If you didn't want siphons to be detected through silo levels and people don't want the API giving flat out lies, why have the API report silo levels in the first place?

Hey guys,
On a final note, we here at CCP really do appreciate it when you contact us directly about issues instead of telling everyone about problems that can be used to negatively impact their experience. There are many ways to do so, bug reports with good steps detailing how to reproduce something is generally the best way. You can however also EVE Mail specific devs if you know they are active. Twitter or IRC also work.

The main point is we really appreciate discretion in these kinds of things, and publicly posting just makes us really not like you very much. In crazy cases if we know your character or account you may even find your API restuls suddenly have the following appended to them:

[specialMessageJustForYou]You can find the bug reporting page here https://community.eveonline.com/support/submit-bug-report and using that makes us friends. Stop being a bad.[/specialMessageJustForYou]

* [ used instead of < because forums.

If you didn't want siphons to be detected through silo levels and people don't want the API giving flat out lies, why have the API report silo levels in the first place?

way to steal my line jerk

I know it's not what you're asking for, but the better way to fix this has nothing to do with changing the API. Instead, have a design team make the following tweaks:

• Siphons no longer take materials on an hourly basis, they merely keep track of how long they would take.
• To steal material, a "Steal Material" option in the dropdown menu of the siphon must be used. This would transfer the appropriate amount of material into the siphon as well as destroys the portion it's supposed to.

It's that simple!
POS-havers in the balls.

you would have to make the siphon auto-steal if it is engaged. But even if you would, a POS owner could secure all materials before killing the siphon. So far i don't think this change would work.

I know it's not what you're asking for, but the better way to fix this has nothing to do with changing the API. Instead, have a design team make the following tweaks:

• Siphons no longer take materials on an hourly basis, they merely keep track of how long they would take.
• To steal material, a "Steal Material" option in the dropdown menu of the siphon must be used. This would transfer the appropriate amount of material into the siphon as well as destroys the portion it's supposed to.

It's that simple!

The upside to you, of course, is no more API nonsense. If you detect a siphon via API in this model, it's because someone already stole from you and may have done so again (the assets API only updates every six hours, if I recall correctly).

The gameplay upside is that there are now vastly more opportunities for player interaction surrounding the siphons. Instead of a small team of logistics players monitoring the API and responding to them as needed - and mind you, as they're the only ones who can put the goo back into the silos, they are the only ones who do this - anyone can do siphon patrols, because all they have to do is shoot the things. On the flipside, it's no longer sufficient as an attacker to just spam a bunch of siphons and then ignore them, knowing that they're causing a bunch of extra effort for the logisticians and causing damage (in the form of the moongoo that the siphon destroys). If a player using siphons for guerilla warfare wants to cause harm, they have to stay in the area, monitor their siphons, return to actually loot them, or they do nothing.

This change would make it far more likely that opposing players actually encounter each other and require active gameplay input on both sides, instead of the relatively passive low interaction model they drive now, solve the problem of the API, and do so in a way that doesn't change the overall function of siphons nor needlessly punch reaction operators and other legitimate POS-havers in the balls.

Doesn't matter, not the point of this thread. Please stay on topic.

If it is possible to detect them by api then many of the large moon owning alliances still have a very long response time. I suspect that this is just an attempt to get them removed from the game. Since they are causing a real headache for the the alliances that want to own hundreds of moons, and don't care to check them. So hopefully if this is a problem it can be fixed.

As for creating an extra step as suggested by mynna... why? I already interact with my siphons on a regular basis. The logistics of siphoning a moon over days already gives numerous attempts for you to kill me. If your logistic guys dont like the work, the solution is simple, downsize the number of moons you own.

I will give you that moon is passive, if you setup correctly, but lets not go crazy here and say that logi guys don't work enough all ready. Have you installed any ihub upgrades lately? oh sorry my bad NPC dweller

The main point is we really appreciate discretion in these kinds of things, and publicly posting just makes us really not like you very much. In crazy cases if we know your character or account you may even find your API restuls suddenly have the following appended to them:

I will give you that moon is passive, if you setup correctly, but lets not go crazy here and say that logi guys don't work enough all ready. Have you installed any ihub upgrades lately? oh sorry my bad NPC dweller

Your actions speak louder than your words. It's been quite apparent for some time now that you (CCP) respond a lot better to issues raised on public fora than you do in private.

I know it's not what you're asking for, but the better way to fix this has nothing to do with changing the API. Instead, have a design team make the following tweaks:

• Siphons no longer take materials on an hourly basis, they merely keep track of how long they would take.
• To steal material, a "Steal Material" option in the dropdown menu of the siphon must be used. This would transfer the appropriate amount of material into the siphon as well as destroys the portion it's supposed to.

It's that simple!

The upside to you, of course, is no more API nonsense. If you detect a siphon via API in this model, it's because someone already stole from you and may have done so again (the assets API only updates every six hours, if I recall correctly).

The gameplay upside is that there are now vastly more opportunities for player interaction surrounding the siphons. Instead of a small team of logistics players monitoring the API and responding to them as needed - and mind you, as they're the only ones who can put the goo back into the silos, they are the only ones who do this - anyone can do siphon patrols, because all they have to do is shoot the things. On the flipside, it's no longer sufficient as an attacker to just spam a bunch of siphons and then ignore them, knowing that they're causing a bunch of extra effort for the logisticians and causing damage (in the form of the moongoo that the siphon destroys). If a player using siphons for guerilla warfare wants to cause harm, they have to stay in the area, monitor their siphons, return to actually loot them, or they do nothing.

This change would make it far more likely that opposing players actually encounter each other and require active gameplay input on both sides, instead of the relatively passive low interaction model they drive now, solve the problem of the API, and do so in a way that doesn't change the overall function of siphons nor needlessly punch reaction operators and other legitimate POS-havers in the balls.

Easy fix. Stop reporting silo levels completely.

Siphons are already too weak as it is; they shouldn't be 100% worthless against alliances willing to no-life themselves to their towers.

[quote=CCP FoxFourI mean, you have a goddamned group of players who advocate to you and get FLOWN TO ICELAND because you had a developer ACTIVELY CHEATING AND COVERING IT UP. Your response to someone making it known that ONE OF YOUR EMPLOYEES WAS CHEATING was to BAN THAT PLAYER. So please shut up about your desire for private whistle blowers.