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MWD's and Cloaking Modules Unbalanced Towards Caldarian Ships?

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Tank CEO	Posted - 2003.10.10 05:52:00 - [1] Anyone think this? I think that these modules (mwd and cloak) are unbalanced towards caldari ships.. Caldari ships depend on sheilds.. you take out its sheilds, you can kiss it good bye.. These modules for example MWD take off 50% sheilds.. This is very very bad towards Caldari since they depend on sheilds. You take any other ship execpt maybe for minmatar, its a no prob penalty.. Now they got -100% sheilds with the cloaking modules, this is very unbalanced towards caldari since Caldari depends on sheilds and that pretty much just kills caldari shields, any caldari ship with this on will surely die in a heart beat. Now you take any other race ship that depend on armor/hull, **** this is a huge bonus for them.. Anyone else agree with me on this? ---
Sally	Posted - 2003.10.10 05:56:00 - [2] I don't need shields on my Caldari ships with my setups. Hence the MWD / cloaking with less shields is perfect for me . -- Stories: #1 --
Morkt Drakt	Posted - 2003.10.10 06:21:00 - [3] Stick enough shield boost amplifiers onto a caldari ship and kiss goodbye to any other ship in the galaxy catching it up in terms of regenerating shields. Btw - you can buy them off us for 2.75 mil per
Zezman	Posted - 2003.10.10 06:26:00 - [4] I may have missed the memo, but when were Cloaking Devices introduced into the game? (»)(») À\Oo/ À=\/= This is Rat. It is a vermin. It has eaten all of Bunny's lettuce.
Sally	Posted - 2003.10.10 06:27:00 - [5] Quote: Stick enough shield boost amplifiers onto a caldari ship and kiss goodbye to any other ship in the galaxy catching it up in terms of regenerating shields. Btw - you can buy them off us for 2.75 mil per Hehehe. Most fighters I know use Capacitor Power Relays, quite the opposite of a shield boosting tool. Morkt is your company selling 1-2 run BPc for a Scorpion? -- Stories: #1 --
snaazex	Posted - 2003.10.10 06:29:00 - [6] Hold on a sec here.... Isn't -100% equal to zero shields? For all races? Doesn't matter if you have 10000000 shield points or what race you are, you still have zero shields after slapping on an MWD and a cloaker. Also, 50% penalt for an MWD is the same for everyone, no matter what race - everyone looses half their shields. I don't really get your point... //snaazex
Li ShangYin	Posted - 2003.10.10 06:36:00 - [7] yes, comparing how much shield you loose relatively leads to everyone loosing as much, but that's not reality, in actuality each race has different amounts of shields in relation to armor on their ships, with the caldari ships relying on their shield as the prime form of defense. So you could put up something like : amarr : 150 armor, 50 shields, caldari : 75 armor, 125 shields.... and caldari would always be at the lower end of the scale as shields are what they live with. Now assume you put an MWD or even that cloaking device onto the ships. With the MWD the caldari guy looses around double the shield amount, with the cloaking he'd drop down to less than half the armor and thus hitpoints from the similar amarr vessel. So if you want to run MWD or especially cloaking you'd be farked in a caldari ship, making the gain from said equipment minor since you are basically almost dead with it already. It's not something new either btw, I think most caldari pilots have been fighting off the MWD effect for ages, basically a highshield setup has always made more sense than the MWD for us, cloaking basically means learn to fly some new ships if you want to use it... ___________________________________ A spring day at the edge of the world. On the edge of the world once more the day slants. The oriole cries, as though it were its own tears Which damp even the topmost blossoms on the tree. -- Li Shang-yin, Exile, ninth century A.D.
