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Rock Saw	Posted - 2006.07.21 18:50:00 - [1] What do the bulk of Eve players run? I've been happy with a GeForce 5900, but I'm looking to upgrade to a 7600 or 7800 and not sure what the big advantages will be... and how much difference it will make. The only thing I really know about graphics cards is that th ebigger the number, the better it should be... right? I'm looking go to faster... boost my fps... but yet keep it on the cheaper side of something up to date. any help?
Dark Shikari Caldari	Posted - 2006.07.21 18:51:00 - [2] Edited by: Dark Shikari on 21/07/2006 18:53:12 They're both good, and what's better depends on what you want to do with it, and what price range you're looking at. Bigger number is definitely not "better": a 6600GT is vastly superior to a 7300 or the like, for example. An 8500 Pro is vastly better than a 9200SE. nVidia has some very specific advantages. For example, they have much better Linux support, better multi-monitor support (I believe you can have two monitors and run one EVE client on each with nVidia cards), and various little things like stereoscopic vision support and the like. ATI has their own advantages: for example, the x800 GTO is less than 130 dollars for PCI-E, and is vastly faster than anything nVidia has for the same price. --Proud member of the [23]-- -WTS Heavy Electron II, 100mn AB II, Medium Warp Bubbles-
Sovy Kurosei Amarr	Posted - 2006.07.21 18:53:00 - [3] Quote: The only thing I really know about graphics cards is that th ebigger the number, the better it should be... right? Mmmmmm. Nope. 'Fondly' remembers about Geforce 4 MX model line The biggest limiting factor for EVE is RAM, I believe. You still have a decent card, I'm doing pretty well with a my Radeon 9600. ___________________
Jester87 Bladerunners	Posted - 2006.07.21 18:53:00 - [4] Just got a laptop with a Geforce G0 7900GS and it makes EVE So beautiful I think im already playing Kali... Honestly, its the most beautiful quality ive ever seen not to mention my Frames per second never drop below 200... and im playing as really high resolution.
Verone	Posted - 2006.07.21 18:55:00 - [5] Originally by: Dark Shikari I believe you can have two monitors and run one EVE client on each with nVidia cards. You can do this quite comfortably with an ATI card too, this is how I run Eve usually. VETO RECRUITMENT
Dark Shikari Caldari	Posted - 2006.07.21 18:55:00 - [6] Edited by: Dark Shikari on 21/07/2006 18:55:16 Originally by: Jester87 Just got a laptop with a Geforce G0 7900GS and it makes EVE So beautiful I think im already playing Kali... Honestly, its the most beautiful quality ive ever seen not to mention my Frames per second never drop below 200... and im playing as really high resolution. Just to note, a better graphics card will not make EVE look better at all. While it may make it go faster, any modern graphics card can crank the settings up to max and max AA/AF to make EVE look good. And that FPS doesn't sound right at all: you can't hit 200 FPS in EVE in a deadspace mission, for example, even with a dual core A64 and SLI'd 7900GTXs. You'd be lucky to get smooth gameplay, let alone a ridiculous number like 200. Thus, I call BS on "200 frames per second everywhere" considering I've never seen a computer that can even hit 200 in space. --Proud member of the [23]-- -WTS Heavy Electron II, 100mn AB II, Medium Warp Bubbles-
Dark Shikari Caldari	Posted - 2006.07.21 18:57:00 - [7] Edited by: Dark Shikari on 21/07/2006 19:04:01 Originally by: Verone Originally by: Dark Shikari I believe you can have two monitors and run one EVE client on each with nVidia cards. You can do this quite comfortably with an ATI card too, this is how I run Eve usually. How? Last time I tried with my 9700 Pro the second monitor was not hardware accelerated, and thus no 3D games could be run at all. I was told that ATI cards cannot hardware accelerate more than one monitor at a time. As I use an ATI card, I would love to be wrong --Proud member of the [23]-- -WTS Heavy Electron II, 100mn AB II, Medium Warp Bubbles-
Rock Saw	Posted - 2006.07.21 19:01:00 - [8] Looking around $150 as a price range... but as of my current gaming experience, I get crappy fps... 20s and lower, escpecially if I'm running any mission with numberous npcs. I usually have to turn off the sound card... ctr+alt+shift+f12 to boost the fps. I can play fine... but as you see, not nearly as good as I should be.
