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Sorja E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2006.08.11 16:49:00 - [1] Since the north is once again as quiet as it can be, I was roaming in Empire hunting pirates (when a Pirate Hunter profession, CCP?). Knowing how shy many of them are, I fitted a Caracal and went to Guristas complexes in Lonetrek since it's a hunting point of choice for pirates (zero meter warping point, no sentries). I finally spot a -9.7 PK in Aunenen, 400km away from a gate. I prompty warp to the complex, and wait. Caracal against Curse, I'm not too much of a threat, right? Well, it seems I was wrong... Quote: EVE System > Channel changed to Aunenen Local Channel Sorja > pussies Sorja > curse and omen, you guys should carebear till the end of your time on EVE Kidd Billups > lmao Sorja > I was waiting for you Kidd Sorja > but you got no balls Kidd Billups > ...? Kidd Billups > no you werent Kidd Billups > you would have warped away with your *** stab loving ass if i came alone Sorja > You were inside my 300.000.000 for like 10 mins Sorja > Then I scanned the omen Kidd Billups > wtf Kidd Billups > i saw you at the last second wapred Kidd Billups > i was never even looking for you Sorja > so you didn't use your scanner Kidd Billups > shut the ** up Sorja > or can't use a scanner properly Kidd Billups > ya? Kidd Billups > your right i cant scan Kidd Billups > when all i do is pvp Sorja > Funny thing is I was talking to a friend while scanning, and when he saw the omen on top of you, he said '10 bucks both of them come' Sorja > ☻ Kidd Billups > and...? Sorja > I was thinking a tech I cruiser would be easy enough for an empire wannabe pirate, I was wrong Sorja > /emote out I'm getting tired of this game where, for many reasons, people only gank. And I'm a ganker too, from my hundreds of kills, 70% are ganks, like 25% fair fleet fights and not even 5% one on one fights. People are complaining everywhere about stabs, CCP even had to introduce interdictors in a desperate attempt to give more fights and with more and more expensive ships/gear, people are so afraid to engage that they blob or hide. Removing stabs on combat ships is urgent, not next year, now. Removing instas, the same. Fixing the silly tech II prices, the same. Local, I don't know, but for the love a God, it should not be that hard to get a fight in a supposed PvP game! Maybe factional warfare will be an improvement, I'm dreaming of Caldari against Gallente fleets fighting all day long for a system, that would be so sweet! But at the moment, EVE is slow, slow and even slower than slow. P.S. : I know of some pilotes, even pirates, who are not afraid to engage one on one, but so few it's not even worth mentioning. ____________________ Darko1107 > does anything in ascn space have tech II fittings? Quillan Rage > Iron ships
Mi Lai Sanguine Legion Atrocitas	Posted - 2006.08.11 16:53:00 - [2] Weird, I allways seem to be able to find a fight if I want one. It might take a few dozen jumps sometimes, but by using the map and getting to know your region a bit, it's not that hard.
Sir Juri Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2006.08.11 16:54:00 - [3] hmm I dont agree, 0.0 yes but not in lowsec. damn need to make a new sig...
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.08.11 16:55:00 - [4] I think ecm is one big reason why people blob. They probably figured your caracal was packed with ecm and didnt feel like sitting there dying, unable to do anything. ECM sucks on normal ships and should be heavily penalized. --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Sir Juri Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2006.08.11 16:57:00 - [5] Originally by: Jim McGregor I think ecm is one big reason why people blob. They probably figured your caracal was packed with ecm and didnt feel like sitting there dying, unable to do anything. ECM sucks on normal ships and should be heavily penalized. one hell of an assumption tho. We are talking about someone who cant use scanner here prolly need to "bait" someone with more experience. damn need to make a new sig...
Rexthor Hammerfists Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.08.11 16:58:00 - [6] i agree that many ppl do not take many risks anymore, or at least not as many as earlier int he game. tho i also can understand the pirate as hes incoe abilities are pretty small and a loss for a pirate hurts more then a loss for a alliance soldier. well, lets hope that when pos`s are fixed again, we can go make ppl pvp or die :P - Purple Conquered The World, We the Universe.
