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Kali Suggestion no. 137: Pardons.

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Darkon Gatland	Posted - 2006.07.17 16:51:00 - [1] An idea struck me while is thinking about security status. When people kill others and take a security hit it takes them along while to get back up to positive security status. A logical scenario of course especially for pirates, but what about those who either shot at someone by accident or killed a pirate in low sec who had been harassing him or his corp? So this idea popped into my head, with Kali we will have factional warfare and "tours of duty" so why can't we have the empire you work for offer you a complete security pardon for services to the empire. Its a good way to get people involved with factional warfare and a good easy way to reset your security to 0.0. Now there must be limits to this pardon system. For example, only agents in high sec systems 0.8 - 1.0 can offer the pardon so big time pirates still have to reduce their sec status to be able to fly a ship into and out of the agent station as well as complete missions within high sec. Aswell as other restrictions to ensure it's a quick reset for the good honest eve player (no offence to pirates, you rock too). Or perhaps its a long term reward after some time with an agent, but then it become an option you can use repeatedly once you have worked a long time for him. Anyways just running it up the flagpole...
Haks'he Lirky Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.07.17 17:10:00 - [2] You used to be able to bribe concord agents and boost your sec rating, but pirates just got in pods and flown to the agents and paid to have there sec increased again. Although it was abit iratating since you had to wait 15 mins between each bribe and if you was at -10 it used to take awhile
Sakura Nihil Tharsis Security	Posted - 2006.07.17 17:25:00 - [3] Quick summary of my ideas: if a pirate aligns with a faction, let them enter their high-sec space, keep their sec status, but not allow them to shoot anyone besides war targets in highsec. Might be exploited by pirates wanting to go after carebears however, so there needs to be checks and balances.
Baldour Ngarr Artemis Rising	Posted - 2006.07.17 18:23:00 - [4] Originally by: Darkon Gatland ...a good easy way to reset your security to 0.0. Nobody's ever yet explained to me why there should be one. We have to live with the consequences of our actions: why shouldn't pirates have to live with theirs? ________________________________________________ "I tried strip mining, but I lost, and it's cold flying around in space naked."
Infinity Ziona The First Noble Truth	Posted - 2006.07.17 18:29:00 - [5] Because its a game and being permanantly locked out of so many systems unless you spend a few months grinding npcs is a bit retarded. Not allowing pirates into empire is one of the main reason why you cant bounty hunt properly in EvE. And saying that allowing pirates into high sec will lead to ganking is stupid since ganking is well and truly alive in EvE anyway in high sec. Let them in. Let us fight them and collect their bounties. Most of them will be freely attackable. Oveur wants the 'Players' to be the main force behind EvE. Then why do NPCS gank any -5 character that enters .5 and up before we get a chance at them.?? Stupid idea.
Wendat Huron Lupus Industries	Posted - 2006.07.17 18:33:00 - [6] Originally by: Baldour Ngarr Originally by: Darkon Gatland ...a good easy way to reset your security to 0.0. Nobody's ever yet explained to me why there should be one. We have to live with the consequences of our actions: why shouldn't pirates have to live with theirs? For killing people with negative standings there should be less of a hit, as should there be some redemption for pirates killing actual other pirates, not the NPC kind.
Jojin Gallente	Posted - 2006.07.17 20:16:00 - [7] There should not be an easy road to recovery for your security status. It was lowered because you chose to take actions against other players. The damage or pain you dished out needs to be something you live with. My main beef with this idea is it would allow individuals to take aggressive actions towards other players in empire space and then easily raise their status back up (-4.9 and up) where they would be protected by concorde, gates, and stations. As mentioned access could be easily gained while in a pod. I am all for letting people act like pirates, but let the players be able to treat them like pirates and attack them on site. As for the pirates not being able to gain access to higher security areas, I don't think it really detracts from access to game play aspects. If they wish to totally change their play style, then they just have a bit of a road to travel.