Morkt Drakt	Posted - 2003.10.10 06:41:00 - [8] Quote: Quote: Stick enough shield boost amplifiers onto a caldari ship and kiss goodbye to any other ship in the galaxy catching it up in terms of regenerating shields. Btw - you can buy them off us for 2.75 mil per Hehehe. Most fighters I know use Capacitor Power Relays, quite the opposite of a shield boosting tool. Morkt is your company selling 1-2 run BPc for a Scorpion? Shield-Boost Amp is mid slot... as ive always said Shield-regen time is irrelevant if you have a shield booster, so killing shield regen for increased cap regen is a no-brainer. I think Tanks point is that "all things being equal" a shield-reliant caldari ship has more shield to regenrate from zero (after de-cloaking) than any other ship - thus - is at a disadvantage. My point is that as the shield-amp is mid slot (caldari advantage) you can use more amps (or shield boosters for which ya only need one amp to do all boosters) and thus the "disadvantage" is turned around. [not atm re-scorps]
Jash Illian	Posted - 2003.10.10 06:59:00 - [9] Hrm...I have to disagree. MWD should be a Raven's best friend. Who care if your shields are halved if 1) The only people with a chance of touching are Tachyon and 1400mm users because you're so far away it's a joke. 2) Orbiting at at ranging with a MWD active would likely play hell with tracking. 3) All those lovely launchers raining torps and cruise missile aren't affected by tracking at all. And as far as a cloaking device goes...Well a Scorpion decloaking is one of those things that runs through my mind...and worries me. Especially with how long to recloak being unknown. Need an example? 1) Decloak 2) Lock 3) Jam 4) Ripple fire torps 5) Recloak If the target can't lock you, they can't prevent you from recloaking. 2 - 3 Scorps playing Peek-A-Boo...Ugly. I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather *** my enemy.- Rohann Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!*- Lallante
Sally	Posted - 2003.10.10 07:00:00 - [10] Quote: And as far as a cloaking device goes...Well a Scorpion decloaking is one of those things that runs through my mind...and worries me. Especially with how long to recloak being unknown. Need an example? 1) Decloak 2) Lock 3) Jam 4) Ripple fire torps 5) Recloak If the target can't lock you, they can't prevent you from recloaking. 2 - 3 Scorps playing Peek-A-Boo...Ugly. That got me moist :-). Jash, I need a date with you. -- Stories: #1 --
Morkt Drakt	Posted - 2003.10.10 07:15:00 - [11] ew please
drunkenmaster	Posted - 2003.10.10 07:24:00 - [12] I dunno, Morkt. That idea gave me a semi. .
Morkt Drakt	Posted - 2003.10.10 07:26:00 - [13] ah man im eating breakfast! (past tense - Dog is now eating breakfast)
Soul Reaver	Posted - 2003.10.10 07:33:00 - [14] Got any decent ripple flavoured launchers for my scorp Morkt :) Ill take 4 please. Be you a Pirate or a Simple Alt creeper! Sooner or later you'll dance with Soul Reaver and His Amazing Underpants Currently chasing Lianhaun
Lola	Posted - 2003.10.10 07:38:00 - [15] I think we've found out more about SI members turn ons in this thread than anyone cared to know. ----------------------------------------- Sig rented by Drethen Nerevitas.
j0sephine	Posted - 2003.10.10 11:41:00 - [16] "And as far as a cloaking device goes...Well a Scorpion decloaking is one of those things that runs through my mind...and worries me. Especially with how long to recloak being unknown. Need an example? 1) Decloak 2) Lock 3) Jam 4) Ripple fire torps 5) Recloak" ... Cloaking takes about 2-3 secs. And i think your locks break as soon as you engage it, so possibly a fast enemy gets a small window where they can lock on you and prevent you from recloaking. One thing about the cloaking that comes to mind after little play with it.... unless there's some tweaking done to it, or the 'area de-cloak' module is made available, it's going to make the gate campers cry so bad it'll make instant bookmarks look like child's play. a) put the cloaking module in the indy's only slot. b) warp to gate, activate cloak while under post-warp immunity. c) tiptoe to the gate at 10 m/s smack talking in local all the way to kill time. d) once within jump range, decloak and jump. Doing so makes one safe from any attack, except maybe large smartbombs. Because as of now, you have to get within 1 k of the cloaked ship to break the cloaking effect... and finding someone with the range/directional scanner with such precision to allow getting so close.. 'tis pretty much an exercise in futility.
Indigo Seqi	Posted - 2003.10.10 12:02:00 - [17] Until now there's been a countermeasure for almost any offensive module in the game, so I guess cloaking will get one too. Thing I'm wondering about tho: I thought that once you had a ship locked you would still keep the lock even if it cloaked itself?
