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SengH
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:34:00 -
[1]
Edited by: SengH on 05/07/2006 21:36:13
Ok I currently have 23mil SP and fly exclusively minnie. I have only 280k in industry so im not a carebear. Today I redid my skill plan around getting a full t2 kit on the phoon and 2 side skills tossed in for random stuff.
Skill Plan for SengH
1: Scout Drone Operation V
2: Amarr Drone Specialization I
3: Gallente Drone Specialization I
4: Caldari Drone Specialization I
5: Minmatar Drone Specialization I
6: Gallente Drone Specialization II
7: Amarr Drone Specialization II
8: Minmatar Drone Specialization II
9: Caldari Drone Specialization II
10: Advanced Weapon Upgrades IV
11: Sharpshooter V
12: Rapid Firing V
13: Surgical Strike IV
14: Repair Systems IV
15: Repair Systems V
16: Energy Grid Upgrades V
17: Energy Management V
18: Energy Pulse Weapons III
19: Energy Pulse Weapons IV
20: Energy Systems Operation V
21: Shield Compensation IV
22: Shield Compensation V
23: Shield Management V
24: Shield Upgrades V
25: Large Artillery Specialization I
26: Large Artillery Specialization II
27: Large Artillery Specialization III
28: Large Artillery Specialization IV
29: Large Autocannon Specialization I
30: Large Autocannon Specialization II
31: Large Autocannon Specialization III
32: Large Autocannon Specialization IV
33: Guided Missile Precision III
34: Guided Missile Precision IV
35: Missile Bombardment IV
36: Missile Projection IV
37: Rapid Launch IV
38: Target Navigation Prediction III
39: Target Navigation Prediction IV
40: Warhead Upgrades III
41: Warhead Upgrades IV
42: Torpedoes IV
43: Torpedoes V
44: Navigation V
45: Evasive Maneuvering V
46: Minmatar Battleship V
47: Advanced Weapon Upgrades V
48: Drone Durability III
49: Drone Durability IV
50: Drone Interfacing III
51: Drone Interfacing IV
52: Drone Interfacing V
53: Amarr Drone Specialization III
54: Amarr Drone Specialization IV
55: Caldari Drone Specialization III
56: Caldari Drone Specialization IV
57: Combat Drone Operation III
58: Combat Drone Operation IV
59: Drone Navigation III
60: Drone Navigation IV
61: Drone Sharpshooting III
62: Drone Sharpshooting IV
63: Gallente Drone Specialization III
64: Gallente Drone Specialization IV
65: Heavy Drone Operation IV
66: Heavy Drone Operation V
67: Minmatar Drone Specialization III
68: Minmatar Drone Specialization IV
69: Cruise Missiles IV
70: Cruise Missiles V
71: Cruise Missile Specialization I
72: Cruise Missile Specialization II
73: Cruise Missile Specialization III
74: Cruise Missile Specialization IV
75: Torpedo Specialization I
76: Torpedo Specialization II
77: Torpedo Specialization III
78: Torpedo Specialization IV
79: Energy Emission Systems IV
80: High Speed Maneuvering IV
80 skills; Total time: 343 days, 18 hours, 59 minutes, 25 seconds
Heck i can be in a effective dreadnought with siege mode and supplementary skills in under half the time it'll take to get a T2 phoon.
For a Tier 1 BS... this is pretty fubared.
Edit: On the other hand I doubt my corp will let me fly any ship other than a battlecruiser till flagships are released.
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SengH
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:41:00 -
[2]
 Originally by: HippoKing
Do you really need smartbombs? 
sadly every time ive thought about fitting them and then went naahh it'll be ok. I run into close range intys :P.
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SengH
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:47:00 -
[3]
Edited by: SengH on 05/07/2006 21:47:42
Originally by: fkingfurious
You are quite clearly, whats the word im looking for here.
Ummmmmmmmmmm.
Oh yeah.
INSANE.
U seem to have listed evert engineerinf skill, drone spec, nav skill, in fact, pretty much ALL OF THEM.
To have a t2 loadout u need heavy drones 5, torps 5, whatever u need for t2 guns, and thats it.
U seem to have decided u need lvl5 in absolutely every skill that has any effect on ur ship.
No wonder u came up with a list that big.
I mean, uve listed energy pulse weapons in there. 4 siege 2's, 4 Auto 2's, thats ur high slots. Just where exactly are u planning to put those smart bombs?
theres the 2xnos 2xsmartie setup 4xAC that I use sometimes. Works decently well and the smarties make pods go a nice squish. Engineering skills are needed cus of the insanely ****ty cap on minnie ships. The shield skills are for my claymore as i need to top that out at some point.
Edit: Also cruise/torps are depending on situation. For anti-bs work you'd go with torps but otherwise you'd use precision cruise for everything else.
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SengH
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:01:00 -
[4]
Edited by: SengH on 05/07/2006 22:02:03
Originally by: HippoKing
I still think shield compensation 5 is a bit above and beyond the call of duty 
Has anyone ever shield tanked a typhoon in its current state?
As I said, thats for the claymore... I'm not gonna be flying any other ship for a long time during ops. At least until flagships come out. I figure a fully kitted t2 phoon will get me placed well for them. Then again given CCPs flip flopping on whether minnie cap ships should shield or armor tank I figure i'll train for both.
