be safe and cozy all of the time (or even part of the time)
Scythe773	Posted - 2006.07.05 05:01:00 - [3] did he do anything such as taking cargo containers that belong to someone else? i have not been killed by a single player yet and ive been playing for about 12 days. he should be in high security systems which means the cops should have jumped on whoever killed him, unless they killed him extreamly quickly and the just warped out which is possible
Manza Plus	Posted - 2006.07.05 05:03:00 - [4] No, he didn't take anyone's cargo. And there's a difference between pvp and griefing.
Noluck Ned	Posted - 2006.07.05 06:42:00 - [5] Dunno how they managed that to be honest, they woiuld either have had to suicide on him(unlikely as he has no valuble items) or they needed to get him to take from their cans or him from theirs tho get aggro timer going. Unless your friend is being less than honest with you there is almost no chance of being griefed unless you bring it on yourself, or have your ore stolen, in which case tell him not to fire back.
Lurtz	Posted - 2006.07.05 07:11:00 - [6] most likely a gang invite from a person at war... some lame griefers like creating 2 accounts at war with each other. one invites anyone passing to join their gang (often accepted by new players thinking it a chat invite), the other can then shoot this valid war target
Anscar	Posted - 2006.07.05 07:12:00 - [7] Originally by: Noluck Ned Dunno how they managed that to be honest, they woiuld either have had to suicide on him(unlikely as he has no valuble items) or they needed to get him to take from their cans or him from theirs tho get aggro timer going. Unless your friend is being less than honest with you there is almost no chance of being griefed unless you bring it on yourself, or have your ore stolen, in which case tell him not to fire back. I'm new to the game so maybe I'm misconstruing something....but I noticed an odd thing in the tutorial zone. I started a second char a couple of days ago and when I did the "shoot the pirates" tutorial, another ship got to the first pirate (with the gate key) before I could and killed him...leaving a container behind with the key, which he didn't pick up. In fact, there were lots of containers drifting in the area. I noticed that this ship was just hanging around the area. I was smart enough not to take anything from the container, but I wondered if it wasn't being used as bait. A noob could very easily think that he was supposed take stuff from the container and ignore the warning....and "pop," he's dead. Anything to this or am I just paranoid. I redocked, played my main char for a while, returned, got a key and used the gate.....but the same guy showed up in training area and killed the pirate drones first....leaving the containers behind. My question: is it possible to greif noobs in the tutorial this way?
R Dan	Posted - 2006.07.05 07:51:00 - [8] Originally by: Anscar when I did the "shoot the pirates" tutorial, another ship got to the first pirate (with the gate key) before I could and killed him...leaving a container behind with the key, which he didn't pick up. My question: is it possible to greif noobs in the tutorial this way? Yes. Once you kill something and it drops a can the can is technically "yours" so if someone else were to take from it they would be criminally flagged. I will save you, but make sure you bring beer - Wrangler and cAKe - Imaran I thought it was bREe, omgi'mgivingawaymodroomsecwetsftl - Cortes when come back ... bring PIE. Me like PIE. -Capsicum
MagicPussyCat	Posted - 2006.07.05 07:51:00 - [9] Originally by: Anscar My question: is it possible to greif noobs in the tutorial this way? Yes...and that's probably what he was doing.
Sakura Nihil	Posted - 2006.07.05 08:16:00 - [10] Get their names and shame them here on the forums, or better yet what corp they're in. Its likely their leaders will harass them for not doing something productive with their time, like ganking haulers in highsec .
losmandy	Posted - 2006.07.05 08:17:00 - [11] My personel experience is most theft from ore /loot cans is carried out by trial accounts. I blow them at every chance i get. Makes me feel better anyway. I often keep them scrammed for ages just to listen pathetic pleas for for mercy. then still blow them up. har har. die young
Anscar	Posted - 2006.07.05 08:34:00 - [12] Thought so. The tutorial is telling the noob to approach the container and open it after he kills the drone....so it'd be really easy to entice him in this way, even with the warning.
Silmenel	Posted - 2006.07.05 09:24:00 - [13] please report the names of the players when you witness "older players" hunting the tuturial NPCs - CCP has banned players for doing so in the past. it is of course "allowed" to shoot a noob that is criminally flagged - it is some way to learn that you read the warnings and think about what you are doing. _______ WTS Sabres and Claymores
Ydyp Ieva	Posted - 2006.07.05 10:17:00 - [14] had this happening to my alt once, was he surprised that the next victim he tried was flying a fully fitted pvp crow and he sitting there in a condor Well that makes me believe it aren't only older people that do it, some newbies do it as well as soon as they can afford a suitable frigate.
