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Lauren Green
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Posted - 2006.08.09 19:35:00 -
[1]
Speaking as somebody who just moved into Jita to trade I was beggining to wonder about the whole phenomenon and how it was started. Unlike most of the other trade hubs in Eve Jita is more polarised than most.
I was wondering if the China cluster can shed light on what happened to make Jita this way. After all it's a virgin server with no established market. If Jita ends up the same way on the China cluster then clearly the cause of this massive polarization really is something inherent in Jita's design.
I'd love to get some numbers from the devs monitoring the China Beta about where the new trade hubs are forming on the Beta server and if there is any correlation between these new hubs and TQ.
Personally I think Jita is something of a self-perpetuating monster. There was some event years ago that made Jita an important place where the agent runners went. Traders followed the agent runners and it became a market hub. However during the agent rebalance the agents that drew players to Jita were moved (and in theory aren't in Jita at all in China) however the trader remained. As a result agent runners (and just about everybody else) moved to Jita because of the volume of cheap modules and ships there which is why you can't "fix" Jita through game mechanics. You might be able to remove the reason Jita became the way it did but it's status as the trade hub of Eve keeps it rolling.
Feel free to use this thread for outlandish theories on how Jita started. Don't use it to complain about how laggy it is. We all know it's laggy. Saying Jita is laggy is like saying the universe is really really big.
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Danton Marcellus
Nebula Rasa Holdings
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Posted - 2006.08.09 19:43:00 -
[2]
It all started when someone decided to enter 'bountyhunter' in the caldari race description on them boxes.
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Coasterbrian
Celestial Fleet
Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.08.09 19:46:00 -
[3]
Jita is highsec. It has a lot of stations. THose stations happen to have a high quantity of level 4 agents, even after CCP moved a lot of them to different systems. Agent runners = loot on market + demand for high end items. So begins a trade hub. Since it's a very complete market, people start to go there for their one stop shop. More people going there means more demand, which means more people selling. That's how jita got as big as it is. It helps that it's in caldari space, which is probably the most populated due to the number of mission runners, and is close to most of the northern 0.0 regions.
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 Originally by: riker to thebold
first post w/ your main.
Soft and Crunchy 4tw! \o/ |
Balazs Simon
Gallente
Destructive Influence
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2006.08.09 20:20:00 -
[4]
As I know the China cluster have a totaly different universe layout.. there is no Jita there... hit me with the sharp stic if I'm wrong...
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POST WITH YOUR MAIN!
New sig coming soon...
This post is my personal opinion. It does not represent the standpoint of the DICE Corporation. |
Coran Ordus
Ominous Corp
Ethereal Dawn
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Posted - 2006.08.09 20:20:00 -
[5]
There will always be a Jita. It may not be in Jita, but if you think of it as 'A single system that gets a disproportionate amount of trade/market activity', that will always exist. There's no conceivable way of avoiding this, although at this point pulling all the agents out of Jita certainly wouldn't hurt matters. (Everyone will still go for the market, but no more agent runners cluttering things up too.)
It's basically down to human nature and statistics. My memory's a little foggy on the precise details, but it's related to Zipf's Law. Essentially, when people form groups, there is a very strong tendency to get a distribution of one huge group, then a group about half that size, then another about a third of the size. (City populations follow this, roughly, for example.)
It'd be interesting to see where the Jita of eve-china is though, I agree. Seems most likely to be in one of the capital systems no matter what.
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VinLieger
Caldari
The Beiatch Corp Inc
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Posted - 2006.08.09 20:21:00 -
[6]
Also dont forget the fact the caldari are by far the most played race so it makes sense to have the main trade hub in caldari space and very near the caldari noob systems
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Burnhard Brutor
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Posted - 2006.08.09 20:25:00 -
[7]
Well the Jita thing is entirely predictable if you know anything about human nature. It's perfectly natural for people to want to come together like that, especially to trade.
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Paddlefoot Aeon
Gallente
Neogen Industries
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Posted - 2006.08.09 20:30:00 -
[8]
Originally by: VinLieger
Also dont forget the fact the caldari are by far the most played race so it makes sense to have the main trade hub in caldari space and very near the caldari noob systems
...and Caldari are the most played because of the low Charisma for their asian bloodline. Taking this into account, I predict that China will start with a relatively well distributed population, but will gravitate towards Caldari when they come to generate another character and have learned about the game's mechanics.
I predict that the largest hub could be in Jita again, or perhaps in a system like Nonni (above 0.5, but close enough to lowsec and 0.0).
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Shamis Orzoz
SniggWaffe
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Posted - 2006.08.09 20:30:00 -
[9]
Its all about AGENTS.
Jita has lots of AGENT runners.
Agent runners have goo for brains.