Double TaP The Establishment	Posted - 2006.08.11 16:58:00 - [7] Originally by: Jim McGregor I think ecm is one big reason why people blob. They probably figured your caracal was packed with ecm and didnt feel like sitting there dying, unable to do anything. ECM sucks on normal ships and should be heavily penalized. if she had 5 Estamel ECM's I wouldn't have been all that afraid of her in an omen and a curse. but to OP how do you know he wasnt even looking for a fight? the fact is that i just killed 5 or 6 people today with a couple corp mates. and that was in 0.0. I know for a fact that most people are dumber in low sec. so basically try harder.
Verone	Posted - 2006.08.11 17:00:00 - [8] Stabs need to get sorted I couldn't agree more. ECM seriously needs looking at as well, as it's currently a win button and it's only counter, ECCM is niether practical or worth gimping a setup for. Thanks for posting this and making everyone aware. The guy smacking in response to your smack in local with the bad language is an applicant to our corp. Rejected. Smack Sucks. VETO RECRUITMENT
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.08.11 17:01:00 - [9] Just trying to say that pirates arent stupid. Like the OP says... Caracal vs Curse, not too much of a threat right? Wrong. It smells trap all over it. :) --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Sir Juri Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2006.08.11 17:02:00 - [10] Originally by: Verone Stabs need to get sorted I couldn't agree more. ECM seriously needs looking at as well, as it's currently a win button and it's only counter, ECCM is niether practical or worth gimping a setup for. Thanks for posting this and making everyone aware. The guy smacking in response to your smack in local with the bad language is an applicant to our corp. Rejected. Smack Sucks. wait you punish him for smackin back when getting ranted upon? still I allways find it easy to get fights in low sec tbh. damn need to make a new sig...
Locke DieDrake Port Royal Independent Kontractors Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2006.08.11 17:05:00 - [11] Originally by: Verone Stabs need to get sorted I couldn't agree more. ECM seriously needs looking at as well, as it's currently a win button and it's only counter, ECCM is niether practical or worth gimping a setup for. Thanks for posting this and making everyone aware. The guy smacking in response to your smack in local with the bad language is an applicant to our corp. Rejected. Smack Sucks. I won't argue about stabs. They need a rework so that they aren't common on combat ships. But I find it hilarious that you would say that ECM is overpowered and then in the same breath say that ECCM is not worth using. How patently rediculas. ___________________________________________ The deeper you stick it in your vein, the deeper the thoughts there's no more pain. ___________________________________________
Gierling Gallente Celestial Fleet Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.08.11 17:05:00 - [12] For some odd reason CCP decided to use an exponential scale for the different ship classes. Which frankly is the most bass-ackwards insane way of doing things, an individual in a cruiser risks 10 times what a person in a frig does, a person in a Battleship 100, and a person in a dreadnaught 1000 times. Yet these ships are not 10-100-1000 times more capable, therefore people only engage with them in circumstances explicitly tailored to thier strengths (as any sane person with self interest would). Eve would be much better if from the get go they decided that a cruiser would cost twice as much as a frig, and be roughly twice as capable, and a Battleship would cost 3 times as much as a frig and be roughly 3 times as capable and the balance oriented along those lines. As it is most ships are not brought out unless there is az relative certainty of winning. The cost ramp up is entirely too high. You want PVP in EVE, make frigs cost a million isk, Cruisers cost 5 and Battleships cost 10 with Dreadnaughts and carriers costing 15 while retaining income generation at exactly the same level. I gueruntee you there will be PVP Galore. As it is the mining/carebearing to combat ratio is entirely too high.