Avon	Posted - 2006.07.05 10:33:00 - [15] Originally by: Anscar I'm new to the game so maybe I'm misconstruing something....but I noticed an odd thing in the tutorial zone. I started a second char a couple of days ago and when I did the "shoot the pirates" tutorial, another ship got to the first pirate (with the gate key) before I could and killed him...leaving a container behind with the key, which he didn't pick up. In fact, there were lots of containers drifting in the area. I noticed that this ship was just hanging around the area. I was smart enough not to take anything from the container, but I wondered if it wasn't being used as bait. A noob could very easily think that he was supposed take stuff from the container and ignore the warning....and "pop," he's dead. Anything to this or am I just paranoid. I redocked, played my main char for a while, returned, got a key and used the gate.....but the same guy showed up in training area and killed the pirate drones first....leaving the containers behind. My question: is it possible to greif noobs in the tutorial this way? That would be petitionable I think. I know it is technically within the rules, but the GM's tend to stamp pretty hard on things like this (because it is in a starter system). The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
Ehker Gerete	Posted - 2006.07.05 10:47:00 - [16] Edited by: Ehker Gerete on 05/07/2006 10:48:17 While people shouldn't kill noob too often, if they can't handle losing a free ibis to something they got warned about, they definitley cannot handle this game. By the way, speaking of gang war flag, someone named Inevitability (something like that, ask me in-game) invited me to a gang when I was 0 meters form a gate. Then 4 or 5 cruisers attacked me. I jumped and someone said "you jump instead of fight?" in the gang channel. Just don't accept gang invites from this person. I also saw him trying to convinve new players to join the gang saying it was for missions. Please keep your signature below the 24000 bytes limit.- Pirlouit There. Fixed. - Ehker
Ehker Gerete	Posted - 2006.07.05 10:48:00 - [17] Edited by: Ehker Gerete on 05/07/2006 10:48:33 the double post is haunting me.... Please keep your signature below the 24000 bytes limit.- Pirlouit There. Fixed. - Ehker
DHU InMe	Posted - 2006.07.05 15:53:00 - [18] Originally by: Manza Plus My friend signed up for the 14 day trial today. He says he likes the game a lot... until he was killed three times by other players during his tutorial. The first two times was him getting blown up outside a station after undocking. The last time he was doing the mining tutorial and someone popped him. All different players. And now he doesn't like this game so much. I mean, he's aware for the worldwide pvp aspect of this game. He liked that idea, but come on, during his tutorial? It doesn't even matter if the other players' ships got concorded to hell, they probably have too much money anyway. This is definately not the way to get new players playing this game. I really doubt your friend was killed in secure space (0.5 and more) by players ! Eve if possible (you have like less than 15 sec to do so, and you **** die for sure after any agression), no one would waste 200+k ship just to blow a rookie ship... __ Eve Links Got a new idea ? (Last updated 9 Mai 06)
Hitomi Nakatani	Posted - 2006.07.05 15:59:00 - [19] Originally by: Silmenel please report the names of the players when you witness "older players" hunting the tuturial NPCs - CCP has banned players for doing so in the past. it is of course "allowed" to shoot a noob that is criminally flagged - it is some way to learn that you read the warnings and think about what you are doing. Definately petition people doing that to newbies in tutorial systems. The GMs take it personally when vet players greif new potential customers in those areas. While "can fishing" for newbies is a valid game mechanic, it is not allowed in the tutorial zones and anyone doing that can and should get a stern warning, or more, from the GMs once they are reported.