Agent runners sell minerals and items cheap.
Producers buy them and build ships&modules. People come to purchase said ships and modules.
Once everybody was in jita, it because the place to set escrows, especially sine escrow doesn't display from far away anymore. So then everybody was in jita.
Shamis
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Sadayiel
Caldari
Tropical Killer Bananas
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Posted - 2006.08.09 21:24:00 -
[10]
remove bounty hunter from civire and china hubs would change slighty.
rememver caldari it's the most played race= more players using same agents = bigger hub, if at china server the agents would be at urlen or lirsautton (for caldari and gallent) i bet those systems would become the hubs .
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The True Pirate secret |
Devilish Ledoux
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2006.08.09 21:29:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Devilish Ledoux on 09/08/2006 21:30:29
Originally by: Paddlefoot Aeon
...and Caldari are the most played because of the low Charisma for their asian bloodline.
Caldari were the most played long before Bloodlines. Reasons for this are many and debateable.
My theory: Caldari have the toughest looking dudes and the hottest women (in a "Girls with Guns" sort of way.)
The Billionaire Buccaneer (A Blog for the Bored) |
Lord Frost
Minmatar
The Crystal Method
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Posted - 2006.08.09 21:29:00 -
[12]
I don't know what planet everyone in Eve is from, but us old guys know that Yulai used to be the main market hub... not Jita.
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Samirol
Ore Mongers
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Posted - 2006.08.09 21:38:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Lord Frost
I don't know what planet everyone in Eve is from, but us old guys know that Yulai used to be the main market hub... not Jita.
as i understand it, yulai wasn't nearly at the same level as jita was. It was more in the 80-100 range. But this is thirdhand information so correct me if i am wrong.
The MAIN reason has to be the mission runners. Look at oursulaert and rens, both VERY solid mission running systems.
Yulai (as i understand it) was trading outpost really, not a hub for mission runners and traders alike
sig is fixed  |
Lord Frost
Minmatar
The Crystal Method
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Posted - 2006.08.09 21:41:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Samirol
Originally by: Lord Frost
I don't know what planet everyone in Eve is from, but us old guys know that Yulai used to be the main market hub... not Jita.
as i understand it, yulai wasn't nearly at the same level as jita was. It was more in the 80-100 range. But this is thirdhand information so correct me if i am wrong.
The MAIN reason has to be the mission runners. Look at oursulaert and rens, both VERY solid mission running systems.
Yulai (as i understand it) was trading outpost really, not a hub for mission runners and traders alike
I'm referring to product avialablity and prices... when you want something, chances are its in Jita... thats how it used to be in Yulai... it was the DED X Plant station or something if I remember.
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Lauren Green
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Posted - 2006.08.09 21:50:00 -
[15]
The Yulai trade hub occured because it was a key Highway system (back when the Highway existed). Every single safe route between the major home regions went through Yulai and as a result it became THE place to base out of as you could check the surrounding regions very quickly and were guarenteed alot of through traffic.
The stargates changed and nobody had any reason to go to Yulai anymore. It was no cheaper than anywhere else (no mission runners in Yulai so no cheap mods being sold to traders like me) and because it was far more inconvinient to travel to Yulai than your local trade hub like Rens or Jita (which were at the time populated mostly by mission runners only).
Yulai's traders returned home after a while and the trade hubs blossomed. This happened to coincide with the great subscription boom (pushed by the 14 day free trial) which naturally greeted an even bigger influx of new Caldari players (Top tip from somebody I know who just started playing: He picked Caldari because it was the first option on the screen and didn't relise it made a difference). More new Caldari players plus the recently added Level 4 agents (foolishly IN the 1.0 systems) plus the closure of Yulai as an inter-region trade hub combined with the fact that if you are Caldari and want to go ANYWHERE you have to go through Jita (you can get anywhere just as easily through Niyabainen but Jita comes first alphabetically so the Autopilot routes you through Jita) and we get the conditions under which Jita was formed.
Now it's being maintained purely by it's own momentum.
Personally I don't think these same circumstances will occur on the China cluster so I don't think the trade hub will be Jita there. My money is more on Nonni (more and better agents, lots of gates and stations, Caldari are STILL the first race option in the menu so will be the largest faction) plus closer to northern 0.0 space (Guristas being the easiest NPCs).
Again I would love to see how this evolves.
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Sneerglaw II
Amarr
Space Honkeys
The Imperial Order
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Posted - 2006.08.09 22:05:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Samirol
Originally by: Lord Frost
I don't know what planet everyone in Eve is from, but us old guys know that Yulai used to be the main market hub... not Jita.
as i understand it, yulai wasn't nearly at the same level as jita was. It was more in the 80-100 range. But this is thirdhand information so correct me if i am wrong.