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SengH
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:14:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Emno
Originally by: SengH
2: Amarr Drone Specialization I
7: Amarr Drone Specialization II
53: Amarr Drone Specialization III
54: Amarr Drone Specialization IV
booo evil drones, they would take me like 5 days to use but i really cba some of those you could really do without heh some its a bit shocking that as a 23mil sp min pilot you don't have yet ;p
You gain some you lose some Alot of the stuff I can do is pretty shocking too.
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SengH
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:27:00 -
[6]
Edited by: SengH on 05/07/2006 22:30:09
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
Originally by: SengH
Edit: Ok if you want. Subtract off 1-2 months for assorted skills that arent really necessary. THATS STILL OVER 3/4 a year to get into a t2 fitted TIER 1 BS. If I was flying a geddon I'd be done already.
So it is really only that long for you because you trained an odd path and left out a ton of basic skills. Not really a property of the phoon but of the way you trained your character.
Realistically I would say the phoon needs some 30 days longer than the Arma for a full T2 fit, that is the 30 days I estimate it takes to train up Torp spec 3. All other skill reqs are kinda the same, guns, armor tank and T2 heavy drones.
The thing is arma's drones arent really a primary weapons system. The phoon needs its drones having the 2nd largest BS dronebay and its split wpns system reduces the effects of dmg mods.
You need both torps and cruise for the phoon depending on how you fit it. Which is a big problem.
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SengH
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Posted - 2006.07.06 01:59:00 -
[7]
Originally by: mrg29
your post is slightly misleading.
the time required to GET INTO a t2 fitted phoon is significantly less than what u have quoted.
the skilltree u have posted basically involves maxing out all relevants skills related to flying a phoon which is totally different.
i'll pick on 2 examples, BS 5 and drone interfacing 5, neither of these is required to be able to fly a t2 outfitted phoon and these 2 skills alone account for over 2 months or around 20% of the training time.
BS5 is to make up for your damage mods only affecting HALF your slots. The BS bonus affects both of them so its needed at 5 so as not to get screwed. Drone interfacing 5 is there so at the end of the VERY long road. The minmatar carrier might possibly be balanced. Or i'll go straight to wing command carriers. Even if you take off those 2. Its almost 280 days on top of 23mil SP to fly a Tier 1 BS. Does the domi/scorp/arma come anywhere near the same amount of SP to use fully fitted with T2? Even then, does the phoon perform better with the higher SP investment required? From preliminary calculations its hard to say that it does.
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SengH
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Posted - 2006.07.06 02:06:00 -
[8]
Originally by: mrg29
not disagreeing that minmatar ships do require a wider spread of skills to be fully effective in that most other BS. i am predominantly a minnie pilot myself so i feel your pain.
i suppose i was just being pedantic pointing out that the skill tree u set out was to reach maxed skills which is a different prospect from just being able to use a t2 outfitted ship which was what your initial post suggested.
To make t2 guns/missiles worth their extra expense you usually have to take the specialization to 4 which is what I did. The only things that are possibly "not needed" would be the shield tanking stuff, the smarties and drone interfacing 5. Thats about 2 months. Out of which the rest of the year is spend training solely for the t2 equipment. Furthermore I cut some corners by not training missile support skills to 5 which could arguably be needed since its a 50/50 weapon split. Missiles at least dont require the support skills to 5 to use the guns.
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SengH
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Posted - 2006.07.06 16:35:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Stamm
Edited by: Stamm on 06/07/2006 14:49:02
You're an idiot posting misleading rubbish in order to try and make a point.
What your post should be is '2 years to max out everything possible, for every fitting I can think of for a Typhoon'
If you have 23mil SP, and all in Minmatar, then why can't you fire T2 large guns already? Where are your skillpoints?
You need repair systems to V and you need shield skills? Are you planning on dual tanking it?
You need spec level IV on your T2 drones, for all races?
You need to max out cruise and torpedoes to get in it? What are you planning to have some of each?
You have drone interfacing to level 2 and you have 23mil SP, again I have to ask what you have spent those skillpoints on.
Surgical strike level 3? Again, same question...
I'm sorry, you're attempting to deceive with this post, there are no two ways about it.
Edit : Yes I know you are leadership specced. But your original post claimed you were fully Minmatar specced, it's at least deceiving to say that without saying how many SP you've invested in leadership. But then again, your whole post was designed to mislead.
If you even read the thread I said I put the shield skills in there for my claymore. I am minnie specced as I can use the claymore how its meant to be used at 97% effectivenses. As I'm going to be flying that for the foreseeable future. I tossed that in there. Its far more useful than any single pvp pilot in almost any group situation.
Drone interfacing lvl 2 is back from the time when the bonus was +1 drones per level. The tempest had space for just 7 heavy drones and I saw little to any point in training it further at the time. I havent had the time since to deal with it. Surgical strike 3 is because I could not justify spending the 4 days for 3% more damage when it could better be spent on other skills that would allow me doing my job better. I fly command ships as how their supposed to be used, not like the superhac crowd.
I even said remove 1-2 months if that makes you happy for skills that you deem extraenous. That still puts it @ 270 days. Well over 3/4 a year, to fly a TIER 1 BS at tech 2 effectiveness.
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