Jason Hawke	Posted - 2006.07.05 16:34:00 - [20] I started the 2 week trial a little bit ago and I was doing the tutorial missions. Learning all of the little icons and combat. So I get sent on a tutorial mission to kill a pirate or two. All I see are empty cans lying around and no pirates, so I thought my coordinates were messed up. I fly to another area and the same thing. I fly near one of the cans and get a warning. If I grab the loot, I will be attackable by said player. So I look around and I see one guy far far off in the distance, but that player was nowhere to be found. So I snatched up the loot. Keep in mind I had some decent noob loot from previous missions in my cargo hold I hadn't dropped off yet. As soon as I snatched the loot and about 2 seconds later BOOM! I get hit by a webifier, warp disruptor and an antiweapon lock and being pounded by missiles and guns. I tried to fight... I tried to run... but I was toast. So what do I do? I cry on the Rookie Channel. "Why would you greif the noobie area?" You know what this dork said? "I was helping a corpmate with his missions." I ran the newbie stuff, you dont need help. He deliberatly baited a trap and camped it (or had a spotter) just to kill noobs. Smuggly he replied, "That will teach you to open other peoples cans", even though he was nowhere to be seen. I just said whatever and put him on ignore. I lost my cargo... I was upset. If he wanted to teach a lesson, he just had to fire on me once and say "bad noob" and I would have given his loot back if he wanted it bad enough. I hate greifers. Now... I have the ability to knock him down, or at least stand a chance solo, but I dont have to any longer, because I have a great Corp I am a part of because of that incident. About a minute later I get a convo invite from a guy who apologized for the incident. He wasn't a part of the corp of the guy, he was apologizing on behalf of PvPers on Eve because while violent, they didn't greif noobs. We get to talking and I finally end up joining his Corp. Moral of the story? Just because a dork who was beat up in high school everyday comes around and blows up your noob ship, doesn't mean that it is all bad. There are good players out there, I love PvP, but I don't condone greifing. It is childish and immature and irresponsible. Hope your friend sticks with it. My 2 week trial ended after the 3rd day. My Corp is awesome. Thanks for taking the time to read.
TricksR4Cats	Posted - 2006.07.05 17:14:00 - [21] Heh today I got in my Ferox and headed to Sobaseki to find a noob. The plan: drop some loot, say it's free stuff, and then blast them out of the sky once they take it. I found my noob. 2 days old. Not a clue how to play. I lay the trap, I start a convo inviting him to take the free stuff. He did. He flashed red. But I couldn't do it. It's just do damn mean. Sure, it sounds like a little fun (Let's poke some n00bs) but it's really, really mean. So I let him keep the stuff and explained that some people will open fire on him and he must be careful. He said he wasnt sure what I meant because concord will attack, so I fired 1 heavy missile at him and took his shields down to 20%. I explained how aggressing and all that works and he was very grateful.
Jason Hawke	Posted - 2006.07.05 17:18:00 - [22] Originally by: TricksR4Cats So I let him keep the stuff and explained that some people will open fire on him and he must be careful. He said he wasnt sure what I meant because concord will attack, so I fired 1 heavy missile at him and took his shields down to 20%. I explained how aggressing and all that works and he was very grateful. Now that is perfectly alright! The teaching aspect AND you can fire on a noob :P
Lurtz	Posted - 2006.07.05 17:19:00 - [23] Originally by: Ehker Gerete Edited by: Ehker Gerete on 05/07/2006 10:48:17 While people shouldn't kill noob too often, if they can't handle losing a free ibis to something they got warned about, they definitley cannot handle this game. By the way, speaking of gang war flag, someone named Inevitability (something like that, ask me in-game) invited me to a gang when I was 0 meters form a gate. Then 4 or 5 cruisers attacked me. I jumped and someone said "you jump instead of fight?" in the gang channel. Just don't accept gang invites from this person. I also saw him trying to convinve new players to join the gang saying it was for missions. Inevitability? Is he still doing that in Kisogo?
Anscar	Posted - 2006.07.05 18:13:00 - [24] Originally by: Ydyp Ieva had this happening to my alt once, was he surprised that the next victim he tried was flying a fully fitted pvp crow and he sitting there in a condor Well that makes me believe it aren't only older people that do it, some newbies do it as well as soon as they can afford a suitable frigate. In my case, the "fisherman" char was only two days old (I checked him out), so he may have been a new player....or an old player using a new alt. Who knows? He was flying what appeared to be a low-end ship (don't recall if it was the starter ship). If he was a new player, could he actually make ISK killing even newer noobs? I've yet to kill a pc, so I don't know what you get....his salvage, his ISK? A brand-new player wouldn't have much worth taking (guess you could sell or reprocess his miner and gun), so I assume it would be simple greifing. The reason I didn't make an issue of this instance is that I didn't actually see the guy in question attack anyone or do anything. (Don't know if he was talking to me because I had my chats closed.) Maybe he was an innocent bystander. I'm way too noob to be causing other people problems with the management...especially since there's lot I don't understand about the game yet. My first reaction when he blew up my practice pirates was anger. I thought about switching to my other char and coming back in my Rifter.....which unfortunately was 21 jumps away. Heh, he'd probably switched to a battleship, if I did that...and Concord would have taken me out, if I attacked him. I count this as a learning experience. PvP is an essential element of the game....and you're advised to "trust no one." For that reason, I was suspicious and didn't bite. Had I bitten, I wouldn't have really lost anything....because a half-hour old char doesn't have anything to lose (except a little pride)...and I would have learned not to open containers that don't belong to me.