The MAIN reason has to be the mission runners. Look at oursulaert and rens, both VERY solid mission running systems.
Yulai (as i understand it) was trading outpost really, not a hub for mission runners and traders alike
Well when Yulai was the main hub there were 4x as less concurrent players then, when you'd log in and there would be 5k players online, you'd think twice about running the gaunlet in 0.0.... the ratio to people now and then are probably about the same. Just my opinion I could be wrong....
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F4ze
Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated
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Posted - 2006.08.09 23:01:00 -
[17]
Yulai ftw! It was alot closer to where I live (Syndicate)
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Eximius Josari
Shadow Reavers
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Posted - 2006.08.09 23:13:00 -
[18]
I miss Yulai.
Victory is the weakness of the enemy. |
Samirol
Ore Mongers
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Posted - 2006.08.09 23:21:00 -
[19]
we all know how to fix this, move all level 4 agents to low sec. Give some risk to the huge rewards.
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Jason Marshall
Hammer Of Light
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Posted - 2006.08.09 23:21:00 -
[20]
Dont forget to take into account the players that were on TQ and moved to Jita. They might, through habbit, head to Jita to get things they need quickly....and they might head there, through habbit, to sell there modules thus accelerating any sort of hub building that might be taking place.
Tacky lens flares in sigs 4tw! |
Lauren Green
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Posted - 2006.08.09 23:48:00 -
[21]
I just thought of something only vaguely related. If CCP can shoehorn it into a patch they should experiment with changing the order that the races are displayed in character creation dependent on the total populations for each race (displaying smallest to largest from left to right).
It would be very interesting to see if this has any effect on population ratios as I do believe that all those players who have no idea about Eve's history before trying it pick Caldari because it is the first race in the list (for no apparent reason the Amarr are first alphabetically).
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Kybane Atreides
Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2006.08.09 23:49:00 -
[22]
Moving agents only helps to a certain extent. The trade hubs, such as Jita, have already been established. There maybe not be one agent in Jita, but the trade would likely continue I
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Gungankllr
Caldari
Celestial Horizon Corp.
Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.08.09 23:57:00 -
[23]
Jita used to be Yulai
Hidden in this signature is a secret message.
I like pie.
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Benglada
Central Defiance
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Posted - 2006.08.10 00:26:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Samirol
we all know how to fix this, move all level 4 agents to low sec. Give some risk to the huge rewards.
agreed
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Originally by: Wrangler
Unfrtinately you dnot get to vote.. 
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Femme X
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.08.10 00:26:00 -
[25]
Jita has 8 stargates.
You can price-check The Forge, The Citadel, and Lonetrek regions from Jita.
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Infinity Ziona
Space Elves of Ragnoroth
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Posted - 2006.08.10 00:34:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Samirol
we all know how to fix this, move all level 4 agents to low sec. Give some risk to the huge rewards.
There were no level 4 agents when Yulai was swarming with people. The problem is its a convenient location. A dynamic congestion tax would be a better option. Go to a smaller market area, pay less tax.
'The alliance should not be a solo contentmobile' - Albert Einstein |
Karl Shade
FinFleet
Lotka Volterra
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Posted - 2006.08.10 00:39:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Benglada
Originally by: Samirol
we all know how to fix this, move all level 4 agents to low sec. Give some risk to the huge rewards.
agreed
Good but not good enough. L3 in lowsec. L4 in true 0.0 only.
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Moridin
Interstellar eXodus
R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2006.08.10 00:42:00 -
[28]
i think Jita has hit critical mass for people working and living there so it is going to continue developing into some city state system with poppulation that can support itself for most part.
also it is about rep. atm jita system is known to almost everyone as the system where you can 100% find everthing you need, and will find a buyer for your loot |
Ozmodan
Minmatar
Lumeria Mu Explorations Inc.
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Posted - 2006.08.10 01:07:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Ozmodan on 10/08/2006 01:07:44
Makes me laugh, everytime someone mentions missions runners the posters come out of the woodwork to post their move level 4 or 3's to low sec etc. messages.
You can't be that naive can you? CCP is not about to drop a significant segment of the population just to satisfy your whimsical desires.
I personally don't care one whit, but there are alot of people playing who don't like risk especially when they play with expensive toys.
So you can be sure one thing will not change, that is moving the missions and the runners to anything below .5.
Learners permit still current |
Miss Cyno
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Posted - 2006.08.10 01:27:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Samirol
we all know how to fix this, move all level 4 agents to low sec. Give some risk to the huge rewards.
I'm all for risk for reward, but this wont happen until the risk of grief sniping and gate ganking is far greater. I wont risk my ship to gankers, until CCP modifies something to give them risk. Kill rights was a start, but they need give the ability to warp to your killer anytime... anywhere.
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