Dark Shikari Caldari	Posted - 2006.07.21 19:03:00 - [9] Originally by: Rock Saw Looking around $150 as a price range... but as of my current gaming experience, I get crappy fps... 20s and lower, escpecially if I'm running any mission with numberous npcs. I usually have to turn off the sound card... ctr+alt+shift+f12 to boost the fps. I can play fine... but as you see, not nearly as good as I should be. Are you looking for an AGP or PCI-E card? This of course is very important... as the wrong card won't fit --Proud member of the [23]-- -WTS Heavy Electron II, 100mn AB II, Medium Warp Bubbles-
Demio Olaron Minmatar	Posted - 2006.07.21 19:06:00 - [10] I'd recommend a GF6600GT either AGP or PCI-E, they are great ---------- I need a sig...
Rock Saw	Posted - 2006.07.21 19:07:00 - [11] good question... PCI-E is the answer. Also, been checking this one out... Linkage
Dark Shikari Caldari	Posted - 2006.07.21 19:11:00 - [12] Edited by: Dark Shikari on 21/07/2006 19:11:52 Originally by: Rock Saw good question... PCI-E is the answer. Also, been checking this one out... Linkage Here's an x800 GTO for 102 dollars. I'm pretty sure it outperforms the 7600GS. If they don't have it in stock, Froogle has another 2 or 3 suppliers that have it between 100 and 110 dollars. --Proud member of the [23]-- -WTS Heavy Electron II, 100mn AB II, Medium Warp Bubbles-
Rock Saw	Posted - 2006.07.21 19:16:00 - [13] Thanks for the linky... how important is my power supply? My crappy Dell only has a 250W and it burnt out before. The only one I get to replace it and actually fit in the case was another 250W from Dell. i was told not to use anything else.
MOS DEF Celestial Fleet Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.07.21 19:20:00 - [14] Edited by: MOS DEF on 21/07/2006 19:21:04 Just for your information: You can run 2 clients on 1 Monitor each on Radeons as well. I used 7800 GTX a while and now a x1900XTX and both run eve very well with multimonitor. It`s a matter of taste. I went for the ATI for the HDR+FSAA and more performance in other games. For eve it doesn`t really matter wich brand really. Dark Shikari: I can hit 200 FPS in Space (or was it 195?) with my OC`d x1900. Definatly not in a deadspace mission though.
O'knar Grettistak Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2006.07.21 19:21:00 - [15] As a rule of thumb, nVidia ftw. I've always used their cards, and they've always been great. I just upgraded to the GeForce 6600GT, and it screams. ---------- Soldier of <-V->
Dark Shikari Caldari	Posted - 2006.07.21 19:21:00 - [16] Originally by: Rock Saw Thanks for the linky... how important is my power supply? My crappy Dell only has a 250W and it burnt out before. The only one I get to replace it and actually fit in the case was another 250W from Dell. i was told not to use anything else. First of all, ignore my comment about the x800 GTO being better--now I'm not sure. I suggest you check out one of Anandtech's benchmarks listing all the modern cards in a long chart. They're a good way to see which cards have more raw speed than others, especially cards from different generations of microprocessors. Second... while Dell power supplies are extremely good for their wattage (PC Power and Cooling makes them), a 250 watt probably won't be able to handle a modern graphics card. You could try it: it wouldn't hurt anything. But you may have to upgrade if it doesn't work. --Proud member of the [23]-- -WTS Heavy Electron II, 100mn AB II, Medium Warp Bubbles-
Smada Templar Republic	Posted - 2006.07.21 19:30:00 - [17] Have to agree with DS - a 250W PSU probably isn't going to cut it with a modern, power hungry graphics solution. Upgrade to a 400W or higher,it'll serve you for a few upgrades then. Seasonic and Tagan both make extremely good PSU's. Solid on the 12V & 5V rails and good energy efficency (82%+)
Augustus Emperius	Posted - 2006.07.21 19:32:00 - [18] Nvidia's fallen by the wayside the last few years. ATI has caught up and surpassed them on a whole bunch of fronts and that seems likely to continue with any future Wii and X360 ports running better on ATI hardware.