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.08.11 17:12:00 - [13] Hey, even I can understand the scanner issue. I've been playing this game since launch and have never fully embraced the scanner, I hate using the damn thing cause it's so sucky... (Or I'm just too lazy) Scan probes too, trained up for them full tilt and hate using them. Nothing about the scanner is user friendly IMO, and I think that's why a lot of ppl don't utilize it more... It almost seems like you have to be some sort of Gypsy to be good with the scanner... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero
Double TaP The Establishment	Posted - 2006.08.11 17:13:00 - [14] Originally by: Locke DieDrake Originally by: Verone Stabs need to get sorted I couldn't agree more. ECM seriously needs looking at as well, as it's currently a win button and it's only counter, ECCM is niether practical or worth gimping a setup for. Thanks for posting this and making everyone aware. The guy smacking in response to your smack in local with the bad language is an applicant to our corp. Rejected. Smack Sucks. I won't argue about stabs. They need a rework so that they aren't common on combat ships. But I find it hilarious that you would say that ECM is overpowered and then in the same breath say that ECCM is not worth using. How patently rediculas. Gonna have to QFT. ECCM is worth using. No one feels like using them though.
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.08.11 17:16:00 - [15] Originally by: Gierling For some odd reason CCP decided to use an exponential scale for the different ship classes. Which frankly is the most bass-ackwards insane way of doing things, an individual in a cruiser risks 10 times what a person in a frig does, a person in a Battleship 100, and a person in a dreadnaught 1000 times. Yet these ships are not 10-100-1000 times more capable, therefore people only engage with them in circumstances explicitly tailored to thier strengths (as any sane person with self interest would). Eve would be much better if from the get go they decided that a cruiser would cost twice as much as a frig, and be roughly twice as capable, and a Battleship would cost 3 times as much as a frig and be roughly 3 times as capable and the balance oriented along those lines. As it is most ships are not brought out unless there is az relative certainty of winning. The cost ramp up is entirely too high. You want PVP in EVE, make frigs cost a million isk, Cruisers cost 5 and Battleships cost 10 with Dreadnaughts and carriers costing 15 while retaining income generation at exactly the same level. I gueruntee you there will be PVP Galore. As it is the mining/carebearing to combat ratio is entirely too high. Your risk calculations are incorrect since there is insurance. Lose a 100 mill battleship and you get 100 mill back. You lose some modules, thats about it. But yeah, battleships arent pwnmobiles, and a few smaller ships can take one down easily. The ability to be fast and dictate range is much more important than being slow and heavily armored. --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Sir Juri Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2006.08.11 17:17:00 - [16] Originally by: Bhaal Hey, even I can understand the scanner issue. I've been playing this game since launch and have never fully embraced the scanner, I hate using the damn thing cause it's so sucky... (Or I'm just too lazy) Scan probes too, trained up for them full tilt and hate using them. Nothing about the scanner is user friendly IMO, and I think that's why a lot of ppl don't utilize it more... It almost seems like you have to be some sort of Gypsy to be good with the scanner... It is good and works good same with probes. But it takes awhile to get used to and depends on personal preference. The probes could and will become better now tho but I like the scanner. damn need to make a new sig...
Wrayeth Inexorable Retribution	Posted - 2006.08.11 17:43:00 - [17] Edited by: Wrayeth on 11/08/2006 17:46:08 I got a pirate domi to 1-v-1 my tempest in Passari a couple days ago. I ended up losing (he had plates and uber resists, and I ran out of ammo in the guns and cap booster charges just as he hit structure), but it was a damned good fight. A day or two later I went hunting solo in my mach and engaged two tech II-fitted pirate feroxes in a belt (I won that one quite handily). The good fights are out there, but you can get really, REALLY long dry spells sometimes. As for ECM, yeah, it's a pain. On battleshipsm conjunctive ECM module seems to work wonders, though - a rook kept failing jam cycles against me with 4 of the proper racial jammers (thorax and rook vs. my mach - they warped off when they realized they couldn't keep me jammed). -Wrayeth "Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!"