Athren Soulsteal Gallente	Posted - 2006.07.17 20:18:00 - [8] Edited by: Athren Soulsteal on 17/07/2006 20:19:14 This idea has merit but only if balanced as every other MMOG, MOD and OOG handles it. By fixing the bounty system so that you donÆt pod to get the bounty but capture and turn in the pod to the law. The neg sec player then spends X amount of time in jail till time is served or until the sec rating is up to where he is offered a pardon (based on him only killing faction enemys). Quote: Because its a game and being permanantly locked out of so many systems unless you spend a few months grinding npcs is a bit retarded. No one is forced to be a pirate, itÆs a choice. I have spent many a time in a MMOG jail because I got so annoyed at some player begging for money or stealing a kill that I would attack them. I would make the choice that the Risk (me going to jail for a bit) was worth the Reward (Killing the lamer). Right now there is no balance to Risk Vrs Reward for players that want to break the law. Balance the risk by allowing us to turn in the Baddies for the bounties and then players will finally have to live by their choices. Then you can offer pardons because it would mean something, offering pardons under the current game just further imbalances the reward the neg players are already getting for their choices. Quote: Think about the people that did fight you fairly. Think.... that were honorable and helped you out in times of need. Those are the real heroes of EVE. I wish I could fit all the Quote
CrayC Gallente	Posted - 2006.07.17 20:23:00 - [9] Originally by: Darkon Gatland So this idea popped into my head, with Kali we will have factional warfare and "tours of duty" so why can't we have the empire you work for offer you a complete security pardon for services to the empire. Its a good way to get people involved with factional warfare and a good easy way to reset your security to 0.0. Problem is, the faction that determines your security rating, is Concord. And you will not be able to work for them, so the Empires, powerful as they may be, are not able to reset the standing achieved with someone else than themselves...
Niccolado Starwalker Gallente	Posted - 2006.07.17 23:30:00 - [10] Originally by: Darkon Gatland An idea struck me while is thinking about security status. When people kill others and take a security hit it takes them along while to get back up to positive security status. A logical scenario of course especially for pirates, but what about those who either shot at someone by accident or killed a pirate in low sec who had been harassing him or his corp? So this idea popped into my head, with Kali we will have factional warfare and "tours of duty" so why can't we have the empire you work for offer you a complete security pardon for services to the empire. Its a good way to get people involved with factional warfare and a good easy way to reset your security to 0.0. Now there must be limits to this pardon system. For example, only agents in high sec systems 0.8 - 1.0 can offer the pardon so big time pirates still have to reduce their sec status to be able to fly a ship into and out of the agent station as well as complete missions within high sec. Aswell as other restrictions to ensure it's a quick reset for the good honest eve player (no offence to pirates, you rock too). Or perhaps its a long term reward after some time with an agent, but then it become an option you can use repeatedly once you have worked a long time for him. Anyways just running it up the flagpole... There should be no easy way resetting your sec status!!! It might be a game, but you should live, breathe and die by your gained reputation. Its easy. If you dont like taking a security hit, you should stay "legal". If you cant, but want to become a "nice" man later, you should work - and work dam hard - to achieve it. Othervice, you can choose between "good guy" one day and "bad guy" the next, and a few days to align your reputation. Thats no good!
Samirol Ore Mongers	Posted - 2006.07.17 23:41:00 - [11] it doesn't take months to go from -10 to -1.9 (so you can go to 1.0) a few weeks of solid 0.0 ratting, level 4s, or complexes can do that. Originally by: Tekka Originally by: ISD "Can I have your stuff?" isn't constructive neither is 95% of the internet
Lorth Synchro.	Posted - 2006.07.17 23:46:00 - [12] Edited by: Lorth on 17/07/2006 23:47:05 WTF double post... ^^^ and someone got in the middle of it? ------------- Recruit me
xeom Obsidian Sins	Posted - 2006.07.17 23:46:00 - [13] Yea its totaly fair to lock players out of game play.I mean what a good sales line! WELCOME TO EVE WHERE YOU'RE FREE! well except if you're a pirate in which case a whole expansion worth of content is lost to you.But no worries Eh!?! keep sending us those 15 dollars a month even tho nobody really goes into low-sec anymore. If so lock out everyone who has a 0.0+ standing out of 0.4 or lower.Hell i want to see pirate concord come out of no where and just gank em.Because why do they deserve to enjoy more content then us?Nay i say! you worked hard to be legal ENJOY IT! nothing lower then 0.5! CCP where are our t2 shield power relays? \| Join[..SIN]
