Just an observation from my side. I came back after a 2 year break.

A lot that was annoying me got better. Some incredible stuff was added. After seeing the toon editor, a lot of the other mmo just look plain uggly. And even though there is absolutely no game play improvement it still is a great technical achievement.

Than I checked my buddy list, mainly composed of mission runners and miners. 95% have left the game. Than checking what has been achieved in the area of mission runners and miners I guess I know why.

Simply almost no new content, and making miners even better targets for gankers did not help a lot either.

So I guess I should applaud to CCP. You successfully removed the guy's that mostly wanted to do some solo money now and then without too much social interference or waiting for others from the game.

Good to see you don't need thier money

So I guess I should applaud to CCP. You successfully removed the guy's that mostly wanted to do some solo money now and then without too much social interference or waiting for others from the game.

To be perfectly fair, this game was always intended to make the players create their "own" missions by utilizing almost limitless freedom. How many other games can you name that have an open-ended sovereignty system and property ownership? "Solo" was never one of EVE's core concepts, and to expect it to be is to show massive ignorance in regard to the product you spend your money on.

Simply almost no new content,

and making miners even better targets for gankers did not help a lot either.

blablabla.

Please close for no content.

Running missions to save up for a better ship to run missions with isn't going to burn anyone out ever, right?

1000 times this.

Any player leaving because the "missions aren't being worked on" is best gone.

Oh ffs. You're 100,000 times wrong.

There are many other lifestyles in EVE besides yours... the game will only remain successful if it welcomes all legitimate playing styles. Yes, even sims in space.

"There are many other driving styles in the world besides yours..The car manufacturer will only remain successful if it welcomes all legitimate driving styles. Yes, even those of soccer moms."
Makes sense, huh?

When you start eve you mostly start with either missions or mining. That's how you are drawn into eve.

Just an observation from my side. I came back after a 2 year break.

A lot that was annoying me got better. Some incredible stuff was added. After seeing the toon editor, a lot of the other mmo just look plain uggly. And even though there is absolutely no game play improvement it still is a great technical achievement.

Than I checked my buddy list, mainly composed of mission runners and miners. 95% have left the game. Than checking what has been achieved in the area of mission runners and miners I guess I know why.

Simply almost no new content, and making miners even better targets for gankers did not help a lot either.

So I guess I should applaud to CCP. You successfully removed the guy's that mostly wanted to do some solo money now and then without too much social interference or waiting for others from the game.

Good to see you don't need thier money

1000 times this.

Any player leaving because the "missions aren't being worked on" is best gone.

Are you a car person? I'm not a car person, but you might be one, so let's make a car example. Let's say some minor car manufacturer is producing a sports coupe. A good amount of young guys and businessmen going through their mid-life crises are buying this sports coupe, and the manufacturer is doing pretty well by catering to those market segments.

The sports coupe caught your eyes, and you went out and bought one. But you're a soccer mom. You're driving the car, and realizing that it's not all that enjoyable when you're forced to stash half of your kids in the trunk with the groceries. You want changes made, and you want them to be made now. You want the next line of this company's sports coupes to be reconstructed according to your demands, so you can trade yours in for the newer model.

"There are many other driving styles in the world besides yours..The car manufacturer will only remain successful if it welcomes all legitimate driving styles. Yes, even those of soccer moms."

Is that a fact? You're sure that's not just an unfounded assumption loosely based on a sweeping generalization of the game's player base?

The rest of the stuff you wrote wasn't even English, so I can't make an argument against it, since I don't know what the hell you were talking about.

Oh ffs. You're 100,000 times wrong.

There are many other lifestyles in EVE besides yours... the game will only remain successful if it welcomes all legitimate playing styles. Yes, even sims in space.

the miners unsubbed because there is no point in paying for an account that ya cant make decent isk from.

mineral prices are too low.... loot, npc hauler spawns and drone poo account for the majority of mineral sources now anyways. Its become too dangerous mining them now thanks to Eve online becoming suicide gank online making the risk too high vs too little reward.

Once tier 3 bc's and buffed destroyers are available next week i'd expect even more players to unsub their soon to be obsolete mining alt accounts. And just run incursions or missions with their main accounts instead.

You mean like the Porsche Cayenne, Lamborghini Estoque, or the 4 seater Ferraris ?