Gift Amarr Loot	Posted - 2006.08.11 17:44:00 - [18] Originally by: Verone The guy smacking in response to your smack in local with the bad language is an applicant to our corp. Rejected. Smack Sucks. First line: "Sorja > pussies" And you reject the pirate for smack? Give the guy a break, it's rather clear who the smack talker was in that local.
343Guiltyspark	Posted - 2006.08.11 17:46:00 - [19] Originally by: Gierling For some odd reason CCP decided to use an exponential scale for the different ship classes. Which frankly is the most bass-ackwards insane way of doing things, an individual in a cruiser risks 10 times what a person in a frig does, a person in a Battleship 100, and a person in a dreadnaught 1000 times. Yet these ships are not 10-100-1000 times more capable, therefore people only engage with them in circumstances explicitly tailored to thier strengths (as any sane person with self interest would). Eve would be much better if from the get go they decided that a cruiser would cost twice as much as a frig, and be roughly twice as capable, and a Battleship would cost 3 times as much as a frig and be roughly 3 times as capable and the balance oriented along those lines. As it is most ships are not brought out unless there is az relative certainty of winning. The cost ramp up is entirely too high. You want PVP in EVE, make frigs cost a million isk, Cruisers cost 5 and Battleships cost 10 with Dreadnaughts and carriers costing 15 while retaining income generation at exactly the same level. I gueruntee you there will be PVP Galore. As it is the mining/carebearing to combat ratio is entirely too high. I love this idea. I've never understood why a frigate could or should be able able to kill a ship much more massive and expensive than itself, with many more guns to bring to bare. A frigate should be nothing more than a step up from a shuttle. A destroyer a step up from a frigate. A cruiser a step up from a destroyer. And so on.
Arkanor Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2006.08.11 17:52:00 - [20] Originally by: Jim McGregor Originally by: Gierling For some odd reason CCP decided to use an exponential scale for the different ship classes. Which frankly is the most bass-ackwards insane way of doing things, an individual in a cruiser risks 10 times what a person in a frig does, a person in a Battleship 100, and a person in a dreadnaught 1000 times. Yet these ships are not 10-100-1000 times more capable, therefore people only engage with them in circumstances explicitly tailored to thier strengths (as any sane person with self interest would). Eve would be much better if from the get go they decided that a cruiser would cost twice as much as a frig, and be roughly twice as capable, and a Battleship would cost 3 times as much as a frig and be roughly 3 times as capable and the balance oriented along those lines. As it is most ships are not brought out unless there is az relative certainty of winning. The cost ramp up is entirely too high. You want PVP in EVE, make frigs cost a million isk, Cruisers cost 5 and Battleships cost 10 with Dreadnaughts and carriers costing 15 while retaining income generation at exactly the same level. I gueruntee you there will be PVP Galore. As it is the mining/carebearing to combat ratio is entirely too high. Your risk calculations are incorrect since there is insurance. Lose a 100 mill battleship and you get 100 mill back. You lose some modules, thats about it. But yeah, battleships arent pwnmobiles, and a few smaller ships can take one down easily. The ability to be fast and dictate range is much more important than being slow and heavily armored. The idea is that with a battleship, 16 times the power (larges 2^2 more powerful than small, 2x the guns) is in the hands of one person. You pay extra to have all that power in your hands, vs finding 15 other pilots. Originally by: Ghosthowl WoW = hardcore paladins smashin dat face. Originally by: HippoKing I just cried, you know that?
Wrayeth Inexorable Retribution	Posted - 2006.08.11 17:53:00 - [21] It's not uncommon for tech II-fitted battleships to have 80 million in modules on them. Combine that with the 30 million ISK insurance cost, and that's 110 mil lost when you lose your battleship. -Wrayeth "Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!"