Lorth Synchro.	Posted - 2006.07.17 23:46:00 - [14] Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker There should be no easy way resetting your sec status!!! It might be a game, but you should live, breathe and die by your gained reputation. Its easy. If you dont like taking a security hit, you should stay "legal". If you cant, but want to become a "nice" man later, you should work - and work dam hard - to achieve it. Othervice, you can choose between "good guy" one day and "bad guy" the next, and a few days to align your reputation. Thats no good! But its a game. Say that 6 times. And not only is it a game, but its one where you don't, or arn't forced to grind your way through it, save for raising your sec status. The only thing forcing someone to grind mindless tasks does, is punich the player, and not the charactor he plays. Which is why I hate people who say such stupid things, as "if you can't do the time dont do the crime." The charactor, which is really who should be punished, since this is a computer game, and your beef isn't with the guy behind the keyboard, isn't punished by having to kill NPC's to get his sec status back up. Think about the for a while. What ill effect occur to Lorth he gains 7 points of security status? The answer is nothing, I gain isk, lots of it in fact. However, the guy playing Lorth, is bored endlessly, by having to do this, and its the same with more or less every other player. Frankly we need anouther way/means of improving sec status other then the current, and only option of the grind. ------------- Recruit me
Montague Zooma Imperial Dreams Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2006.07.17 23:58:00 - [15] Originally by: xeom Yea its totaly fair to lock players out of game play.I mean what a good sales line! WELCOME TO EVE WHERE YOU'RE FREE! well except if you're a pirate in which case a whole expansion worth of content is lost to you.But no worries Eh!?! keep sending us those 15 dollars a month even tho nobody really goes into low-sec anymore. Or how about WELCOME TO EVE WHERE OTHER PLAYERS DESTROY ALL YOUR STUFF? Hunting NPCs and mining in low sec has its drawbacks...so does preying on the players who go there. If I choose to go into low sec, I won't complain about the pirates who attack me. The pirates shouldn't complain about the consequences either. We choose our own paths, it's not like the penalties weren't explained in advance.
xeom Obsidian Sins	Posted - 2006.07.18 00:34:00 - [16] Originally by: Montague Zooma Originally by: xeom Yea its totaly fair to lock players out of game play.I mean what a good sales line! WELCOME TO EVE WHERE YOU'RE FREE! well except if you're a pirate in which case a whole expansion worth of content is lost to you.But no worries Eh!?! keep sending us those 15 dollars a month even tho nobody really goes into low-sec anymore. Or how about WELCOME TO EVE WHERE OTHER PLAYERS DESTROY ALL YOUR STUFF? Hunting NPCs and mining in low sec has its drawbacks...so does preying on the players who go there. If I choose to go into low sec, I won't complain about the pirates who attack me. The pirates shouldn't complain about the consequences either. We choose our own paths, it's not like the penalties weren't explained in advance. And wrong! you see you're gameplay is not being limted.If anything its being enhanced!Low-sec is the area where you have to watch out and deal with people.But you can goto low-sec and with enough planing and witts and you normaly won't get killed.On the other hand i can do nothing of the sort to access new stuff in the xpac.Unless of course i stop pirating and spend 2 months WORKING NO FUN to raise my sec status.There is no risk v reward there.For us its just a plain grind,and even then i have to stop doing what i love! Really i have no need for high-sec except the market.But once kali starts pumping out new and fun things in high-sec thats Bullsh**,thats gameplay i cannot access it.nobody is stoping you from coming into low-sec.Concord is stoping my 110% from going into high-sec. CCP where are our t2 shield power relays? \| Join[..SIN]
Infinity Ziona The First Noble Truth	Posted - 2006.07.18 00:55:00 - [17] Originally by: xeom Originally by: Montague Zooma Originally by: xeom Yea its totaly fair to lock players out of game play.I mean what a good sales line! WELCOME TO EVE WHERE YOU'RE FREE! well except if you're a pirate in which case a whole expansion worth of content is lost to you.But no worries Eh!?! keep sending us those 15 dollars a month even tho nobody really goes into low-sec anymore. Or how about WELCOME TO EVE WHERE OTHER PLAYERS DESTROY ALL YOUR STUFF? Hunting NPCs and mining in low sec has its drawbacks...so does preying on the players who go there. If I choose to go into low sec, I won't complain about the pirates who attack me. The pirates shouldn't complain about the consequences either. We choose our own paths, it's not like the penalties weren't explained in advance. And wrong! you see you're gameplay is not being limted.If anything its being enhanced!Low-sec is the area where you have to watch out and deal with people.But you can goto low-sec and with enough planing and witts and you normaly won't get killed.On the other hand i can do nothing of the sort to access new stuff in the xpac.Unless of course i stop pirating and spend 2 months WORKING NO FUN to raise my sec status.There is no risk v reward there.For us its just a plain grind,and even then i have to stop doing what i love! Really i have no need for high-sec except the market.But once kali starts pumping out new and fun things in high-sec thats Bullsh**,thats gameplay i cannot access it.nobody is stoping you from coming into low-sec.Concord is stoping my 110% from going into high-sec. Yup. CCP seem to make some very 'odd' game decisions. But usually only for a specific group of people.