Rock Saw	Posted - 2006.07.21 19:32:00 - [19] Thanks for the help... I'm looking at some benchmark results on card comparisons... and the high end cards almsot double the 6600GT and 6800GT... but it looks like I'll be going with one of those. Not too sure about the power supply, but I think it may be time to learn more about this stuff and build my own computer
Rock Saw	Posted - 2006.07.21 19:34:00 - [20] Originally by: Smada Have to agree with DS - a 250W PSU probably isn't going to cut it with a modern, power hungry graphics solution. Upgrade to a 400W or higher,it'll serve you for a few upgrades then. Seasonic and Tagan both make extremely good PSU's. Solid on the 12V & 5V rails and good energy efficency (82%+) The only way to checnge out the 250W is get a new case completely... and Dell likes to make that very difficult... which means I'd need a new motherboard and chip I believe.... then again, its only money... and its only Eve.
Obodi	Posted - 2006.07.21 19:40:00 - [21] I run two PCs, one with an AMD 3600+ w/ATI X800Pro (AGP) that runs EVE better than the other one with an AMD 4400+ X2 w/Nvidia 6600. The 4400+ X2, however, is better at running multiple EVE clients, and I'm thinking I should invest in a better graphics card.
Smada Templar Republic	Posted - 2006.07.21 19:47:00 - [22] Rock Saw - I'd buy something on a par with a 6800GT, but to be honest a 6600GT will do the trick. Not going to spend any more money until I have seen what we're going to need for Vista. As it stands Nvidia cards can't do AA and HDR together at the moment and ATI can allegedly (I've never run one so I cant comment on that). So as Trinity will be doing some form of HDR I might have to swap to an ATI card to see it in it's full glory. hth
RacerX1 0utbreak	Posted - 2006.07.21 20:07:00 - [23] Originally by: Verone Originally by: Dark Shikari I believe you can have two monitors and run one EVE client on each with nVidia cards. You can do this quite comfortably with an ATI card too, this is how I run Eve usually. yup. I have a 9800 and dual monitors. 1 client per monitor works fine. Was as easy as just making my 2nd monitor the primary for that specific client. decent fps too. : ) nothin like havin a cov ops and your main lookin at ya without alt-tab
Scott McClellan Forum Posters Anonymous	Posted - 2006.07.21 20:11:00 - [24] ATI took the distinctive edge a few years ago when the then "Next Gen" of cards were introduced, the Radeon 9700 was vastly superior to the "lawnmower" GeForce 5800. I have an X800SE from a year and a half ago (when X800XT and 6800something were top dogs.) Nvidia took the lead when the 7900GTX came out, ATI introduced another line but they can't beat it as of yet. NVidia back in the days had loud big fan assemblies on their top end cards (namely the 5800,) while ATI's cards were slimmer (1 slot, not 2) and quieter. Now you can pretty get any card that will only take up 1 PCI slot, although there are some brands that have the bigger ones on both sides of the fence. As a general rule, Nvidias now have more pixel pipelines, while ATI's run faster clocks. This is why they can perform rather differently on the same thing.
Lifeguard Hoff	Posted - 2006.07.21 20:20:00 - [25] Just ordered one of these: Linkage And plain and simple, ATi cards suck
Kaylana Syi Minmatar	Posted - 2006.07.21 20:56:00 - [26] I run 3 or 4 EVE Clients on my Dual Core AMD64 (3800+)/2gig CAS2 DDR400/Nvidia 7800GT and it works fine for most stuff if I set the first 2 clients to have their own proc affinity. If I am going to do combat I drop down to 2 clients w. seperate affinity. If its just to convo or run missions I will not bother with setting affinity. By the way, you can use an SLI motherboard and run EVE off each core through seperate affinity and on two different monitors if your PC ins't running in SLI mode. Each monitor will be fully accellerated GPU wise as well as CPU wise. As for EVE needing anything more than a 6600GT or an X800 GTO... it doesn't like Dark Shikari said. EVE atm is basically DX8.0 graphics and processor dependant not GPU dependant. Team Minmatar Carriers need Clone Vats
Cannabi Caldari	Posted - 2006.07.21 21:04:00 - [27] I just caught an ad in my pcgamer mag and nvidia has come out with a double graphics card for one slot. This is for people that want an SLI setup but doesn't have the mboard to support it. If my geforece 6800 didn't work well with eve at 1600x1200 then I'd probably go for it.