j0sephine	Posted - 2003.10.10 12:08:00 - [18] "Thing I'm wondering about tho: I thought that once you had a ship locked you would still keep the lock even if it cloaked itself? IIRC when someone is locked on you, you simply cannot engage the cloak. o.O
DREAMWORKS	Posted - 2003.10.10 12:11:00 - [19] Quote: Hrm...I have to disagree. MWD should be a Raven's best friend. Who care if your shields are halved if 1) The only people with a chance of touching are Tachyon and 1400mm users because you're so far away it's a joke. 2) Orbiting at at ranging with a MWD active would likely play hell with tracking. 3) All those lovely launchers raining torps and cruise missile aren't affected by tracking at all. And as far as a cloaking device goes...Well a Scorpion decloaking is one of those things that runs through my mind...and worries me. Especially with how long to recloak being unknown. Need an example? 1) Decloak 2) Lock 3) Jam 4) Ripple fire torps 5) Recloak If the target can't lock you, they can't prevent you from recloaking. 2 - 3 Scorps playing Peek-A-Boo...Ugly. Why even recloack, the other guy is dead anyway... __________________________ http://www.nin.com/visuals/thtf_hi.html
Sally	Posted - 2003.10.10 12:16:00 - [20] Quote: One thing about the cloaking that comes to mind after little play with it.... unless there's some tweaking done to it, or the 'area de-cloak' module is made available, it's going to make the gate campers cry so bad it'll make instant bookmarks look like child's play. Well, cloaking devices are likely to become a tool for campers too :-). Stay cloaked near a gate and decide what targets to pick and what not, e.g. camp with a cheap BB to pick on indies only :-). -- Stories: #1 --
dalman	Posted - 2003.10.10 12:18:00 - [21] Well, very simple, the big penalty on cap means that Cloak devices are best suited for: RAVEN, TEMPEST and TYPHOON. I wouldn't worry about a sincle Scorpion, since it would not have enough cap to use EW for very long. Neither would I worry about any Amarr/Gallente ship. But to have a Raven(6 missiles/2 projectile turrets) or Tempest(2/6 or 4/4) uncloak and be able to deal huge amount of damage without worrying about it's small cap... M.I.A. since 2004-07-30
Sally	Posted - 2003.10.10 12:21:00 - [22] Quote: Well, very simple, the big penalty on cap means that Cloak devices are best suited for: RAVEN, TEMPEST and TYPHOON. I wouldn't worry about a sincle Scorpion, since it would not have enough cap to use EW for very long. Neither would I worry about any Amarr/Gallente ship. But to have a Raven(6 missiles/2 projectile turrets) or Tempest(2/6 or 4/4) uncloak and be able to deal huge amount of damage without worrying about it's small cap... I think the Scorpion is able to recover from low cap very fast since it has 8 middle slots. -- Stories: #1 --
j0sephine	Posted - 2003.10.10 12:22:00 - [23] "Well, cloaking devices are likely to become a tool for campers too :-). Stay cloaked near a gate and decide what targets to pick and what not, e.g. camp with a cheap BB to pick on indies only :-)." ... I dunno if it will help the campers much, though... you can cloak the ship and your presence, sure... but can you cloak that huge green dot on the map in the spot where you are? ;s
Captin Zed	Posted - 2003.10.10 12:23:00 - [24] Just wondering but does anybody know if the modules will stack like the shield hardeners? You are not able to get 100% resistence to damage so mabey it works the other way too, never get 0% shield. "There are 10 types of people I know, those that understand binary and those that don't" Improvise, Adapt, Overcome.
Sally	Posted - 2003.10.10 12:23:00 - [25] Quote: "Well, cloaking devices are likely to become a tool for campers too :-). Stay cloaked near a gate and decide what targets to pick and what not, e.g. camp with a cheap BB to pick on indies only :-)." ... I dunno if it will help the campers much, though... you can cloak the ship and your presence, sure... but can you cloak that huge green dot on the map in the spot where you are? ;s Hehe. We will be able to move around and spread the green points among a few solar systems. -- Stories: #1 --
Gan Howorth	Posted - 2003.10.10 12:24:00 - [26] Well even if cloaking doesnt remove the radar print, it will still be a big edge for camping. Remember all the grid exploit skirmishes, couldnt see them, but they were still showing on radar...didnt stop people walking right into it.
Jash Illian	Posted - 2003.10.10 14:27:00 - [27] Quote: Why even recloack, the other guy is dead anyway... Your ship can't take 6 torp hits? Oooooh...you must fly one of those industrial thingies into war zones I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather *** my enemy.- Rohann Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!*- Lallante
Jash Illian	Posted - 2003.10.10 14:32:00 - [28] Quote: ... Cloaking takes about 2-3 secs. And i think your locks break as soon as you engage it, so possibly a fast enemy gets a small window where they can lock on you and prevent you from recloaking. "Fast" is not a word I associate with most people when it comes down to targetting. In fact, it seem the pirates are the only ones that have heard of a skill called signature analysis Quote: One thing about the cloaking that comes to mind after little play with it.... unless there's some tweaking done to it, or the 'area de-cloak' module is made available, it's going to make the gate campers cry so bad it'll make instant bookmarks look like child's play. a) put the cloaking module in the indy's only slot. b) warp to gate, activate cloak while under post-warp immunity. c) tiptoe to the gate at 10 m/s smack talking in local all the way to kill time. d) once within jump range, decloak and jump. Doing so makes one safe from any attack, except maybe large smartbombs. Because as of now, you have to get within 1 k of the cloaked ship to break the cloaking effect... and finding someone with the range/directional scanner with such precision to allow getting so close.. 'tis pretty much an exercise in futility. My god...Mines may have a use all of a sudden I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather *** my enemy.- Rohann Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!*- Lallante
Cmd Sisko	Posted - 2003.10.10 14:41:00 - [29] heh. eve is now going into the startrek thing. they stole the clocking device of the romulans! next thing u will see is romulan warbirds flying around looking for cloaked ships.
Koda	Posted - 2003.10.10 15:35:00 - [30] I missed the memo on cloaks too. CCP handing out Tech stuff again? -------------- Share the love in the SNIGG Forums

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