Montague Zooma Imperial Dreams Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2006.07.18 01:22:00 - [18] Originally by: xeom And wrong! you see you're gameplay is not being limted.If anything its being enhanced!Low-sec is the area where you have to watch out and deal with people.But you can goto low-sec and with enough planing and witts and you normaly won't get killed.On the other hand i can do nothing of the sort to access new stuff in the xpac.Unless of course i stop pirating and spend 2 months WORKING NO FUN to raise my sec status.There is no risk v reward there.For us its just a plain grind,and even then i have to stop doing what i love! Hey! I'm enjoying hitting my head with a hammer...but I don't like the pain. Make the pain stop, just don't insist that I stop hitting my head with a hammer! OUCH!!! You can always prey on players in 0.0 where there is no security penalty.
xeom Obsidian Sins	Posted - 2006.07.18 01:25:00 - [19] Originally by: Montague Zooma Originally by: xeom And wrong! you see you're gameplay is not being limted.If anything its being enhanced!Low-sec is the area where you have to watch out and deal with people.But you can goto low-sec and with enough planing and witts and you normaly won't get killed.On the other hand i can do nothing of the sort to access new stuff in the xpac.Unless of course i stop pirating and spend 2 months WORKING NO FUN to raise my sec status.There is no risk v reward there.For us its just a plain grind,and even then i have to stop doing what i love! Hey! I'm enjoying hitting my head with a hammer...but I don't like the pain. Make the pain stop, just don't insist that I stop hitting my head with a hammer! OUCH!!! You can always prey on players in 0.0 where there is no security penalty. Great analogy BTW.Except this isn't real-life and its just a game for fun.Tell ya what show me 1 other class of player that has such limits inposed on him as we do and ill be quite.No body else has gameplay cut from them cut dry and simple.Also 0.0 combat is nothing like low-sec piracy k? CCP where are our t2 shield power relays? \| Join[..SIN]
nahtoh Caldari	Posted - 2006.07.18 02:00:00 - [20] Edited by: nahtoh on 18/07/2006 02:00:53 Originally by: xeom Edited by: xeom on 18/07/2006 00:58:25 Originally by: Montague Zooma Originally by: xeom Yea its totaly fair to lock players out of game play.I mean what a good sales line! WELCOME TO EVE WHERE YOU'RE FREE! well except if you're a pirate in which case a whole expansion worth of content is lost to you.But no worries Eh!?! keep sending us those 15 dollars a month even tho nobody really goes into low-sec anymore. Or how about WELCOME TO EVE WHERE OTHER PLAYERS DESTROY ALL YOUR STUFF? Hunting NPCs and mining in low sec has its drawbacks...so does preying on the players who go there. If I choose to go into low sec, I won't complain about the pirates who attack me. The pirates shouldn't complain about the consequences either. We choose our own paths, it's not like the penalties weren't explained in advance. And wrong! you see you're gameplay is not being limted.If anything its being enhanced!Low-sec is the area where you have to watch out and deal with people.But you can goto low-sec and with enough planing and witts and you normaly won't get killed.On the other hand i can do nothing of the sort to access new stuff in the xpac.Unless of course i stop pirating and spend 2 months WORKING NO FUN to raise my sec status.There is no risk v reward there.For us its just a plain grind,and even then i have to stop doing what i love! Really i have no need for high-sec except the market.But once kali starts pumping out new and fun things in high-sec thats Bullsh**,thats gameplay i cannot access it.nobody is stoping you from coming into low-sec.Concord is stoping me 110% from going into high-sec. Tough nuggies? Cry Me A River Build A Bridge And Get Over It? Theres no agents in low sec that may have faction warfare missions? Nobody forced you to pop other players in empire space, deal with it. Now I thought that the attraction of eve was its harsh it can hurt type game play... ========= "I am not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but why can`t we just take the safety labels off everything and let the problem fix its self