Phoenix Lord The Arrow Project The ARR0W Project	Posted - 2006.07.21 21:08:00 - [28] Originally by: Li*uard Hoff Just ordered one of these: Linkage And plain and simple, ATi cards suck fanboyism ftw eh? --- Which brand you choose depends on which generation of cards youre going to buy, if youre going to buy from the FX/9x generation, ATi would be better, but with the 6x/X generation, nvidia would be better for their PS3. Im not sure about the newest generation of cards though. Btw, you should be able to get a new case easily, all of the current motherboards are either mini-ATX or ATX size. I havent seen any stock computer company make a custom motherboard yet. Oh and, EVE doesnt really rely on your GPU very much at all, its mostly CPU and RAM from what i can see. I may be wrong though.. ---------------- Meet... bunneh:
Phoenix Lord The Arrow Project The ARR0W Project	Posted - 2006.07.21 21:27:00 - [29] Edited by: Phoenix Lord on 21/07/2006 21:27:51 EDIT: Double post ---------------- Meet... bunneh:
Ralus eXceed Inc. Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.07.21 21:52:00 - [30] You can get a 7900 GT for ú180 these days and correct me if i'm wrong but thats a lot of gfx card for your money. look here
Directive	Posted - 2006.07.21 21:53:00 - [31] Originally by: Smada Have to agree with DS - a 250W PSU probably isn't going to cut it with a modern, power hungry graphics solution. Depends on the PSU pretty much. My Shuttle 250W isn't having any problems with a X1600Pro. I'm not running any other powerhungry hardware though, except for an age old Athlon XP. Originally by: O'knar As a rule of thumb, nVidia ftw. I've always used their cards, and they've always been great. I just upgraded to the GeForce 6600GT, and it screams. I've had 4 different GeForces; a original GeForce 256, a GeForce 2 MX, a Ti4200 and a 6600GT. Only 1 of them isn't broken now and that's the GF2MX. 256 just decided to start randomly corrupting textures, Ti4200 had it's caps leak (and do a chess-pattern on screen) which I had replaced but it started doing the pattern again after a week of surfing the web, while the 6600GT just decided to die without any visible reason conveniently a month after the warranty had expired. None of them were overclocked either before the magic smoke started acting weird. Suffice to say, my experience with GeForces is rather horrible.
Caethes Adain Minmatar	Posted - 2006.07.21 22:48:00 - [32] I've been thinking about my next gfx upgrade for months now and it comes down to ATI x1900gt Nvidia 7900gt As a rule of thumb, ATI have better visual qaulity and Nvidia have more speed due to the way they 'optimise' their cards. I think at the mo' ATI seem to be increasing their pixel pipelines whereas nvid are trying to be a bit more 'all round' with their gpu design. After reading numerous reviews about said gfx cards, nvid are on top on most games besides oblivion. I'm no fanboy, but i'm going to go for nvid, even though the hideous fx series has plagued my PC for the last few years. I sooo wanted to for for ATI but the price/performance ball is in nvid court atm. People dissapoint me. End my dissapointment.