How dare they try to cater to a larger audience. I bet the purists were mighty upset.

why in hell u want more missions... pve fries your brains, makes u emo quit out of boredom...

trading is the way to go

Tsk tsk. We are producing content here by inducing tears. Keep on lynching.

I don't get this... You want mining to be very easy, very rewarding and very boring?

I I was a miner I would love the current situation! More risk, more rewards and more fun.

My allegory dealt with one product made by one company. Your counterpoint deals with multiple products made by any particular company. If CCP had been running more than one game, then your counterpoint would have been valid.

I'll make it even simpler: your counterpoint is based off of the fact that those companies started new product lines to cater to wider customer audiences. Are you saying that CCP's solution is in either creating a new game for the more, uh, "passive" players, or perhaps sharding the current one?

Your original metaphor is flawed: car manufacturers do not sell cars, they sell ranges of cars. CCP isn't the "sports coupe" its General Motors. It might use the flashy "sports coupe" to lure people in through the door but you can bet that they are selling heaps more 5 door hatchbacks and people carriers than coupes.

Dropping the (flawed and also crap) metaphor, CCP has just one product to sell so it is in their best interests to make it appealing to as broad a market segment as the can, so miners and missioners need love just as much as pvpers and gankers.

WoW is General Motors.
Eve is AM General

You're not going to get far expecting AM general to make a sports coupe, even if market research suggests better sales than a Hummer.

They did add Incursions, that's pretty big for the mission running crowd. And they're putting in more exploration sites and buffing existing ones for Crucible. Mining could use a bit more attention.

Maybe they should have...

AM General to lay off 350 and cut production of Hummers.

http://www.businessweek.com/ap/financialnews/D9Q2ERN83.htm

And whats this? Diversification?

"The layoffs announcement comes just eight days after AM General held a news conference to announce it had begun making wheelchair-accessible cars in the plant where it formerly made H2 Hummers"

Nothing wrong with cutting down production on a product that doesn't sell and develop a second one to compliment. Much better than trying to make, lets say, the Hummer into a wheelchair-accessible sports coup+¬.

[quote=DeBingJos][quote=David Grogan] i make my isk running incursions & PI.

there is no big reward for mining.... certainly more risk for mining but crap all reward for it.

Once again, I'm no car person, but what about companies like Lotus, Pagani, Saleen, et cetera? Sure, you can say that all car manufacturers sell ranges of cars, but there is a whole bunch of non-megacorporate small-scale builders who cater to specific customer demographics, such as the sports coupe demographic in my example.

Does every car manufacturer need to be on the scale of Toyota, GM, Ford, Hyundai, and so on? Is CCP obligated to reach the scale of, say, Blizzard? Why? Why can't CCP focus on a more specialized product that appeals to a narrower range of customers? Why does CCP need to move away from their original image of EVE Online, a "cold, harsh universe," to something that's family-friendly and able to cater to people who seek a passive, single-player experience?

You said CCP is like General Motors? How? How many different products does CCP offer? What is CCP's MMO market capitalization?

Just an observation from my side. I came back after a 2 year break.

A lot that was annoying me got better. Some incredible stuff was added. After seeing the toon editor, a lot of the other mmo just look plain uggly. And even though there is absolutely no game play improvement it still is a great technical achievement.

Than I checked my buddy list, mainly composed of mission runners and miners. 95% have left the game. Than checking what has been achieved in the area of mission runners and miners I guess I know why.

Simply almost no new content, and making miners even better targets for gankers did not help a lot either.

So I guess I should applaud to CCP. You successfully removed the guy's that mostly wanted to do some solo money now and then without too much social interference or waiting for others from the game.

Good to see you don't need thier money

I'll make it even simpler: your counterpoint is based off of the fact that those companies started new product lines to cater to wider customer audiences. Are you saying that CCP's solution is in either creating a new game for the more, uh, "passive" players, or perhaps sharding the current one?

[quote=David Grogan][quote=DeBingJos][quote=David Grogan]

Have you ever seen a coal mining tycoon?
probably not, they don't exist
miners typically make enough to feed their family, and pay the mortgage and car payments
and as recent history has proven, they have a pretty decent chance to die in the mine
or years later from black lung