Carch	Posted - 2006.07.18 02:11:00 - [21] Edited by: Carch on 18/07/2006 02:12:22 Originally by: xeom Edited by: xeom on 18/07/2006 00:58:25 Originally by: Montague Zooma Originally by: xeom Yea its totaly fair to lock players out of game play.I mean what a good sales line! WELCOME TO EVE WHERE YOU'RE FREE! well except if you're a pirate in which case a whole expansion worth of content is lost to you.But no worries Eh!?! keep sending us those 15 dollars a month even tho nobody really goes into low-sec anymore. Or how about WELCOME TO EVE WHERE OTHER PLAYERS DESTROY ALL YOUR STUFF? Hunting NPCs and mining in low sec has its drawbacks...so does preying on the players who go there. If I choose to go into low sec, I won't complain about the pirates who attack me. The pirates shouldn't complain about the consequences either. We choose our own paths, it's not like the penalties weren't explained in advance. And wrong! you see you're gameplay is not being limted.If anything its being enhanced!Low-sec is the area where you have to watch out and deal with people.But you can goto low-sec and with enough planing and witts and you normaly won't get killed.On the other hand i can do nothing of the sort to access new stuff in the xpac.Unless of course i stop pirating and spend 2 months WORKING NO FUN to raise my sec status.There is no risk v reward there.For us its just a plain grind,and even then i have to stop doing what i love! Really i have no need for high-sec except the market.But once kali starts pumping out new and fun things in high-sec thats Bullsh**,thats gameplay i cannot access it.nobody is stoping you from coming into low-sec.Concord is stoping me 110% from going into high-sec. then quit really tired of the i cant go high sec, low sec, 0.0 areas whines from everyone in every thread
xeom Obsidian Sins	Posted - 2006.07.18 02:19:00 - [22] Edited by: xeom on 18/07/2006 02:21:14 Wow thats a really good rebutal...No wait I was reading one of my posts.You seem stuck on this idea that punishing the player is anything smart to do.First of,me blowing you up is part of the game.CCP love's that part hell read some of ovuers blogs.Here's the problem they can't hurt my gameplay because i won't be getting any.Plain simple nothing for me a whole Expansion pack zoomed passed like nothing. Im all for penalising me.Hell you can attack and pod me at any given time.But to tell me,O sorry you can't play that part of the game.Is just plain silly. Cool i poped some players so mabye i get less rewards or something.Mabye any of the other factions can attack me at any time whatever it my be!But to not give me gameplay at all is unbalanced.And i highly doubt there will be low-sec empire agents sence it seems to be PVP oriented.Also they are fighting for empire land. Overall people think we are not a real part of the game.And need to be punished.This is not true,sure penalise my CHARACTER,but not me the paying customer. CCP where are our t2 shield power relays? \| Join[..SIN]
nahtoh Caldari	Posted - 2006.07.18 02:31:00 - [23] Originally by: xeom Edited by: xeom on 18/07/2006 02:21:14 Wow thats a really good rebutal...No wait I was reading one of my posts.You seem stuck on this idea that punishing the player is anything smart to do.First of,me blowing you up is part of the game.CCP love's that part hell read some of ovuers blogs.Here's the problem they can't hurt my gameplay because i won't be getting any.Plain simple nothing for me a whole Expansion pack zoomed passed like nothing. Im all for penalising me.Hell you can attack and pod me at any given time.But to tell me,O sorry you can't play that part of the game.Is just plain silly. Cool i poped some players so mabye i get less rewards or something.Mabye any of the other factions can attack me at any time whatever it my be!But to not give me gameplay at all is unbalanced.And i highly doubt there will be low-sec empire agents sence it seems to be PVP oriented.Also they are fighting for empire land. Overall people think we are not a real part of the game.And need to be punished.This is not true,sure penalise my CHARACTER,but not me the paying customer. Hell use a trained up ALT to take part in it, thats not punishing the player. It may stop one of the players characters from taking part. Pirates do what they want to do, granted it does not appeal to me. But hey what ever floats your boat. But I place your points in the same catagory I do with "WHAAAA Why can't I get a Titian solo" Or "WTF outposts are 0.0 only that sucks!!!" You wanted to be a in game criminal? fine knock yourself out, but don't expect the lawgivers to give you a free access pass into highsec. ========= "I am not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but why can`t we just take the safety labels off everything and let the problem fix its self