Casyus Quinn	Posted - 2006.07.05 20:05:00 - [25] when i was doing the kill the pirate part of the tutorial i was lost, i think i had taken a pass key that belonged to another noob and got flagged, he attacked, i attacked back, i won, lol, its kinda funny thinking back on it know, two noobs fighting over something you cant sell or reprosses, i still have that pass key
Synchronicity II	Posted - 2006.07.05 21:18:00 - [26] I started 4 days ago and I had the same problem others are reporting. For the first pirate mission, no pirates were to be found but instead tons of floating containers. I tried to pick one up but I got the flag, so I closed it. Just then a ship Dark Tormenter popped into view. I sat and waited for a pirate to spawn, and even warped to other points. No pirates, lots of containers. As I moved from one place to another I could tell that Dark Tormenter was making rounds. He then took it one step further... When I finally found and shot down a pirate and I was trying to figure out how to loot the container, he ended up taking it from me. Of course this flagged him, but I figured that would get me blown out of space if I even tried to attack. Eventually, I lucked out, or he got tired, and I finally completed the mission. Problem is...since this is a rookie zone, rookies would have no idea that what was going on was wrong or not really supposed to happen. I have had enough experiences with other online games to know not to draw a target on myself, but I still found it extremely...cruel. What benefit does the guy get anyways? There must be something...
Casyus Quinn	Posted - 2006.07.05 21:28:00 - [27] Originally by: Synchronicity II I started 4 days ago and I had the same problem others are reporting. For the first pirate mission, no pirates were to be found but instead tons of floating containers. I tried to pick one up but I got the flag, so I closed it. Just then a ship Dark Tormenter popped into view. I sat and waited for a pirate to spawn, and even warped to other points. No pirates, lots of containers. As I moved from one place to another I could tell that Dark Tormenter was making rounds. He then took it one step further... When I finally found and shot down a pirate and I was trying to figure out how to loot the container, he ended up taking it from me. Of course this flagged him, but I figured that would get me blown out of space if I even tried to attack. Eventually, I lucked out, or he got tired, and I finally completed the mission. Problem is...since this is a rookie zone, rookies would have no idea that what was going on was wrong or not really supposed to happen. I have had enough experiences with other online games to know not to draw a target on myself, but I still found it extremely...cruel. What benefit does the guy get anyways? There must be something... nor is the noob likely to know that if they said something about it in local that a whole fleet would likely show up to deal with the griefer and help the noob
Jon Charlie	Posted - 2006.07.06 00:57:00 - [28] Dark Tormentor needs to be hospitalized for a long long time.
TricksR4Cats	Posted - 2006.07.06 01:15:00 - [29] Which system is this in? I'll give him a surprise in my own ship ;)
Ehker Gerete	Posted - 2006.07.06 02:18:00 - [30] Originally by: Lurtz Originally by: Ehker Gerete Edited by: Ehker Gerete on 05/07/2006 10:48:17 While people shouldn't kill noob too often, if they can't handle losing a free ibis to something they got warned about, they definitley cannot handle this game. By the way, speaking of gang war flag, someone named Inevitability (something like that, ask me in-game) invited me to a gang when I was 0 meters form a gate. Then 4 or 5 cruisers attacked me. I jumped and someone said "you jump instead of fight?" in the gang channel. Just don't accept gang invites from this person. I also saw him trying to convinve new players to join the gang saying it was for missions. Inevitability? Is he still doing that in Kisogo? yep, afaik. Please keep your signature below the 24000 bytes limit.- Pirlouit There. Fixed. - Ehker

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