Dark Shikari Caldari	Posted - 2006.07.21 23:26:00 - [33] Edited by: Dark Shikari on 21/07/2006 23:26:42 Originally by: Directive I've had 4 different GeForces; a original GeForce 256, a GeForce 2 MX, a Ti4200 and a 6600GT. Only 1 of them isn't broken now and that's the GF2MX. 256 just decided to start randomly corrupting textures, Ti4200 had it's caps leak (and do a chess-pattern on screen) which I had replaced but it started doing the pattern again after a week of surfing the web, while the 6600GT just decided to die without any visible reason conveniently a month after the warranty had expired. None of them were overclocked either before the magic smoke started acting weird. Suffice to say, my experience with GeForces is rather horrible. It sounds like you're buying from a bad board-maker. The chipmaker has nothing to do with such problems whatsoever. Since nVidia does not make boards for their cards, they have nothing to do with the problem. Originally by: Caethes Adain As a rule of thumb, ATI have better visual qaulity and Nvidia have more speed due to the way they 'optimise' their cards. Exactly the opposite. ATI has implemented built-in "optimizations" into their Catalyst Control Center (called Catalyst AI) which can be turned off, but are on by default. nVidia has no such cheats. nVidia is known for superior visual quality, but the difference these days has pretty much dropped to zero. Both cards give basically equal image quality. --Proud member of the [23]-- -WTS Heavy Electron II, 100mn AB II, Medium Warp Bubbles-
D'onryu Shoqui Gallente	Posted - 2006.07.21 23:53:00 - [34] probably the best buyers guide to vid cards ever made with no BS and all the tech facts http://futuremark.com/forum/showthread.php?t=164
Avon Caldari	Posted - 2006.07.21 23:58:00 - [35] Some gfx card makers provide a lifetime waranty. If I buy nVidia I buy BFG. Had cards replaced before, no problems at all. They may not be the cheapest, but they are forever. The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
Dark Shikari Caldari	Posted - 2006.07.21 23:59:00 - [36] Originally by: D'onryu Shoqui probably the best buyers guide to vid cards ever made with no BS and all the tech facts http://futuremark.com/forum/showthread.php?t=164 I heartily endorse this link. --Proud member of the [23]-- -WTS Heavy Electron II, 100mn AB II, Medium Warp Bubbles-
evistin	Posted - 2006.07.22 00:00:00 - [37] The Card you buy now, is of not much value or differance. Its when Kali gvies eve a face-life then you need to look into a new card. The current engine of eve is not very hungry compared to morden 3d engines. you can run 2 to 3 clients at a playable fps on 2 to 3 19" mointers, respectivly. Looking at the pictures of the new engine, I am wondering how much horse power do I need to run 2 eve clients at the same time right now. Hold you purchase till the specfication for the Kali upgrade comes 1st, it will most certainly help give you an informed decision -------------------
St Dragon Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2006.07.22 00:14:00 - [38] I have one of these....Graphical Goodness!!! ----------------------------------------------- "Kill one man, and you are a murderer. Kill millions of men, and you are a conqueror. Kill them all, and you are a god." -- Jean Rostand
Chris Supernova Gallente	Posted - 2006.07.22 00:27:00 - [39] Videocard Comparison
Shittake RONA Deepspace Process of Elimination	Posted - 2006.07.22 00:39:00 - [40] I started off using ATI cards and their flukey drivers drove me away. I've used nVidia ever since. The fact that some of my friends who use ATI use some special modified 3rd-party version of the ATI drivers to make them work better says it all.
Dark Shikari Caldari	Posted - 2006.07.22 00:41:00 - [41] Edited by: Dark Shikari on 22/07/2006 00:41:38 Originally by: ****take I started off using ATI cards and their flukey drivers drove me away. I've used nVidia ever since. The fact that some of my friends who use ATI use some special modified 3rd-party version of the ATI drivers to make them work better says it all. Things have changed in 5 years, Shittake. Today, nVidia drivers are actually quite a bit more "flaky" than ATI drivers, which work flawlessly out of the box. On the other hand, nVidia drivers generally have more features, and ATI Linux drivers are basically nonexistant, while nVidia ones work perfectly out of the box. --Proud member of the [23]-- -WTS Heavy Electron II, 100mn AB II, Medium Warp Bubbles-
FuzionMonkey	Posted - 2006.07.22 00:55:00 - [42] I'm an nVIDIA fan. I have an ATi card and I don't like it much.
Kyozoku Loot	Posted - 2006.07.22 01:04:00 - [43] blind faith / raving fandom to ati
Kalindra naskan Amarr	Posted - 2006.07.22 01:27:00 - [44] Edited by: Kalindra naskan on 22/07/2006 01:28:17 Not to hijack, but what do you guys think is better of these two cards. Does ps 3.0 etc make any real difference? Right now I'm leaning on x850 XT. --- This sig is rated "N" for Nonexistent It's nonexistent btw - Cortes Ok I fixed it, now what?