Carch	Posted - 2006.07.18 02:33:00 - [24] then think of the grind as a prison sentence to be served, that is if you really want to get back into high sec space. so that you can get to what ever that content is you want. you made the choises that put you where your at. be proud of em, wear em like a medal
xeom Obsidian Sins	Posted - 2006.07.18 02:50:00 - [25] Edited by: xeom on 18/07/2006 02:50:12 Whats that about titans & outposts?Sure a single person will never be able to build one alone.Let alone run it.But agian please please,show me another gameplay style that cuts you off from other parts of the game.Because neither of those do.The problem isn't team work or something hard i need to do.Its that i have to stop playing the way i like. "You get to do what ever you wan't to!" yea... I get to blow up people.NOBODY ELSE GETS TO! War's and 0.0 exist.Again i just prefer the pirate style of fighting.I'm not asking for 1.0 access just wan't to be able to use the new content.And why do i need a alt?The latest EON mag talks about no carears.And not forcing the player into certain mold.I think it needs a reprint thats clearly wrong. Also on the whole "raising you're sec status is like prison time." So let me get this straight.I should come home from work or school and then spend 4-5 hours each day working to raise my sec status?And then send some people 15 dollars a month for doing it? Really if someone came selling something like that to you're house im pretty sure you would have thrown him out.Not to mention kicked his a**. CCP where are our t2 shield power relays? \| Join[..SIN]
Carch	Posted - 2006.07.18 02:55:00 - [26] whats your sec status now? you could have started to rat a bit at -5.01 or something instead of waiting untill its gonna take forever to get back to -4.99
xeom Obsidian Sins	Posted - 2006.07.18 03:03:00 - [27] im -9.0 and plan to go full blow -10. But the question is why do i have to work,NOT PLAY to raise it.further more why not create a system where i can only use the new content with restraints. Why do i have to stop my gameplay of choice to enjoy another part of eve?Who else has to do that? Someone give me a reason besides "uhhmmmmm because you killed pplz!" CCP where are our t2 shield power relays? \| Join[..SIN]
Carch	Posted - 2006.07.18 03:12:00 - [28] Originally by: xeom im -9.0 and plan to go full blow -10. But the question is why do i have to work,NOT PLAY to raise it.further more why not create a system where i can only use the new content with restraints. Why do i have to stop my gameplay of choice to enjoy another part of eve?Who else has to do that? Someone give me a reason besides "uhhmmmmm because you killed pplz!" i think youll have to go to m0o's complaint department for that anser. as a mission runner im cut off from all minmatar space, i mean sheesh cant they take a joke? (i knew the conseqences and it dont bother me, you know the conseqences of being -9 and plan to go farther)
xeom Obsidian Sins	Posted - 2006.07.18 03:17:00 - [29] You're right nobody is forced to grind,and i never plan to.The problem is not going into high-sec for easy kills. I wan't to be able to do the new kali warfare(PVP).And fight for a faction! Unless i can sign up for a pirate faction or something ,gameplay is simply not accessable to me. Again why a alt? You guys just keep coming up with the same thing. "STOP CRYING YOU KILLED PEOPLE LIVE WITH IT YOU DONT GET THE NEW GAMEPLAY!" Again why? CCP where are our t2 shield power relays? \| Join[..SIN]
xeom Obsidian Sins	Posted - 2006.07.18 03:19:00 - [30] Great mate now i wana be able to go -10 with amarr to and fight for the minmatar faction.Don't see what the problem is,its still going to be PVP. Also you're gameplay is not being cut off missions are basicly the same for all the sides.Change a few names around and such but you still get the thing. CCP where are our t2 shield power relays? \| Join[..SIN]

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