eLLioTT wave Art of War	Posted - 2006.08.11 17:53:00 - [22] Originally by: Verone Stabs need to get sorted I couldn't agree more. ECM seriously needs looking at as well, as it's currently a win button and it's only counter, ECCM is niether practical or worth gimping a setup for. Thanks for posting this and making everyone aware. The guy smacking in response to your smack in local with the bad language is an applicant to our corp. Rejected. Smack Sucks. @ verone: +0.1 respect @ applicant: REJECTED
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.08.11 17:58:00 - [23] Edited by: Jim McGregor on 11/08/2006 17:58:50 Originally by: Wrayeth It's not uncommon for tech II-fitted battleships to have 80 million in modules on them. Combine that with the 30 million ISK insurance cost, and that's 110 mil lost when you lose your battleship. Imagine killing the guy with 80 mill gear on the ship by yourself then... nice profit there. :) Thats why i usually pirate solo. That, and the fact that im still in a npc corp for no good reason at all. --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Wrayeth Inexorable Retribution	Posted - 2006.08.11 18:03:00 - [24] Originally by: Jim McGregor Imagine killing the guy with 80 mill gear on the ship by yourself then... nice profit there. :) Thats why i usually pirate solo. That, and the fact that im still in a npc corp for no good reason at all. Yep. That domi pilot got some nice loot off me...except the stuff that was destroyed, which included half the guns and both tech II large reps. -Wrayeth "Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!"
Baldour Ngarr Artemis Rising	Posted - 2006.08.11 18:04:00 - [25] Originally by: Gierling (plan for altering ship prices) ... I gueruntee you there will be PVP Galore. Yes there will, but how much will it mean? There's PvP galore in WOW, but who cares? Nobody loses anything. In EVE, your combat means something ... it hurts when you lose. That's the very thing that people like about EVE's PvP system, and it's ALSO the very thing that makes people not want to risk an even battle. You can't have it both ways. ________________________________________________ "I tried strip mining, but I lost, and it's cold flying around in space naked."
Kylania Gallente	Posted - 2006.08.11 18:05:00 - [26] Originally by: Sorja I was roaming in Empire hunting pirates (when a Pirate Hunter profession, CCP?). If you were hunting pirates, sounds like there's a pirate hunter profession to me. EVE has no professions, you can do what you want, you don't need the game or CCP to tell you what to do or what you are. -- Lil Miner Newbie Skills Roadmap \| CCG Card Lookup
Ikvar Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2006.08.11 18:09:00 - [27] Originally by: Sorja Sfor the love a God, it should not be that hard to get a fight in a supposed PvP game! Damn right.
Electric Cucumber Amarr Beagle Corp	Posted - 2006.08.11 18:11:00 - [28] Originally by: Bhaal It almost seems like you have to be some sort of Gypsy to be good with the scanner... The scanner is ridiculously simple
Cl0nED	Posted - 2006.08.11 18:11:00 - [29] Edited by: Cl0nED on 11/08/2006 18:11:44 Only thing I have to say is this: If it takes hours to grind the isk (as a solo pirate or even corp pirate) to get into a said "properly" fitted t2 ship... heck Im flying arround and something "unpredictable" happens, youll be darn right Ill warp out, sure it doesnt sound "fair" but if you want people to start blowing up like crazy you might as well have to revamp the entire economy since T2 stuff + implant supply would run scarce faster then you can say ... OUCH. For your Stab comment: If all the fights were "fair" you wouldnt need stabs, but 90% of the time one gets ganked like you said, having a small safe guard vs that when your not looking to gank yourself isnt half bad... and As for your insta comment: I agree, but not because of its functionality (since if it didnt keep people somewhat safe: Economy goes crazy remember) but because its lagging the client and servers to hell.
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.08.11 18:12:00 - [30] Originally by: Kylania Originally by: Sorja I was roaming in Empire hunting pirates (when a Pirate Hunter profession, CCP?). If you were hunting pirates, sounds like there's a pirate hunter profession to me. EVE has no professions, you can do what you want, you don't need the game or CCP to tell you what to do or what you are. I think what he meant is a bounty system that works... Which the new contract system will take care of FINALLY! Hopefully bigger bounties are in store for bounty hunters. I just made a new PvP char for this exact purpose! Can't wait! ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero

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