Luc Boye Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.07.22 01:40:00 - [45] I've had nvidia cards since GeForce2, from ASUS, MSI, Gainward and XFX. They all worked like charm even when I removed fans and put passive cooler or water cooling. The only problem I ever had was with Gainward card, it would overheat no matter how I cooled it, but I guess that was due to bad example, rather due to bad model. Also I run both windows and linux, and nvida binary drivers for linux rock. Now I do have radeon mobility something on my laptop, and its good as well. So read reviews, performance wise I'd say it doesn't really diff that much between same class of cards, but things I look for are power consumption, cooling, and noise level.
Nikolai Nuvolari Caldari	Posted - 2006.07.22 04:10:00 - [46] GeForce! ------------------ Originally by: kieron Buy ISK for RL cash here! Mebrithiel Ju'wien > Nik's bio 4tw btw Graelyn > Nikolai for Dev 108!
Torze Legion Of The Void	Posted - 2006.07.22 05:21:00 - [47] I still run an ATI Radeon 9500 pro and Eve runs just fine. One suggestion I do have if you choose an ATI card is to just uninstall the Catalyst Control Center cause that program actually causes problems. Card itself is still great though.
Ann Mari Amarr	Posted - 2006.07.22 07:45:00 - [48] Bigger is definitaly not better... My old 4800Ti ran circles around the 5700s And I now have a 6800GT that I'm very happy with :) And I prefer Nvidia over Radeon anyday and twice on Sundays ///End "There can be no justice, if rules are absolute" "The enemy of my enemy, is my friend"
Hunt Smacker Gallente	Posted - 2006.07.22 08:36:00 - [49] I'm looking to replace my GF5700 LE... It seems really crap for some reason. I'm looking for an AGP card (no PCI-E) for under say ... $150, no more.... Less money is better! Spending enough lately as it is.. -----------
Hydrian Alante Galactic Fighter Syndicate Knights Of the Southerncross	Posted - 2006.07.22 08:51:00 - [50] You can Upgrade to what you want... You won¦t see any more fps over a FX5900. CPU and RAM is the limiting factor in EvE. If you really want to upgrade your Graphics Card for EvE just wait till the new DX10 Cards are out at the End of this year. Then and only then you will have the maximum viewing pleasure with the new EvE Client. When you are upgrading your graphics card now you have to do it again if you wanna get all the Eyecandy which the Vista Client brings.
Hunt Smacker Gallente	Posted - 2006.07.22 08:57:00 - [51] I think I will, I'm getting like 10-30 fps with this thing. What the heck is wrong with it? Oh, the system is a 3.2 P4 (64bit supported), 1gb DDR.. Supports only 8x AGP. -----------
Hydrian Alante Galactic Fighter Syndicate Knights Of the Southerncross	Posted - 2006.07.22 09:12:00 - [52] Ah FX5700LE is musch slower than a FX5900. The FX5700 Chip is a cut down FX5900. And it is cut down to the half. The Mermory Interface was Cut down too. From 256Bit to 128Bit. This means half Memory Bandwitch with at the same clock rates. The FX5700LE is even more slower. It has reduced Clock Rates and the memory interface is even more cut down, to a 64Bit one, which makes the Card incredibly slow.
Dark Shikari Caldari	Posted - 2006.07.22 10:08:00 - [53] Originally by: Hydrian Alante You can Upgrade to what you want... You won¦t see any more fps over a FX5900. CPU and RAM is the limiting factor in EvE. This doesn't seem that true anymore. I upgraded from a 9700 Pro (faster than an FX5900) to an x800 GTO and got a massive speed boost. --Proud member of the [23]-- -WTS Heavy Electron II, 100mn AB II, Medium Warp Bubbles-
Admiral Pieg Caldari	Posted - 2006.07.22 10:13:00 - [54] im superhappy with my 7800 gt ______________ Pod from above.
Hunt Smacker Gallente	Posted - 2006.07.22 17:50:00 - [55] So your saying I should wait until the next line of AGP supported cards are out, but doesn't that mean I'm gonna have to pay a large sum? -----------
Directive	Posted - 2006.07.22 17:59:00 - [56] Originally by: Dark Shikari It sounds like you're buying from a bad board-maker. Creative, Gainward, XFX. Don't remember what the GF2MX was, but it's still working :)

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